Traveling to Russia

[sterlingice]

Ok, we're starting to get this one off the ground a little so I'd love any help (it's going to be posted to a couple of different places which is why it sounds like it starts over next paragraph). Castlerock, I'd especially love to see you pick this apart and help out with your expertise:

(moved from here: travelling to europe - Front Office Football Central)


My wife and I are planning a trip to Russia in April/May timeframe next year. Some of the hard stuff is taken care of: airline miles to get there and 5 days of hotel each in Moscow (Courtyard Paveletskaya) and Petersburg (Courtyard St. Petersburg Center West/Pushkin Hotel) through Marriott points. We're looking to be there 2-2 1/2 weeks and have never been to Russia before. We both know a little Russian but it's going to be rusty at best, inadequate at worst.

The simple structure is fly into Moscow and stay 5 nights there, take the train to St Petersburg and do 5 days there, return to Moscow and then fly back. However, we also are looking to add a few days to the trip, either between Moscow and Petersburg or after returning from St Petersburg. Below is the results of our brainstorms: lists of items we would like to do tho not an intinerary: we're just working on winnowing the list down and planning the days. Also, any items we're missing that are can't misses or personal favorites?

Moscow:
-Red Square (St Basils), Kremlin (Armoury, Diamond Fund), Bolshoi Theatre, Tretyakov Gallery, Pushkin Museum, Gorky Park, Patriarch Pond, Gum, Space Monument and Museum, Additional churches (Church of the Great Ascension? Cathedral of Christ the Savior?), Kuskovo Estate, Izmailovsky Market/Old Arbat/Tverskaya Street (souvenirs); Novodevichy/New Maiden Convent and Cemetery; Lenin's mausoleum
-The first day, we're looking at getting a guide for a day to help show us around the city and get us acclimated. Then we'll work in the rest in an order that makes sense spatially and time-wise
-We'd love to do a show at the Bolshoi but tickets seem hit and miss

St Petersburg:
-St Petersburg: The Hermitage/Winter Palace, Russian Museum, Peter and Paul Fotress, Mariinsky Theater, Nevsky Prospekt
-Can the Hermitage be done in a day if you only speak limited Russian? I remember feeling somewhat rushed at the Met in NYC and the Vatican spending "only" a day at each. Same idea here where it might be better ot plan a day and a half?
-Tickets for the Mariinsky (vs Bolshoi) seem more "available" (tho expensive); Ideally we'd like to do a show at each- say, an Opera at one and Ballet at the other
-I assume the 4 hour high speed train is the way to go between the two cities

Day Trip Questions:
-My wife is really into Russian literature and wants to do a day trip out the Tolstoy estate (Yasnaya Polyana). Is this a full day? Is there other stuff to do out that direction?
-Are there any day trips out from St Petersburg? I just don't see a whole lot. I'd love to do something related to being close to the Arctic Circle- something out in nature- but I didn't see anything easily accessible.
-Speaking of which, are there any good "national park" equivalents near where we are going to be? I'd love a chance to go see wildlife or see something unique that's safe for tourists and gets some non-urban flavor.
-Another quality candidate seems to be to hit up one of the Golden Ring cities- train out there, tour the city, maybe spend a night, head back to Moscow. It seems like all have good churches and town squares. Are there any that have something that sets it apart from the others?
-What about the Trans-Siberian Railroad? Is it worth it to head out to Yaroslavl or another city for a day and head back?

Additional Questions:
-May 9th looks like a huge national holiday. I've even heard there are a lot of places open that are not open any other day of the year. Is this a good thing to be there for first time visitors where you would get to see something interesing like parades and other celebrations? Or is it something that would be more of a hassle where everything is crowded, it bogs down the city, and/or Russians don't really want to "share" the holiday with foreigners and it's better to leave before that?
-Our idea of night life is going to shows (want to do Bolshoi and Mariinsky) or sporting events. For instance, we both love going to baseball games and I'm up to 20 stadiums (19 for her). Is there something we would enjoy seeing? It looks like the KHL season would be done by then. What about basketball, soccer, or something else? And is it safe for foreigners?
-We're looking for a mix of different activities that work for those with limited Russian. This trip so far looks pretty museum heavy (tougher when you don't know the language), monument heavy (doesn't take too long), and light on most else (a couple of shows but that's about it). Normally, we'd hit up, say, a zoo for a change of pace but the reviews are pretty bad and we don't really want to waste our time there. What else could we see to add some variety?

