KNBR talk-show host fired over racial comments

[Fouts]

I didn't see a thread about this, but I listen to KNBR daily so thought I would post this and get some thoughts. You gotta watch what you say in regards to categorizing people. If he had left out Caribbean, nobody woulda blinked an eye.

He said the Giants have too many "brain-dead Caribbean hitters hacking at slop nightly". Felipe wouldn't accept his apology, and he was canned a week later.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slu...v=ap&type=lgns

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Fouts

If he had left out Caribbean, nobody woulda blinked an eye.

This is a very interesting issue that I haven't heard anyone really discuss in-depth. My assumption is that had he left out "brain-dead," he would have been OK. My reasoning for that is that even Caribbean people joke about the motto, "you don't get off the island by walking." This is an accepted thing in baseball, that Caribbean players do not have the best strike zone judgment as a whole. Calling them brain-dead just added nothing but an insult to those specific players, though, which was unacceptable.

Who knows, maybe this would have played out like the Al Campaneris/Jimmy the Greek thing in that case - people get outraged, they get fired, then Caribbean players/commentators show up on ESPN and say the exact same things that got those guys fired for (ala Dr. Edwards).

[Young Drachma]

I thought it was a bit unfair, after reading the story. But maybe you hear one, you hear so many..and it's like "for goodness sakes people."

[Karlifornia]

I always like Larry Krueger...well..maybe not so much liked him as much as I didn't dislike him. I think Felipe Alou was being a bit too stubborn about this. The guy made a mistake. He gets paid to be animated on the radio, and something relatively malignant came out of his mouth. Alou basically blackballed KNBR into firing him. I don't know if I agree with that.

[RainRaven]

Alou has said he didn't want the guy fired. He just had felt hurt due to hearing similar things as a player so many years ago and now hearing them in the modern day. I think Alou would've been happy with a longer suspension probably.

[Ksyrup]

Again, the brain-dead thing was inexcusable, but I'm sorry, no one can say that Caribbean players are known for their strike zone judgment. They may learn it when they get over here, but they freakin' swing at everything early in their careers, and some never really grow out of it.

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by RainRaven

Alou has said he didn't want the guy fired. He just had felt hurt due to hearing similar things as a player so many years ago and now hearing them in the modern day. I think Alou would've been happy with a longer suspension probably.

Alou also called the guy a minion of satan, so I take what Alou says with a grain of salt. Alou got him fired. I wonder if a Carribean or black would have made a similar comments about a white player from the sticks if it would have gotten a similar response.

[SackAttack]

What I love is that this comes just days after the adamant response that he wouldn't be fired, and the head of his program director and one other fella who worked for the station rolled, too.

This basically sounds like they were so desperate for Alou's show that they were willing to do what it took to keep him in the lineup.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

Alou also called the guy a minion of satan, so I take what Alou says with a grain of salt. Alou got him fired. I wonder if a Carribean or black would have made a similar comments about a white player from the sticks if it would have gotten a similar response.

Doubt it. Folks of ethnic origin get a free pass on stuff like that because it's racist to imply that they might be prejudiced in any way.

Remember Dusty Baker's comments a couple years ago, about how players from the islands were better suited to the heat because of their pigmentation or whatever the heck it was? I don't see that dogging him, and (surprise!) he's black.

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

Alou also called the guy a minion of satan, so I take what Alou says with a grain of salt. Alou got him fired. I wonder if a Carribean or black would have made a similar comments about a white player from the sticks if it would have gotten a similar response.

Nope, because you can't fire what isn't there. There probably aren't too many broadcasters of Afro-Carribean descent in major market sports broadcasting to begin with...

[Karlifornia]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Doubt it. Folks of ethnic origin get a free pass on stuff like that because it's racist to imply that they might be prejudiced in any way.

Remember Dusty Baker's comments a couple years ago, about how players from the islands were better suited to the heat because of their pigmentation or whatever the heck it was? I don't see that dogging him, and (surprise!) he's black.

Wouldn't people from tropical places be more used to hot weather? I don't see what's wrong with that statement.

[ShaefIllini]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Doubt it. Folks of ethnic origin get a free pass on stuff like that because it's racist to imply that they might be prejudiced in any way.

