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#1 | ||
College Prospect
Join Date: Dec 2003
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High School Coach never punts, wins state title
Rivals High - Arkansas coach punts traditional game plan
As a high school O coordinator, I loved this story. Don't think I would ever be able to convince my head coach to do this, or expect the D coordinator to talk to me ever again if we did. |
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#2 |
General Manager
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: The Mountains
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I read some kind of scholarly study a while ago that argued that teams go for it on 4th down WAY too infrequently. It was a statistical analysis. Having 25% more downs than your opponent is a huge advantage,
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#3 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: San Jose, CA
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I wonder what football would be like if they just completely did away with punts and field goals. More boring, or more exciting?
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Look into the mind of a crazy man (NSFW) http://www.whitepowerupdate.wordpress.com |
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#4 | |
Death Herald
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Le stelle la notte sono grandi e luminose nel cuore profondo del Texas
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Quote:
Here ya go: http://elsa.berkeley.edu/%7Edromer/p..._CORRECTED.pdf
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Thinkin' of a master plan 'Cuz ain't nuthin' but sweat inside my hand So I dig into my pocket, all my money is spent So I dig deeper but still comin' up with lint |
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#5 |
Death Herald
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Le stelle la notte sono grandi e luminose nel cuore profondo del Texas
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Dola,
QuikSand will spontaneously orgasm during the reading of the article. ![]()
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Thinkin' of a master plan 'Cuz ain't nuthin' but sweat inside my hand So I dig into my pocket, all my money is spent So I dig deeper but still comin' up with lint |
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#6 | |
College Prospect
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Quote:
thank you this is awesome, going to send to my kindle and read all 43 pages - I love this kind of stuff. |
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#7 |
FOFC's Elected Representative
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: The stars at night; are big and bright
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I read it, it seems like a long time ago. I always go for it, but most 11-12 year old teams do.
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"i have seen chris simms play 4-5 times in the pros and he's very clearly got it. he won't make a pro bowl this year, but it'll come. if you don't like me saying that, so be it, but its true. we'll just have to wait until then" imettrentgreen "looking at only ten games, and oddly using a median only, leaves me unmoved generally" - Quiksand |
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#8 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Maryland
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TMQ has been advocating this for a couple years.
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#9 |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
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I'm waiting for the first coach to figure out that they should go for two points every time.
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#10 | |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Back in Houston!
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Fun read- skimmed/read through most of it. The third down/fourth down thing could be a problem with the logic but it makes sense.
Quote:
I'm of that belief, but I thought someone statistically proved that in the NFL, there's something like a 46% return rate on 2pts vs 99% on 1pt so the expected rate of return was actually higher on extra points (.46*2 = .92 vs .99*1 = .99) versus 2 point coversions. In college where the spread offense is prevalent due to speed not being universally fast and short yards being easier to gain, this may not be the case. Anyone have the link to that study? SI
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Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!" Last edited by sterlingice : 12-29-2008 at 10:24 PM. |
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#11 |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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High School Coach never punts
That seems odd to you? Where I'm from they always had a student punt, never the coach. SHURG.
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There are no houris, alas, in our heaven. |
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#12 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Quote:
What about Mike Leach and Texas Tech? hxxp://www.statesman.com/sports/content/sports/stories/other/10/15/1015tech.html Last edited by Galaxy : 12-30-2008 at 12:11 AM. |
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#13 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Great Northwest
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Quote:
Can't you do that with maximum football? |
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#15 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: San Jose, CA
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Quote:
Cheeser.
__________________
Look into the mind of a crazy man (NSFW) http://www.whitepowerupdate.wordpress.com |
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#16 |
lolzcat
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
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#17 |
Death Herald
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Le stelle la notte sono grandi e luminose nel cuore profondo del Texas
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I'm there for you.
Not literally there, that would be awkward, but, well, you know what I mean.