Beyond that, we're just looking for any other great ideas- like that great site off the beaten path that was very much worth visiting. We're also wanting to know about general pitfalls like the fact that getting a visa appears to be a pretty big hassle.

SI

[Izulde]

Since your wife is really into Russian literature: Ìóçåé Íàáîêîâà â Ïåòåðáóðãå

I don't know if it's worth visiting or not - I just know that I was bitterly disappointed I couldn't go to this because my tour group had a very packed, tight schedule that didn't allow for the side trip.

[JediKooter]

In Russia, the party brings the vacation to you.

[Castlerock]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

We both know a little Russian but it's going to be rusty at best, inadequate at worst.

The more Russian that you know the better. Both spoken and written. You will not find many English speakers or English signs outside of St Petersburg (or at western hotels). To be able to see a sign for 'Красная площадь' and to know that reads 'Red Square' will aid a lot.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Moscow:
-Red Square (St Basils), Kremlin (Armoury, Diamond Fund), Bolshoi Theatre, Tretyakov Gallery, Pushkin Museum, Gorky Park, Patriarch Pond, Gum, Space Monument and Museum, Additional churches (Church of the Great Ascension? Cathedral of Christ the Savior?), Kuskovo Estate, Izmailovsky Market/Old Arbat/Tverskaya Street (souvenirs); Novodevichy/New Maiden Convent and Cemetery; Lenin's mausoleum

St Basils is one of my favorite buildings in the world. The area in/around Red Square is the main tourist area in Moscow. Definite must see. The Bolshoi was closed every time I was there but my wife was there in 1987 (before the fall of the Soviet Union) and she enjoyed it. Should be even more spectacular now. Have heard good things about the Pushkin Museum as well as Gorky Park. Tverskaya Street is not really for souvenirs unless you buy Cartier (or the like) as souvenirs. Ultra-high-end. You will want to see it because it's famous but... eh. Arbat was much more interesting. The Gum department store was also interesting. It's high-end now but when my wife was there in 1987, just about all you could buy there was rough wool socks. I always wanted to go see one of the Seven Sisters (7 Stalinist-style highrises) but I don't know how tourist friendly they are. Moscow is not a city I would describe as 'friendly'. :-)

Originally Posted by sterlingice

-The first day, we're looking at getting a guide for a day to help show us around the city and get us acclimated. Then we'll work in the rest in an order that makes sense spatially and time-wise
-We'd love to do a show at the Bolshoi but tickets seem hit and miss

A guide with a car would be very nice. Just beware that traffic in Moscow is a nightmare 24 hrs a day. Also, take a ride on the Metro. It is stunning and efficient.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

St Petersburg:
-St Petersburg: The Hermitage/Winter Palace, Russian Museum, Peter and Paul Fotress, Mariinsky Theater, Nevsky Prospekt
-Can the Hermitage be done in a day if you only speak limited Russian? I remember feeling somewhat rushed at the Met in NYC and the Vatican spending "only" a day at each. Same idea here where it might be better ot plan a day and a half?

I spent a day at the Hermitage. You cannot see even a fraction in a day. Similar to the Vatican/Met. Not speaking Russian will not be problem anywhere in St Petersburg. Loved strolling Nevsky Prospect. Be sure to see 'Church of the Savior on Spilled Blood'. There are so many palaces, museums, churches, bridges, etc to see If it were me, I'd spend more time in 'Peter' as the locals call it and less time in Moscow. If you can get an guide to show you around St Petersburg, that would be nice. There are lots of statues and things with stories behind it that a guide can show you. Like the statue between St Isaacs and one of the palaces with its ass facing the palace to tweak someone (I forget who) living in the palace. Also see the Catherine Palace, Smolny Cathedral, the canals through out the city. If you can, be there for the White Nights Festival (sometime in June). No end of things to see here.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

-I assume the 4 hour high speed train is the way to go between the two cities

I think, yes.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Day Trip Questions:
-My wife is really into Russian literature and wants to do a day trip out the Tolstoy estate (Yasnaya Polyana). Is this a full day? Is there other stuff to do out that direction?
-Are there any day trips out from St Petersburg? I just don't see a whole lot. I'd love to do something related to being close to the Arctic Circle- something out in nature- but I didn't see anything easily accessible.
-Speaking of which, are there any good "national park" equivalents near where we are going to be? I'd love a chance to go see wildlife or see something unique that's safe for tourists and gets some non-urban flavor.
-Another quality candidate seems to be to hit up one of the Golden Ring cities- train out there, tour the city, maybe spend a night, head back to Moscow. It seems like all have good churches and town squares. Are there any that have something that sets it apart from the others?
-What about the Trans-Siberian Railroad? Is it worth it to head out to Yaroslavl or another city for a day and head back?