Remember Dusty Baker's comments a couple years ago, about how players from the islands were better suited to the heat because of their pigmentation or whatever the heck it was? I don't see that dogging him, and (surprise!) he's black.

Dusty has A LOT of things to be dogged about at this point, maybe people just lost that comment in the shuffle.

[Draft Dodger]

those comments are offensive?

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by Draft Dodger

those comments are offensive?

They should hear what I say about Andruw Jones. I think they might have a problem with my "Bobby needs to put on the shock collar" when he's swinging at anything.

[JonInMiddleGA]

And while I rolled my eyes considerably over this story when it first broke last week, I'm a little more open about his firing.

Salvadore said the firings were related to ``inappropriate comedy sound bytes'' played Tuesday morning during a discussion of Alou's recent interview with ESPN in which he roundly criticized KNBR and Krueger, who was suspended last Friday.

I didn't hear the show, obviously, nor have I seen any description of what sound bytes they allegedly used, but I can sort of see how the scenario might have played out:
1)Station mgmt says basically "we've got to suspend you at least a little while but this wasn't all that bad,not enough to be fired over. Just keep your head down for a while, don't draw any more fire, it'll be fine.
2) Announcer figures "That was close but I survived" & having done so, can't resist adding a few "enhancements" to the Alou clips ... or at least his producer (who was also fired) couldn't resist adding them. It wouldn't surprise me if whatever was added might have even been a surprise to Krueger but he picked up the gag & played along with it on-air.

At that point, Kruger has violated the whole "just let this blow over" instructions & the station GM felt he had to fire him.

Not saying that's how it went down, just saying I suspect that's roughly how it went down, in no small part because Krueger got canned along with his producer AND the guy ultimately responsible for both guys.

[Fouts]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

And while I rolled my eyes considerably over this story when it first broke last week, I'm a little more open about his firing.



I didn't hear the show, obviously, nor have I seen any description of what sound bytes they allegedly used, but I can sort of see how the scenario might have played out:
1)Station mgmt says basically "we've got to suspend you at least a little while but this wasn't all that bad,not enough to be fired over. Just keep your head down for a while, don't draw any more fire, it'll be fine.
2) Announcer figures "That was close but I survived" & having done so, can't resist adding a few "enhancements" to the Alou clips ... or at least his producer (who was also fired) couldn't resist adding them. It wouldn't surprise me if whatever was added might have even been a surprise to Krueger but he picked up the gag & played along with it on-air.

At that point, Kruger has violated the whole "just let this blow over" instructions & the station GM felt he had to fire him.

Not saying that's how it went down, just saying I suspect that's roughly how it went down, in no small part because Krueger got canned along with his producer AND the guy ultimately responsible for both guys.

I think you may be right about his producer doing those things, but I believe Krueger was still on suspension.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by RadioFriendlyUnitShifter

Wouldn't people from tropical places be more used to hot weather? I don't see what's wrong with that statement.

Originally Posted by Dusty Baker

It's easier for most Latin guys and it's easier for most minority people because most of us come from heat. You don't find too many brothers in New Hampshire and Maine, right? We were brought over here for the heat. Isn't that history? Your skin color is more conducive to heat than it is to the lighter-skinned people. I don't see the brothers running around burnt. That's a fact. I'm not making this up. I'm not seeing some brothers walking around with some white stuff on their ears and noses.

I dunno. You be the judge.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Good catch Fouts, 'cause I had misread it to believe that Kruger was back on the air Tuesday.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...PG9OE5KV71.DTL

Beleaguered talk-show host Larry Krueger has lost his job at KNBR -- and two other station employees also were fired late Tuesday night.

Longtime program director Bob Agnew and Tony Rhein, the producer of KNBR's morning show, were let go by the station. The announcement was made around 10:15 p.m. Tuesday in a statement issued by senior vice president Tony Salvadore on KNBR's Web site.

On "Sportsphone 680" last Wednesday night, Krueger made reference to the Giants' "brain-dead Caribbean hitters hacking at slop nightly." That led to Krueger getting a suspension that was due to end this Monday.

Giants manager Felipe Alou refused to accept an apology from Krueger. Alou appeared on ESPN's "Outside the Lines" program Monday night and called Krueger "this messenger of Satan, as I call this guy now. ... And I believe there is no forgiveness for Satan."

