NCAA Sam Keller vs. EA Update (Patent Arcade)

[ODogg]

Exactly, what you said in your last paragraph Legionnare makes sense. Give the kids a small stipend for "food allowance" and call it a day. Not only would doing so be sensible and just but it would also preclude further lawsuits (so long as the NCAA makes it clear that by accepting the money the athlete surrenders all rights to their likeness to the NCAA for any outside deals - such as EA).

But as you say, in doing so it potentially opens them up for a lawsuit from past players. It's really a difficult situation for them to be in.

[peteykirch]

Don't players already get a per diem on road trips? I remember reading through that kid from OSU his blog, that Club Trill and he gets a per diem.

[tarheelguy4736]

We talked about this case in my Sports Law class. Eventhough Keller may win the case at the California state level, EA will more than likely take it to the Supreme Court and more than likely the Supreme Court will rule in favor of EA because there have been other cases just like this with the same argument Keller has. So more than likely the Supreme Court would go on precedent and rule in favor of EA. I think this will be a long drawn out case that will end with failure for Keller but I still think itll hurt EA's game designs in the future of its college sports.

[yankeesgiants]

Quote: Originally Posted by peteykirch

Don't players already get a per diem on road trips? I remember reading through that kid from OSU his blog, that Club Trill and he gets a per diem.

They do:


NCAA Rules Regarding Per Diem and Meal Allowances for Student-Athletes
Per NCAA Bylaw 16.8.1.2.3, all student-athletes on the same team must receive identical meal allowances on intercollegiate trips and during vacation periods when student-athletes are required to remain on campus for organized practice sessions or competition. Such allowances may not exceed the amount provided by the institution to institutional staff members on away-from-campus trips and may not be provided for a particular meal if the student-athlete receives that meal (or its equivalent) from another source (i.e., coach pays, event banquet, etc.).
Any meal may be:

• Fed as a team meal and charged on the hotel bill,
• Fed at a remote location and paid from this advance fund, or
• Given as cash to each student with their signature on the Student Per Diem Signature Form serving as their receipt.

The Student Per Diem Signature Form must be completed, and signatures for the exact amount of cash should be obtained by the coach. The dollar amount given to each student athlete must be posted on the student signature form at the time the student athlete signs the form and receives the money. It should be clearly explained that this signature and initialing serves as receipt of funds. Students shall not, under any circumstances: 1) be asked to sign a blank student per diem signature form, nor 2) be asked to sign the form without receiving the per diem at the same time.
Department of Intercollegiate Athletic Policies & Procedures:

1. Each Head Coach should ensure that the starting period, proper increment of petty cash for the appropriate number of meals, and the ending term for the petty cash issued are adhered to. The guidelines for these issues are as follows:
   
2. Time frames when breakfast, lunch and dinner meal money can be provided:
   Before 8:30 a.m. – Breakfast
   Between 12:00 Noon & 1:30 p.m. – Lunch
   After 5:00 p.m. - Dinner
   
3. Beginning Time Period for Issuing of Per Diem - Whether on or off campus, the meal money issued should start no earlier than the assembly time required for the team, (e.g. if the team is required to depart Tuscaloosa, or meet for an on campus event at 2:30 p.m., the noon increment of money cannot be issued since the student should have eaten their noon meal in their normal area.)
   
4. Any meal which falls within the time frame of a meet, match, or game should be fed as the team meal, or the increment of meal money should be issued to the student athlete for the meal missed.
   
5. If a team meal is purchased by the department (e.g., between double header games, or while a meet is under way, but not involving all athletes at all times) no meal money can be issued to the particular athlete who receives the provided meal, in addition to providing that meal.
   
6. For meals not purchased by the Intercollegiate Athletics Department or another source (i.e, Event Host.), increments of meal money should be issued to athletes. The increments must meet the amounts listed in section 5(h) below.
   
