GroupThink - Front Office issues

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 08:04 AM

Post here your thoughts on:

-Coach and scout hiring

-Overall team aproach issues

-Name and location of franchise

...plus any other "big picture" issues

- - -

The file is up and you can get it at the following address.

FOFC_GT.zip

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 08:15 AM

Here are comments on the available coaches, pinched from the "main" thread:

- - -

(They are not in any order)
Name...Record...Age...Money Wanted (Million)...Worst Attributes...Best Attributes

Ian Bosworth (NED) 45-24...60...3.64...Fair Secondary...Excellent QB / O-line

Skip Brady...0-0...52...5.79...Poor Linebackers...Excellent Young Talent

Rodney Perry...0-0...56...3.72...Fair O-Line...Excellent Linebackers

Lionel Clanton...0-0...65...3.7...Fair O-Line...Excellent Injury / D-Play Call

Dexter Reeves...0-0...55...4.34...Fair O-Line / LBs...Very Good - RB / Motovation

Richard Bedwell (MIN)...27-25...60...4.77...Fair WRs...Excellent O-line / Secondary

Norbert Wilson...0-0...59...4.46...Fair D-line / Motovation...Excellent Secondary

Full Contact Jarvis...0-0...46...4.13...Fair D-line / D-Play Call...Very Good - QB / O-line

Richard Crane (HOU)...22-41...62...3.46...Fair O-Play Call...Excellent Kicker / D-line

J.J. Boles...21-14...50...6...Poor D- Play Call...Excellent LBs

- - -

I went ahead and rated all of the coaches and here's my top ten in order:

Ian Bosworth –
He's 60, probably the best coach and by far the best value, asking only $3.64 mil compared to a high of 6 mil. Not great at developing positions or talent, but a good playcaller, plus VG, G and VG at Motivation, discipline and injury avoidance respectively. Not actually my preference, but he rated out the highest. Also has the 3rd best Winning pct of active coaches and has won a championship. Only 5 years as a Head Coach.

Richard Bedwell –
Also 60, also a solid value, asking $4.77. Probably the best all-around coach, excelling with the O-line and secondary as well as VG at QBs, Off playcalling and Injury Avoidance. Coming off of a 12-4 season with the Vikes, they lost the Super Bowl in only his 3rd year as a Head Coach.

Jonathon Mitchell –
57, but he's got 15 years logged as a Head Coach, including 5 playoff apearances and a championship. Asking $4.4, about what he's worth, possibly on the downcurve of his career. Slightly above average for positions, though excellent with the o-line. Only average w/Young Talent, though, as his strengths lie in Motivation, discipline and playcalling. Very similar to Bosworth, but a longer track record, though San Fran finished just 8-8 last year.

Full Contact Jarvis –
Well, gotta love the name. At 46, he's never been a Head Coach, one of only three such candidates in my top ten. Another good value, asking only $4.13. He's a change of pace, rating good or better at every position except d-line (avg). Only average w/young talent and weak w/discipline and def playcalling. Something of a risk, but he may pay off.

Richard Crane –
Our current Head Coach, though his contract is up. He's 62 and we've been below .500 in all three of his years coaching us (though that may not be his fault considering the lack of stability). He's hit or miss with the positions, though he is excellent w/D-line and Kickers. He also rates Good at Young Talent, Motivation, Discipline and Injury Avoidance. The other positives are a reasonable $3.46 mil salary and that retaining him helps maintain cohesion.

JJ Boles –
He's 50 and has been nothing but successful, coaching SD the past two years (his only two) and making the playoffs both years, losing in the AFC championship last year to eventual champs Tennessee. Good at almost everything, but his playcalling is abysmal, and he's not any better than good, except when dealing with LBs (exc). While he looks good at first glance, his $6 mil pricetag makes me a bit way.

Tyrus Joseph –
Along the lines of Full Contact, he's 49 and has never been a Heach Coach. He's also primarily a position guy, though he's very good at developing young talent, which is nice to see. His major weaknesses lie in his fair Discipline and Def playcalling and Average Off playcalling and Injury avoidance. A better deal than Full Contact at $3.63 mil, but I think I'd be more willing to take a chance on F.C. Jarvis.

Ryan Reeves –
At 53, he's been coaching for 7 years, but has yet to make the playoffs. His main selling point is that he's solid across the board except for Kickers and Motivation. He's VG with the offensive players and excellent w/the D-line. A decent coach, but overpriced at $5.33 mil and still unproven, despite several opportunities.

Walter Keen –
60, w/15 years of experience, he's only made the playoffs 3 times, though he did finish 9-6 w/NO last year. Another guy who might be dropping off, he's developing some Jekyll and Hyde tendencies, either being VG or poor in almost every category. His strength is all offense, both w/position players (minus the O-line) and playcalling -- we're talking Steve Spurrier here. He's also good w/young talent, which helps, as does his pricetag, a modest $3.77 mil. Still, he seems more like a filler coach than anything.

Korey Geather -
A whiz kid, he's only 42, with no Head Coaching experience and decent ratings. A key, though, is that he's VG w/ QBs and LBs, two key positions and is only below avg in the Secondary and at RB. He's a huge risk reward candidate, with massive room for growth coming with a massive salary: $5.7 million.

