To Those Madden Haters Out There

[RedKingGold]

I thought this was pretty humorous...

During an appearance for EA Sports at a Manhattan hotel suite last week, Shaun Alexander offered a sharp assessment of the Madden video game series. The EA executives in the room practically blanched when they realized that Alexander was offering constructive analysis of what is missing from Madden rather than merely parroting bullet points about this year's new features. -- New York Times

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...ors.nfl/1.html

[Franklinnoble]

He probably thinks his ratings are too low in that game.

[ISiddiqui]

I want to know what Alexander actually said .

[MikeVic]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I want to know what Alexander actually said .

Me too. I'd like to know if he mentioned anything about unrealistic stats or something... that would be cool.

[A-Husker-4-Life]

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

I thought this was pretty humorous...


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...ors.nfl/1.html

Thats great ... He must really play the game in his spare time. Hey maybe EA will listen to him because they don't listen to the common fan.

[flere-imsaho]

Apparently the biggest thing he said is that he doesn't understand why you can't play multiplayer with 11 guys (including yourself) on your team, as it's a "team game". Given that there are a number of games that allow this interaction (including on the XBOX), it seems a reasonable criticism.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Apparently the biggest thing he said is that he doesn't understand why you can't play multiplayer with 11 guys (including yourself) on your team, as it's a "team game". Given that there are a number of games that allow this interaction (including on the XBOX), it seems a reasonable criticism.

Could you imagine trying to coordinate 11 people to play on one side of the ball? It would be total chaos.

[CraigSca]

That would be hysterical. A quarterback and 10 guys bitching to play quarterback. Yeah, baby! I'm a right guard!

[Huckleberry]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Could you imagine trying to coordinate 11 people to play on one side of the ball? It would be total chaos.

I have a funny feeling that Shaun Alexander might be able to round up 10 guys that know what to do on any given offensive play more easily than the average gamer.

[MikeVic]

That would be a funny option though. Why stop at 11? Why not have guys as the punter, kicker, return men...

[panerd]

Rumor has it that Shaun will be the new spokesperson for Maximum Football. "Want to play all 11 guys on the field? You can do it!" "Want to draft me for your team? Make sure you have the first pick in round 5, the running back round!"

[Klinglerware]

The full NY Times article, by the way...

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/06/sp...ll/06game.html

Originally Posted by The New York Times

Making Virtual Football More Like the Real Thing


By SETH SCHIESEL
Published: July 6, 2006

He may not need the money, but when Shaun Alexander of the Seattle Seahawks is finished playing pro football, he just may have a future in video games.

Alexander already has a presence in video games as the cover model for the new installment of the successful Madden football series, which is due to be released later this summer. This is the time of year, before N.F.L. preseason camps open, when Electronic Arts, the world's No. 1 video-game company, traditionally revs up its Madden publicity machine.

During an appearance at a Manhattan hotel suite last week, Alexander demonstrated why he is known as one of the league's more cerebral players, in addition to being one of the top running backs. He did so by offering a sharp assessment of the Madden series based on his experience of playing various versions of the game for about a decade.

"Madden has always been great," Alexander said. "But it's always been one-on-one, just you and another person, and real football is a team game."

He added: "You should be able to make a team and play together with your friends. Like if you have 10 friends, you could all play different positions and be in 10 different houses and play together over the Internet. Or maybe you just have like five people, and you control the skill positions and the program controls the other guys."

The EA executives in the room practically blanched when they realized that Alexander was offering constructive analysis of what is missing from Madden rather than merely parroting bullet points about this year's new features, like a revamped rushing game.

But Alexander's concept seems powerful and exciting because it dovetails with the way the Internet is facilitating new sorts of collaborative, rather than merely competitive, entertainment.

Multiplayer gaming once meant a bunch of lone-wolf players each trying to do in the others. These days, however, team-based play is popular, and gamers are discovering the camaraderie and esprit de corps that have long been the province of soldiers and athletes.

That is why Counter-Strike, with its reliance on precise coordination among players rather than Rambo-style assaults, has been the most popular online combat game for many years. That is why the top rewards in multiplayer games like World of Warcraft go to guilds in which dozens of players work hand-in-hand to master complicated large-scale battles rather than to solo players. EA's own Battlefield series has been a big hit because of its team-based combat management.

Football is dependent on teamwork. So it could come as a surprise that the top football video game, Madden, is almost entirely a solo or one-on-one experience. The next step would be to allow players across cyberspace to control different players on the same team at the same time.

Electronic Arts would not comment on whether it is working on team-based play modes. With the integration of voice chat into consoles like the Xbox 360, making such a system actually work could be only a year or two away.

But for all the emphasis on teamwork in football, one man is alone at the top: the head coach. While Madden has always been popular among wannabe quarterbacks, reflex-challenged football fans who love the strategy of the game and identify more with the guy on the sideline have been left out, at least until now.

