NBA Live 10 Video: Shooting & Driving The Lane

[Joka2122]

Quote: Originally Posted by michaeljordanjr

I don't get when people say that because the other NBA games have shown nothing literaly and last years version was very frustrating and pitiful. this video was amazing, it shows a massive amount of control and I can't believ how far from live 09 this is. the choice is EASY THIS YEAR

No my friend. The choice is going to be hard as LB23 stated. NBA 2k has been on top for multiple years. NBA Live has greatly improved in just a matter of a year which is great but, a "easy choice" is not based on how much one game has improved but rather how much better the game is vs. its competition.

[pbz06]

Quote: Originally Posted by 23

Now that said.... You guys going on about this trailer and help defense just stop it. Its getting old as heck and you know good and well its on lower difficulty. I expect this crap from rookie posters but not you guys to continue on with this stuff. Its been beaten a million times, Live 09 had better help defense than any other game put out last year including slider tweaks. If Mike says the NCAA team helped them improve their zone defense, and the longest part of Da Czar's article is on defense then I know its there, including what i've seen and what I know from this series history. Its a bunch of Bull yall spouting off and you know it is

Amen to that. In the video, it's clearly some sort of extreme iso play. Now, we can sit here all day and say that Gasol would never stand outside the 3-point line even in an Iso, but who cares? Why nitpick on that single item instead of focusing on the 390+ plays they got correct, or the fact that you can run the triangle offense in Live 10? lol. It's jst people looking to complain, and there's always a common denominator with them. Maybe the User can put the pressure on "sag" or "light" during Iso plays which would cause the D to leave more room and shade towards the paint and away from the offensive players a bit.

Maybe Duncan recovers and blocks that on All-Star difficulty?

Either way, every time these guys complain about the help D, it's during the extreme Iso plays and most likely on a lower difficulty level.

Watch videos of Live 10 during 5vs5, or even play Live 09, you will know that Help D and defensive rotations are one of Live's strengths.

[Pared]

Quote: Originally Posted by 23

Now that said.... You guys going on about this trailer and help defense just stop it. Its getting old as heck and you know good and well its on lower difficulty. I expect this crap from rookie posters but not you guys to continue on with this stuff. Its been beaten a million times, Live 09 had better help defense than any other game put out last year including slider tweaks. If Mike says the NCAA team helped them improve their zone defense, and the longest part of Da Czar's article is on defense then I know its there, including what i've seen and what I know from this series history. Its a bunch of Bull yall spouting off and you know it is

If it's a non-issue, fantastic. Won't know until the game is here.

"Bunch of bull" is pretty harsh for a game you haven't played. Looking at the vids, it's a solid concern. There were even some issues of it in the YouTube video that was an All-Star difficulty.

But again, it's there. If you can't comment on the video, there's no point in putting it up except to go "wow, awesome, sick!"

As it has been said plenty of times, will need to wait for the demo/final before knowing for sure. As if a sports video game never "broke" something year to year.

[loadleft]

I guess this is kinda a question and a comment to the guys that are discussing the defensive rotations in the video. I read somewhere from one of the developers that there are a couple of approaches to making the difficulty settings progressively easier/harder. One would be ratings boost (which I assume is not possible in Live 10 since they don't have shot ratings) and the second would be making the defense less stout on the lower levels. This appears to be the approach that has been taken in Live 10. It seems to me that if the defense rotated and contact was forced on the easier levels (which we've been told are used for these videos) then those levels would not be easy. I guess they could just allow the offensive players to score over good defense but I think that would amount to a ratings boost. So my question is how would the lower levels be easy if the defense rotated to the ball and defended the offense properly? It's like when I play basketball with my kids, to make it easy for them I pretend to be slower than they are and can't jump higher than they can even though I an a foot taller. If I played them with straight up D how would they score? I guess my thought is that in some way the game has to be easier on the lower level and if it's not with weaker poorer rotating D how would you guys make it easier? Let me end this by saying I am not trying to start an argument but I seen you guys discuss this topic in a couple of other threads and it just got me wondering: "Well how else would you make the game easier on lower levels?"

[pbz06]

Quote: Originally Posted by Pared

If it's a non-issue, fantastic. Won't know until the game is here. "Bunch of bull" is pretty harsh for a game you haven't played. Looking at the vids, it's a solid concern. There were even some issues of it in the YouTube video that was an All-Star difficulty. But again, it's there. If you can't comment on the video, there's no point in putting it up except to go "wow, awesome, sick!" As it has been said plenty of times, will need to wait for the demo/final before knowing for sure. As if a sports video game never "broke" something year to year.

