Battlestar Galactica Season 4

[ISiddiqui]

Spoilers be here and all that and I don't care about waiting for West Coasties (so there!)

You have been warned...



Well, that was the Starbuck we know and love. Though pointing a gun at the President may not be the best way to convince her that you aren't crazy. I wonder what Lee's "government" job is. Baltar's somewhat selfless intentions leading to him being uber-prophet is not going to end well... not with a man with his ego.

It was somewhat fun seeing Tigh, Chief, Anders, and Prez's assistant (what's her name) making scared eyes at each other whenever anyone mentioned if Kara could have been a Cylon.

And I wonder why the President didn't notice that the captured Six didn't really answer her question if Starbuck was a Cylon.

[RendeR]

Loved the opening episode, it certainly opens up a lot of tangent-plotlines.

I admit that they got me with the snap-shot scene of Tigh shooting Adama, I almost came out of my chair I was so pissed off. Thank god it was a dream sequence type thing =)

Not sure I like the shift in Roslyn's personality, she's gone from captain conservative to queen bitch in the last 5-6 episodes.

Can't wait for next week!!!!

[Edward64]

I *hate* the Baltar story lines. I wish they would spend the time on other plots.

What are your theories on Starbuck?

[kcchief19]

Not to mention the scene between Starbuck and Anders when he said he would still love her if she were a Cylon and and she said if he were a Cylon she would put a bullet between his eyes.

Great episode. The Christ figure role for for Baltar is interesting. Love the previews for next week showing the other cylon models discovering the final five are in the fleet and discussing what to do. Still wondering exactly what prompted the Cylons to react the way they did when they scanned Anders and apparently realized he was a Cylon.

Still not convinced Starbuck is a Cylon. Obviously we're being led to believe that possibility, so normally if she is the payoff wouldn't be much. I'm still betting on Roslyn. However, I'm still annoyed at Tigh being a Cylon since based on what we previously learned, he certainly should be too old to be one of the 12.

[Crapshoot]

Look, the final Cylon has to be one of 3 people - Starbuck, Roslin, or Adama - it just doesn't make sense for it to be anyone else. It would be a let down.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

Great episode. The Christ figure role for for Baltar is interesting. Love the previews for next week showing the other cylon models discovering the final five are in the fleet and discussing what to do. Still wondering exactly what prompted the Cylons to react the way they did when they scanned Anders and apparently realized he was a Cylon.

If I recall, I think the Cylon shock troops are programmed to not harm one of the uber-Cylons.

[Barkeep49]

Spoiler about who fifth is not:

Spoiler

Ronald Moore has stated that it is not anyone found in this picture:

I was a bit disappointed with last season, but think this season is off to a promising start and also liked the previews for next week. I knew that Tigh hadn't actually shot Adama, but I also thought that Anders was having a delusion with the Heavy Raider. I'm still a little pissed about Tigh being in the Final Four because he is too old to be a cylon and he has aged.

[bosshogg23]

Ronald Moore has intentionally mislead the audience before about future story lines, particularly regarding Starbuck near the end of last season. I would take anything he says with a grain of salt.

[Barkeep49]

My favorite theory at the moment is the idea that they're all Cylons and that the humans are long dead and that this is a Civil War that keeps repeating itself over and over.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

My favorite theory at the moment is the idea that they're all Cylons and that the humans are long dead and that this is a Civil War that keeps repeating itself over and over.

That would almost be laughable, if i didn't know that Moore was sick and twisted enough to try it....

[Ironhead]

Don't forget it is on tonight!

[Eaglesfan27]

I've been long behind on the series because of Katrina messing up season 2 for me and then having to wait for DVD releases to catch up on season 2 and then season 3. Anyway, I just caught up with the first 2 episodes of season 4. Loved them. I think season 3 and the first 2 episodes of season 4 have really picked up the pace from the earlier episodes, although I agree that I could do without the Baltar storylines right now.

Anyway, I think Starbuck has to be a Cylon. The only alternative theory I could see is if somehow people on Earth are monitoring the progress of the fleet and they somehow cloned Starbuck and sent her back to help lead the fleet towards Earth, but if that is the case, why erase the ship's computer? Why give her such spotty memories? I think the Cylon theory make much sense. Even though that is the obvious answer, I think the emotional impact will be great particularly when Adama realizes that Saul and Starbuck are Cylons. If the Rosalind dies, with Lee's departure, those two revelations (along with a much lesser extent the relevation of Chief) would probably threaten to push him over the edge.

