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authentic24 · 08-28-2009, 05:29 PM

well at the end of the day forget the competition thing, because it should look like the real life sport. all the extra features mean nothing if at the end of the day it doesn't represent the sport. competition really means nothing if its something based on the real life sport they are tryin to portray.

Sleazell · 08-28-2009, 05:36 PM

I think he is right to a degree. Using the ratings systems to back up his theory is wrong however I do agree that time, money and resources (talent) are the main factors in making a great game. The problem is in business there really is no true competition. True competition is when you would go all out to beat the other guy. Businesses for the most part determine their market share and decide how much time, money and resources they should allocate to reach their targeted market share. So lets say NFL 2K did make a comeback. Why would EA pump more into development when now there is a chance they will sell less? From a true competition sense of course you would want to stomp the competitor but from the business side you wouldn't want to take the risk of spending more money and not gain a significant amount of the market share. In a genre where they have to come out with a game year after I doubt any business would dump the extra money necessary to try to truly out do their competitor (apparently game development is just damn expensive). Thus EA did the next best thing with our beloved football and bought the licensing agreements. Either way I think the consumer is hosed but at least with competition you have a choice to possibly satisfy your need to have a feature that one of the competitor didn't have.

Good article by the way. It's always good people to discussing things no matter what side of the fence they are on.

jsquigg · 08-28-2009, 05:37 PM

This is operation sports, not operation politics, and if you think this article has anything to do with capitalism or communism, then you are the one who needs to study more. Capitalism in theory ignores issues that communism addresses and vice versa. That has nothing to do with this article, and all the flamers are arguing with no data or data that is more subjective than review data. Unfortunately, the whole premise of this argument is opinion based, but if Chris were to include sales data into his argument it might speak louder than the consensus of the "experts" reviews. You can argue opinions into infinity, but money trumps opinion, which is the reason for exclusive deals in the first place.

kGinGreen · 08-28-2009, 05:42 PM

There is no competition. The OS awards are going to start looking pretty funny every year when there is only 1 game released in each genre. Do you guys really need to do awards every year any more since we all know who is going to win anyways? BAsketball is the only one up for debate because EA hasn't eaten away at 2k there yet.

vaderdog · 08-28-2009, 05:43 PM

Just a thought, but if OUR (we the consumer) gut feelings and opinions do not count as statistical data relevent to your "experiment," why would a group of "reviewers" opinions and ratings matter? It would seem to me that they are giving a rating based off solely their opinion. What makes a reviewer's opinion worthy of statistical data? And Logic Doctor is dead on, great post

RaychelSnr · 08-28-2009, 05:50 PM

jsquigg,

You are right that money is what the game publishers are after. However, this article isn't about sales data, as that isn't what we're measuring game quality here with because we all know that while Madden and FIFA are consistently the best selling sports games, they probably aren't the best sports games on the market every year. Sales definitely aren't a good measure of quality but maybe of customer acceptance?

kGinGreen · 08-28-2009, 05:50 PM

The reality is capitalism becomes socialism. It's not necessarily communism but socialism is a bridge, and all our resources are being funnelled into one entity. Yes that can create better games but it's not the foundation this country was built on. People with money ultimately call the shots which is good in some ways but it's also not good in others. They control things. Do you like Walmart? Do you think they always charge the best price possible? I don't. you wonder why inflation occurs its because all this money is being funnelled into one thing and we aren't paying for what we think we are half the time. There is a lot of stuff going on in the world that people aren't aware of. You wonder why games are $60 and gas prices are the way they are and consumers are being milked for their dollar. The reality it's not a free country. It costs money and we aren't necessarily making the decisions we think we are. Yes you tax the rich and this whole health care debate is because these things need to be paid for by someone, but it's also a control game. I think Obama has what he feels are the countries best interests at heart and i'm not against him at all, but people really should educate themselves as to what is really going on. These are just games but it's bigger than that. Do you guys know why we are fighting a war, and why you hear things like globalization? Do you understand what is really going on and why you see these large corporations trying to control markets?

RaychelSnr · 08-28-2009, 05:52 PM

vaderdog,

Because they write their opinions down and they are recorded with a rating. If you get down to the bottom of it, game reviewers are just as much of a game customer as anyone else, they are simply writing their opinions down. I'm not discounting popular opinion so much as trying to use the only method which is quantifiable. Again, if you know of a better way to measure game quality which can be measured in a meaningful way, I'm open to hear it.

08-28-2009, 05:42 PM	#60
kGinGreen Banned OVR: 23 Join Date: Dec 2008 Blog Entries: 6	Re: Competition Creates Better Games is Baloney There is no competition. The OS awards are going to start looking pretty funny every year when there is only 1 game released in each genre. Do you guys really need to do awards every year any more since we all know who is going to win anyways? BAsketball is the only one up for debate because EA hasn't eaten away at 2k there yet.

