Madden NFL 10: Updated Running Animation

[mrprice33]

but wait a second, those running animations are all without the ball. the bad ones are all ball-carrier based, aren't they?

so is it possible those are in the game, but you just didn't notice them due to them being specific routes?

edit: exactly at the poster above. they did custom throwing styles and kicking styles on top of everything else. who knows what changed running styles can do? what if they have different run styles but they can't get the collision to match up, or the ball to match up, or any one of 1000 different things? would you all rather have pretty running with goofy/weird outcomes?

[SoxFan01605]

Quote: Originally Posted by NFLHITMAN

Running Animations should have been #1 on priorities for Madden 06-07-08-09 & 10. Like I said in the 1st running animations thread a looooong time ago...This should have been #1, #2, and #3 before Hand Warmers, Chain Gangs, Refs and Fluff.

I think it's more a question of what they can get done more than priority. I doubt they sat around and said "I know running animations need work, but F that...we gotta get towels!"

I think, if we are to take Ian at his word, they did what they could, but given the work it needed (in relation to it's cooperation with other systems) it only garnered minimal attention.

I agree to an extent with your point. It should be a priority over fluff. It was right to put it behind OL/DL interaction, WR/DB jostling, AI logic, etc though IMO.

Of course, I'd have to see the level of improvement in those other areas before I can 100% claim it worked.

[beau21]

Quote: Originally Posted by SoxFan01605

I think it's more a question of what they can get done more than priority. I doubt they sat around and said "I know running animations need work, but F that...we gotta get towels!"

Agreed.

[NFLHITMAN]

Quote: Originally Posted by SoxFan01605

I think it's more a question of what they can get done more than priority. I doubt they sat around and said "I know running animations need work, but F that...we gotta get towels!" I think, if we are to take Ian at his word, they did what they could, but given the work it needed (in relation to it's cooperation with other systems) it only garnered minimal attention. I agree to an extent with your point. It should be a priority over fluff. It was right to put it behind OL/DL interaction, WR/DB jostling, AI logic, etc though IMO. Of course, I'd have to see the level of improvement in those other areas before I can 100% claim it worked.

Actually the guy who does the animations posted that he had a chance to redo the running animations in Madden 10 but opted to to 9 man gang tackling so they did say as you posted....

"I doubt they sat around and said "I know running animations need work, but F that...we gotta get towels!"

I will look up the anim8tors thread on it.

[NFLHITMAN]

Quote: Originally Posted by SoxFan01605

I think it's more a question of what they can get done more than priority. I doubt they sat around and said "I know running animations need work, but F that...we gotta get towels!" I think, if we are to take Ian at his word, they did what they could, but given the work it needed (in relation to it's cooperation with other systems) it only garnered minimal attention. I agree to an extent with your point. It should be a priority over fluff. It was right to put it behind OL/DL interaction, WR/DB jostling, AI logic, etc though IMO. Of course, I'd have to see the level of improvement in those other areas before I can 100% claim it worked.

This post is right from the guy who does the animations on Madden 10.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anim8or

	I would love some more feedback on this from you guys. (Animation Director of Madden (Simon) Here BTW). The stiffest cycles I went through personally and touched up myself over the last month or so (which was after this video was captured I believe, and the sprinter run cycles were the ones I gave the most love to with some back and forth with Ian Cummings). FIFA locomotion is amazing, coming from FIFA they spend more time on locomotion than anything else, it's pretty much what FIFA is and they do it better than any game in the world ever has. I am planning/hoping to take their entire locomotion engine next year (it was on the table this year but I felt prioritizing gang tackles would be much more of a game changer and the animation and technical work associated with going from 3 to 9 man gang tackling was pretty immense). Running changes would be purely visual and i really wanted to finish the tackle engine design (2 years in the making) and we wanted much better blocking plus presentation focus was a huge thing from the community. However, we have loads of cycles we could tune up visually, it's certainly not too late for that. I would like to know of other games that do it better visually as comparison for visual style in the cycles themselves that you guys are talking about, some youtube videos would be a huge help (of games with better run cycles). Even pointing out the moments in our trailer where you think they look bad... To me the WR and DB at the end look great running together and since our loco system got a complete overhaul last year with a lot of positive response we focused on other areas this year (can't redo loco every year...), but maybe I have just be staring at this stuff for too long... More feedback (clips of games that do it better, or pointing out where in our video it looks particularly bad would help us narrow down what you guys are directly talking about here).

