Death on Disney Ride

[rkmsuf]

WTF...do they have to make rides like this. I mean come on. This is awful...it's supposed to be a FUN park.

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Boy dies after riding Disney space ride in Florida By Barbara Liston
1 hour, 1 minute ago



ORLANDO, Fla. (Reuters) - A 4-year-old boy died after going on a Walt Disney World thrill ride that uses centrifugal force to simulate the weightlessness, and often the queasiness, of a rocket launch, investigators said on Tuesday.


The boy met the 44-inch (112 cm) height requirement for the Mission: SPACE ride at Disney's Epcot Center park and his mother said he had no history of medical problems, said Orange County Sheriff's Cpl. Carlos Torres.

He initially seemed fine during the Monday afternoon ride, Torres said.

"She said she did notice he was a little rigid, maybe because of the excitement of the ride. She thought he might have been afraid so she grabbed his hand," he said.

But when the ride ended, he was limp and unresponsive, Torres said.

The boy, Daudi Bamuwamye of Sellersville, Pennsylvania, was carried out of the attraction by his mother, Agnes, and placed on a bench where Epcot employees attempted cardiopulmonary resuscitation. He was taken to nearby hospital where he was pronounced dead on Monday afternoon.

An autopsy was ordered to determine the cause of death.

The ride was closed after the incident on Monday but reopened as usual Tuesday morning, said Disney spokeswoman Jacquee Polak.

Torres said investigators inspected the ride as well as the compartment in which Bamuwamye rode with his mother and 8-year-old sister, Ruth. They found no evidence that the boy had vomited and no possible explanation for his death, he said.

The $100 million ride, Disney's most technologically advanced attraction, is a simulator ride that uses spinning centrifugal force to create the sensation of a rocket launch. After lifting off on a pretend trip to Mars, riders experience a momentary feeling of weightlessness, and some complain of nausea. Motion sickness bags are stowed in each ride compartment.

Disney says that Mission: SPACE's G-forces are less than a typical roller coaster, but thrill ride fans say the G-forces are considerably longer than the momentary bursts on a roller coaster.

Multiple warning signs and recorded audio tracks at the Mission: SPACE entrance and in the queue discourage visitors from riding the attraction if they are pregnant or have heart conditions or back and neck problems.

A Disney fan-administered Web site cautions that enough riders over age 55 have complained of chest pain or nausea to become a concern, although the site notes that most of those guests had pre-existing conditions that are specifically mentioned in the posted warning signs.

[Raiders Army]

That is absolutely horrible. The real question is why would a mother take her son on that ride? He's four years old. Wouldn't he be better suited for the teacups? I know that even if my four year old son wanted to ride and he met the height requirement, I would have a lot of hesitation in letting him ride.

[rkmsuf]

right but if it says 44 inches then you would think it's safe right? I mean we are buying their bullsh$t 50 dollar tickets to begin with. At least you'd expect attractions with a ZERO casualty rate for qualifying riders. I don't think that's too much to ask for.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

At least you'd expect attractions with a ZERO casualty rate for qualifying riders. I don't think that's too much to ask for.

Actually, it is. People die. At random times. If you have millions of people riding rides for 2 minutes thousands of times a day, some of them simply have to die.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Samdari

Actually, it is. People die. At random times. If you have millions of people riding rides for 2 minutes thousands of times a day, some of them simply have to die.

Not as a result of your entertainment. You are saying that this kid, sitting at home in front of the tv, keels over regardless then.

I mean simulated rocket launch? Give me a f-king break. Not every Disney customer is cut out for a rocket launch. According to their guidelines anyone over 44 inches tall and no other symptons is.

I'm pretty sure NASA puts them through some other tests.

[sachmo71]

I would ride this ride. I'm not sure I would take my kids on it, though.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

right but if it says 44 inches then you would think it's safe right? I mean we are buying their bullsh$t 50 dollar tickets to begin with. At least you'd expect attractions with a ZERO casualty rate for qualifying riders. I don't think that's too much to ask for.

I think that's entirely too much to ask. You could have a four year old walk outside, have a bird fall out of the sky and impale itself on his jugular. Or walk outside after a light frost, slip on a really small patch of ice, fall over, and die. Or walks outside when raining, the water just happens to have rolled off of a peanut in the mouth of a bird and he's deathly allergic to peanuts. Or maybe he just has a birth defect in his heart, takes a step outside and dies.