On Tuesday morning, KNBR aired Alou's sound bite from "Outside the Lines" and then parodied it with Satan references from the Comedy Central show "South Park."

That apparently was the impetus for Rhein's dismissal -- and might have had something to do with the termination of Agnew, who had been with KNBR since 1989.

"The segment, featuring inappropriate comedy sound bites," Salvadore wrote in the statement, "demonstrated an utter lack of regard for the sensitivity of the issues involved and a premeditated intent to ridicule Felipe Alou's commentary."

On his Tuesday night KRON (Channel 4) sportscast, Gary Radnich, the midmorning host on KNBR, said Giants executive vice president Larry Baer and the team were not behind the decision to remove Krueger, Agnew and Rhein.

"KNBR deeply regrets the comments and actions of these individuals," Salvadore said in the statement, "which do not reflect our beliefs or values as an organization. We would like to express our deepest apologies to Felipe Alou, his players and the Giants' organization for this offense to the Caribbean community."

[Crapshoot]

The thing is, while I appreciate there's one guy willing to call Alou the idiot he is, the brain dead hitters on the Giants share a bond well beyond race- there's Mike Matheny, who swings at everything, Marquis Grissom, whose grandmother knows the outside slider is coming on strike 2, there's Lance Neikro, and Jason Ellison - the "Caribbean" hitter in this case is the best hitter on the team. I'm irritated that Alou has any say in this, but Krueger wasn't offensive- he was wrong, and was singling out a group that he didnt need to.

[kingfc22]

On a slightly similiar note:

Grace unlikely to be punished for 'technical difficulty'

---

Associated Press

MIAMI -- Diamondbacks television analyst Mark Grace used multiple expletives during a broadcast of Arizona's game against the Florida Marlins . Team president Rich Dozer said the Tuesday gaffe was regrettable and blamed an apparent faulty "talk-back" button connecting the visiting TV booth to the television truck at Dolphins Stadium. "Through a technical difficulty, I may have offended some people," said Grace, who apologized during a postgame interview and promised not to curse again during a broadcast. "If that's the case, I apologize and I will face any consequences." Dozer told The Arizona Republic there was "no excuse" for the cursing during the Fox Sports Net Arizona telecast. The team president said the Diamondbacks weren't planning disciplinary action against Grace, who spent his final three years as a player with Arizona after 13 seasons with the Chicago Cubs. "We feel terrible about it, and I know Mark is mortified about it, but it's a tough lesson for us all," Dozer said. "Our mission is to provide a quality, family atmosphere, and it's unfortunate something like this happened." Grace's broadcast partner, Thom Brennaman, offered an on-air apology shortly after the crew became aware of the cursing. Diamondbacks spokeswoman Susan Webner told The Associated Press that the team wasn't releasing a statement about Grace's gaffe.

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Anyone know what Grace said? If it was insensitive is he getting special treatment since he is a former player? I hate all this PC crap that goes on, but I think Krueger got a raw deal as did Bob Agnew and I don't see why Grace shouldn't get the boot as well.

[daedalus]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

They should hear what I say about Andruw Jones. I think they might have a problem with my "Bobby needs to put on the shock collar" when he's swinging at anything.

They may find it irritating. They may find it excessive. But I would not think for the same reason as this fellow. You mentioned nothing about his ethnic origin. You did not introduced an unnecessary, unrelated and uncalled for piece of information that has nothing to do with the message you're trying to convey. If you had said, "Bobby needs to put on the shock collar because those brain-dead island people/Curacao-ans (or whatever they're called)/negroes just never learn," then perhaps the offensive level of your example comment may be closer.

I also don't think Alou is required to "forgive" that guy just because he read off some prepared statement written by the station's publicist. If he felt offended by it, he did. If he didn't felt the apology sincere enough, he didn't. That's his business.

NOTE: I have not read the linked article nor have I heard the comment spoken by the announcer. Only commenting on the comments I have seen in this thread.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Someone on a radio board mentioned an interesting possible sub-plot to all of this.

The station in question is currently for sale (as are all Susquehanna stations) -- it's possible that dumping everyone involved in this might be related to that fact; i.e. a) this isn't going to be our problem much longer, let's just fire them all & be done with it and b) the last thing we need while trying to sell stations is any sort of controversy, let's just fire them & avoid any issues (however minor) in the sale process.