[Barkeep49]

I think it's interesting how the cylons have created their own cylons to rebel with the centurions.

[Eaglesfan27]

As far as the Cylon rebellions, I wonder if Boomer predicted that response when she agreed to lobotomize the raiders?

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I think it's interesting how the cylons have created their own cylons to rebel with the centurions.

Yep, the cycle repeats itself. How soon before the Centurions rebel against the skinjobs?

I don't think Starbuck is the final Cylon. But I can easily see how characters in the show can look at her craziness (since the beginning) and think she may be. Then again, the Cylons are smart but would they make such a wacked out skinjob (make people think that she's just a bit too crazy to be a Cylon)?

Spoiler

Moore has, IIRC, said it isn't going to be a main character, so that makes it a bit more interesting

[Bonegavel]

I can't see how Starbuck is a cylon as it would just be too frackin' obvious. They made a big point to show all the weirdness - ship is new, missing time, etc.

And if the goal of the cylons was to kill the humans, with these guys in place (especially chief and the XO) they could have done it long ago. So I'm not sure what all the attacking has been about. Do they want to kill the humans or not?

Wouldn't they have known the presence of the 5 during all the other attacks?

I don't like knowing as much as we do about the cylons and their side of the story. It was much better when they were a complete mystery.

[kcchief19]

Taking Moore at face value -- which at times is difficult because he has retreated course on us before -- Baltar and Starbuck (or my choice of Roslin for that matter) can't be the final cylon because they are in The Last Supper-esque photo Moore has put out and it's suggested heavily that the last cylon is missing from the photo, not in the photo.

I have my belief on who is my next most likely choice. I keep looking for clues and all the ones I have identified hint at one person but I don't necessarily trust that instinct.

The rebellion within the Cylons was a nifty development. It certainly helps setup the stage for the Caprica, Boomer and Leoben models to unbox the D'Anna models and go to war with the other three. All of this has happened before and will happen again, eh?

Moore has done a nice job of taking the elementary mythology of the original series and expanding and adding to it. Clearly there are characters with "destinies" predicted by their religions -- Roslin, Starbuck and Baltar. It will be interesting to see if the show plays out to fulfill these prophecies.

I'm intrigued so far with the current Starbuck angle. For frans of the original series, we had the Beings of Light and Starbuck returned from an encounter with them in a similar shape as the reimagined Starbuck did -- Galactica thought Starbuck was dead and he returns in better shape than he left. Now all we need is for Count Iblis to show up!

And is just me, or is the Natalie version of Six that's leading the Sixes right now hotter than the bleached blonde versions? Tricia Helfer is hot, but get her with a more natural hair color and hubba hubba.

[Coop]

I've been saying that Gaeta is a cylon since I started watching the show so I'll stick with that. My second guess would be Dualla.

[SFL Cat]

I think the whole series will end with Dirk Benedict (the original Starbuck) waking up and saying..."Frak, I was a girl?!"

[Crapshoot]

I thought the Cylon civil war angle was awesome - I'm intrigued by it.

[TazFTW]

That was fraked up.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

That was fraked up.

Yes, it was. She was one of my favorite characters, and I wish she had kept it together and gone straight to security or the Admiral, although I can understand her reaction. As far as the Skinjobs, I wonder if that was some higher level programming directing her actions - she just got another hybrid baby that the Cylons value so much.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

I thought the Cylon civil war angle was awesome - I'm intrigued by it.

Oh yeah... I wonder if any of the 6s survived in the end? That'd be interesting, to have the Cavils always get their way without dissent.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Yes, it was. She was one of my favorite characters, and I wish she had kept it together and gone straight to security or the Admiral, although I can understand her reaction. As far as the Skinjobs, I wonder if that was some higher level programming directing her actions - she just got another hybrid baby that the Cylons value so much.

I missed the episode. Appreciate it if you could give me the highlights?

[Bad-example]

At this point, I am taking this show as unintentional camp. I thought last night's episode was hilarious. The show takes itself so frakkin' seriously I am finding humor in nearly every scene. I am glad that a lot of people love this show. I am even more glad that I have found my own way to enjoy it.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

That was fraked up.

And we never saw her naked. Boo.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Edward64

I missed the episode. Appreciate it if you could give me the highlights?