It doesn't look like Disney did anything wrong here and sometimes accidents do happen. Try being the engineer- how do you design for the one fluke death while millions of people have ridden this ride without any incident? Do you not use scissors because there's a chance you could somehow injure yourself when using them?

SI

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I think that's entirely too much to ask. You could have a four year old walk outside, have a bird fall out of the sky and impale itself on his jugular. Or walk outside after a light frost, slip on a really small patch of ice, fall over, and die. Or walks outside when raining, the water just happens to have rolled off of a peanut in the mouth of a bird and he's deathly allergic to peanuts. Or maybe he just has a birth defect in his heart, takes a step outside and dies.

It doesn't look like Disney did anything wrong here and sometimes accidents do happen. Try being the engineer- how do you design for the one fluke death while millions of people have ridden this ride without any incident? Do you not use scissors because there's a chance you could somehow injure yourself when using them?

SI

Simple, don't design a ride where there is a chance of DEATH because of the ride.

Of course people keel over but I'm talking about as a result of G forces or something like that.

I really think these "engineers" are pushing the limits of reasonable entertainment. This isn't an isolated incident.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Not as a result of your entertainment. You are saying that this kid, sitting at home in front of the tv, keels over regardless then.

I mean simulated rocket launch? Give me a f-king break. Not every Disney customer is cut out for a rocket launch. According to their guidelines anyone over 44 inches tall and no other symptons is.

I'm pretty sure NASA puts them through some other tests.

I agree that deaths as a result of the entertainment provided should be exceptionally rare (I think even with that condition, guaranteeing zero would be impossible) if a requirement of noone ever dying on the ride were imposed, there would be no rides anywhere.

Also, we do not yet know that this kid actually did die as a result of the entertainment provided. I would bet he had a condition that was unkown to anyone, and riding the ride with such condition was the problem. After all, if 44 inches is the only requirement, I bet thousands (at a minimum) of 44 inch 4 year olds have ridden this ride in the past without dying.

I do find it really surprising that they operated the ride the next day however. I would think that some sort of official inquiry into his death by local authorities, and CYA if not mock concern by Disney would have kept it closed a few days at least.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

don't design a ride where there is a chance of DEATH because of the ride.

Well, Engineers don't have data that include the amount of G's that would kill every person who might ever be born (and over 44" tall). You really are asking the impossible. There is simply NO activity for which anyone can guarantee a death rate of zero.

[Raiders Army]

Disney says that Mission: SPACE's G-forces are less than a typical roller coaster, but thrill ride fans say the G-forces are considerably longer than the momentary bursts on a roller coaster.

Multiple warning signs and recorded audio tracks at the Mission: SPACE entrance and in the queue discourage visitors from riding the attraction if they are pregnant or have heart conditions or back and neck problems.

While I agree that death should never be caused by riding these rides, it was certainly not intentional. Additionally, do you blame the park or the mother or both for the death?

Many people warn against the dangers of driving a car, yet people die in cars every day. The car manufacturers can install all sorts of safety devices, yet some responsibility has to lie with the people who drive them...just like some responsibility has to lie with the mother.

The kid was four years old. He's not in a position as to decide whether he goes on a ride or not. The parents are ultimately responsible.

[rkmsuf]

Maybe zero is unattainable but I just think subjecting people to forces unnatural to "normal" folk is irresponsible. Particularly when you charge them huge fees to get into the park.

I mean anything can happen but compare the fatality rate to all McDonalds restaraunts and these rides and you tell me where the random element lies.

[Aylmar]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

I mean anything can happen but compare the fatality rate to all McDonalds restaraunts and these rides and you tell me where the random element lies.

Long or short term fatality rate?

[Julio Riddols]

It would seem to me that it is up to the rider if they want to go on a ride and/or take their kids. It was a bad decision, nothing more, nothing less. A tragedy, but not something to be outraged about IMO. There are warnings for a reason, and I am sure that they will change the requirements for this ride to help avoid future incidents.

[judicial clerk]

All your questions and concerns will all be addressed in the lawsuits.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

I just think subjecting people to forces unnatural to "normal" folk is irresponsible. Particularly when you charge them huge fees to get into the park.