That's my summary, with

Ronnie Perry
Luther drake
Bernie Johnstone
Tim Perez
Norbert Wilson
Mitchell Bowling
Butch Serman

other candidates I thought might be worth a look, but just didn;t make my top ten.

wade moore · 02-10-2003, 08:44 AM

I unfortunately did not get the chance to look at them before I had to go to work.

I'll give my general opinion. For my side, I prefer someone strong in RB/OLine and in Offensive play calling (duh

).. then the higher avoid injury, the better.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 08:49 AM

An open question - how much are we worried about player development versus on-field skills? We'll almost certainly come into 1990 with a very, very young team and very low cohesion. I think we should expect to struggle early regardless.

It might make sense to focus on player development even more than playcalling, motivation, etc. I'm not wedded to any articular concept... but that seems reasonable to me. (Unless I'm misreading our tam expectations - are we going to spend money all-out in an attempt to win right away?)

Easy Mac · 02-10-2003, 08:56 AM

Definitely do player development the first few years, try to build a strong team. Make sure to give the younger players a chance to start.

wade moore · 02-10-2003, 08:59 AM

I would agree, player development is definately crucial... I just have to play my roll as OC wanting Offensive Playcalling to be as stellar as possible

... But yes, Young-Talent should definately be high... I would rather build through the draft and Undrafted free agents as much as possible, rather than a ton of pricey veterans..

Easy Mac · 02-10-2003, 09:03 AM

Also, I'd like my receivers to stay healthy as we build them, so maybe we could get a vg-exc injury avoidance. I believe thats why I liked Bosworth, as he was good in both I think. Crane also seemed pretty decent, and is a good guy to work under

wade moore · 02-10-2003, 09:05 AM

To me we should not take a coach who is worse than VG in injury, but that's just my opinion..

primelord · 02-10-2003, 09:19 AM

I also agree that atleast for the first few years our focus should be on a coach that is good developing talent. And I'd agree that the injury avoidance is an important one too as our players won't develop if they are on the IR.

Later today I am going to lay out my plan for the defense. I have already gone into it a little, but I was going to go into some detail so my defensive staff and the scouts can start evaluating players. But a huge key to our defense is going to be the defensive line. It's going to be expensive, but our DLine must be able to put constant pressure on the QB and they have to be able to stop the run. So from a defensive aspect I would really prefer a coach who can develop DLine well.

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by wade moore
To me we should not take a coach who is worse than VG in injury, but that's just my opinion..

While in theory I like this, it severely limits the number of candidates -- I was thinking only guys with Good of better, since it allows for a wider range of candidates. I realize avoid injury is important, but I'm not sure I want to sacrifice all other areas for injury avoidance.

wade moore · 02-10-2003, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DolaBump
While in theory I like this, it severely limits the number of candidates -- I was thinking only guys with Good of better, since it allows for a wider range of candidates. I realize avoid injury is important, but I'm not sure I want to sacrifice all other areas for injury avoidance.

My experience with this is that having Good or lower and you have EXTREME injury issues... having a guy that can coach QBs does no good if the starting QB, RB, and half of the defense is hurt... that is just my opinion on the issue...

Plus, with young guys, you risk really hurting their future development with injuries..

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 09:32 AM

Aright, if we go with VG or better at injury avoidance, that leaves us with these guys (in order I initially rated them)--

Ian Bosworth
Richard Bedwell
Ryan Reeves
Walter Keen
Ronnie Perry
Luther Drake
Lionel Clanton
Ted Ellison
Carlton Crocker

Doug5984 · 02-10-2003, 09:45 AM

Ian Bosworth is my # 1 choice, but I like all of the candidates reall.....Also we really need to think about getting a new scout, ours has 1 year left on his contract and is he is not good at all.

Bee · 02-10-2003, 09:47 AM

Ian Bosworth...excellent at O-line. I'd be happy.

Easy Mac · 02-10-2003, 09:47 AM

i think we should only replace staffs when they are out of contract or if we have a <.400 winning percentage. Only way to keep the game fair, or else we could just change on a whim.

wade moore · 02-10-2003, 10:16 AM

I agree with this, but perhaps there should be a waiver in our very first year?

cthomer5000 · 02-10-2003, 10:18 AM

Since we're essentially new ownership, we should defintiely be able to clean house. When it comes to staff decisions, I think we need to be as realistic as possible. Scout's should be judged on the players we bring in, draft, etc. Coaches should be judged on what happens on the field.

Bee · 02-10-2003, 10:21 AM

I agree. After the first year we should have a rule about keeping coaches and scouts until the end of the contract unless we lose X number of games (I'd say if we lose 10 games, we can make coaching/scouting changes).

WebEwbank · 02-10-2003, 10:23 AM

I like the focus on youth and health. I'll start scouting the Southern divisions for players who:
-have less then 7-8 years experience, ideally less
-have either a strong current or very strong future rating
-don't have huge bonus structures which makes the AI reluctant to trade them
Generally I've had luck with using free agency to build depth, especially on the lines and in the defensive backfield, while using the draft for stars at DL, QB, and RB.

primelord · 02-10-2003, 10:24 AM

I don't know, I kind of like Bedwell. Neitehr Bosworth or Bedwell are great with Dlineman Bedwell is better overall with developing the defense. Plus he is better with Young Talent.

