Bill Cosby

[Fidatelo]

I got the chance to catch Bill Cosby perform live tonight, and it sure was a real treat. He gave me a pretty good scare when he started off extremely slow, not finishing sentences, randomly skipping topics, and not making any jokes. I honestly started to feel awkward, like maybe he was going senile and nobody had the heart to tell him.

Thankfully, he started to warm up after about 15 minutes, and just got better and better as the show went on. In all he performed for an hour and 45 minutes, which I feel is an impressive amount of time for a 70 year old guy doing his second show of the evening. He has an amazing delivery, and is fascinating to listen to (in my eyes, anyways). I don't know anything about him as a person beyond what I've seen on TV over the years, but he really feels like one of those rare people that I could just pull up a chair beside and listen to him ramble for days on end.

Anyways, I'm very thankful that I was able to see him perform at least once in my lifetime. Ironically, going to the show was a birthday gift for my father-in-law, but right now it feels like it was as much of a gift to me.

Hats off to Mr. Cosby.

[Lathum]

we were thinking of catching him when he comes here, perhaps we will now

[Deattribution]

One of my favorite comedians of all time. He's always been able to be hilarious without falling into the f-bomb crudefest most other comedians rely on. Always seemed like a genuinely nice guy as well.

[Pumpy Tudors]

I guess the lession here is: If you're going to see Bill Cosby, show up 15 minutes late.

[PurdueBrad]

I saw him five years ago at a theatre in the round experience and he was really, really impressive. He worked the stage and crowd brilliantly. It truly was one of those things I will always be glad I did.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by Deattribution

One of my favorite comedians of all time. He's always been able to be hilarious without falling into the f-bomb crudefest most other comedians rely on. Always seemed like a genuinely nice guy as well.

maybe now, but early on he made Pryor blush....

[AZSpeechCoach]

We saw the Cos in Vegas on our anniversary about 6 years ago. Great show.

[Subby]

"Well, tell Bill I said have a Coke and a smile and shut the fuck up. Jello pudding-eating motherfucker...."

[sterlingice]

I saw him about 15 years ago at the Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo- they get the biggest and best country singers, or so I'm told (dunno, never was into country). But they also have some other acts since it's such a huge stage. He was just amazing.

He's maybe the funniest comic of modern times. As Deattribution said, he doesn't resort to the shock of blue humor. He's just very, very good and is the absolute best at universal humor. It's not a bunch of inside jokes and referential humor- it's genuinely funny and all people get it and understand it. He has some of the greatest comic bits of all time.

SI

[Kodos]

News from The Associated Press

[Butter]

Sounds like the Cos sure liked him some roofies.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Kodos

News from The Associated Press

Yeah, I believe her.

This is the same alcoholic person who has a history of mental issues and who also accused her father of being a pedophile, says she killed her father ("When my father was having a heart attack, I threw his heart pills out of the ambulance window. I killed him, but I have no regrets. It doesn't feel good, but I'd do it all over again.") and wrote something entirely different about Cosby in one of her books. In short, she has no credibility.

Frankly, I don't know if the "Cos" did anything to anyone. What sets my BS meter to about 9.5 is that every single one of them has the same exact general story (only after the first one was made public) and none of them actually describe anything about Cosby's body or the physical aspect that would even start to lend credence to their tales. None went public, reported anything to the authorities or went to a doctor. In short, these tales just seem like empty bullshit stories from people trying to get 15 minutes of fame and/or a quick buck.

[sterlingice]

Why now? Why after 20 and 30 years are a bunch of these allegations suddenly coming out at once?

SI

[jeff061]

That's generally how it happens. No one wants to be the first and only, because they just get attacked and no one believes them. Especially with a guy like this.

I have a really hard time believing Cosby didn't rape some people.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

In short, these tales just seem like empty bullshit stories from people trying to get 15 minutes of fame and/or a quick buck.

Except there are women who have come forward without giving thier names - so there is no financial or publicity angle. The fact that all of the stories are extremely similar lend credibility in my opinion - a bunch of wildy divergent stories about a rapist don't make sense. Finally, if he were innocent, and I don't believe he is, being the sanctimonious narcissist he is he'd get in front of a camera and unequivocally state how innocent he is, not slink behind his wife during an interview and just shake his head.