7. Ending Time Period for Issuing Per Diem - For on campus events, per diem may be issued for the projected meals that an athlete will miss through one (1) hour past the end of the last event of the day (e.g. a baseball game which ends at 5:15 p.m., would require an additional hour for interviews and showers, we would assume that the student athlete would miss a 6:00 p.m. evening meal, therefore is entitled to competition day evening meal increment of $12. If the event was scheduled at 1:00 p.m. and terminates at 4:00 p.m., the noon increment and dinner meals may be issued to student athletes.
   
   For off campus events, the ending time period will be the time at which athletes are released upon their return to campus.
   
8. Different circumstances and different locations may dictate different per diems to equitably support student athletes’ meal requirements. The following guidelines will govern the amounts allowable for meal allowances for student athletes.
   
   Competition Days - On or Off Campus
   Breakfast $ 8.00
   Lunch 12.00
   Dinner 15.00
   Pre- or Post-Game Food Must Be Provided
   Max. Total for Day $35.00
   
   Note: If student dining is open, only meals missed as a result of events may be reimbursed. All practice schedules must allow for students to meet their scheduled meal times. The Associate Athletics Director for Compliance must approve any exception.
   
   Non-Competition Days – Off Campus or Days When Student-Athletes are Required to Remain On Campus During Official University Vacation Periods for Practice/Competition (i.e., Spring Break)
   
   Breakfast $ 8.00
   Lunch 12.00
   Dinner 15.00
   Max. Total for Day $35.00
   
9. On competition days only, it is permissible to provide a post-game snack or meal (actual food only; no cash may be provided in lieu of this post-game snack/meal), depending on nutritional requirements.
   
10. In some instances cost of living increases in certain metro areas increasing the allowable per diem to not more than $45 each day. Prior written approval from sport oversight Associate Athletic Director must be obtained.
    
11. During NCAA Championships and bowl games, NCAA bylaw 16.8.1.6 permits the institution to provide qualifying student-athletes $20 per day incidental expense money during a period limited to the maximum number of days of per diem allowed for the involved championship, or, for certified post-season bowl contests, for a period not to exceed 10 days. The $20 per day may be provided only after the team departs for or reports to the site of the championship or bowl game

[marxshut]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

Yeah good luck organizing a bunch of high school kids and their parents to demand money instead of, or in addition to, a free (and rather expensive) education and a chance at millions of dollars. The very nature of college ball is that all players going in feel they have a shot at millions of dollars so it'll never happen. Hinsight for players like Keller is 20/20. As others have said, if he was in the NFL making millions right now he'd not be involved in this suit. And that my friends is the reason future students will never unionize, because each player feels as if in doing so they are potentially giving up millions of dollars in the NFL..and for many students who have nothing and have grown up in poverty, that'll never happen. Also, two more words and I rest my case: Maurice Clarett

I don't think it will start with HS kids and parents. It will start with their so-called handlers / agents. More and more of the HS kids have "handlers" which is just a fancy term for agent. Bryce Brown's handler made money selling his recruiting updates. The less than ethical sports agents are going to figure out that there's money to be made here (i.e. selling the players likeness to EA for the game) the start to leach onto these top prospects. This is already happening now.

Again I'm not saying this happens tomorrow, but the more money that the NCAA generates, the more hands that will want to reach into the pot and find ways to get college athletes paid so they can get their slice.

[ODogg]

How would that happen when having an agent, no matter what they call themselves, is against collegiate rules? If there were any organization by a "handler" or agent it would come out who was doing it and the kids would immediately lose any potential scholarships and that'd be the end of the story altogether. So for that reason I don't think it's possible at all for that to occur.

There is just no potential way, considering the situation, for any sort of unity against the NCAA by pre-college kids to occur here. None.

[ka520]

I guess Keller's job as a bartender in Scottsdale isn't suppoting his coke habit.

[jkra0512]

Quote: Originally Posted by ka520

I guess Keller's job as a bartender in Scottsdale isn't suppoting his coke habit.

Really guy, is that necessary?