You lose one notch in QB's and WR's with Bedwell, but he is as good or better in almost every otehr category. I think my vote would go for Bedwell.

cthomer5000 · 02-10-2003, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bee
I agree. After the first year we should have a rule about keeping coaches and scouts until the end of the contract unless we lose X number of games (I'd say if we lose 10 games, we can make coaching/scouting changes).

well, if we go 11-5, 11-5, 6-10... should he be fired?

I think you have to look at it plausibly. Basically you expect a coach to make the playoffs. That's a neutral. Winning playoff games is a positive, missing the playoffs a negative.

I don't think you can ever judge a coach on one year.

Doug5984 · 02-10-2003, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cthomer5000
well, if we go 11-5, 11-5, 6-10... should he be fired?

I think you have to look at it plausibly. Basically you expect a coach to make the playoffs. That's a neutral. Winning playoff games is a positive, missing the playoffs a negative.

I don't think you can ever judge a coach on one year.

I think a good rule would be if our coach has back to back 10 loss (or more) seasons, or if he consistantly goes 8-8, 7-9...then goes 3-13 I think he should be fired....Its hard to set a rule for something like this.

Bee · 02-10-2003, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cthomer5000
well, if we go 11-5, 11-5, 6-10... should he be fired?

I think you have to look at it plausibly. Basically you expect a coach to make the playoffs. That's a neutral. Winning playoff games is a positive, missing the playoffs a negative.

I don't think you can ever judge a coach on one year.

I think you misunderstand what I was saying. You have to keep him unless he loses 10 games. You don't have to fire him if he loses 10 games. The rule is for enforcing the contract, not enforcing firing.

Easy Mac · 02-10-2003, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doug5984
I think a good rule would be if our coach has back to back 10 loss (or more) seasons, or if he consistantly goes 8-8, 7-9...then goes 3-13 I think he should be fired....Its hard to set a rule for something like this.

Thats why I say enforce a contract unless he has a below .400 winning percentage and say 3 years w/ the team. under your example, 8-8, 7-9, 3-13... his overall record is 18-30, which is equal to winning 3 out of every 8 games, or .375 winning percentage. Under the perameters, he should be replced, or at least we have the option to replace him.

We also don't have to resign a winning coach, but I think we should. Maybe say we can't fire a coach, or we have to do everything to re-sign a coach w/ a .600 or greater winning percentage.

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 11:11 AM

Well, Bosworth and Bedwell seem to be the top two, especially limiting our selection to VG at injury avoidance. As I stated above, I prefer Bedwell, but I'm the Secondary Coach and he's excellent there, so I'm a bit biased. Even more importantly, though, Bedwell is better with Young Talent while rating equally at the positions.

Just to boraden the search a tiny bit, though, I want to mention that I like Full Contact a lot. He's only 46, so I'm thinking his rating might improve, he's solid across the board and good at injury avoidance, which will hopefully get better. Basically he's just one of those guys who you get a feeling about now and then -- Bedwell and Bosworth are definitely safer bets.

Doug5984 · 02-10-2003, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DolaBump
Well, Bosworth and Bedwell seem to be the top two, especially limiting our selection to VG at injury avoidance. As I stated above, I prefer Bedwell, but I'm the Secondary Coach and he's excellent there, so I'm a bit biased. Even more importantly, though, Bedwell is better with Young Talent while rating equally at the positions.

Just to boraden the search a tiny bit, though, I want to mention that I like Full Contact a lot. He's only 46, so I'm thinking his rating might improve, he's solid across the board and good at injury avoidance, which will hopefully get better. Basically he's just one of those guys who you get a feeling about now and then -- Bedwell and Bosworth are definitely safer bets.

I agree with you on everything. Also, I think another reason to like Full Contact, is because of his name.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 11:35 AM

I love the idea of our coach being named "Full Contact" and personally would be willing to suffer a little in skill to have him aboard.

primelord · 02-10-2003, 12:43 PM

I think we sacrafice too much going with Full Contact. I like the name too, but I think Bedwell is a better fit for us.

Bee · 02-10-2003, 12:44 PM

Full Contact is very good at O-line, so that's fine with me too.

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 12:48 PM

First:
Are we going to concern ourselves w/$$ at all in this franchise? Just checking, since we lost $47 mil this year and $50 mil last year. Obviously firing is turned off, but Id like to have some sort of financial accountability.

Second:
On the Scouting front, under the rules can we get a new scout? If so, this is a fairly easy choice, coming down to Neal Terrell and

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 12:49 PM

dola -- stupid enter button

Neal Terrell and Leslie Bronkow, by far the top two scouts -- probably Bronkow is a better fit (see the initial groupthink post for my breakdown of the Top 10 scouts).

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 12:52 PM

and for a triple dola --

Back to the coaching question, Bedwell is the best fit right now and I ahve not problem with going after him. The thing I like about Full Contact is that, if he gets better, he may be one of the top 2 or 3 coaches in the league, while I think Bedwell is what he is, a top ten coach.

Bee · 02-10-2003, 12:58 PM

You gotta love the name Full Contact.

primelord · 02-10-2003, 01:03 PM

Is coaching improvement based on age or experience? For some reason I thought I read it was based on age so if that's the case then it's reasonable to think Full Contact could improve a little, but probably not a lot. However if it is based on experience then it is reasonable to think he could improve quite a bit.