[Toddzilla]

Haven't we gotten past the point of using "why didn't they speak up back then?" "why did they wait so long?" or "why mention it now?" as a way to discredit the accusers?

[timmae]

My personal issue with this is the "news" stations that are spending 2 minutes of their newscast on this stuff. Once he's found guilty, fine, news blurb. Until then keep your sensationalist stories away from me.. It's why I routinely change the channel after I find out nothing near my house blew up today and there aren't any raving lunatics shooting people in the loop. Sorry, rant (and threadjack) over..

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Haven't we gotten past the point of using "why didn't they speak up back then?" "why did they wait so long?" or "why mention it now?" as a way to discredit the accusers?

You would really hope so, but apparently not.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Except there are women who have come forward without giving thier names - so there is no financial or publicity angle. The fact that all of the stories are extremely similar lend credibility in my opinion - a bunch of wildy divergent stories about a rapist don't make sense. Finally, if he were innocent, and I don't believe he is, being the sanctimonious narcissist he is he'd get in front of a camera and unequivocally state how innocent he is, not slink behind his wife during an interview and just shake his head.

Women who have come forward without giving their names? I think every one of them has given a name.

The stories are superficially similar but entirely any real specificity and anyone who corroborates any part of the tale (thus far). That bothers me because it doesn't really make sense that Cosby is supposedly carrying around the same bottle of pills for 30 years and these women all happen to ask him for drugs for some problem or another. Is this really such a common thing? Did the Cos somehow secretly concoct a knockout pill that looks like many different types of drugs, is undetectable in alcohol but allows perfect memory recall the next morning? Hell, Flunitrazepam wasn't even created until the mid-70s. I'm not saying he did it. I'm not saying he didn't. But a bunch of decades-old stories that have zero concrete evidence to them isn't going to sway me in the least. I'm a believer in evidence, not tales from the 60s and 80s. Is one true? Are all true? Are any true? Who the hell knows?

Also, if the stories weren't true, I wouldn't bother going in front of a camera and try my case in the media either. That's a no-win. If I were rich and 77 years old, I'd say "fuck 'em" and work behind my publicist and lawyers. That's what I hired them for.

Why would you say Cosby is a "sanctimonious narcissist"? Seems like you have something against him.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Haven't we gotten past the point of using "why didn't they speak up back then?" "why did they wait so long?" or "why mention it now?" as a way to discredit the accusers?

No, because decades-old accusations have no physical evidence or even corroborating evidence. At best those accusations are generally "he said, she said" and at worst they're just an attempt to get publicity at the expense of assassinating someone else's character. It's one thing when the assaulter is a family member or otherwise an authority figure and the victim is young/under aged because there can be a great deal of pressure to keep things quiet. It's another to think that a supermodel (who says she killed her father) at the height of her career would somehow get raped with physical evidence and supposedly wouldn't say anything for 30 years.

In short, I require evidence. Once decades pass, there is no evidence.

[Easy Mac]

Come on people, physical evidence is a must if someone is accused of a crime... not murder or hate crimes, but definitely any other crime

[Fidatelo]

In my original post that started this thread I wrote "I don't know anything about him as a person beyond what I've seen on TV over the years, but he really feels like one of those rare people that I could just pull up a chair beside and listen to him ramble for days on end.".

I'm not sure what to make of these accusations. If it were one or two, and the women involved seemed shady, then I'd be pretty ok with writing it off as nothing. But there appear to be something like a dozen women now making these claims. I can't help but feel that this is a case of "where there's smoke, there's fire".

This whole thing just makes me sad. Either the guy is guilty and we've all been idolizing a serial rapist as some kind of father-figure for the past 40 years, or he's innocent and he's going to be remembered by many for horrible things he didn't do. Nobody wins in any of this.

[MrBug708]

Having been around janice Dickinson a few times, I can't think of a less pleasant person I've ever met. No idea of this story is true tho

[lighthousekeeper]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Having been around janice Dickinson a few times, I can't think of a less pleasant person I've ever met. No idea of this story is true tho

I'm intrigued - what exotic circumstances would bring together a MrBug and a Janice Dickinson?