Day-trips outside of the city, I can't really help on. Just know that a lot of Russia is very, very poor. There are the rich, the poor, and the dirt poor. That said, my time spent in the non-urban Russia was closer to Siberia.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

-Our idea of night life is going to shows (want to do Bolshoi and Mariinsky) or sporting events. For instance, we both love going to baseball games and I'm up to 20 stadiums (19 for her). Is there something we would enjoy seeing? It looks like the KHL season would be done by then. What about basketball, soccer, or something else? And is it safe for foreigners?

I would think that a hockey game would be best as they love hockey. My guess is that it would be safe for foreigners but I would keep a low profile. Hard to do as you will stick out like a sore thumb.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Beyond that, we're just looking for any other great ideas- like that great site off the beaten path that was very much worth visiting. We're also wanting to know about general pitfalls like the fact that getting a visa appears to be a pretty big hassle.
SI

Getting a Visa can be a hassle. We used a consulting service but we generally needed expedited service.

If you have a black leather jacket, bring that. Every male in Russia seems to wear black leather. Women are dressed to the nines at all times.

The Moscow airport is quite a way outside of the city. We always had a driver meet us and it was not cheap. There is the usual swarm of people offering rides just as you pass through customs but I would advise not using any of them.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Castlerock

The more Russian that you know the better. Both spoken and written. You will not find many English speakers or English signs outside of St Petersburg (or at western hotels). To be able to see a sign for 'Красная площадь' and to know that reads 'Red Square' will aid a lot.

My wife's second degree is in Russian but she was never quite fluent because she didn't spend any time there. Also, didn't know square was feminine. Stupid soft symbol That said, I'm going to be struggling a lot more than she will.

St Basils is one of my favorite buildings in the world. The area in/around Red Square is the main tourist area in Moscow. Definite must see. The Bolshoi was closed every time I was there but my wife was there in 1987 (before the fall of the Soviet Union) and she enjoyed it. Should be even more spectacular now. Have heard good things about the Pushkin Museum as well as Gorky Park. Tverskaya Street is not really for souvenirs unless you buy Cartier (or the like) as souvenirs. Ultra-high-end. You will want to see it because it's famous but... eh. Arbat was much more interesting. The Gum department store was also interesting. It's high-end now but when my wife was there in 1987, just about all you could buy there was rough wool socks. I always wanted to go see one of the Seven Sisters (7 Stalinist-style highrises) but I don't know how tourist friendly they are. Moscow is not a city I would describe as 'friendly'. :-)

Thanks for all the advice. Are we talking about New York unfriendly or New York if it was horribly xenophobic unfriendly? I suspect it's more of the latter. This would be a departure from everywhere I've visited in the past (Turkey, Italy, Colombia) that was quite tourist friendly.

A guide with a car would be very nice. Just beware that traffic in Moscow is a nightmare 24 hrs a day. Also, take a ride on the Metro. It is stunning and efficient.

I don't think I want to drive Moscow at all and that includes as a passenger. The guides we were looking at meet you at the hotel and you take the Metro as that's part of the tourist experience.

I spent a day at the Hermitage. You cannot see even a fraction in a day. Similar to the Vatican/Met. Not speaking Russian will not be problem anywhere in St Petersburg. Loved strolling Nevsky Prospect. Be sure to see 'Church of the Savior on Spilled Blood'. There are so many palaces, museums, churches, bridges, etc to see If it were me, I'd spend more time in 'Peter' as the locals call it and less time in Moscow. If you can get an guide to show you around St Petersburg, that would be nice. There are lots of statues and things with stories behind it that a guide can show you. Like the statue between St Isaacs and one of the palaces with its ass facing the palace to tweak someone (I forget who) living in the palace. Also see the Catherine Palace, Smolny Cathedral, the canals through out the city. If you can, be there for the White Nights Festival (sometime in June). No end of things to see here.

With life getting in the way, we're looking more at that April/May timeframe. Also, it's before the tourist season so we should have better crowds than summer and I'm fairly pleased with that. So no luck on the festival. Thanks for helping with suggestions to flesh out the St Petersburg portion of the trip. We had done more Moscow as it was first on our list and we ran out of time Saturday.

Day-trips outside of the city, I can't really help on. Just know that a lot of Russia is very, very poor. There are the rich, the poor, and the dirt poor. That said, my time spent in the non-urban Russia was closer to Siberia.