Last week, Electronic Arts released NFL Head Coach, a detailed simulation of the sleep-deprived life lived by the famously fanatical men who run pro football teams: drafting players, running practices, setting depth charts.

A week before Alexander's appearance, the company made the first NFL Head Coach spokesmodel, Bill Cowher of the Pittsburgh Steelers, available in New York. Cowher, naturally, knows all about teamwork and how to foster it. In February, the Steelers won the Super Bowl against Alexander and the Seahawks.

"Most people see the game on Sunday, and that's all they see, that's all they know," Cowher said. "They don't see how much work we all put in all week, all season and all year. I think this country gets so concerned with results, and we care so much about results that sometimes we lose sight of the process and the hard work required to achieve those results.

"They can't get that from TV, but they can get a better appreciation of that from the video game because the game shows them what has to happen behind the scenes."

Football is often used as a metaphor for various aspects of American life. The future of digital football, at least, may lie in a renewed emphasis on teamwork and a new appreciation for careful preparation before the big game.

[SunDevil]

Fritz wants a Beer Tent

[ISiddiqui]

Actually having 4 or 5 friends playing all the skill positions may be fun.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Actually having 4 or 5 friends playing all the skill positions may be fun.

I remember playing games like that on the Super NES. It was great fun for QBs and RBs, but it was horrible for WRs. It was nearly impossible to run the route properly to get in position to catch a ball. It might be possible to have the QB throw to the man rather than the spot, but that is tough with a human controlled WR who isn't going to be running in a straight line. Nice idea, but I'm not sure how well it would work.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

I have a funny feeling that Shaun Alexander might be able to round up 10 guys that know what to do on any given offensive play more easily than the average gamer.

They would know what to do, but would then be able to translate that into video game controls? Would the AI act "human" enough to make their skills meaningful?

[flere-imsaho]

I don't think it's totally out of the question. There are a number of on-line, multiplayer games out there that require coordination amongst a number of players simultaneously.

[Schmidty]

I keep reading this as "To Those Mad Hatters Out There"

[Surtt]

practically blanched?

[Raiders Army]

I don't think Shaun Alexander is in touch with what the average Madden gamer wants. He wasted an opportunity to correct flaws in the game, instead voicing a want for a game mode that few would want.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

I don't think Shaun Alexander is in touch with what the average Madden gamer wants. He wasted an opportunity to correct flaws in the game, instead voicing a want for a game mode that few would want.

1. The average Madden gamer wants to use Reggie Bush to run for 95 yard TDs on every play.

2. He could have just as easily said "Madden rulez! It's the greatest game ever!"

3. He gave an example of an extra feature that, in his opinion, would be cool. No other game has such a feature. If he says "Madden has been, and will always be, unrealistic," the EA people get legitimately pissed, others hear about it, and his endorsements dry up.

[lighthousekeeper]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Could you imagine trying to coordinate 11 people to play on one side of the ball? It would be total chaos.

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERROOOOOYYYYYYYY!

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Logan

1. The average Madden gamer wants to use Reggie Bush to run for 95 yard TDs on every play.

2. He could have just as easily said "Madden rulez! It's the greatest game ever!"

3. He gave an example of an extra feature that, in his opinion, would be cool. No other game has such a feature. If he says "Madden has been, and will always be, unrealistic," the EA people get legitimately pissed, others hear about it, and his endorsements dry up.

1. Where's your proof? Here's mine: http://www.maddenmania.com/forums/sh...9&page=1&pp=20 According to these guys, they're upset that the game isn't realistic enough because while you're blocking, you can hold the defender. I would consider this to be a somewhat large subset of the Madden gamers.

2. No comment.

3. That's not what I was saying at all. You're putting those words in his mouth, not me. I would rather have somebody stand up and point out things that need to be fixed that occur year after year instead of adding another mode. Not to mention the fact that implementation of this mode would be very tricky and probably not very fun for players playing the linemen.

There is a huge difference between playing Counterstrike and Madden. While both games have a diversity of roles and teamwork is required to win, all roles in Counterstrike are able to kill the other team whereas in Madden, all roles do not get the ball or strongly influence the game every play. That's a huge fun factor difference.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

1. Where's your proof? Here's mine: http://www.maddenmania.com/forums/sh...9&page=1&pp=20 According to these guys, they're upset that the game isn't realistic enough because while you're blocking, you can hold the defender. I would consider this to be a somewhat large subset of the Madden gamers.

2. No comment.

3. That's not what I was saying at all. You're putting those words in his mouth, not me. I would rather have somebody stand up and point out things that need to be fixed that occur year after year instead of adding another mode. Not to mention the fact that implementation of this mode would be very tricky and probably not very fun for players playing the linemen.

There is a huge difference between playing Counterstrike and Madden. While both games have a diversity of roles and teamwork is required to win, all roles in Counterstrike are able to kill the other team whereas in Madden, all roles do not get the ball or strongly influence the game every play. That's a huge fun factor difference.

Sorry, but you're the one missing my point.

