Kill a Cop for God

[judicial clerk]

Punk band's use of slain officer's photo blasted
January 15th, 2009 @ 7:01pm
by Associated Press

TUCSON, Ariz. - The Arizona Daily Star has acted to halt the unauthorized use of a slain police officer's photo to illustrate a punk rock album that the newspaper and Tucson police call offensive, its editor said Thursday.

The local band, called Awful Truth, used a photo of officer Erik Hite, shot last year, lying on the ground with officers aiding him.

Hite died after being shot by a gunman during a crosstown chase.

Star Executive Editor Bobbie Jo Buel said MySpace.com had removed the album - called ``Kill a Cop for God'' - because of a copyright violation.

Another Web site also removed the self-published album that it was selling on consignment for about $6 a copy. Buel said there has been no decision whether to pursue legal action over the copyright violation.

``We are absolutely outraged and disgusted'' that a band would glorify killing police officers, police spokesman Lt. Rick Middleton said. He hailed the newspaper's action, saying police were pleased with the Star's commitment over the copyright violation.

Singer David Stine said the five-member band's first album was released last month and about a dozen copies have been sold. He called the title ``just a joke'' that emanated from men's room graffiti that said, ```Kill a cop for God, Kill a judge for Jesus.'

``We thought that it was funny. The song is kind of a fan favorite, and so we made it the album's name. We saw that picture in the Daily Star, and it fit.''

Stine, 30, did not apologize if anyone was offended and said he had no regrets.

``That's what punk rock is all about,'' he said. ``It's loud, offensive music - key word offensive. If you don't think it's funny then you don't have to laugh, you don't have to look at the album, you don't have to listen to the song.''

One song apparently honors ``the cop killers'' and names John Montenegro Cruz, who killed a Tucson officer in 2003, and Hite's accused killer, David Delich.

``We're very serious in all cases about protecting our copyright, and in this case it just goes beyond that to being very offensive, and it has to stop,'' Buel said.

Police and many readers were critical last year of the Star's having published the photo, but the newspaper defended its use as helping report a major news event and inform the public.

Middleton said the album was ``not a criminal action. I think it's just a heartless act on their part to glorify the killing of public servants.''

Police learned about the album only after responding to an aggravated assault Sunday on the band's drummer while playing at a Tucson club.

``Now they want the police to investigate this crime and prosecute,'' Middleton said.



Cops have to put up with a lot of BS.

[flere-imsaho]

Surprised this wasn't about Fred Phelps.

[kcchief19]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Surprised this wasn't about Fred Phelps.

He probably wrote the original graffiti that inspired the song.

[Lathum]

I am conflicted about this.

I in no way condone the killing of any police officer ( or anyone for that matter).

But why should the paper profit off it but a punk band get slammed for doing the same thing.

I also agree the punk is about rebelling against the system, etc... but I think this takes it a little to far.

[Shkspr]

Originally Posted by judicial clerk

Police learned about the album only after responding to an aggravated assault Sunday on the band's drummer while playing at a Tucson club.

``Now they want the police to investigate this crime and prosecute,'' Middleton said.

I certainly hope they do. What better way to demonstrate that policemen operate on a higher ethical plane than the crappy band that mocks them than to ensure that they continue to protect and serve all of their citizens rather than just those they don't find offensive?

[MrDNA]

Incredibly tasteless, but I defend their right to do it. If it was my dead father or brother on the cover, however, I would do everything I could to make life painful for anyone profiting from his death (band and newspaper)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

But why should the paper profit off it but a punk band get slammed for doing the same thing.

Maybe I'm missing something about the photo here but ... who benefits more from (what seems to have been) a standard photo that goes with a story about the murder of a police officer: the newspaper or law enforcement who would be much more humanized by the presence of a picture than by being an anonymous name in a mass of text?

Sorry but I'm not seeing where the presence of the usual mug shot style photo of a cop is going to sell a single extra copy of anybody's print edition.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by Lathum

But why should the paper profit off it but a punk band get slammed for doing the same thing.

Because the paper owns the rights to the photo, and as such can prevent others from using it?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Maybe I'm missing something about the photo here but ... who benefits more from (what seems to have been) a standard photo that goes with a story about the murder of a police officer: the newspaper or law enforcement who would be much more humanized by the presence of a picture than by being an anonymous name in a mass of text?

Sorry but I'm not seeing where the presence of the usual mug shot style photo of a cop is going to sell a single extra copy of anybody's print edition.

Because according to the story it wasn't a "mug style" photo as you described it.

The picture was a crime scene photo of other officers around the fallen cop.

If you don't think that picture sold extra papers your nuts.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by digamma

Because the paper owns the rights to the photo, and as such can prevent others from using it?

from a copywrite standpoint I completely agree.