Well, being subjected to forces they don't normally face is the allure of thrill rides. People are paying those huge fees specifically for the opportunity to be subjected to those forces.

Now, maybe Disney did irresponsibly design this ride, or set the requirements for riding it irresponsibly. We don't know nearly enough to decide that yet though. This could have been a random death that happened to occur on a perfectly safe ride. We just don't know yet. But, because his mother happened to say he was "perfectly healthy," we can't just jump to the conclusion that this ride is extremely dangerous. After all, we do know millions of people have ridden it without dying.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Maybe zero is unattainable but I just think subjecting people to forces unnatural to "normal" folk is irresponsible. Particularly when you charge them huge fees to get into the park.

I think a ride, by definition, subjects people to unnatural forces. Be it a teacup ride or this one. There is a choice one has to either go on the ride or not. Disney does not force you to go on this ride and there is an element of danger that can occur.

You can not protect everyone from everything. You can do things to minimize the risk but, accidents do happen unfortunately.

[gstelmack]

I predict it will turn out this kid had a not-yet diagnosed heart issue.

[JonInMiddleGA]

As those who know me (and our frequent family trips to WDW) might imagine, this story definitely got my attention this morning.

As it happens, Mission:Space was the highlight ride of the final night of our most recent trip a few months back, so this is even fresher in my mind.

The ride is a more intense experience than most park attractions, that's for certain. But it was quite obvious (to us) that it was tougher on me, for example, than it was on our 7 y/o daredevil.

Other than some lightheadedness after the 2nd time around no ill effects on any of us, and that was very likely a product of being too tired & having not eaten properly that day combined with riding twice a little too close together.

I'm not a big "thrill ride" person (much to my family's chagrin), so if I give something marks as being passable, you have to figure it's relatively tame ... and far safer IMO than some of the roller coasters, or the new Soarin' ride, etc.

Having ridden it, my layman's guess would be that this particular child had some undiscovered heart condition or circulatory problem, one that would have put him at risk for any number of activites -- this just happened to be the one where it was revealed.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Simple, don't design a ride where there is a chance of DEATH because of the ride.

Of course people keel over but I'm talking about as a result of G forces or something like that.

I really think these "engineers" are pushing the limits of reasonable entertainment. This isn't an isolated incident.

There's no such thing as "no chance of death".

There are millions and millions of theme park visitors a year and every year a couple die. It's not possible to predict every way someone can die. You certainly try to minimize the chance, you don't intentially cut corners, but this is one of those "how much is too much".

For instance, you complain about the $50 cost of the ticket. How about if it costs $20000 to go to Disney because every person riding on every ride is subjected to an MRI, CAT scan, and full physical before and after every ride. It might prevent one or two deaths, but it would put Disney out of business and what rights do they have?

SI

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

I predict it will turn out this kid had a not-yet diagnosed heart issue.

I was thinking about-to-burst brain aneurism.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Simple, don't design a ride where there is a chance of DEATH because of the ride.

Well, let's see here ...

Space Mountain gets shut down immediately -- heights, abrupt turns, speed
Splash Mountain goes too -- enough water to drown you, and a 52 foot drop ain't exactly natural.
Astro Orbiter -- one rambunctious moment & down you go ... gotta close it
Big Thunder Mtn RR -- see Space Mountain, minus the height -- gone
Pirates of the Carribean & It's A Small World -- all that water to drown in
Magic Carpets of Alladin & Dumbo - plenty of height for a fall to kill you
Peter Pan's Flight -- one mechanical failure & you're dumped a long way down into the London street scene, so it's gotta go.
Goofy's Barnstormer -- ever see how high that short little ride is off the ground? Closed
Jungle Cruise, Tom Sawyer Island, Liberty Square Riverboat -- one problem & those boats will sink quick, drowing tens of people. Gone
WDW Railroad -- one slip & under the wheels you go
Haunted Mansion -- nobody is likely to survive a drop backwards "down the roof" to the graveyard. It's gotta go too.
Tomorrowland Indy Speedway -- One sharp collision from behind could snap an unsuspecting neck.
Swiss Family Treehouse -- I think that actually may be the highest accessible point in the whole park, and it's literally waiting for one false step to claim your life.
Tomorrowland Transit Authority -- those outdoor segments are too high off the ground

Let's see, that leaves ... Hall of Presidents, County Bear Jamboree, Buzz Lightyear's Space Ranger Spin, Cinderella's Golden Carousel (and it's iffy), Donald's Boat, Mickey & Minnie's Country House, Philharmagic, The Enchanted Tiki Room, Pooh, Timekeeper, Mad Tea Party, Cinderella's Castle, Carousel of Progress, Stitch's Great Escape,Frontierland Arcade and Snow White (which actually has one of the highest rates of terrified children of any Disney attraction, it should probably go too).