I'll go on record saying I think Bedwell is the best choice for us, but if the masses want Full Contact I won't fight it.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 01:08 PM

Since I'm the GM... and I have some time right now... I think I'll go into negotiations with our potential coach, and will make an offer to a new scout.

What financial limitations are relevant here? My plan would be to remain prudent, but not constrained by anything in particular.

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 01:11 PM

Well, actually, I'm starting to give a bit here. To be honest, I haven't experimented enough to know what coach improvement is based on and the more I compare the two, the more I wonder. I have an idea but I'm not sure how it fits within House Rules. Can we consider a different candidate after the first week of offers? Or is it like FA, we make an offer the first week and if he signs w/someone else, then we can go after another guy?

My thinking is that Bedwell should be our top choice, but there's going to be a lot of interest in him -- he just went to the Super Bowl after all. Meanwhile Full Contact might not be as coveted and we may be able to switch to him if someone makes an outrageous bid for Bedwell.

As I said earlier, I'm leaning towards Bedwell cause he's a safe bet and we need to be somewhat safe until we get some continuity in the franchise, but Full Contact could be the kind of guy who is a top 2 or 3 coach for years to come.

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 01:14 PM

Well, the top two scouts want double what our current guy is making, so that would put us another $13 mil in the red, while Bedwell and Full Contact are both reasonably priced and would only add another $6-7 mil to our expenses.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 01:14 PM

Okay, now for the scouting --

first off, our scout, Johnny Kim, rates worse than all but one scout available, the abysmal Brant Hansen. I'm not sure what out House Rules say about this situation, but I believe we said we could bring in our own guys in the first year. I think we might want to consider a limit on what we can spend on a coach/scout, but that's another topic. On to my list --

The top two Scouts stand out pretty obviously:

Neal Terrell-
This is hands down the best guy out there. He's 49, been with Indy for 3 years, they've made the playoffs all three. Good or better across the board, except for RB (avg) and LB (Fair). While I would prefer a better scout at those two positions, he's too good everywhere else, including being Good at Young Talent. He's a bit pricey at $610,000, but he's worth it.

Leslie Bronkow-
9 years as a scout, his teams have made the playoffs 8 times. 57, Very good at Young talent, weak at QB and LB. Asking $590,000, also steep, also worth it. These guys are the best available by far and essentailly equal except for Terrell's age.

The rest of the Top 10:

Lincoln Glenn-
Defensive Scout really, 49, never been a Lead Scout, but he's VG at Young Talent. $570,000. I like this guy, but I'd shell out a few more bucks for one of the top two first.

Frankie Rizzo-
Makes good financial sense, 50 asking $410,000. 15 years in, good or better at every position minus Secondary (Fair). Only Average w/Young Talent or else he's an elite Scout. The money makes him the best value.

Adrian Medzihradsky-
Another newbie, ancient at 70, a stopgap solution. Wants $550,000, overall solid across the board, Good w/Young Talent. Age is obviously a factor, though.

Tony Shields-
Young guy, 38, VG w/QBs and Secondary, Fair w/Kickers and D-Line. Only $410,000 and Good w/Young TAlent, plus his youth will probably mean he gets better in a coupleyears. No experience as a Lead Scout, though.

Louis Burnett-
56, hit or miss as a position scout, but VG at Young Talent gives him a leg up. Pricey, $600,000, probably not worth it, but rates good enough to place here.

Alan Francis-
I prefer Francis to Burnett, younger, 43, his only real weakness is at RB, where he's Poor. Good with Young talent, though, and cheap, $380,000. If we go outside the top 4, I like this guy.

Kris Bridges-
4 seasons as a scout, 2 playoffs appearances, exellecent w/Offensive guys, Average everywhere else. I prefer balanced scouts, especially when he wants $530,000 a year and he's 54.

Frankie Barrett-
52, econo-scout, wants just $330,000 and is good across the board except Fair at QB and AVG at RB and Secondary. Good with Young Talent, a decent option if we're strapped.

Also considered, but not quite up to snuff:
Tyrus Williams
Harris Riti
Claude Brito
Jeffrey Hammond
Larry Ohanian

primelord · 02-10-2003, 01:30 PM

Quik,

Before you make any offers I posted this in another thread. FOF4 generates the draft randomly after the new staff hiring. So if you hire a new coach and scout then you will have to distribute out the game files so everyone has the same draft to work off of.

That doesn't have to be a problem. I can just give you access to the site where I stored the first file, but whoever hires the coach and scout needs to distribute out the new file.

Doug5984 · 02-10-2003, 01:31 PM

If we don't go with one of the top 2 scouts then I really like this guy:
"Tony Shields-
Young guy, 38, VG w/QBs and Secondary, Fair w/Kickers and D-Line. Only $410,000 and Good w/Young TAlent, plus his youth will probably mean he gets better in a coupleyears. No experience as a Lead Scout, though."

He seems like a good fit for our team.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 01:35 PM

From the desk of the General Manager
Hiring our front office - update

Well, the first round of hiring didn’t go all that well. Our first-choice at coach, Richard Bedwell, predictably was re-signed by Minnesota – for a steaming load of cash, $11.2m a year for 4 years. That’s a good deal more than we have been paying – and we’re already in the red overall. We also made an initial offer to scout Leslie Brinkow, but watched him take a new deal with the Bears for just over $1 million a year – also more than we can really afford.