I would think that a hockey game would be best as they love hockey. My guess is that it would be safe for foreigners but I would keep a low profile. Hard to do as you will stick out like a sore thumb.

I believe the KHL finishes the season in February or March, so before we get there, unfortunately. I was looking forward to checking it out and I think my wife was not looking forward to trying to talk me out of it. I'm still a little annoyed that I never got to see soccer when I was in Italy or bullfighting in Colombia so I wanted to give this a go.

Getting a Visa can be a hassle. We used a consulting service but we generally needed expedited service.

If you have a black leather jacket, bring that. Every male in Russia seems to wear black leather. Women are dressed to the nines at all times.

The Moscow airport is quite a way outside of the city. We always had a driver meet us and it was not cheap. There is the usual swarm of people offering rides just as you pass through customs but I would advise not using any of them.

No leather jacket. Flyer Talk seems to have a couple of preferred Visa assistance services which give good results so I was going to give one of them a go.

If there's a decent Metro from DME to the center of town, I suppose that's an option. There's a Metro about 3 blocks from our hotel but I'm not sure I want to rely on that to bring all of our luggage from the airport.

SI

[Castlerock]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Thanks for all the advice. Are we talking about New York unfriendly or New York if it was horribly xenophobic unfriendly? I suspect it's more of the latter. This would be a departure from everywhere I've visited in the past (Turkey, Italy, Colombia) that was quite tourist friendly.

Compared to Moscow? New York is downright hospitable. Think of muscovites as soviet DMV employees. I was in Red Square early on a Sunday morning with my wife and young son. I asked a couple passing by to take a photo of us in front of St Basil's. The response? 'Nyet' and they kept walking. I don't really understand it because the Russians that I know are very nice.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I don't think I want to drive Moscow at all and that includes as a passenger. The guides we were looking at meet you at the hotel and you take the Metro as that's part of the tourist experience.

You do NOT want to be driving but a passenger is fine. The Metro is great and with a guide will not be intimidating at all. But since you appear to know a good deal of Russian, you will be a lot better off than I was. The cyrillic-only signs on the first full day were intimidating.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

If there's a decent Metro from DME to the center of town, I suppose that's an option. There's a Metro about 3 blocks from our hotel but I'm not sure I want to rely on that to bring all of our luggage from the airport.

I never flew in/out of Domodedovo (always Sheremetyevo). Looks like there is a rail link to Paveletsky station which is not far from your hotel. You would need to get a cab to the hotel. I'm not sure if there is an 'official' taxi stand there or not. If there is no official taxi stand, you may find yourself dealing with the 'unofficial' taxis (which is anyone with a car) and trying to figure out which is which. My advice would be to pay the money to have a driver meet you at the airport. At least for the first day of the trip.

[sterlingice]

I don't expect too many problems with the Metro. Yes, there is the issue that it's in another language, but we were really comfortable with DC's and Chicago's and have used the NYC subway and BART extensively when we visited those cities. Our plan is to use mass transit and walking within the cities and trains to get between the cities.

SI

[sterlingice]

So... anyone else know anything about Russia (specifically traveling there)...?

I almost feel like I should turn this into a dynasty

SI

[Castlerock]

We used:
Russian American Consulting Corp.
45 West 34th Street, Suite 703
New York, NY 10001

to process our visas. You don't need to but it is easier.

[RPI-Fan]

It looks like Russia is funneling all of its tourist visas through a new private servicer: INVISA LOGISTIC SERVICES USA

Total cost (with consular and service fees) is $235 per person. (INVISA LOGISTIC SERVICES USA.) It looks like you cannot apply more than 90 days BEFORE you travel. ("Russian tourist visa applications are accepted only within 90 days of the proposed entry date to Russia. Please apply only within 90 days of the date of travel." Russia Visa: Application, Requirements. Apply for Russian Visas Online..)

[sterlingice]

Oh, that's annoying (re: 90 days). There used to be quite a few decent ones- about $200 apiece but they'd get the job done.

Must be one of Putin's family members or donors who run it.

SI

[sterlingice]

Update: Our trip is only a couple of weeks away.

The vaunted Visa process wasn't too awful- on par with a trip to the DMV, which for something Russian is like a win, I think. Fortunately, since there is a consulate in Houston, there is also a local branch of Invisa, too. It only took one try of "do we have all the paperwork" "no, you need this, this, and this" before we had turned everything in and they had it back to us in 7 days, as promised.

