Mike Wang Returns to 2K Sports: NBA 2K Series (ESPN)

[kcxiv]

Quote: Originally Posted by rspencer86

Yes, and that is exactly why I don't have much confidence. They are still using netcode from the Dreamcast era? Come on, now.

up until 2K9 they had no reason to change it, just tweak it. 2K9 seen a huge up from 2K8, and 2K10 even more. No one, i mean no one expected 60 percent in increased sales. They kept with the norm, but now that NBA series is a huge hit, they have to alter things. What was 2K best known for? their online. NFL2K series and their early NBA2K series. There as never any issues really with online except when 2 people's connections didnt synch up.

The old saying is, dont fix something thats not broken, well that ish is broken now and they are going to fix it. I think they are starting with MLB2K10 i believe.

They told me a few other things as well that i cant really say yet as they want to release that in due time, but i hope whatever it is they are doing now works.

[Tomba]

They need Tomba not Wang lol

I'm interested in seeing the 2k engine not really evolve but moreso the graphics engine be revamped in some way

[bamalam]

Quote: Originally Posted by spankdatazz22

First, he didn't work on those games by himself. never stated he did, but wrong or right he is associated with all those games mentioned. and that gives him a strong track record. Second, for all the accolades people give to Inside Drive, it went away not because of exclusivity, but because there weren't enough people buying the game. i thought it went away as part of the ms agreement to get rid of its sports line. i could be wrong. sales were pretty strong for id. Have to disagree with the need for some people to only comment on games at either end of the spectrum. 2K9 imo wasn't a bad game - there were many obvious gameplay improvements that occurred in 2K9 that were being put out as features for Live 10. It's your right not to like the game, but I don't see the need for some to always overstate issues. 2k9 was a bad game, no doubt about it. not overstating it. no def ai, pip,etc. many agree with me on this Live 10 is supposed to be a good game, yet in a heads up battle w/no discernible advantages to either (other than maybe EA having more marketing muscle) it got smoked. 2K10 is clearly the better/more feature rich game. i agree 2k10 was miles beyond live 10. i refernced that game only to point out that d/t wang, live was even in the conversation as a distant alternate to those dudes who like live. my game this year is 2k10 by a landslide(rob stated they were going back and looking at 2k7 to improve 2k9 and result was 2k10. wang was 2k7. look where each game started from o8 games. live made a huge jump because of wang. as a comparison from jump 2k6 made to 2k7, and live 08 to live 09, it is a valid point that wang was the pivotal influence in those jumps. All this talk of "I hope Mike Wang fixes the color palette on the cover" "I think Mike Wang's involvement means we'll get 240-page manuals with the game" like talk is silly. Like before, he'll add to an already strong dev team. He's not THE team. They've succeeded with him, they've succeeded without him. I'm guessing they'll be that much better with him back.

didnt read all that talk, but agree he will make the team better, a lot better.

[HMcCoy]

A lot of folks are confusing Beluba's impact as a statement that he does everything by himself. Thats obviously false. But great basketball games appearing out of thin air every single time he takes a lead is fact. Even if he doesn't lift a finger, his ideas and direction makes basketball games significantly better. Give the man his propers.

Obviously, noobs on here don't remember when the pre-Wang 2K series was an absolute joke, and a distant third in the OS hivemind, lol.

I think the most interesting thing to take from this is that you can NOT force sim down peoples throats. I don't blame the folks at EA for wanting to change focus a bit, because the idea that everyone wants realistic basketball is the biggest fallacy in gaming. The Show is often brought up as an example, but that's heavily skewed. Their competition blows. When High Heat was touted as being the most realistic baseball game on the market, it still got crushed by MVP, ASB and WSB in sales. Uber-realism is a niche ideal, kids. 99.9% of 2K players don't play remotely sim, and I'd wager it's an even bigger disparity throughout Live's fanbase. I think Live10 proved that being heavy handed with defensive AI may draw a handful of realism junkies, but won't get you much love from the masses. I hope 2k continues to be the best of both worlds.

I just want to see some of Live's locomotion innovations and smooth movement brought over, their home/away uni freedom and accesories implemented, and all bugs squashed.

Welcome back, B.

[Pared]

Quote: Originally Posted by kcxiv

up until 2K9 they had no reason to change it, just tweak it. 2K9 seen a huge up from 2K8, and 2K10 even more. No one, i mean no one expected 60 percent in increased sales. They kept with the norm, but now that NBA series is a huge hit, they have to alter things. What was 2K best known for? their online. NFL2K series and their early NBA2K series. There as never any issues really with online except when 2 people's connections didnt synch up. The old saying is, dont fix something thats not broken, well that ish is broken now and they are going to fix it. I think they are starting with MLB2K10 i believe. They told me a few other things as well that i cant really say yet as they want to release that in due time, but i hope whatever it is they are doing now works.