At scout, this leaves Kris Bridges, Larry Ameche, and Tony Shields as the most likely targets. Tony Shields is young and unproven, but his only real downside is with the defensive line. I think he could be a step up over what we have on hand. We make an offer to him – 4 yrs, $400,000/yr.

At coach, J.J. Boles and Full Contact Jarvis are the two remaining standouts. Luther Drake has an offer on the table, but he’s still not sealed up – and he is the last guy left (worth noting) who is rated “very good” with avoiding injuries. I put in an offer of 3 yrs, $4.0m/yr to Full Contact Jarvis… he wasn't the best guy available in the initial pool, but at this offering price he’d cost only a fraction of what Bedwell ($11.2m) and even Bosworth ($7.2m) already landed (not to mention the $11.16m/yr offer that Boles is considering).

After week two, we have our scout, as Tony Shields accepts. Coach Jarvis is till reluctant – so I negotiate with him, and he agrees to my same terms – so we have him for three years. Overall, our front office spending shouldn’t change all that much from prior years – we’re not breaking the bank, but I think we are upgrading at both positions.

- - -

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 01:45 PM

Well, that takes care of that. Nice economizing, I was worried that Bedwell's asking price was going to be outrageous. I think we're in good shape, especially with two young guys at the Coach and Scout positions. And it'll only add about $8 mil to the payroll.

Bee · 02-10-2003, 01:47 PM

Excellent! We got a couple young staff members that should grow with the team.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 01:53 PM

Here's a shot at the "simple" file transfer method. This zip file contains the files that were hanged on my CPU after making the hirings, and entering free agency. I hope you can just unzip this into your universe directory, and have your game fully updated - without redownloading the whole game file again. This would be *very* easy, if so.

edit - this file is the first of two you will need to acquire...

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 01:55 PM

Here is file number two... extract them both into your universe directory, and we shoudl be able ot talk about free agents and rookies...

DolaBump · 02-10-2003, 01:56 PM

looks good -- makes things easier

Doug5984 · 02-10-2003, 01:58 PM

the files worked great...and I am now looking at the draft...looks to be an ok draft for us at # 4.

primelord · 02-10-2003, 01:59 PM

Thats why you are the GM Quik. You are always thinking.

Those files worked just fine.

QuikSand · 02-10-2003, 01:59 PM

Regrettably, I'm off to a meeting... will be back in a couple of hours. Hope that works, and that we can move ahead.

primelord · 02-10-2003, 02:01 PM

And with the 4th pick in the 1990 Draft the [Name to be decided] choose LDE K.C. Brackens of Oregon St.

02-10-2003, 09:19 AM	#9
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	I also agree that atleast for the first few years our focus should be on a coach that is good developing talent. And I'd agree that the injury avoidance is an important one too as our players won't develop if they are on the IR. Later today I am going to lay out my plan for the defense. I have already gone into it a little, but I was going to go into some detail so my defensive staff and the scouts can start evaluating players. But a huge key to our defense is going to be the defensive line. It's going to be expensive, but our DLine must be able to put constant pressure on the QB and they have to be able to stop the run. So from a defensive aspect I would really prefer a coach who can develop DLine well. __________________ .

02-10-2003, 10:24 AM	#20
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	I don't know, I kind of like Bedwell. Neitehr Bosworth or Bedwell are great with Dlineman Bedwell is better overall with developing the defense. Plus he is better with Young Talent. You lose one notch in QB's and WR's with Bedwell, but he is as good or better in almost every otehr category. I think my vote would go for Bedwell. __________________ .

02-10-2003, 12:43 PM	#28
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	I think we sacrafice too much going with Full Contact. I like the name too, but I think Bedwell is a better fit for us. __________________ .

02-10-2003, 01:03 PM	#34
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Is coaching improvement based on age or experience? For some reason I thought I read it was based on age so if that's the case then it's reasonable to think Full Contact could improve a little, but probably not a lot. However if it is based on experience then it is reasonable to think he could improve quite a bit. I'll go on record saying I think Bedwell is the best choice for us, but if the masses want Full Contact I won't fight it. __________________ .