No, that's not the problem. The problem is there's a select group of guys that bring off-topic "concerns" about non-issue items.

Funny, I browse the other forum and see a completely different tune in your "observations".

[23]

Quote: Originally Posted by Pared

If it's a non-issue, fantastic. Won't know until the game is here. "Bunch of bull" is pretty harsh for a game you haven't played. Looking at the vids, it's a solid concern. There were even some issues of it in the YouTube video that was an All-Star difficulty. But again, it's there. If you can't comment on the video, there's no point in putting it up except to go "wow, awesome, sick!" As it has been said plenty of times, will need to wait for the demo/final before knowing for sure. As if a sports video game never "broke" something year to year.

Pared man come on with this crap dude. At least we do know who has played the game bias aside and unless you want to call the dude a liar im more inclined to believe him along with the other examples I posted. Its complete bull.

I cant believe you're going on with this help defense crap in another trailer when the devs have stated thats EXACTLY what they did.

I dont need to wait for anything because I know someone who doesnt have ties to a game company that played it.

I dont care if you arent wowed by the video because im not wowed by the video and I said so, but thats not the point

You know good and well help defense was a problem in one of the two basketball games that actually sell and NBA Live wasnt the game.

I'll post Czar's account from the finished game, NOT the demo, but the finished product and again, if you choose to ignore it thats on you, but dont think im not going to call you on that trash

Quote:

Defense If were talking about player movement and momentum lets talk about the defense while were here. Have you ever wanted to play a game where your defensive mistakes could be taken advantage of ? I'm serious. Where there is no “magic” recovery available you just get beat and have to do better next time ? The Live team brings that to the table in 10. Still ... Live 10 is not perfect. Initially I was not feeling the defensive controls in Live 10. I just didn't get it. Then I discovered that Czar himself had become subject to cheese tactics... I know family... I'm embarrassed to admit it myself but just hear me out for a minute. In most other hoop games we have been trained that if the guy your guarding goes to his left, to stop him ... You must move your controller to the right. In most instances you can use a defensive assist that will move you to that position automatically. Well in Live 10 that concept will get you beat like you stole something. To defend well in Live 10 you MUST understand your match-ups on the floor. In addition to that, its helpful to know a thing or two about the individual your guarding. Those individual player momentums play a deciding factor in how well you will be able to stay with the ballhandler. Additionally the defensive system goes further , allowing players with higher on ball defense to be more effective with bodying up the ball handler. Consider this quote from Mike Wang in his blog : “The improved locomotion system also plays a huge role in this as great onball defenders will be able to plant and accelerate much faster than a lumbering stiff. So knowing your personnel and when to crowd vs. gap your check is crucial to being successful on defense. “ What this means is that all these scenarios can play out different. 1.Quick guards who are able to change directions quickly will put bigger slower players on skates.... 2.An athletic big man in the same situation has a better chance of staying in front but will not be as effective as a an athletic guard or forward with a high on ball defensive rating. 3. An athletic wing with no handles being guarded by a big man playing well off of him may not be able to take advantage of the mismatch. Think of the strategical battles that will rage between you and the cpu or another human opponent when every player has their own momentum.... I could go on as this is not near as deep as the rabbit hole goes but I just want to illustrate what all is happening and why Live is a game you may want to play before dismissing it as a minor improvement over Nba Live 09. I'm not done with defense. The cpu offense is masterful at choosing attack angles to the rim. This forces you to defend angles to the basket. If implemented correctly it encourages both the offense and defense to play real basketball. Normally to stop a drive attempt you move your defender to the left or right depending on the direction of the offensive players drive. In Live 10 the closer you are to the offense the quicker you must react to the drive especially if your guarding a player with a great first step. This would cause you push hard (don't forget our momentum system) in the direction of the drive, which, if you remember our discussion on the different foot plants available, could leave you dead in the water (depending on the match-up) if a quick offensive player decides to change direction. Naturally, after you get beat a few times either off of the initial drive or the change of direction, the game teaches you to defend the angles. As well as to not be so heavy handed with the left stick on defense. So that when the drive is made you no longer move your defender hard in that direction but back at an angle to protect the basket. Even better, it teaches you not to crowd guys who are great at getting to the basket. This maybe why you see so many seemingly uncontested jumpers in the demonstration videos. If your too overaggressive challenging the shot you leave yourself open to too many angles and could get beat to the basket. I am eager to get more time in with the game to verify, but from my initial play time it appears Live 10 will make it valuable to play the percentages on defense. For players with devastating mid-range games this is why you can't stop them in Live 10 with inferior defenders. You can't stop everything baby !!! pick your poison... cut off the drive and force the contested J ( but be careful of pump-fakes and step backs or escape dribbles) or try to take away the jumper and hope your help d can keep him out of the lane. In last years game the faulty defensive mechanic allowed you as a defender to close the gap on the offensive player with no fear of being beat. In live 10 closing that gap to stop the jumper can be a precarious situation depending on the match-up. Don't play videogames... play basketball. You will not have an anwer for elite players without using a double team to take the ball out of their hands. Its not a cheap feeling either Its just how the game of basketball is designed. Great offense will always beat Great defense. The key then is to not allow “easy” baskets for the superstars and challenge every shot. I will be very interested to know if defensive schemes held over the course of a game can prove effective in deterring stars from getting the ball in their sweet spots. I wonder if the ego's we digital ballers have built up over the years of playing inferior offensive AI can handle the same truth great NBA defenders face nightly. With the elite players you can not stop them BABY! You can only HOPE to contain them. This was certainly the case during my stay in Canada. Lets hope the AI has the chops to deal with Czar and the Sim Nation after we are all well accustomed to the controls. You see I saw the blogs and heard people on the Live team make statements like they wanted to make every possession and every game feel different. I thought it was BS till I laid my hands on the sticks. From my limited playing experience. Mission accomplished ! One thing In regards to its imperfection on defense I would love to see the post defense have the ability to cause contact defending the post. As it stands the offense can have an advantage and occassionaly you can be left feeling helpless on defense. This could be a result of my lack of experience with the system. I didn't find this to be the case the entire game but it came up on a few occasions and I thought it prudent to mention. I also wish you could apply more pressure on the ball. My favorite part of defense is trying to stay in front of a great ball handler with a clumsy post player. When you get the demo make the switch off and see what I mean. It hilarious and feels as difficult as it really should be. One other note that hardly bares mentioning is that there can be an occasional slight slide when your on defense. It did not happen consistent enough in my brief time with the game to be able to put a finger on if it happens in repeatable circumstances or is just a random occurrence. Certainly it is no where near the type of sliding present in both games last year and comparitively speaking would not deserve a mention.