Main highlights:

Starbuck is alienating her crew on the ship as she continues to look for Earth while acting erratically. She fracked her husband again during one of her erratic outbursts.

Chief was meeting with the President's aide (whose name I'm forgetting) at a bar because he couldn't sleep and Callie saw it. The aide was touching Chief Tyrol on the arm and flirting with him, and Callie thought he was having an affair. Later in the episode, she found a message in Chief's belongings about a meeting. She thought it was an affair hookup, but it was a cylon meeting. She spied on the meeting and found out that Chief, the aide, and Saul were cylons. She freaked out and rather than telling anyone went to her quarters to get her baby. She then went to the airlock to commit suicide taking her baby with her. The aide talked her down, then grabbed the baby, and then gave her a vicious backhand knocking her back and dazing her. She then proceeded to flush her out the airlock. Presumably, she has plans for the baby.

Also, during the episode, the Cavils led the 6's baseship into a trap and blew up their baseship (or so it appeared.)

[ISiddiqui]

President's aide (whose name I'm forgetting)

Tori.

Also, during the episode, the Cavils led the 6's baseship into a trap and blew up their baseship (or so it appeared.)

Don't forget that not only the Cavils lead the 6s baseship into a trap, but right before the attack, the baseships jumped EXCEPT the resurrection ship. So when they destroyed the 6s baseships, it was a true death, because no res ships around to res the 6s.

[flounder]

Were all of the 6s on that one baseship? If so, that leaves the 6 on Galactica as the only remaining one of her line. That could get interesting.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Tori.



Don't forget that not only the Cavils lead the 6s baseship into a trap, but right before the attack, the baseships jumped EXCEPT the resurrection ship. So when they destroyed the 6s baseships, it was a true death, because no res ships around to res the 6s.

Right - that is a big point. Also, we saw a hint at Boomer's possible motivation as she appears to be romantically involved with a Cavil. Unless, she is just pretending to be interested in him as part of some grander plot of hers. Also, the Centurion's were showing more resistance to the 6's commands and she had to use please to get it do to what she wanted at one point.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by flounder

Were all of the 6s on that one baseship? If so, that leaves the 6 on Galactica as the only remaining one of her line. That could get interesting.

I believe they were, but it wasn't clear.

[Barkeep49]

Remember it's not just the 6s. It's whatever model the Sharons are as well.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Remember it's not just the 6s. It's whatever model the Sharons are as well.

I thought that some of the Sharons were on other baseships as well... after all, no Sharons were in the room when the 6 ordered the Centurions to take out the Cavils.

[kcchief19]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Also, during the episode, the Cavils led the 6's baseship into a trap and blew up their baseship (or so it appeared.)

I'll have to go back and watch the ending again -- I think the "so it appeared" is the key. A resurrection ship could always jump in at the last minute and save the day or they manage to get the FTL drives up and moving.

Explosive developments to say the least. I was all prepared for Cally to take herself out the airlock and then when Tory talked her out of it I actually believed her. When Tory hit her I almost thought it was Cally who it her after the number she did on Tyrol.

Plot devices aside, it killed me a little bit to see how much firepower Starbuck got to take with her on the garbage ship -- she's got Helo, Athena, Gaeta (OK, nerd power), Hardball, at least four Vipers and I'm assuming a Raptor. Hope Galactica doesn't need Viper pilots anytime soon.

Assuming the Sixes and Eights survive and the Threes get unboxed, they are going to need help against the others. Any chance the Centurions and Natalie's group of Cylons decide to team up with Galactica against the other humanoid Cylons? There is an apparent "pro-human" faction of Cylons, or at least Cylons who believe the war against humanity was a mistake. Why not surrender and join up with Galactica?

[Eaglesfan27]

Yeah, that is why I put the disclaimer there. I think there are several possible outs such as the ones that you mention.

I also believed Tory and was annoyed when she hit Callie, in part because Callie has been one of my favorite characters.

I also agree with your point about how much manpower Starbuck got to take with her. When she went, I thought she was just getting herself and a barebones crew. I'm also disappointed that they gave her so many people, although I understand that it serves a point in the plot.

[ISiddiqui]

Well, it seems Adama gave her a barebones crew and then allowed volunteers and a bunch of folks (including Anders jumped on that... um.. in more ways than one )

[Coop]

I'm never watching another preview from SciFi again, they ruined the whoel episode.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Coop

I'm never watching another preview from SciFi again, they ruined the whoel episode.