It's going to be 5 days in Moscow, 5 in St Petersburg, and another 6 in Moscow. However, 2 of those later Moscow days are going to be a day and back to Suzdal. We also would have liked to work in a trip to Yasnaya Polyana but they are not answering their emails and we don't want to do the 3 hour drive there and back without an English tour in hand. If anyone has any contacts or knows a good way to get in touch with them, I'd love to know.

I'm a little bummed because I wanted to go to Luzhniki Stadium for a soccer game. However, the home game the week we are arriving is the day before we arrive and the one the week we are leaving is the day before we leave so we may not get a chance. Also, the KHL season is already over. Doesn't leave a lot for sporting events. We have tickets to both a ballet and opera each for the Bolshoi and Mariinsky. We are in the equivalent of maximum nosebleed for the Bolshoi ballet (upper balcony towards the side, second row) as anything on the floor or first balcony ran from $150-$400.

One thing that is concerning us is laundry. It seems like there is nowhere to do laundry and with international luggage limits and over 2 weeks of clothes, well, it's going to make for interesting packing. At the Marriott we're staying at, it's $8 for a pair of socks and goes up from there so that's not really an option. We have some "spare" time in Moscow- I'd really prefer to see if we can do something there but all my searches have come up with nothing. Laundromats just aren't a way of life there: either you have a washer and dryer or you sink and tub wash things.

Speaking of expensive, there's tours. We want to make the most out of our time there and are willing to pay a premium for that. In Moscow, we found a very well reviewed tour company that's in our price range and visits a lot of what we want to see so we're using them for four of our days: Moscow Private Tours - City tours in Moscow with personal guides. Cost is $200 per day for both of us, which is a lot, but when you break it down to you're basically paying $20-25 an hour to someone in a strange city you don't know where most costs are on par with New York, that's a valuable service and worth the price.

St Petersburg is another matter entirely. Due to the crazy cruise industry they do, there is a ton of competition but it just seems to make things more expensive. While Trip Advisor only had a couple of highly rated Moscow companies with a lot of feedback, Petersburg had almost 20. And to make things more complicated, one of the days we are there has about 12K passengers in town, from what we've been told. We can join a tour of up to 16 for $150 per day or private tours start around $400 per day (I had one well known company quote me $2000 for a standard 3 day itinerary). We're thinking of getting a private guide for 1 day to show us around the city and get us out to Catherine's Palace since it's a bit of a haul but then do the rest on our own. We didn't end up staying at the Marriott there and instead used the points in Moscow so we're staying at a little converted apartment building hotel which was reasonable and well reviewed right in the heart of the city, about 2 blocks from St. Isaac's. This puts practically everything in walking distance. This part is the only big thing that is still driving me nuts.

A bonus of our stay there is that it's International Museum day on Saturday May 18th, which they call "Museum Night" so a lot of museums are open 1800-2300, which will give us an extra partial day of seeing things. Any suggestions off of the list of things that might be good for English speakers since I think pretty much everything will be in Russian. We figured something like the circus or zoo or botanical garden might be good since it's mostly visual anyway:
Музеи на карте города | �очь музеев, Санкт-Петербург

So there we are- we're getting packed and getting ready. We arrive at 2pm on May 10th, nonstop IAH-DME on Singapore air. That's a 12 hour plane ride but I guess if we're going to do it, Singapore Air is the way to go. And that means only having to fight jetlag for about 6 hours before being able to get back on a good sleep schedule.

SI

[saldana]

make sure you have a nice healthy helping of Cok every morning for breakfast

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by saldana

make sure you have a nice healthy helping of Cok every morning for breakfast

I dunno. Do you think it will be fresh and safe to drink? (sorry, that's as innuendo-y as I could take this joke)

SI

[saldana]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I dunno. Do you think it will be fresh and safe to drink? (sorry, that's as innuendo-y as I could take this joke)

SI

hahaha...i have a picture that would make this joke much funnier, but i dont have a website to link it to...its on my phone from my layover at shermetoyvo last fall

[sterlingice]

Leaving later on this week. Mostly packed and almost ready to go.

Not expecting to post from Russia to FOFC, tho- a bit concerned about identity theft there.

SI

[DaddyTorgo]

Nice - have fun Sterlingice - take a ton of pics!!

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Nice - have fun Sterlingice - take a ton of pics!!

That will certainly happen. I think on each of my last 2 international trips, I topped 2K pics.

SI

[vex]

Sounds like a great trip!

[Young Drachma]

Veselites'!

[sterlingice]

Oh, yeah- so got back on the day before Memorial Day. Still catching up from being gone for over 2 weeks.

SI