From a moral standpoint I don't agree with those outraged over the band using it.

[Shepp]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Maybe I'm missing something about the photo here but ... who benefits more from (what seems to have been) a standard photo that goes with a story about the murder of a police officer: the newspaper or law enforcement who would be much more humanized by the presence of a picture than by being an anonymous name in a mass of text?

Sorry but I'm not seeing where the presence of the usual mug shot style photo of a cop is going to sell a single extra copy of anybody's print edition.

The photo was of the wounded officer right after it happened. I think this is the photo:
hxxp://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.azstarnet.com/ss/2008/06/02/241816-1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.azstarnet.com/allheadlines/241816&usg=__UvcwEzaJWNCnxCqdMQitFXXPHR4=&h=203&w=300&sz=45&hl=en&start=18&um=1&tbnid=UdSgJGCU-nhqHM:&tbnh=78&tbnw=116&prev=/images%3Fq%3DErik%2BHite%2Barizona%2Bdaily%2Bstar%2Bphoto%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:*%26sa%3DN

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

If you don't think that picture sold extra papers your nuts.

And if you think that picture (as you describe it) actually moved a significant number of copies then I'd say you're nuts.

Rule 1: Relatively few people buy newspapers any more
Rule 2: There's virtually nothing you can do to change rule #1.

The only sort of single photo that's going to help move copies is something that's part of a keepsake style edition (as many papers are likely to do this coming week). I'm just not picturing anybody outside of immediate family or co-workers sticking back a copy of that edition to save.

[Danny]

I agree with Jon. The people who are going to buy the paper buy it. That picture didn't convince those who don't buy it to change their minds.

[Lathum]

shrug

I guess we'll agree to disagree

[Danny]

In that past I would agree, but the newspaper just isn't relevant anymore in that way I don't think.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Danny

In that past I would agree, but the newspaper just isn't relevant anymore in that way I don't think.

OK, I'll put it differently.

The paper put that picture in there for shock value, it really holds no news purpose.

The band did the same thing, shock value.

[Danny]

In that case, if they took their own picture then it would be no different I guess. But if the newspaper owns the rights to the picture, then the band shouldn't be using it.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Danny

In that case, if they took their own picture then it would be no different I guess. But if the newspaper owns the rights to the picture, then the band shouldn't be using it.

And this is the only thing anyone involved did wrong.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by RendeR

And this is the only thing anyone involved did wrong.

Other than offer their support to cop killers & then ask for the police to intervene on their behalf on their own affairs.

These aren't punks making a statement, they're posers trying to fake it.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Other than offer their support to cop killers & then ask for the police to intervene on their behalf on their own affairs.

These aren't punks making a statement, they're posers trying to fake it.

So what? its their right to speak any way they wish. If you don't like it, don't buy the cd. They have every right to be served and protected by the police no matter what their albums look like or say.

They infringed on a copyright, nothing more. Anything relating to what their music says is irrelevant to the discussion.

I disagree with 90% of the shit rap crap that is published, but I support their right to create such crap.

I support the rights of the Nazi skinheads to march and speak their opinions, it doesn't make me a Nazi. I think they're morons and hope the gene pool is free of them someday, but they have every right in this country to speak their minds.

This case is no different. Using that specific image was pathetic, tasteless and in my mind a mistake, but the only thing that is wrong with it in fact is that they stole it from the newspaper.

[BYU 14]

They do have the freedom to use the photo, but that freedom doesn't grant them immunity from the ramifications that come with it in whatever backlash the image invokes against them (And that does not mean the police would not protect and serve them)

Like Jon said, these guys are posers just trying to get attention and they did that, so they need to deal with it. What the hell did they expect kudos for the powerful statement of putting a slain officers picture on their CD, his colleagues, family and the general public have a right to upset, it was tasteless shit.

And the fact that this guy is 30 and still trying to get his punk band off the ground says it all. His quote "Punk is loud offensive music" is true. It is also true that was started as an outlet for disgruntled young men in their late teens and early 20's lashing out at society. Thirty something is when you start deciding what you want to be when you grow up and selling about a dozen copies of your shitty garage band CD means that probably wont be music career.

[Raiders Army]

The newspaper had more than one story that day, I'd reckon; this lessens the exploitation impact. The band, not so much.

[Cringer]

I support the band in this for the most part, though there is little way to get around the copyright so they are screwed there.

I won't comment on anything else since I don't know the history of the cop killing case or the band members. Details in both of those areas could swing me either way very easily. No info there means making things up to rant on about these guys for no reason, like their career choice or if they are posers.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

The newspaper had more than one story that day, I'd reckon; this lessens the exploitation impact. The band, not so much.