This is a huge crock. The more you post, the more ridiculous you make yourself look.

I've been running leagues here since 2k7 and network drops have consistently been a problem every single year.

No matter if things get changed, looked at, thought of, theorized, talked about and any other choice words you can think of, the online play has failed to be stable to where it is at the level of other games.

We've trekked through our leagues even with the drops, but stop posting, because you're making yourself out to be a mini-version of Ronnie and you do that company more harm than good.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by HMcCoy

A lot of folks are confusing Beluba's impact as a statement that he does everything by himself. Thats obviously false. But great basketball games appearing out of thin air every single time he takes a lead is fact. Even if he doesn't lift a finger, his ideas and direction makes basketball games significantly better. Give the man his propers. Obviously, noobs on here don't remember when the pre-Wang 2K series was an absolute joke, and a distant third in the OS hivemind, lol. I think the most interesting thing to take from this is that you can NOT force sim down peoples throats. I don't blame the folks at EA for wanting to change focus a bit, because the idea that everyone wants realistic basketball is the biggest fallacy in gaming. The Show is often brought up as an example, but that's heavily skewed. Their competition blows. When High Heat was touted as being the most realistic baseball game on the market, it still got crushed by MVP, ASB and WSB in sales. Uber-realism is a niche ideal, kids. 99.9% of 2K players don't play remotely sim, and I'd wager it's an even bigger disparity throughout Live's fanbase. I think Live10 proved that being heavy handed with defensive AI may draw a handful of realism junkies, but won't get you much love from the masses. I hope 2k continues to be the best of both worlds. I just want to see some of Live's locomotion innovations and smooth movement brought over, their home/away uni freedom and accesories implemented, and all bugs squashed. Welcome back, B.

Good post; agree w/your points. I definitely respect Beluba's impact on basketball games and feel that he'll make the 2K team that much stronger. Just disagree w/the view that was seemingly being perpetrated that he's somehow involved in all aspects of developing a game and can somehow be made soley responsible for a game's success, yet none of it's failures. I think the teams need to be given more respect than that, a lot more. As I said I'm no fan of Live, but I have to wonder how their team feels w/so many people jumping off their bandwagon simply because of what one person said, not because of what they've done. The hardcore can be extremely fickle.

And definitely agree w/your points re the uber-realism many preach as the only thing acceptable with no compromises. Not that I think Live is some hyper-sim from my brief experience playing it, but think developers have to take the approach of making their games be as well-rounded as possible.

[BroMontana82]

Quote: Originally Posted by spankdatazz22

And definitely agree w/your points re the uber-realism many preach as the only thing acceptable with no compromises. Not that I think Live is some hyper-sim from my brief experience playing it, but think developers have to take the approach of making their games be as well-rounded as possible.

exactly. for the broad fanbase, sim doesn't sell as well as the sportscenter highlight reel plays and the ease of performing them in the game. this is certainly the case for online play too. most people don't want to play sim and have proper defensive positioning. they want the 360 windmill dunks. this is a fact. these companies do aggressive perception studies, analyse consumer sentiment, and constantly utilize FECS (front end customer strategy). every company does this...how else would they continue to be profitbable if they didn't cater to what their customers wanted? i think everyone here is guilty at some point of forgetting that we and the sim crowd are just a small portion of the game's buyers. it's all about pleasing the largest segment of consumers and cost/benefit ratios. i think overall, at least for 2k, more and more people want sim, but again, not everyone does so most sports games will never be strictly sim. we just need to keep voicing our opinions but also realize the reality of the situation and the market for these games.

[CX1329]

Quote: Originally Posted by sambf12

for the broad fanbase, sim doesn't sell as well as the sportscenter highlight reel plays and the ease of performing them in the game. this is certainly the case for online play too. most people don't want to play sim and have proper defensive positioning. they want the 360 windmill dunks. this is a fact. i think overall, at least for 2k, more and more people want sim,

This is an example of how people sometimes forget that the 2K series isn't some sort of holy grail of basketball, devoted to protecting the innocence and purity of basketball gaming. In 2K9, you could take Kobe or Lebron and perform said 360 windmill dunks every time down. And while 2K10 rectified that problem to a large extent, you can still pound the ball into the paint nearly everytime if you're that intent and know how to cheese.

Regardless of what blind fans (and this isn't targeted at anybody, I'm just speaking in general) might think, the issue isn't so simple as 2K being "sim" and Live being "arcade". EA is guilty of producing some terribly arcade games, but 2K isn't exempt from guilt either. I'd go as far as to say that Live 10 plays a LOT more sim out of the box than any 2K game ever has. Prior to 2K10, I can't recall ever playing a single NBA 2K game in which I couldn't just run up to the basket and dunk all day straight out of the box. Sliders have always been a necessity.