2K Sports Has Already Approached NFL About NFL 2K13 Licensing Deal

[JoeRyan33]

I hope something is in the works and comes to fruition. The only company that makes good football games should be making football games.

[tcp]

I hope they make a game even if they dont get the license.

Look at what happened with Winning Eleven (PES). With all the customization that was possible with the game, it really got a huge following over the years and got where it is today. I remember buying/burning so many "custom patches" of a single version (WE10).. I had a DVD for the Brazilian League, Champions League, old 70's leagues.. that was one cool game on the PS2.

The gameplay is there. If 2K releases a fully customizable game, I'm sure the community would back it up and create thousands of "add-ons" for the game. I think we've discussed this a lot of times, but it's never enough until a game comes out

[StormJH1]

Quote: Originally Posted by tcp

I hope they make a game even if they dont get the license. Look at what happened with Winning Eleven (PES). With all the customization that was possible with the game, it really got a huge following over the years and got where it is today. I remember buying/burning so many "custom patches" of a single version (WE10).. I had a DVD for the Brazilian League, Champions League, old 70's leagues.. that was one cool game on the PS2. The gameplay is there. If 2K releases a fully customizable game, I'm sure the community would back it up and create thousands of "add-ons" for the game. I think we've discussed this a lot of times, but it's never enough until a game comes out

Totally agree with what you're saying, but the issue is that they need to find that happy medium between making a good football game with feature sets that the hardcore community will appreciate, and making a game that your average NFL fan/casual videogame player will want to actually buy.

APF 2k8 is the prime example of this...really, the core gameplay there was great. I wouldn't say it was perfect (there's some weird things going on with relative speed there and drops seemed pretty prevalent with the generic players). But you could just feel with the way they marketed it that they got about halfway in and were like "Wait, why are people going to want to BUY this?" So they went door-to-door wasting money on NFL vets, which is great because your average 13 year old videogame player is really going to remember the glory days of watching O.J. Simpson and Jack Lambert when they played the game. They were so beholden to marketing themselves as a "classic players" Madden alternative, that the game went to market with really no reason for you to do anything other than play online, or play one-off exhibition games. Even worse, the odd decision to take ratings out of the game (reportedly so as not to offend the veteran players) meant that there wasn't even an infrastructure for a FlyingFinn-type mod to really work.

Backbreaker was a whole different story because there was all this build-up to it, and then they released a game that thought it would have wide appeal, but really is decidedly hardcore. The decision to lock you in this first person camera is not only visually difficult, but also requires you to understand the specific roles of individual players on the field, rather than just play the game and follow the ball like you are watching TV (in Madden). What's worse, the selling point of that game was supposed to be the physics engine, but Euphoria annoys as many people as it attracts. Heck, I threw in a copy of NFL 2k5 on B/C 360 yesterday, and I still think the physics in that game make more sense than Backbreaker or even current gen Madden.

My point is that they could make an ideal 2k football game, even one without a license (which, I'm sad to say, is more likely going to be the case), and only about 300,000 to 500,000 people would buy it unless they find some way to explain on the front of the box to kids and parents why this game deserves your money. People forget that as great as 2k5 was, Madden never even viewed it as a real threat until 2k forced the issue with the $19.99 price drop.

People have loyalty to the Madden brand the way that new smartphone users are loyal to iPhones..."I've heard about them, my friends all have them, this must be what I want". They don't actually know (or care) if iPhone has the best operating system, battery life, processor, whatever...the marketing drives the purchase.

[Segagendude]

I think what 2k should do is develop a generic football game for the PC....


Imagine the mod possibilities! And no real threat from the NFL for licensing issues. Users could create the NFL on their own, ala Backbreaker.

[tcp]

Quote: Originally Posted by StormJH1

Totally agree with what you're saying, but the issue is that they need to find that happy medium between making a good football game with feature sets that the hardcore community will appreciate, and making a game that your average NFL fan/casual videogame player will want to actually buy. APF 2k8 is the prime example of this...really, the core gameplay there was great. I wouldn't say it was perfect (there's some weird things going on with relative speed there and drops seemed pretty prevalent with the generic players). But you could just feel with the way they marketed it that they got about halfway in and were like "Wait, why are people going to want to BUY this?" So they went door-to-door wasting money on NFL vets, which is great because your average 13 year old videogame player is really going to remember the glory days of watching O.J. Simpson and Jack Lambert when they played the game. They were so beholden to marketing themselves as a "classic players" Madden alternative, that the game went to market with really no reason for you to do anything other than play online, or play one-off exhibition games. Even worse, the odd decision to take ratings out of the game (reportedly so as not to offend the veteran players) meant that there wasn't even an infrastructure for a FlyingFinn-type mod to really work. Backbreaker was a whole different story because there was all this build-up to it, and then they released a game that thought it would have wide appeal, but really is decidedly hardcore. The decision to lock you in this first person camera is not only visually difficult, but also requires you to understand the specific roles of individual players on the field, rather than just play the game and follow the ball like you are watching TV (in Madden). What's worse, the selling point of that game was supposed to be the physics engine, but Euphoria annoys as many people as it attracts. Heck, I threw in a copy of NFL 2k5 on B/C 360 yesterday, and I still think the physics in that game make more sense than Backbreaker or even current gen Madden. My point is that they could make an ideal 2k football game, even one without a license (which, I'm sad to say, is more likely going to be the case), and only about 300,000 to 500,000 people would buy it unless they find some way to explain on the front of the box to kids and parents why this game deserves your money. People forget that as great as 2k5 was, Madden never even viewed it as a real threat until 2k forced the issue with the $19.99 price drop. People have loyalty to the Madden brand the way that new smartphone users are loyal to iPhones..."I've heard about them, my friends all have them, this must be what I want". They don't actually know (or care) if iPhone has the best operating system, battery life, processor, whatever...the marketing drives the purchase.