I totaly disagree with this statement.

I am sure the paper had other stories, but what is the circulation on the paper?

That picture reached far more people because of the paper then the bands CD ever could.

It would probably have to be a gold record to reach as many for the band

[Schmidty]

Sometimes I think people argue just to argue around here. And it's always the same people.

[remper]

Originally Posted by judicial clerk

Singer David Stine said the five-member band's first album was released last month and about a dozen copies have been sold.


Cops pay attention to a lot of BS.

There are ALWAYS going to be people/bands/organizations that say outrageous things. This particular band sold 12 copies of their album in a month. This news story only helps their sales, if anything.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Sometimes I think people argue just to argue around here. And it's always the same people.

isn't that the point of a message board?, dipshit.

and there is a difference between arguments and discussions.

This thread is a discussion, no onr is going crazy on anyone else and everyone is respecting each others opinions.

What you and I are about to have is an argument

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Lathum

isn't that the point of a message board?, dipshit.

and there is a difference between arguments and discussions.

This thread is a discussion, no onr is going crazy on anyone else and everyone is respecting each others opinions.

What you and I are about to have is an argument

[Lathum]

glad you picked up on the humor.


dumbass.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by remper

There are ALWAYS going to be people/bands/organizations that say outrageous things. This particular band sold 12 copies of their album in a month. This news story only helps their sales, if anything.

This is what I take from the whole incident, as well.

[Crim]

Lathum v. Schmidty

This might be good.

[Autumn]

Weren't any of you guys Dead Kennedy fans? I had the sticker on my Walkman, the Boy Scout at the gravestone. Isn't that the nature of youth, to be callous about death? It's horrible for those who knew that police officer, but it's just a joke to these kids. Some day they'll grow up and perhaps feel a bit different.

I agree with the sentiment that they can do what they want, and should be free to, and should (and undboubtedly do) expect backlash.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I am conflicted about this.

I in no way condone the killing of any police officer ( or anyone for that matter).

But why should the paper profit off it but a punk band get slammed for doing the same thing.

I also agree the punk is about rebelling against the system, etc... but I think this takes it a little to far.

1) The paper took crap for publishing the photo. As others have said, it didn't have a huge impact on profit. Papers just don't sell anymore. How many extra papers do you think it really sold? 1k? 10k? 20k? the paper has a daily circulation of about 117k. If they got an extra 1k people to buy the paper I'd be stunned. That's an extra 500 bucks.

2) The paper holds the copyright to the photo. Regardless of economic impact, the band has to purchase the rights to use it They didn't and got slapped down.

I love how the band calls the cops because of an assault on the drummer. Spout off the garbage, honor cop killers, be controversial and then you want them to help investigate a case for you? That's rich.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Autumn

but it's just a joke to these kids. Some day they'll grow up and perhaps feel a bit different

The "kid" singer is 30 years old.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

The "kid" singer is 30 years old.

I'm speaking maturity, not age. The guy's job is to live out adolescent rebellion, I'll give him a few extra years.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by TroyF

I love how the band calls the cops because of an assault on the drummer. Spout off the garbage, honor cop killers, be controversial and then you want them to help investigate a case for you? That's rich.

You do realize that the police take an oath to protect and serve?

They don't have an option to choose who they respond to and who they don't. If they did we may as well exist in a state of anarchy.

Your last statement just blows my mind. Do you understand that if they wanted to have a white power rally it is totaly in their right and if police protection was required and there were black cops they would be required to offer that protection?

Say what you want about copywrites, morality, etc... People who are saying it's silly that the drummer expected the police to investigate the crime against him have no concept of our criminal justice system.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

People who are saying it's silly that the drummer expected the police to investigate the crime against him have no concept of our criminal justice system.

And people who don't see the hypocrisy in his desire have no concept of what the hell is going on.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

And people who don't see the hypocrisy in his desire have no concept of what the hell is going on.

never said the drummer isn't being hypocritical, but to think he is outside his rights to expect their assistance is just ludicrous.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Lathum

You do realize that the police take an oath to protect and serve?

They don't have an option to choose who they respond to and who they don't. If they did we may as well exist in a state of anarchy.

Your last statement just blows my mind. Do you understand that if they wanted to have a white power rally it is totaly in their right and if police protection was required and there were black cops they would be required to offer that protection?

Say what you want about copywrites, morality, etc... People who are saying it's silly that the drummer expected the police to investigate the crime against him have no concept of our criminal justice system.

I guess you missed the sarcasm.

I do understand the police protect and serve. There is zero doubt in my mind they'll do everything they can to help this jack ass. I only hope the moron decides to stop honoring cop killers in his bands music as payback.

I still find the irony and humor in this rich. People like these band members make me hope karma really exists.