Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

[randers]

Quote: Originally Posted by kjcheezhead

Here's why the average person uses just a handful of plays. http://www.youtube.com/user/versuz2#p/u/170/Q24KR9dQl8I Adaptive AI where were you on this vid?

looooolz. you know you have a brain. so you're supposed to be the adaptive AI.

[Critical Kills]

Quote: Originally Posted by edwolf

This nonsense is why i hope the NFL lockout happens so that they can tear up this stupid EA-NFL contract. Say what you want but 2k is for real sim players while Madden only cares about people who don't know anything about the real game of football.

Then what are you doing in the Madden forums?? I guess you don't know anything about the real game of football if you're here eh?

[J Masta J]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

Then what are you doing in the Madden forums?? I guess you don't know anything about the real game of football if you're here eh?

He said Madden only cares about people who don't know football, not that only people who don't know football visit the Madden forum.

Apples to oranges.

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by CreatineKasey

Personally I like to think I'm the opposite of that type of gamer. I'm one who tries not to call the same plays more than twice. It has obvious advantages. The first advantage being that the user controlled pass defender legitimately has no idea what's coming and is therefore stripped of his inherent advantage to CPU players: he doesn't know what's coming either.

I'm OK with plays being called several times over. NFL teams do that all the time, but they usually mix up the formations. I'd guess Indy runs outside zone 10 times/game. Philly runs screens all day. Dallas runs the delayed lead probably 8-10 times/game. Teams have staples and run them well and often. Nothing wrong with that IMO.

Quote: Originally Posted by CreatineKasey

On defense, many people find 1 or 2 blitzes that get through consistently and call it a day. One trick ponies are just everywhere in ranked matches. These guys bank on someone now knowing a basic counter to their strategy.

I blame this on the playbooks. I think people would run more offensive plays if there were more plays in the playbook and they were better organized. And I think tiering the defensive playbook would give gamers all the tools they need to stop plays.

We need better adaptive AI.

And we need a system that rewards setting up plays. For example, defenders should be more susceptible to play action if the offense has been succesfully rushing the ball. Draws should work better if an offense has been passing well.

Quote: Originally Posted by CreatineKasey

Where I think things get really sad is when you see guys who play this game for money. They play just like the ranked lobby kids: 1 base play and audibling/hot routing from it. What does this tell us: It's really the best way to play if your main goal is to win at all costs. That's not good. That needs to change. There's clear logical reasons why teams don't come out in the same play every play. That logic needs to be reflected in Madden in some way.

IMO, this is nothing more than a style of play, similar to a hurry up offense. Again, I think the answer is tiering the defensive playbook so gamers have the tools to counter this.

Quote: Originally Posted by CreatineKasey

I'd like to see mechanisms within the game that force varied playcalling. Something as simple as that would add so much to the game. Nothing kills Madden (or any video game nonetheless) more than people "gaming the game". It sucks the life out of everything you intend to do in a game. It becomes a moral battle. It's you playing a guy willing to mess with the AI for an advantage while you won't. I'd rather have the moral battle be gone.

Again, I think more defensive optioins would force more offensive variety.

Quote: Originally Posted by CreatineKasey

Interestingly, Tecmo Super Bowl's simple concept of "guessing plays" eliminates money plays and repetitive playcalling right then and there. Tecmo does more with it's 8 plays than many Madden games do with their 300. There's a lesson to be learned there, guys.

I'd hate a counter system like Tecmo since it wouldn't involve tiered defensive play calling. Having a defensive "play" that counters an offensive play is not football. Defense is so much more than that and needs to be more than that, not only to compete with the offense, but to make defense fun, involved & dynamic

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rashad19

No disrespect taken Bezo...I played college ball except on the offensive side of the ball. I'm familiar with tiered play calling but assumed that position audibles was basically the same thing with more work involved. Thus everyone requesting tiered play calling was mostly looking to save time. Anyway, thanks for the quick knowledge session.

Cool. I'm not sure of everyone's level of football knowledge, and I tend to respond to post and talk to everyone else at the same time.

Quote: Originally Posted by Rashad19

I would love to have tiered play calling in Madden 11 but if there is no gap control, stunts/delayed blitzes are not functional, and players don't defend their zones then we are back to square one with respect to people only using a handful of plays. As things stand right now there are too many game-play issues that hinder our play calls. I don't call certain plays because I know no matter what the circumstances are they will not work ever.

I'll add contain AI for every defensive call.

But yeah, it all goes together. We need better defensive assignments/AI along with more dynamic defenses. And they can't forget the animations, interaction & physics.

Quote: Originally Posted by Rashad19

I'm not for the Tecmo Bowl style of countering your opponent. But I am for your defense or offense recognizing a play that has been ran 10 times and beating/stuffing it!

We definitely need adaptive AI. But it still needs to take into account certain things. I don't mind a play working often if it's set up well. Varying formations should play a part as well as ratings.

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by Boregard

You know why everyone uses the Hitstsick for every tackle??? Because there is no button tackle that gives you a better chance at making a tackle. I just played an two entire games trying to just use the run into the guy or dive button only and I swear I missed more tackles than if I were to hitstick all game long. And I mean situations were I had the ball carrier squared up and was in perfect position to make a tackle = just stupid!!! The idea should be that if you are "playing it safe" you should have a better success rate when making tackles - but in M10 that does not play out!!! This is something that really annoys me about EA - there is no sense when playing M10 of risk vs reward in your play calls or decision making during the game play!!!

We need:

-wrap/grab tackle - it should be the safest tackle, yet maybe allow for more yac
-aggresive tackle - it should stop ball carreirs in their tracks, be good for goal line, short yardage and situations where the ball carrier or WR can't see the tackler, but be more susceptible to jukes, spins, ect
-low tackle - it should be for smaller and/or bad tackling defenders, and it needs to also be more susceptible to jukes, spins, ect.
-desparation/dive tackle - it should be the least effective, mainly used for trying to trip up ball carriers nearly out of reach

And of course, the success rate and animations should be based on ratings & context.

[Critical Kills]

when you say "we need" are you saying we need a button or button combo to pick which type of tackle ourselves or we need an animation that is triggered automatically?

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

when you say "we need" are you saying we need a button or button combo to pick which type of tackle ourselves or we need an animation that is triggered automatically?

Both.

At minimum, we need a tackle button, one that triggers a wrap tackle. It's the most common in the NFL and doesn't exist in Madden.

But the animations should be contextual, accounting for angle, size & ratings.

I know there aren't enough buttons for 4 types of tackles. I'd settle for the dive button becoming the basic tackle button, triggering contextual animations... wrap/grab tackles, cut tackles, ect, and the hit stick becoming the aggressive/desparation tackle button, again triggering contextual animations... smashing hits, diving tackles, trip ups, ect.