08-28-2009, 05:50 PM	#63
kGinGreen Banned OVR: 23 Join Date: Dec 2008 Blog Entries: 6	Re: Competition Creates Better Games is Baloney The reality is capitalism becomes socialism. It's not necessarily communism but socialism is a bridge, and all our resources are being funnelled into one entity. Yes that can create better games but it's not the foundation this country was built on. People with money ultimately call the shots which is good in some ways but it's also not good in others. They control things. Do you like Walmart? Do you think they always charge the best price possible? I don't. you wonder why inflation occurs its because all this money is being funnelled into one thing and we aren't paying for what we think we are half the time. There is a lot of stuff going on in the world that people aren't aware of. You wonder why games are $60 and gas prices are the way they are and consumers are being milked for their dollar. The reality it's not a free country. It costs money and we aren't necessarily making the decisions we think we are. Yes you tax the rich and this whole health care debate is because these things need to be paid for by someone, but it's also a control game. I think Obama has what he feels are the countries best interests at heart and i'm not against him at all, but people really should educate themselves as to what is really going on. These are just games but it's bigger than that. Do you guys know why we are fighting a war, and why you hear things like globalization? Do you understand what is really going on and why you see these large corporations trying to control markets? Last edited by kGinGreen; 08-28-2009 at 05:57 PM.

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08-28-2009, 05:29 PM	#57
authentic24 Banned OVR: 22 Join Date: Jul 2009 Blog Entries: 6	well at the end of the day forget the competition thing, because it should look like the real life sport. all the extra features mean nothing if at the end of the day it doesn't represent the sport. competition really means nothing if its something based on the real life sport they are tryin to portray.

08-28-2009, 05:36 PM	#58
Sleazell Rookie OVR: 2 Join Date: Aug 2009	I think he is right to a degree. Using the ratings systems to back up his theory is wrong however I do agree that time, money and resources (talent) are the main factors in making a great game. The problem is in business there really is no true competition. True competition is when you would go all out to beat the other guy. Businesses for the most part determine their market share and decide how much time, money and resources they should allocate to reach their targeted market share. So lets say NFL 2K did make a comeback. Why would EA pump more into development when now there is a chance they will sell less? From a true competition sense of course you would want to stomp the competitor but from the business side you wouldn't want to take the risk of spending more money and not gain a significant amount of the market share. In a genre where they have to come out with a game year after I doubt any business would dump the extra money necessary to try to truly out do their competitor (apparently game development is just damn expensive). Thus EA did the next best thing with our beloved football and bought the licensing agreements. Either way I think the consumer is hosed but at least with competition you have a choice to possibly satisfy your need to have a feature that one of the competitor didn't have. Good article by the way. It's always good people to discussing things no matter what side of the fence they are on.

08-28-2009, 05:37 PM	#59
jsquigg MVP OVR: 16 Join Date: Nov 2003 Blog Entries: 1	This is operation sports, not operation politics, and if you think this article has anything to do with capitalism or communism, then you are the one who needs to study more. Capitalism in theory ignores issues that communism addresses and vice versa. That has nothing to do with this article, and all the flamers are arguing with no data or data that is more subjective than review data. Unfortunately, the whole premise of this argument is opinion based, but if Chris were to include sales data into his argument it might speak louder than the consensus of the "experts" reviews. You can argue opinions into infinity, but money trumps opinion, which is the reason for exclusive deals in the first place.

08-28-2009, 05:43 PM	#61
vaderdog Rookie OVR: 5 Join Date: Jul 2009	Just a thought, but if OUR (we the consumer) gut feelings and opinions do not count as statistical data relevent to your "experiment," why would a group of "reviewers" opinions and ratings matter? It would seem to me that they are giving a rating based off solely their opinion. What makes a reviewer's opinion worthy of statistical data? And Logic Doctor is dead on, great post

08-28-2009, 05:50 PM	#62
RaychelSnr Executive Editor OVR: 57 Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 4,846 Blog Entries: 490	jsquigg, You are right that money is what the game publishers are after. However, this article isn't about sales data, as that isn't what we're measuring game quality here with because we all know that while Madden and FIFA are consistently the best selling sports games, they probably aren't the best sports games on the market every year. Sales definitely aren't a good measure of quality but maybe of customer acceptance?

08-28-2009, 05:52 PM	#64
RaychelSnr Executive Editor OVR: 57 Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 4,846 Blog Entries: 490	vaderdog, Because they write their opinions down and they are recorded with a rating. If you get down to the bottom of it, game reviewers are just as much of a game customer as anyone else, they are simply writing their opinions down. I'm not discounting popular opinion so much as trying to use the only method which is quantifiable. Again, if you know of a better way to measure game quality which can be measured in a meaningful way, I'm open to hear it.

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Competition Creates Better Games is Baloney