Yeah, I never watch previews on there or anywhere else and hope they won't be discussed in this thread, at least without a spoiler tag.

[ISiddiqui]

I really liked this episode. The Baltar as Messiah plot is getting interesting. It seems that unlike everything else, where he's doing it for self-interest or power, this time, Baltar REALLY believes he's doing what is right. It began with him pleading with God to take him over the boy and this time when Head6 told him that a guy who brought God to the people would be a great man, Baltar said that it wasn't like that. Amazingly, Baltar actually seems to believe that he is doing what is proper and that is what is driving him.

Liked Mr. Adama being a thorn in the side of Roslin (let's be honest, she just wants to be a benevolent dictator) and not just fading away.

I found the scene in Tyrol's chambers between the advice Tigh and Tori were giving Chief... err, now Specialist, to be fascinating. It seems Tigh is saying it doesn't matter that I'm a Cylon, I choose to be human, while Tori wants to embrace her Cylon-ness. Tyrol is going to have to make a choice of which side he wants to be on.

[Eaglesfan27]

I still think Baltar is all about his self-interest, and I'm not convinced that he really believes what he is selling. I think he wants to believe, but I'm not sure that he does.

No doubt that Tori has fully embraced her Cylon nature and the contrast between her reaction to the information and Tigh's handling is one of the most interesting subplots in my mind right now.

[TazFTW]

I really want Tyrol to kill Tory for killing Callie but it looks like that won't happen. I think Lee is being setup to be the next President.

I'm not sure what roll Anders has but I'm leaning towards Starbuck finding Earth and then Anders sabotages the ship so that Galatica will never find it.

Not sure what to make of "showing" Six pick up Baltar. That's just too weird.

[Crapshoot]

I'm really enjoying this season - its dark, like Season 1, although the pseudo-religious stuff still annoys me. As for Lee Adama, I always think that he'd make a shitty leader - he's easily lead around to "principled" positions as opposed to pragmatic ones.

[ISiddiqui]

Well that's Lee's reason. He's the ideals and a bullwark against going too far down the road of Roslin benign fascism. True, he's doesn't believe in the pragamatic course, but the question of is humanity worth saving (ie, the redeeming values of humanity) is a good one that Roslin doesn't quite see.

And personally, I do think Baltar has finally "turned the corner" and is surprising himself with the fact that he actually wants to protect his followers and that he actually finds himself believing strongly in the Cylon God.

[Kodos]

Just caught up with the current season after my wife caught up on season 3 on DVD (she was late to join the BSG game). Interesting start to the season. Some real shocking developments. I have a theory that when they get to Earth, it will be in our past ... and that Baltar will be the founder of Christianity.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Kodos

I have a theory that when they get to Earth, it will be in our past ... and that Baltar will be the founder of Christianity.

Wow... that'd be mega controversial .

Though I don't think they'll be going in that direction. But imagine the discussion that'd unleash!

[Horizon]

I do not understand why there is not a murder invistigation going on with Callie's death? The bay door was unlocked from outside the bay in the controll center with the Chief's key? I don't think you would need Columbo to say it is murder here?

I may be an episode behind, but I was very confused when I watched the episode after Callie was murdered and know one was talking about how she was murdered or who murdered her?

[TazFTW]

Originally Posted by Horizon

I do not understand why there is not a murder invistigation going on with Callie's death? The bay door was unlocked from outside the bay in the controll center with the Chief's key? I don't think you would need Columbo to say it is murder here?

I may be an episode behind, but I was very confused when I watched the episode after Callie was murdered and know one was talking about how she was murdered or who murdered her?

I thought Callie went there to kill herself and the baby. If I remember correctly she was going to press a button before Tori interfered.

[ISiddiqui]

I'd imagine that Tori would have put Chief's key back inside the bay door lockbox after she did the deed to make it seem like Callie did it from inside (which is seemed like she was going to do in the first place).

[Bonegavel]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Just caught up with the current season after my wife caught up on season 3 on DVD (she was late to join the BSG game). Interesting start to the season. Some real shocking developments. I have a theory that when they get to Earth, it will be in our past ... and that Baltar will be the founder of Christianity.

How does Hendrix fit into that theory?

[ISiddiqui]

Hendrix is God... duh.