02-10-2003, 01:14 PM	#38
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	re-showing DolaBump's scout analysis Okay, now for the scouting -- first off, our scout, Johnny Kim, rates worse than all but one scout available, the abysmal Brant Hansen. I'm not sure what out House Rules say about this situation, but I believe we said we could bring in our own guys in the first year. I think we might want to consider a limit on what we can spend on a coach/scout, but that's another topic. On to my list -- The top two Scouts stand out pretty obviously: Neal Terrell- This is hands down the best guy out there. He's 49, been with Indy for 3 years, they've made the playoffs all three. Good or better across the board, except for RB (avg) and LB (Fair). While I would prefer a better scout at those two positions, he's too good everywhere else, including being Good at Young Talent. He's a bit pricey at $610,000, but he's worth it. Leslie Bronkow- 9 years as a scout, his teams have made the playoffs 8 times. 57, Very good at Young talent, weak at QB and LB. Asking $590,000, also steep, also worth it. These guys are the best available by far and essentailly equal except for Terrell's age. The rest of the Top 10: Lincoln Glenn- Defensive Scout really, 49, never been a Lead Scout, but he's VG at Young Talent. $570,000. I like this guy, but I'd shell out a few more bucks for one of the top two first. Frankie Rizzo- Makes good financial sense, 50 asking $410,000. 15 years in, good or better at every position minus Secondary (Fair). Only Average w/Young Talent or else he's an elite Scout. The money makes him the best value. Adrian Medzihradsky- Another newbie, ancient at 70, a stopgap solution. Wants $550,000, overall solid across the board, Good w/Young Talent. Age is obviously a factor, though. Tony Shields- Young guy, 38, VG w/QBs and Secondary, Fair w/Kickers and D-Line. Only $410,000 and Good w/Young TAlent, plus his youth will probably mean he gets better in a coupleyears. No experience as a Lead Scout, though. Louis Burnett- 56, hit or miss as a position scout, but VG at Young Talent gives him a leg up. Pricey, $600,000, probably not worth it, but rates good enough to place here. Alan Francis- I prefer Francis to Burnett, younger, 43, his only real weakness is at RB, where he's Poor. Good with Young talent, though, and cheap, $380,000. If we go outside the top 4, I like this guy. Kris Bridges- 4 seasons as a scout, 2 playoffs appearances, exellecent w/Offensive guys, Average everywhere else. I prefer balanced scouts, especially when he wants $530,000 a year and he's 54. Frankie Barrett- 52, econo-scout, wants just $330,000 and is good across the board except Fair at QB and AVG at RB and Secondary. Good with Young Talent, a decent option if we're strapped. Also considered, but not quite up to snuff: Tyrus Williams Harris Riti Claude Brito Jeffrey Hammond Larry Ohanian

02-10-2003, 08:15 AM	#2
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Here are comments on the available coaches, pinched from the "main" thread: - - - (They are not in any order) Name...Record...Age...Money Wanted (Million)...Worst Attributes...Best Attributes Ian Bosworth (NED) 45-24...60...3.64...Fair Secondary...Excellent QB / O-line Skip Brady...0-0...52...5.79...Poor Linebackers...Excellent Young Talent Rodney Perry...0-0...56...3.72...Fair O-Line...Excellent Linebackers Lionel Clanton...0-0...65...3.7...Fair O-Line...Excellent Injury / D-Play Call Dexter Reeves...0-0...55...4.34...Fair O-Line / LBs...Very Good - RB / Motovation Richard Bedwell (MIN)...27-25...60...4.77...Fair WRs...Excellent O-line / Secondary Norbert Wilson...0-0...59...4.46...Fair D-line / Motovation...Excellent Secondary Full Contact Jarvis...0-0...46...4.13...Fair D-line / D-Play Call...Very Good - QB / O-line Richard Crane (HOU)...22-41...62...3.46...Fair O-Play Call...Excellent Kicker / D-line J.J. Boles...21-14...50...6...Poor D- Play Call...Excellent LBs - - - I went ahead and rated all of the coaches and here's my top ten in order: Ian Bosworth – He's 60, probably the best coach and by far the best value, asking only $3.64 mil compared to a high of 6 mil. Not great at developing positions or talent, but a good playcaller, plus VG, G and VG at Motivation, discipline and injury avoidance respectively. Not actually my preference, but he rated out the highest. Also has the 3rd best Winning pct of active coaches and has won a championship. Only 5 years as a Head Coach. Richard Bedwell – Also 60, also a solid value, asking $4.77. Probably the best all-around coach, excelling with the O-line and secondary as well as VG at QBs, Off playcalling and Injury Avoidance. Coming off of a 12-4 season with the Vikes, they lost the Super Bowl in only his 3rd year as a Head Coach. Jonathon Mitchell – 57, but he's got 15 years logged as a Head Coach, including 5 playoff apearances and a championship. Asking $4.4, about what he's worth, possibly on the downcurve of his career. Slightly above average for positions, though excellent with the o-line. Only average w/Young Talent, though, as his strengths lie in Motivation, discipline and playcalling. Very similar to Bosworth, but a longer track record, though San Fran finished just 8-8 last year. Full Contact Jarvis – Well, gotta love the name. At 46, he's never been a Head Coach, one of only three such candidates in my top ten. Another good value, asking only $4.13. He's a change of pace, rating good or better at every position except d-line (avg). Only average w/young talent and weak w/discipline and def playcalling. Something of a risk, but he may pay off. Richard Crane – Our current Head Coach, though his contract is up. He's 62 and we've been below .500 in all three of his years coaching us (though that may not be his fault considering the lack of stability). He's hit or miss with the positions, though he is excellent w/D-line and Kickers. He also rates Good at Young Talent, Motivation, Discipline and Injury Avoidance. The other positives are a reasonable $3.46 mil salary and that retaining him helps maintain cohesion. JJ Boles – He's 50 and has been nothing but successful, coaching SD the past two years (his only two) and making the playoffs both years, losing in the AFC championship last year to eventual champs Tennessee. Good at almost everything, but his playcalling is abysmal, and he's not any better than good, except when dealing with LBs (exc). While he looks good at first glance, his $6 mil pricetag makes me a bit way. Tyrus Joseph – Along the lines of Full Contact, he's 49 and has never been a Heach Coach. He's also primarily a position guy, though he's very good at developing young talent, which is nice to see. His major weaknesses lie in his fair Discipline and Def playcalling and Average Off playcalling and Injury avoidance. A better deal than Full Contact at $3.63 mil, but I think I'd be more willing to take a chance on F.C. Jarvis. Ryan Reeves – At 53, he's been coaching for 7 years, but has yet to make the playoffs. His main selling point is that he's solid across the board except for Kickers and Motivation. He's VG with the offensive players and excellent w/the D-line. A decent coach, but overpriced at $5.33 mil and still unproven, despite several opportunities. Walter Keen – 60, w/15 years of experience, he's only made the playoffs 3 times, though he did finish 9-6 w/NO last year. Another guy who might be dropping off, he's developing some Jekyll and Hyde tendencies, either being VG or poor in almost every category. His strength is all offense, both w/position players (minus the O-line) and playcalling -- we're talking Steve Spurrier here. He's also good w/young talent, which helps, as does his pricetag, a modest $3.77 mil. Still, he seems more like a filler coach than anything. Korey Geather - A whiz kid, he's only 42, with no Head Coaching experience and decent ratings. A key, though, is that he's VG w/ QBs and LBs, two key positions and is only below avg in the Secondary and at RB. He's a huge risk reward candidate, with massive room for growth coming with a massive salary: $5.7 million. That's my summary, with Ronnie Perry Luther drake Bernie Johnstone Tim Perez Norbert Wilson Mitchell Bowling Butch Serman other candidates I thought might be worth a look, but just didn;t make my top ten.

