Ping: Referees

Poli · 09-15-2013, 09:31 PM

Team A has the ball on Team B's 30 yard line and it is 3rd and 10.

Team A attempts to throw a hitch pass that hits the ground. A referee starts to call the pass incomplete, begins to blow into his whistle and stops.

Team B has a player pick up the ball and attempt to throw it to the referee. The referee moves out of the way and the ball travels 20 yards to the 50 yard line. Team A recovers the ball.

Sort this mess out.

Here's how it broke down for us:

Spoiler

Logan · 09-15-2013, 09:33 PM

How does the referee reconcile the ball hitting the ground as a result of a forward pass, and then going backwards however many yards?

TroyF · 09-15-2013, 09:41 PM

Not a ref, but if he's going to rule this a fumble and the ball is picked up by the defense, that's a change of possession and new downs no matter how the play ends.

I believe a forward pass after a change of possession is a five yard penalty from the spot of the foul.

Maple Leafs · 09-15-2013, 10:04 PM

How do you begin to blow into your whistle and then stop? I mean, it either makes a noise or it doesn't, right?

britrock88 · 09-16-2013, 12:53 AM

And the forward throw of the ball by the defending player is illegal, too.

Poli · 09-16-2013, 05:23 AM

Inadvertent whistle on the incomplete pass/lateral should make this a 4th and 10 on the 30 for Team A as far as I'm concerned.

Logan and Troy, near as I can tell, he ruled that Team B's player continued the play with that pass being a 'loose ball'. Which is about impossible, since he picked up the ball and threw it to the referee.

At that point, when he takes possession of the ball, it is Team B's ball. It is an illegal forward pass. Team B's ball at around the 27 or after the penalty.

It's all moot, though. The whistle killed the play. That's the very reason B's player (my player, FWIW) threw the ball back to the referee. The half hearted whistle can be heard on the film. Instead of a 'confident' long blown whistle, it came out for about a second and was definitely cut short.

revrew · 09-16-2013, 10:37 AM

IMO, If the whistle sounded, it's sounded. No such thing as a "half-whistle."

Also, since it sounded, the ref should have the personal integrity to say, "My bad, inadvertent whistle. Sorry, Team B."

corbes · 09-17-2013, 07:48 PM

If you blow the whistle at all, play stops. Period.

Dr. Sak · 09-17-2013, 08:14 PM

He either blew the whistle and calls it an incomplete pass or had an inadvertent whistle which means A has the choice to accept the result of the play or replay the down.

09-15-2013, 10:04 PM	#4
Maple Leafs Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2002	How do you begin to blow into your whistle and then stop? I mean, it either makes a noise or it doesn't, right? __________________ Down Goes Brown: Toronto Maple Leafs Humor and Analysis

09-16-2013, 05:23 AM	#6
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	Inadvertent whistle on the incomplete pass/lateral should make this a 4th and 10 on the 30 for Team A as far as I'm concerned. Logan and Troy, near as I can tell, he ruled that Team B's player continued the play with that pass being a 'loose ball'. Which is about impossible, since he picked up the ball and threw it to the referee. At that point, when he takes possession of the ball, it is Team B's ball. It is an illegal forward pass. Team B's ball at around the 27 or after the penalty. It's all moot, though. The whistle killed the play. That's the very reason B's player (my player, FWIW) threw the ball back to the referee. The half hearted whistle can be heard on the film. Instead of a 'confident' long blown whistle, it came out for about a second and was definitely cut short. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

09-16-2013, 10:37 AM	#7
revrew Team Chaplain Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Just outside Des Moines, IA	IMO, If the whistle sounded, it's sounded. No such thing as a "half-whistle." Also, since it sounded, the ref should have the personal integrity to say, "My bad, inadvertent whistle. Sorry, Team B." __________________ Winner of 6 FOFC Scribe Awards, including 3 Gold Scribes Founder of the ZFL, 2004 Golden Scribe Dynasty of the Year Now bringing The Des Moines Dragons back to life, and the joke's on YOU, NFL! I came to the Crossroad. I took it. And that has made all the difference.

09-17-2013, 07:48 PM	#8
corbes College Benchwarmer Join Date: Nov 2003	If you blow the whistle at all, play stops. Period. Last edited by corbes : 09-17-2013 at 07:48 PM.

09-15-2013, 09:33 PM	#2
Logan Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: NYC	How does the referee reconcile the ball hitting the ground as a result of a forward pass, and then going backwards however many yards?

09-15-2013, 09:41 PM	#3
TroyF Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Not a ref, but if he's going to rule this a fumble and the ball is picked up by the defense, that's a change of possession and new downs no matter how the play ends. I believe a forward pass after a change of possession is a five yard penalty from the spot of the foul.

09-16-2013, 12:53 AM	#5
britrock88 Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Madison, WI	And the forward throw of the ball by the defending player is illegal, too.

09-17-2013, 08:14 PM	#9
Dr. Sak Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Stuck in Yinzerville, PA	He either blew the whistle and calls it an incomplete pass or had an inadvertent whistle which means A has the choice to accept the result of the play or replay the down.

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