APF2k8 has no replay value. Seriously, it was fun to set up a team or two and play. But the season ended and what did you do?

I live in Brazil and online was never an option. I know the game is for US players and I don't dispute that, but a franchise mode with FULLY customizable league (players, teams, stadiums?), with the option to not drag the legends to the league, would make a lot of sense. 2k drop the bucket when they didnt include offline replayability to the game. Customization+draft+franchise = win.

Marketing a game with no license would be more of a effort of saying 'hey, here's this great game of football. It feels like football, its sim, you can play it online and have a deep franchise mode offline. It is totally customizable, you can add and edit 'anything' in the game. Edit team colors, helmet, stadiums, rosters. Edit each player. Edit future draft classes/draft tendencies. Here are some videos, enjoy'. And keep doing that for some time while you create a buzz for the game. Im not in the marketing business but someone close is and talking to him yesterday about this stuff, he said that would make sense. We've got great ways to promote products these days that wont cost a lot of money and would certainly gather attention. Youtube?

The reason to buy the game would float around two things -- gameplay and customization. I don't think the WE series was a success with only hardcore fans. With the ease of sharing knowledge these days, it would not be a hassle to distribute patches, rosters, etc. I strongly believe that giving the community the tools for it to improve your game is a great factor for a game's success.

I've been a researcher and a tester for the Championship Manager/Football Manager series, I've had a few websites on the topic and it's amazing how customization allows a game to become better solely based on customization. For instance, play FM from the box. Now get a nice skin, an updated roster and download player photos, pitch art and team/league badges. It's another game.

About the price.. PSN/XBL could actually help that, no?

BTW, good post about ratings.

[StormJH1]

Quote: Originally Posted by tcp

APF2k8 has no replay value. Seriously, it was fun to set up a team or two and play. But the season ended and what did you do? I live in Brazil and online was never an option. I know the game is for US players and I don't dispute that, but a franchise mode with FULLY customizable league (players, teams, stadiums?), with the option to not drag the legends to the league, would make a lot of sense. 2k drop the bucket when they didnt include offline replayability to the game. Customization+draft+franchise = win.

No, I totally agree about 2k8 having no replay value. I basically bought my 360 in anticipation of THAT game...people forget how excited a lot of people were about the return of 2k football, even if it wasn't in an NFL format.

It was the use of the legendary players that became an excuse not to have a full franchise mode. What would be the point...the game already had no basis in time/reality to begin with, so how would you make a league with drafting/trades/FA's that pretended like it was real.

That game was set up to fail from the start. There never was going to be a sequel with that concept (what would it offer, MORE old players?). NBA 2k11 is the perfect example of what they could have and should have done with APF 2k8. The level of thought and detail they put into creating Jordan (and the players around him) at different points in his career is brilliant. But on top of that, they had an improved version of 2k10, and my bet is that people play the Jordan stuff first, but end up spending most of their replay time doing regular franchises and just playing the game, assuming they like it.

If you want to let me play as Barry Sanders, that's cool. But don't just create his likeness in some vanilla season mode, and then depict him talking trash at the coin toss and doing the Dirty Bird after he scores a TD. That's not Barry Sanders. And give me an actual GAME to play underneath the novelty of playing with those legends, because I would've loved playing a true franchise game with generics using that football engine.

[Cryolemon]

Quote: Originally Posted by Segagendude

I think what 2k should do is develop a generic football game for the PC.... Imagine the mod possibilities! And no real threat from the NFL for licensing issues. Users could create the NFL on their own, ala Backbreaker.

It would be cool certainly.

[wheelman990]

Quote: Originally Posted by StormJH1

No, I totally agree about 2k8 having no replay value. I basically bought my 360 in anticipation of THAT game...people forget how excited a lot of people were about the return of 2k football, even if it wasn't in an NFL format. It was the use of the legendary players that became an excuse not to have a full franchise mode. What would be the point...the game already had no basis in time/reality to begin with, so how would you make a league with drafting/trades/FA's that pretended like it was real. That game was set up to fail from the start. There never was going to be a sequel with that concept (what would it offer, MORE old players?). NBA 2k11 is the perfect example of what they could have and should have done with APF 2k8. The level of thought and detail they put into creating Jordan (and the players around him) at different points in his career is brilliant. But on top of that, they had an improved version of 2k10, and my bet is that people play the Jordan stuff first, but end up spending most of their replay time doing regular franchises and just playing the game, assuming they like it. If you want to let me play as Barry Sanders, that's cool. But don't just create his likeness in some vanilla season mode, and then depict him talking trash at the coin toss and doing the Dirty Bird after he scores a TD. That's not Barry Sanders. And give me an actual GAME to play underneath the novelty of playing with those legends, because I would've loved playing a true franchise game with generics using that football engine.

Really good post, and also right on about Sanders. They didnt even try IMO