[Pared]

Quote: Originally Posted by loadleft

I guess this is kinda a question and a comment to the guys that are discussing the defensive rotations in the video. I read somewhere from one of the developers that there are a couple of approaches to making the difficulty settings progressively easier/harder. One would be ratings boost (which I assume is not possible in Live 10 since they don't have shot ratings) and the second would be making the defense less stout on the lower levels. This appears to be the approach that has been taken in Live 10. It seems to me that if the defense rotated and contact was forced on the easier levels (which we've been told are used for these videos) then those levels would not be easy. I guess they could just allow the offensive players to score over good defense but I think that would amount to a ratings boost. So my question is how would the lower levels be easy if the defense rotated to the ball and defended the offense properly? It's like when I play basketball with my kids, to make it easy for them I pretend to be slower than they are and can't jump higher than they can even though I an a foot taller. If I played them with straight up D how would they score? I guess my thought is that in some way the game has to be easier on the lower level and if it's not with weaker poorer rotating D how would you guys make it easier? Let me end this by saying I am not trying to start an argument but I seen you guys discuss this topic in a couple of other threads and it just got me wondering: "Well how else would you make the game easier on lower levels?"

You pick a good choice. Slower to react, less successful in attempts. Standing there is not the answer.

pbz,

If you don't have anything to offer on the video, stop posting.

[pbz06]

Quote: Originally Posted by Pared

You pick a good choice. Slower to react, less successful in attempts. Standing there is not the answer. pbz, If you don't have anything to offer on the video, stop posting.

Everything I said was about the video

I think "23" basically said everything else that was needed to say...maybe you should listen to him because he's spot on

I think the video showed what was intended (driving the lanes, and shooting), and did it well. It's unfortunate people can't look at that without bringing on the nit-picking about off-topic items that are a non-issue.