I am posting the Anim8tors original post and in no way am I attacking this man. I am just pointing out that it was a decision on 9 man gang tackling or running animations and they chose 9 man gang tackling instead.

[SoxFan01605]

^^^That's contrary to your previous point though. That's not prioritizing over "fluff"...that's prioritizing needs. You may disagree with the order of precedence, and that's fine (I'm sure we all have our own ideas on that). But that's separate from your original argument that they chose "fluff" like hand warmers, chain gangs, etc. I would hardly call tackling animations fluff.

As I alluded earlier, sometimes prioritization comes down to balancing quality AND quantity. As much as I agree that running animations need work, I would be sorely disappointed if that was ALL that got improved from an animation standpoint. I also think people could make a pretty fair argument that tackling animations needed every bit the work it apparently got, but that's obviously subjective and separate from the point.

EDIT: and Anim8tor's post basically addresses that. It's the amount of work involved in relation to what's addressed that was a key determinant in the why running animations was pushed back.

They both required too much work to get them both done. It wasn't the secondary stuff that pushed it out, but another needed, primary feature.

[NFLHITMAN]

Quote: Originally Posted by SoxFan01605

^^^That's countering your previous point though. That's not prioritizing over "fluff"...that's prioritizing needs. You may disagree with the order of precedence, and that's fine (I'm sure we all have our own ideas on that). But that's separate from your original argument that they chose "fluff" like hand warmers, chain gangs, etc. I would hardly call tackling animations fluff. As I said, sometimes prioritization comes down to balancing quality AND quantity. As much as I agree that running animations need work, I would be sorely disappointed if that was ALL that got improved from an animation standpoint. I also think people could make a pretty fair argument that tackling animations needed every bit the work it apparently got, but that's obviously subjective and separate from the point.

I understand your thoughts and opinion but how many threads on OS over the years has been about Running Animations? Compare that to anything else on this forum or any other forum for that matter when it comes to game development and I bet there is a 5-1 ratio with running animations being the 5.

This is obviously is a huge issue with gamers that play any game and especially when we all play Madden. Like I said " I have Madden 10 already paid for because I see the improvements and like them" I just wish as many others that the Running Animations are the #1 priority over every thing else in the game.

" You would not put new rims, tint, paint, neon light and more on a car when the Engine itself does not work "

Fix the engine 1st than make it pretty!

[NFLHITMAN]

Quote: Originally Posted by SoxFan01605

^^^That's contrary to your previous point though. That's not prioritizing over "fluff"...that's prioritizing needs. You may disagree with the order of precedence, and that's fine (I'm sure we all have our own ideas on that). But that's separate from your original argument that they chose "fluff" like hand warmers, chain gangs, etc. I would hardly call tackling animations fluff. As I alluded earlier, sometimes prioritization comes down to balancing quality AND quantity. As much as I agree that running animations need work, I would be sorely disappointed if that was ALL that got improved from an animation standpoint. I also think people could make a pretty fair argument that tackling animations needed every bit the work it apparently got, but that's obviously subjective and separate from the point. EDIT: and Anim8tor's post basically addresses that. It's the amount of work involved in relation to what's addressed that was a key determinant in the why running animations was pushed back. They both required too much work to get them both done. It wasn't the secondary stuff that pushed it out, but another needed, primary feature.

I don't really think that 9 man gang tackling is a need at all