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Haven't we gotten past the point of using "why didn't they speak up back then?" "why did they wait so long?" or "why mention it now?" as a way to discredit the accusers?

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

You would really hope so, but apparently not.

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

This whole thing just makes me sad. Either the guy is guilty and we've all been idolizing a serial rapist as some kind of father-figure for the past 40 years, or he's innocent and he's going to be remembered by many for horrible things he didn't do. Nobody wins in any of this.

I'm not saying this did or didn't happen. I know enough to know I don't know a real person from their public persona. And, yes, I hope it's not true. But it's not like it's world shattering if it is, just kindof sad like many other news tragedies.

But to say there's not a vested interest in people to lie about something like this is just not true. And this seems like a really valid question now. If I were looking for money, it's not the biggest stretch in the world to go after an older rich guy and expect to get paid just to make me go away. And after the first one comes forward, rightly or wrongly, it makes it easier for both true and false claims to come forward.

SI

[thesloppy]

What a gross, disheartening story this has evolved into. 14 women is far too many for me to ignore or dismiss. On the other hand, in this day and age it's also probably too high a number to not allow for one or more being strictly publicity seekers, and/or mentally ill.

Anybody familiar with the Jimmy Savile case in the UK? Dude was subject to lots of gossiping and rumoring, but he dismissed it all easily, was never charged with anything, and lived out his life in relative peace....after which an investigation into those rumors revealed 589 alleged sexual-assault victims. Fame can be intimidating.

[miami_fan]

The Washington Post had an interesting article about this.

Bill Cosby was accused of rape eight years ago. Why is the story going viral now? - The Washington Post

Put me in the category of those who have heard about these rumors for years. I don't know if he did it or not. I think he did it but I do have my reasonable doubt. I will say that we (the public) have convicted many for much less. Ben Roethlisberger would be one example.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

Women who have come forward without giving their names? I think every one of them has given a name.

False. In a civil suit that Cosby settled out of court, there were 13 women prepared to testify that Cosby has drugged and raped them but did not since the case never went to court and therefore were never named. It's possible some of those women are some of those that have come forward recently, but that makes a majority of the women accusing Cosby those who are unnamed and not seeking fame nor fortune.

[Toddzilla]

A pretty good synopsis, echoing Fidatelo's words:

"A defense of Cosby requires that one believe that several women have decided to publicly accuse one of the most powerful men in recent Hollywood history of a crime they have no hope of seeing prosecuted, and for which they are seeking no damages. The alternative is to see one of the most celebrated public fathers of our time, and one of the great public scourges of black morality, revealed as a serial rapist."


hxxp://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2014/11/the-cosby-show/382891/

[JeeberD]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

Why would you say Cosby is a "sanctimonious narcissist"? Seems like you have something against him.

My sister-in-law worked with Cosby for a charity event she was organizing, and she would certainly agree with that assessment. She had absolutely nothing good to say about him.

[molson]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Bill Cosby was accused of rape eight years ago. Why is the story going viral now? - The Washington Post

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Why now? Why after 20 and 30 years are a bunch of these allegations suddenly coming out at once?

I think there's only two new ones, Janice Dickinson and that journalist's published essay, and those both came out after that twitter meme fiasco, which is when all this went viral again. The other accusations were scattered over the decades and they just came to life again. That twitter thing may have been the very worst celebrity PR move of all time.

There's all kinds of psychological reasons victims of sexual crimes delay disclosure or don't disclose at all. That doesn't mean they're telling the truth, but there's nothing unusual or suspicious about late disclosure. And of course, Cosby's had the other kind of accusation too - at least two people in the early 00's going to police immediately after the alleged incidents.

Sexual crimes are tough. There's almost never physical evidence even if a victim does come forward. If there's actual sex, there would be evidence of that, but usually not of lack of consent. And police are understandably reluctant to seek detention warrants on people when they know that most of these cases are not going anywhere. Slate had an article on this dynamic yesterday. I think the intended tone of this article is of course, how horrible police are for not believing every victim immediately, but these are really difficult cases.

How cops respond to rape: A new study of officers at one police department.