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Thinkin' of a master plan 'Cuz ain't nuthin' but sweat inside my hand So I dig into my pocket, all my money is spent So I dig deeper but still comin' up with lint |
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#18 | |
General Manager
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Town of Flower Mound
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Quote:
Umm, no. Mike Price has shown me several times over the past couple of years that going for unnecessary two point conversions can lose games for you... ![]()
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UTEP Miners!!! I solemnly swear to never cheer for TO |
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#19 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Georgia
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I don't think you should always go for two, but I've been harping for a while that the current theory on conversions is assinine, and numbskull announcers don't help matters. Apparently the only time you're allowed to go for two now is if you're down by two and you just scored with no time left on the clock.
I've always felt that if you're down by 15, you should go for 2 right away. That way, you'll either be down by 7 or 9 and will know that you have to speed up or slow down for your next drive.
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Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added) Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner Fictional Character Draft Winner Television Family Draft Winner Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner |
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#20 | |
Banned
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Astoria, NY, USA
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Quote:
more exciting. going for it on 4th down in your own territory and not converting basically hands the other team a free td. i've said for the longest time i hate field goals - i wish they'd change the rule that field goals can only be used to tie a game, but not win it. it's such a cheap way to win a game. look at this hypothetical game scenario that plays out all too often: the score is 14-9, Giants are down 5 pts to the Eagles and march down the field for a 80 yard td, and go up by 2 pts. score is 16-14, Giants lead. Eagles return the kickoff and only have to get to the 30, 25 yard line to kick the FG and win the game 17-16. so cheesy. i hate it. but to respond to the title of the thread, its the DC's responsibility to stop the other team. when i play Madden i pray for the kids i'm competing against to be stupid enough to go for it on 4th down, if they don't make it then i get great positioning on the field. call the right defensive play, make the stop and get the ball back. it's beneficial for both teams if the offense goes for it on 4th down. its the only down where execution is the only thing that matters. |
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#21 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Georgia
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In HA's scenario, I would personally put out a death warrant on Tom Coughlin for not going for a two point conversion there.
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#22 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Quote:
Don't allow the Eagles to return it back to the 30 yard line. |
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#23 |
Banned
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Astoria, NY, USA
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that's easy to say. so in one scenario the Eagles defense has to stop the Giants from going 80 yards, and the Giants defense has to stop the Eagles from only going the 50, 55 yards to kick a simple 3 point FG. one isn't as challenging as the other and the team that doesn't have the bigger challenge shouldn't get to escape a loss by opting for the less challenging FG. that's just my opinion.
Last edited by Anthony : 12-30-2008 at 02:13 PM. |
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#24 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Georgia
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Quote:
This is stupid. The situation is like this because the Eagles had the lead earlier in the game. The Giants opted for the less challenging FG's earlier, while the Eagles went the length of the field and scored two TD's. And again, the Giants deserve to lose in this scenario because they didn't go for two.
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Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added) Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner Fictional Character Draft Winner Television Family Draft Winner Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner Last edited by larrymcg421 : 12-30-2008 at 02:33 PM. |
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#25 | |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Back in Houston!
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Quote:
Amen. But, as someone said in a thread about this a while ago, coaches who do this are treated by announcers and fans like child molesters. In a situation where information is at a premium, paying .05 points (.99 to .94) to determine how you should much more wisely proceed with the rest of the game seems like a really good idea. SI
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Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!" |
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#26 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Appleton, WI
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Quote:
Announcers and fans care much more about excitement and hope. In a situation down 15 with the ball, you can realistically hope for 2 scores but not 3. If you score the 7 first, there is still hope of tying with the second score. If you miss the 2-point conversion, hope is pretty much gone. Much more exciting if the 2-point happens on the last play. |
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#27 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: The scorched Desert
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I have a new Idol!!!
I went and looked at my game breakdowns this season. We punted 7 times in 9 games and I went for it on 4th down 19 times and the kids converted on 12 of them. On 7 of those attempts we ended up scoring. 3 of the failures were inside our 40, but we gave up no points. We allowed 2 TD's after being stopped on 4th down, one of which was a 99 yard drive by the other team (See ugly Deer Valley game in my diary of this season) The other one was a 52 yard drive. The Head varsity coach did comment that I went for it on 4 and 6 inside our 30 once that I had balls..........or was out of my F****** mind! an easy reply for me.....I trust our defense more than our long snapper ![]() |
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