1. I don't know how many units of Madden are sold worldwide, and yes I don't have proof of the exact number, but I'm willing to wager that 95% of the Madden-playing population is not the type that posts on message boards what their feelings are on how realistic the game is. Madden is primarily played by button-mashers, many of whom will just be playing with their buddies, or would think it's cool to beat the computer 42-7 behind 320 yards rushing on 17 Larry Johnson carries. You, me, and the people on this board (and that board) are not typical Madden players.

3. I'm not saying that you're saying that's what he's saying (follow? ). My point is it would be stupid for a paid endorser to say what he believes is wrong with the game. He's speaking as a representative of EA Sports. To knock him for not criticizing the game isn't right, in my opinion.

[Raiders Army]

1. Gotcha. I just don't know what basis you have for making that wager.

2. Follow and agree with you saying that it would be stupid for him to say what's wrong with the game...but he did just that. I'm knocking him for criticizing the wrong aspects of the game (i.e. fix what you have instead of adding another game mode).

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

1. Where's your proof? Here's mine: http://www.maddenmania.com/forums/sh...9&page=1&pp=20 According to these guys, they're upset that the game isn't realistic enough because while you're blocking, you can hold the defender. I would consider this to be a somewhat large subset of the Madden gamers.

I most definitely wouldn't consider MaddenMania to be the average Madden fan. The fact that Madden sells so much while continuing to be unrealistic seems to show that fans like that it isn't too realistic.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

1. Gotcha. I just don't know what basis you have for making that wager.

I could take a guess at this. Ever played Madden online against a random person?

[Suburban Rhythm]

This thread makes me want to share (again? might have posted this before) a great Madden story.

This guy I worked with a few years ago...we all have one of them in our office, the sports "genius" who gets all his knowledge from what Trey Wingo tells him on SportsCenter.

He was a few years younger than me (at the time, me probably about 28, him 26), and annoyed the hell out of me.

He came in the one morning telling me about how he had stayed up "all night" playing the new Madden (whatever year that would have been). We got into a debate of how realistc/unrealistc the game is...I pointed at EA games as a whole, like Rob Blake being able to shoot 400 mph slap shots in EA NHL, etc.

He got quiet...then after awhile started up again. He asked who I thought the fastest player in the NFL was. I asked him fast, as in game conditions, or fast, running a 40. He told me he "knew" who it was....Michael Bennett. While agreed he was a fast player, I debated he was, for sure, THE fastest player in the league. How did he "know" he was the fastest?

Simple!! Bennett was "the only player to get a 99 speed rating in Madden".

So that is how I view all Madden fans...out of touch with reality.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Pumpy Tudors

I could take a guess at this. Ever played Madden online against a random person?

Just a few times; most of the time I play against my friends.

[Guelph Spartan]

Simple!! Bennett was "the only player to get a 99 speed rating in Madden".

So that is how I view all Madden fans...out of touch with reality.

What was even more fun was having friends base their entire football knowledge on the ORIGINAL Tecmo Bowl. They "thought" they knew a whole lot about 8 teams... wow am I old.

As for multiplayer Madden, wasn't there an online baseball game that tried that years ago? Anybody remember the name of that? Anyways, somebody said it previously, but I really don't think that football would translate well to a completely multiplayer experience, whereas baseball might actually pull it off...

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Just a few times; most of the time I play against my friends.

I played Madden 2005 (that was the first on XBox Live, right?) many times against random players, and most of my opponents were interested in just running the same play over and over again. If the play got them more than 10 yards one time, they'd keep running it until it didn't. Then they'd do a different play. Many of these guys only used two or three plays in the playbook, and they apparently didn't know or care about any of the others.

Given the number of online Madden players who play this way, I think it's a pretty good indicator of what many players want out of the game. I find it to be pretty sad when you're just looking to run up the score against people you don't know, but that's the way it is, and it'll probably be this way forever.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

1. Where's your proof? Here's mine: http://www.maddenmania.com/forums/sh...9&page=1&pp=20 According to these guys, they're upset that the game isn't realistic enough because while you're blocking, you can hold the defender. I would consider this to be a somewhat large subset of the Madden gamers.

I dunno- we're talking about a really small, albeit vocal, sample for a game that sold 2.9 million copies last year (*sigh*)

SI

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I dunno- we're talking about a really small, albeit vocal, sample for a game that sold 2.9 million copies last year (*sigh*)

SI

That was just on the PS2, they sold another 1.2 million on the xbox. That does not even count sales on the PC, PSP or Nintendo.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

That was just on the PS2, they sold another 1.2 million on the xbox. That does not even count sales on the PC, PSP or Nintendo.

That's right. Forgot about that in the quick thumbnail sketch I looked at.

SI

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

I keep reading this as "To Those Mad Hatters Out There"

It scares me when I have something in common with Schmidty.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Surtt

practically blanched?

Not to mention, these are video game developers. They were probably already pretty pale to begin with.