02-10-2003, 08:49 AM	#4
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	An open question - how much are we worried about player development versus on-field skills? We'll almost certainly come into 1990 with a very, very young team and very low cohesion. I think we should expect to struggle early regardless. It might make sense to focus on player development even more than playcalling, motivation, etc. I'm not wedded to any articular concept... but that seems reasonable to me. (Unless I'm misreading our tam expectations - are we going to spend money all-out in an attempt to win right away?)

02-10-2003, 08:56 AM	#5
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	Definitely do player development the first few years, try to build a strong team. Make sure to give the younger players a chance to start.

02-10-2003, 09:03 AM	#7
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	Also, I'd like my receivers to stay healthy as we build them, so maybe we could get a vg-exc injury avoidance. I believe thats why I liked Bosworth, as he was good in both I think. Crane also seemed pretty decent, and is a good guy to work under

02-10-2003, 09:32 AM	#12
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	Aright, if we go with VG or better at injury avoidance, that leaves us with these guys (in order I initially rated them)-- Ian Bosworth Richard Bedwell Ryan Reeves Walter Keen Ronnie Perry Luther Drake Lionel Clanton Ted Ellison Carlton Crocker

02-10-2003, 09:45 AM	#13
Doug5984 College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Louisiana	Ian Bosworth is my # 1 choice, but I like all of the candidates reall.....Also we really need to think about getting a new scout, ours has 1 year left on his contract and is he is not good at all.

02-10-2003, 09:47 AM	#14
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	Ian Bosworth...excellent at O-line. I'd be happy.

02-10-2003, 10:21 AM	#18
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	I agree. After the first year we should have a rule about keeping coaches and scouts until the end of the contract unless we lose X number of games (I'd say if we lose 10 games, we can make coaching/scouting changes).

02-10-2003, 10:23 AM	#19
WebEwbank High School JV Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Natick, MA	I like the focus on youth and health. I'll start scouting the Southern divisions for players who: -have less then 7-8 years experience, ideally less -have either a strong current or very strong future rating -don't have huge bonus structures which makes the AI reluctant to trade them Generally I've had luck with using free agency to build depth, especially on the lines and in the defensive backfield, while using the draft for stars at DL, QB, and RB.

02-10-2003, 11:11 AM	#25
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	Well, Bosworth and Bedwell seem to be the top two, especially limiting our selection to VG at injury avoidance. As I stated above, I prefer Bedwell, but I'm the Secondary Coach and he's excellent there, so I'm a bit biased. Even more importantly, though, Bedwell is better with Young Talent while rating equally at the positions. Just to boraden the search a tiny bit, though, I want to mention that I like Full Contact a lot. He's only 46, so I'm thinking his rating might improve, he's solid across the board and good at injury avoidance, which will hopefully get better. Basically he's just one of those guys who you get a feeling about now and then -- Bedwell and Bosworth are definitely safer bets.

02-10-2003, 11:35 AM	#27
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	I love the idea of our coach being named "Full Contact" and personally would be willing to suffer a little in skill to have him aboard.

02-10-2003, 12:44 PM	#29
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	Full Contact is very good at O-line, so that's fine with me too.

02-10-2003, 12:48 PM	#30
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	First: Are we going to concern ourselves w/$$ at all in this franchise? Just checking, since we lost $47 mil this year and $50 mil last year. Obviously firing is turned off, but Id like to have some sort of financial accountability. Second: On the Scouting front, under the rules can we get a new scout? If so, this is a fairly easy choice, coming down to Neal Terrell and

02-10-2003, 12:49 PM	#31
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	dola -- stupid enter button Neal Terrell and Leslie Bronkow, by far the top two scouts -- probably Bronkow is a better fit (see the initial groupthink post for my breakdown of the Top 10 scouts).