I think the thing to focus on from the get-go should be victim support, rather than prosecution. Prosecute if the evidence is there, of course, but I've learned you cannot tie a sex assault or domestic violence victim's well-being to the criminal justice system - they can't NEED a conviction to be able to heal and more forward, because most times, that's just not possible. More and more police departments and prosecutors' offices now have a consolidated approach with other local services in communities - when a victim comes in to talk to police about their allegations, they're ALSO simultaneously getting access to other services that aren't dependent on a charge being filed - job training, STD tests, therapy, substance abuse treatment, whatever.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I'm intrigued - what exotic circumstances would bring together a MrBug and a Janice Dickinson?

She just came into where I worked, nothing too fancy. Customer Service type of job

[Ryan S]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Anybody familiar with the Jimmy Savile case in the UK? Dude was subject to lots of gossiping and rumoring, but he dismissed it all easily, was never charged with anything, and lived out his life in relative peace....after which an investigation into those rumors revealed 589 alleged sexual-assault victims. Fame can be intimidating.

The Jimmy Savile case opened a can of worms, and now a surprising number of British celebrities have been jailed for historic sexual abuse crimes.

[SteveMax58]

Ok so didn't see this mentioned here. Apparently Cosby's brilliant social media people (I guess he has those) went & told twitter followers to "go ahead and meme me".

The Bill Cosby #CosbyMeme Hashtag Backfired Immediately

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by Ryan S

The Jimmy Savile case opened a can of worms, and now a surprising number of British celebrities have been jailed for historic sexual abuse crimes.

I fell down a rabbit-hole last month when reading about Savile and his peers, and clicking through all the related/updated links. The allegations stretched to necrophilia, corpse-robbing, and satanism....part of me couldn't stop reading, and the other part just slowly withered away and cried itself to sleep. Gross stuff. It certainly further highlighted how fame can serves as one of the best cloaks for predatory behavior.

Back to Cosby, I find the the drugging allegations particularly disgusting, as they imply making very calculated, extended plans of raping a specific person at appointed times and places, rather than a crime of immediate passion or circumstance.

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

Here's the 1969 Bill Cosby Routine About Wanting to Drug Women's Drinks | Village Voice

I wasn't sure he did it until I heard this bit. A little too much of a coincidence, kind of like how Jerry Sandusky named his biography, Touched.

[Easy Mac]

That sounds like one of the oldest bits in the book.

I guess we should ban the Beastie Boys because they rapped about it?

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

All I can say is it convinced me. It clearly didn't convince you. And your argument convinced no one.

[NobodyHere]

Weird Al made a song about Spam and he's a vegetarian.

Did I convince anyone?

[Draft Dodger]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Weird Al made a song about Spam and he's a vegetarian.

Did I convince anyone?

nope, but if a lot of people said they saw him eating meat, I'd probably start to wonder

[cartman]

I love The Onion

[Buccaneer]

Maybe Cos and Tiger Woods ought to do a road show together.

[molson]

Kenan Thompson's take on Bill Cosby from a few years ago on the Howard Stern show is amusing (should be cued up).

Howard Stern Kenan Thompson 031710 - YouTube

[Subby]

Was THE COS ever a frat bro at UVA? Asking for a friend....

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by molson

Kenan Thompson's take on Bill Cosby from a few years ago on the Howard Stern show is amusing (should be cued up).

Howard Stern Kenan Thompson 031710 - YouTube

Piling on a bit. Here's Janice Dickinson on Stern in 2006 when her book came out.

Janice Dickinson talks to Howard Stern about Bill Cosby in 2006 - YouTube

[Matthean]

Mitch Albom: Erasing Bill Cosby with the speed of light

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Mitch Albom: Erasing Bill Cosby with the speed of light

I don't know what to make of Cosby. I'd like to study it a bit longer.

But that won't stop me from publishing a column!

[Kodos]

Simple. I do my best not to support the careers of assholes. That's why I'll never watch another Mel Gibson movie.

[Toddzilla]

Has anyone stepped up to defend this guy yet?

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Has anyone stepped up to defend this guy yet?

Well, uh, he seems to have Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck on his side...