Madden 09 Mondays Week 5: See All of the Action With the New Cam

[seanmac]

Quote: Originally Posted by BezO

Ha! I wasn't a lineman, but I played QB in highschool. It was my job to know blocking assignments better than anyone on the field. Our lineman were not taught to stand around on pass plays. They were taught that if no one showed, punch/help to their assigned side. If our RG's responsibility was head up to outside, he would help to the right if no one showed. But they were also taught to keep their head on a swivel in case of a stunt. It was all timing, part of what gives a line cohesion & chemistry. A stunting DL would show in a second or so. Odds are, if you've taken your steps and no one shows, it's safe to help. There was never a time when our coaches wanted a lineman standing around ready to do nothing. Looking at those photos, it's clear there's no one for either of those linemen to block. They should be helping. I don't see NFL lineman standing around. Even on 3-man rushes, everyone is hitting someone. Now that I say all of that, maybe EA's double team blocking mechanic can't handle offensive linemen helping. But the visuals sure are pretty. Whenever EA gets the gamplay & animations on that level, they'll have a gem on thier hands.

Right, and this is something that you will literally never see in EA's football engine. They don't even seem to have animations for interior linemen sliding over to help out. All of the interactions are strictly one-on-one, so a blocker will stand around doing nothing, wait for a defender to beat his man and then step up to try to block the defender one-on-one. It's the height of absurdity.

[coogrfan]

Quote: Originally Posted by seanmac

Right, and this is something that you will literally never see in EA's football engine. They don't even seem to have animations for interior linemen sliding over to help out. All of the interactions are strictly one-on-one, so a blocker will stand around doing nothing, wait for a defender to beat his man and then step up to try to block the defender one-on-one. It's the height of absurdity.

I'm not sure what you mean here. I know I saw numerous instances in Madden 08 (360) where 2 players would double team a dl at the snap, and then depending on the situation one of those players would slide off and block someone at the next level.

[poster]

So there are only two camera options in game? Only the garbage cam from last year and this new cam? Am I incorrect in assuming that from reading the blog?

[seanmac]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

Well just to clarify what I meant, I didn't mean that the OL should just stand there and do absolutely nothing, as you say they should be looking on a swivel to assist if needed. My point was that in the pics they show, there really is not any defenders that I saw that the guys should be moving to pick up. It looks like they have the situation under control. I do 100% agree Madden needs work in this area, just saying that a lot of people seem to berate certain things about the game that aren't perfect but aren't as flawed as they like to mock the game about.

No, it's a serious, serious problem. After spending a lot of time flipping back and forth between NFL games and the replay modes in Madden and APF, I'd say that the passing physics/quarterback drops and animations, the OL/DL interaction and the blocking AI and the WR/CB interaction at the line of scrimmage and down the field are problems 1, 1A and 1B, and that they are all major problems. Having hand towels? Now that's a minor problem. But much of Madden simply doesn't simulate what it is supposed to be simulating.

[seanmac]

Quote: Originally Posted by coogrfan

I'm not sure what you mean here. I know I saw numerous instances in Madden 08 (360) where 2 players would double team a dl at the snap, and then depending on the situation one of those players would slide off and block someone at the next level.

On run blocks. It literally never happens in pass protection.

[Pared]

Quote: Originally Posted by seanmac

On run blocks. It literally never happens in pass protection.

This is very true. Pass protection has had the same blocking for what seems like years.

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

Well just to clarify what I meant, I didn't mean that the OL should just stand there and do absolutely nothing, as you say they should be looking on a swivel to assist if needed. My point was that in the pics they show, there really is not any defenders that I saw that the guys should be moving to pick up. It looks like they have the situation under control.

Yeah, but they shouldn't be waiting for someone to defeat a block before they help. The idea is to go double someone if you don't have anyone to block... at least that's how my coaches taught. If my highschool OL coach saw someone standing around like that on film, they'd be doing machine gun drills the next practice. My coach wanted you hitting someone, even it was just a punch to help the initial blocker control the defender.

From what I've seen in the NFL, linemen never stand around. Even on a 3-man rush, everyone is blocking someone.

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

I do 100% agree Madden needs work in this area, just saying that a lot of people seem to berate certain things about the game that aren't perfect but aren't as flawed as they like to mock the game about.

I don't think this is one of the things over criticized. I've seen lineman standing around like that while the QB took a sack. They don't go to help until it's too late, if at all. The blocking AI has been pretty bad in the past. They have a long way to go if this is supposed to look like what we see on Sundays.

Maybe folks won't feel the need to drop back 20 yards if they could trust all of their linemen to block someone.

[BigD]

That grass sure looks good.