02-10-2003, 12:52 PM	#32
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	and for a triple dola -- Back to the coaching question, Bedwell is the best fit right now and I ahve not problem with going after him. The thing I like about Full Contact is that, if he gets better, he may be one of the top 2 or 3 coaches in the league, while I think Bedwell is what he is, a top ten coach.

02-10-2003, 12:58 PM	#33
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	You gotta love the name Full Contact.

02-10-2003, 01:08 PM	#35
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Since I'm the GM... and I have some time right now... I think I'll go into negotiations with our potential coach, and will make an offer to a new scout. What financial limitations are relevant here? My plan would be to remain prudent, but not constrained by anything in particular.

02-10-2003, 01:11 PM	#36
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	Well, actually, I'm starting to give a bit here. To be honest, I haven't experimented enough to know what coach improvement is based on and the more I compare the two, the more I wonder. I have an idea but I'm not sure how it fits within House Rules. Can we consider a different candidate after the first week of offers? Or is it like FA, we make an offer the first week and if he signs w/someone else, then we can go after another guy? My thinking is that Bedwell should be our top choice, but there's going to be a lot of interest in him -- he just went to the Super Bowl after all. Meanwhile Full Contact might not be as coveted and we may be able to switch to him if someone makes an outrageous bid for Bedwell. As I said earlier, I'm leaning towards Bedwell cause he's a safe bet and we need to be somewhat safe until we get some continuity in the franchise, but Full Contact could be the kind of guy who is a top 2 or 3 coach for years to come.

02-10-2003, 01:30 PM	#39
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Quik, Before you make any offers I posted this in another thread. FOF4 generates the draft randomly after the new staff hiring. So if you hire a new coach and scout then you will have to distribute out the game files so everyone has the same draft to work off of. That doesn't have to be a problem. I can just give you access to the site where I stored the first file, but whoever hires the coach and scout needs to distribute out the new file. __________________ .

02-10-2003, 01:31 PM	#40
Doug5984 College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Louisiana	If we don't go with one of the top 2 scouts then I really like this guy: "Tony Shields- Young guy, 38, VG w/QBs and Secondary, Fair w/Kickers and D-Line. Only $410,000 and Good w/Young TAlent, plus his youth will probably mean he gets better in a coupleyears. No experience as a Lead Scout, though." He seems like a good fit for our team.

02-10-2003, 01:35 PM	#41
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	From the desk of the General Manager Hiring our front office - update Well, the first round of hiring didn’t go all that well. Our first-choice at coach, Richard Bedwell, predictably was re-signed by Minnesota – for a steaming load of cash, $11.2m a year for 4 years. That’s a good deal more than we have been paying – and we’re already in the red overall. We also made an initial offer to scout Leslie Brinkow, but watched him take a new deal with the Bears for just over $1 million a year – also more than we can really afford. At scout, this leaves Kris Bridges, Larry Ameche, and Tony Shields as the most likely targets. Tony Shields is young and unproven, but his only real downside is with the defensive line. I think he could be a step up over what we have on hand. We make an offer to him – 4 yrs, $400,000/yr. At coach, J.J. Boles and Full Contact Jarvis are the two remaining standouts. Luther Drake has an offer on the table, but he’s still not sealed up – and he is the last guy left (worth noting) who is rated “very good” with avoiding injuries. I put in an offer of 3 yrs, $4.0m/yr to Full Contact Jarvis… he wasn't the best guy available in the initial pool, but at this offering price he’d cost only a fraction of what Bedwell ($11.2m) and even Bosworth ($7.2m) already landed (not to mention the $11.16m/yr offer that Boles is considering). After week two, we have our scout, as Tony Shields accepts. Coach Jarvis is till reluctant – so I negotiate with him, and he agrees to my same terms – so we have him for three years. Overall, our front office spending shouldn’t change all that much from prior years – we’re not breaking the bank, but I think we are upgrading at both positions. - - -

02-10-2003, 01:45 PM	#42
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	Well, that takes care of that. Nice economizing, I was worried that Bedwell's asking price was going to be outrageous. I think we're in good shape, especially with two young guys at the Coach and Scout positions. And it'll only add about $8 mil to the payroll. Last edited by DolaBump : 02-10-2003 at 01:48 PM.

02-10-2003, 01:47 PM	#43
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	Excellent! We got a couple young staff members that should grow with the team.

02-10-2003, 01:53 PM	#44
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	New game file Here's a shot at the "simple" file transfer method. This zip file contains the files that were hanged on my CPU after making the hirings, and entering free agency. I hope you can just unzip this into your universe directory, and have your game fully updated - without redownloading the whole game file again. This would be very easy, if so. edit - this file is the first of two you will need to acquire...

02-10-2003, 01:55 PM	#45
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Here is file number two... extract them both into your universe directory, and we shoudl be able ot talk about free agents and rookies...

02-10-2003, 01:56 PM	#46
DolaBump Mascot Join Date: Oct 2002	looks good -- makes things easier

02-10-2003, 01:58 PM	#47
Doug5984 College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Louisiana	the files worked great...and I am now looking at the draft...looks to be an ok draft for us at # 4.

02-10-2003, 01:59 PM	#48
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Thats why you are the GM Quik. You are always thinking. Those files worked just fine. __________________ .

02-10-2003, 02:01 PM	#50
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	And with the 4th pick in the 1990 Draft the [Name to be decided] choose LDE K.C. Brackens of Oregon St. __________________ .

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