Bo and Herschel

[dawgfan]

I'm sure there are plenty of people that know this already, but I just realized after doing a little looking back at their careers that Bo Jackson and Herschel Walker are basically the same age. Pretty amazing to think that two of the most gifted athletes ever to play football are the same age and played in the same conference in college after growing up relatively close to each other in Alabama and Georgia (respectively).

Both are guys I'd think of as "once in a generation" type talents, but obviously there were at least two in their generation, if not many more. Perhaps this simply serves to show that there are more phenomenally talented football players at any one time than we give credit for, and it's just that Bo and Herschel made good on their potential.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Perhaps this simply serves to show that there are more phenomenally talented football players at any one time than we give credit for, and it's just that Bo and Herschel made good on their potential.

Hmm ... I think you could get pretty good arguments that neither really lived up to their potential, in spite of relatively successful careers.

That's maybe more frightening in some ways than anything else.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Hmm ... I think you could get pretty good arguments that neither really lived up to their potential, in spite of relatively successful careers.

That's maybe more frightening in some ways than anything else.

That's an interesting argument for sure. I guess I meant to the extent that both were stars in the pros, as opposed to other phenomenally talented guys that might have never made it to the pros or were basically non-entities in the pros.

Herschel probably fell a little short, though the hype around him was going to be really difficult to live up to. I wonder how much of his best years were spent in the USFL? He also wasn't done any favors with the trade to Minnesota where he went to a coaching staff that wasn't thrilled with getting him and for a ridiculous haul in return that was clearly beyond what he was actually worth.

Bo I suppose fell short, but only in the sense that injury cut short his career. He was a pretty good baseball player, and he probably would be a Hall of Famer in the NFL had he prioritized football and stayed healthy longer.

I notice that Eric Dickerson is only a couple years older than Bo and Herschel; I'm not sure if I'd qualify his physical talent as equal to them, but if he falls short in that area, it's only just barely.

More and more I'm coming around the idea that, as spectacular as Bo and Herschel were as athletes, they weren't as unique as I might have originally thought.

[QuikSand]

Always hard to say with true clarity after so long, but I'm pretty sure that Herschel as a sophomore was the best I ever saw run the ball.

[Comey]

And Barry Sanders is what, 4-5 years younger? I'd classify that as the same generation too.

That's pretty damn good.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

More and more I'm coming around the idea that, as spectacular as Bo and Herschel were as athletes, they weren't as unique as I might have originally thought.

And see, I think that had Bo played football only and not got injured (I know, I know ifs and buts, etc.) he would have destroyed every major NFL record and put them so far out of the stratosphere that we would queston whether anyone would ever catch Emmitt for 2nd. I truly think Bo could have rushed for 2500+ every year given a 16 game season and you know a real training camp.

Herschel on the other hand was just what I would consider very good, not great.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Herschel probably fell a little short, though the hype around him was going to be really difficult to live up to. I wonder how much of his best years were spent in the USFL? He also wasn't done any favors with the trade to Minnesota where he went to a coaching staff that wasn't thrilled with getting him and for a ridiculous haul in return that was clearly beyond what he was actually worth.

The Minnesota coaching staff used him in such a ridiculous way he really didnt have a chance for success. They constantly tried to run him out of split back sets which didnt allow his great vision and speed to be an asset. Them few times they actually ran him out of the eye formation he was very good. It became so bad later in his career that he was only finding success at a kick returner and running draw plays. Its sad how horrible the Vikings were at utilizing his tremendous talent.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I truly think Bo could have rushed for 2500+ every year given a 16 game season and you know a real training camp.

Um, no.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

And see, I think that had Bo played football only and not got injured (I know, I know ifs and buts, etc.) he would have destroyed every major NFL record and put them so far out of the stratosphere that we would queston whether anyone would ever catch Emmitt for 2nd. I truly think Bo could have rushed for 2500+ every year given a 16 game season and you know a real training camp.

Herschel on the other hand was just what I would consider very good, not great.

Someone played too much Tecmo Bowl. Bo could be spectacular, but overall he was more hype than reality. Here's a stunning fact...Bo never rushed for even 1,000 yards in a season. In 38 career games, he rushed for 100 yards in only 8 of those games. He carried the ball 20 times in 5 games...and rushed for 100 in only 1 of those.

He was a great situational runner, witnessed by his 5.4 career YPC. But there's no evidence that he could have withstood the pounding of even being the primary running back for a team, never mind shouldering the load to run for 2,000+ yards or "destroying every major NFL record".

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by Comey

And Barry Sanders is what, 4-5 years younger? I'd classify that as the same generation too.

That's pretty damn good.

Thurman Thomas too.

[BishopMVP]

Marcus DuPree as well.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Always hard to say with true clarity after so long, but I'm pretty sure that Herschel as a sophomore was the best I ever saw run the ball.

He was just at such a different level as a college player relative to those around him. First one I remember as a kid. His 1985 season with New Jersey in the USFL gets discounted, but it was ridiculous.

[kcchief19]

Hershel's punished unfairly for his three years in the USFL. Add his three years in the USFL to this NFL totals and he had almost 14,000 yards rushing. Despite putting up three redonkulous years in the USFL, he still retired No. 2 all-time in the NFL in total net yards including yards from scrimmage and return yardage.

As noted earlier, if he hadn't had a horrible coaching staff and a team that never dug out of the hole created by his trade in the first place, his numbers in Minnesota would have been much better. I have a hard time arguing that Herschel didn't live up to his potential -- he lived pretty darn close.

Bo was just sick. One fluke tackle robbed us of watching a guy who could have made the hall of fame in both sports. Bo was well on his way to becoming a 40-homer a year guy, and he would have been 32 when MLB started juicing the ball in 1995 and probably become a 50-60 homer guy. He would have easily cleared 500 homers, maybe 600.

Bo had a pretty decent chance at maybe rushing for 8,000 career yards in just part-time duty. Had he played full-time, I have no doubt he could have put up in the ballpark of 1,600-plus pretty regularly. You rush for 5.5 yards per carry and you can get a lot done.

Here's all you need to know about Mike Shanahan as a coach -- he went 7-9 with Bo and Marcus Allen in the same backfield. Art Shell went 12-4. If Shanahan and Alex Gibbs had perfected cut blocking about five years earlier, who knows what Bo could have done? Bo would know.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

Bo had a pretty decent chance at maybe rushing for 8,000 career yards in just part-time duty. Had he played full-time, I have no doubt he could have put up in the ballpark of 1,600-plus pretty regularly. You rush for 5.5 yards per carry and you can get a lot done.

A couple of reasons that Bo's YPC is great is that he played at the end of the season when defenders are more worn down and Marcus Allen/Steve Smith did much of the short-yardage dirty work. That's part of the reason why Bo only had 16 rushing TDs in 4 years. Most people don't remember that Bo wasn't an every down back and even in his biggest year he didn't average of 16 carries per game - and that's barely 250 carries projected to a 16 game season. To suggest that he could keep that average up while being a full-time RB and doing the short-yardage dirty work is a pretty long stretch.

Simply put, he was spectacular...but his greatness is rather debatable once you start looking at the stats and truly remembering how he was used in the Raiders offense.