Add that up, and what's left is basically a small school fair with some animatronic show plus a couple of high-tech rides.

[DanGarion]

I think we should ban sports, I mean come on, people die!!!!! ON NOES!!!!!111!1one!

Riding a ride at Disneyland or any amusement park is safer then driving a car.

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by Mustang

I think a ride, by definition, subjects people to unnatural forces. Be it a teacup ride or this one. There is a choice one has to either go on the ride or not. Disney does not force you to go on this ride and there is an element of danger that can occur.

You can not protect everyone from everything. You can do things to minimize the risk but, accidents do happen unfortunately.

I believe gravity is a natural force. If it exists, that is.

[Celeval]

Although this article doesn't state it, the one I read on CNN mentions the standard amusement park sign - "Do not ride this ride if you have high blood pressure, heart problems, etc..." I agree with before, chances are the kid had a weak heart or some other condition. They hadn't found it yet, and the ride exacerbated it. Not much else can be done there.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

The kid may have had some sort of illness or maybe a brain aneurism during the ride. Regardless to say it is sad.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Samdari

Well, Engineers don't have data that include the amount of G's that would kill every person who might ever be born (and over 44" tall). You really are asking the impossible. There is simply NO activity for which anyone can guarantee a death rate of zero.

If there was an activity with a guarenteed death rate of zero it'd be worth millions ..... even if it was a boring way to ensure immortality

[ISiddiqui]

Jesus Christ... people are blaming Disney without any knowledge of why the kid died? You gotta be kidding me? How many people have ridden on the ride without dying?

Oh, and Jon, I also read that a 77 year old woman died while on Pirates of the Carribean, so you can mark that on your list as a ride that has already killed!

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

WTF...do they have to make rides like this. I mean come on. This is awful...it's supposed to be a FUN park.

Do you go outdoors?

[rexallllsc]

If I had to guess which ride someone died on, this one would be a ways down the list.

I think anyone who has ridden on it would agree. This is not a crazy ride by any means.

[JonInMiddleGA]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/busin...home-headlines
An autopsy this afternoon did not reveal any obvious cause of death, such as trauma. The office now will do more tests on the boy to determine exactly what caused the death -- a process that could take four to 12 weeks.

[Bad-example]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

An autopsy this afternoon did not reveal any obvious cause of death, such as trauma. The office now will do more tests on the boy to determine exactly what caused the death -- a process that could take four to 12 weeks

Damn...12 weeks is a long time to wait before burying your 4 year old

[JonInMiddleGA]

B-e, they won't always hold the body that long, that's just how long some lab results take to get back (not many things more overworked, in my experiences, than a state crime lab, which is where a lot of tests like that are done)

[Bad-example]

Good point. I hope they don't have to wait too long.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Samdari

I agree that deaths as a result of the entertainment provided should be exceptionally rare (I think even with that condition, guaranteeing zero would be impossible) if a requirement of noone ever dying on the ride were imposed, there would be no rides anywhere.

Also, we do not yet know that this kid actually did die as a result of the entertainment provided. I would bet he had a condition that was unkown to anyone, and riding the ride with such condition was the problem. After all, if 44 inches is the only requirement, I bet thousands (at a minimum) of 44 inch 4 year olds have ridden this ride in the past without dying.

I do find it really surprising that they operated the ride the next day however. I would think that some sort of official inquiry into his death by local authorities, and CYA if not mock concern by Disney would have kept it closed a few days at least.

I was surprised they opened it the next day, too. But maybe they thought it'd be admitting guilt.

[ShaqFu]

Originally Posted by judicial clerk

All your questions and concerns will all be addressed in the lawsuits.

Nope. Disney usually offers a lump sum before ever going to court. Read "Mouse Tales" or "More Mouse Tales." I actually haven't had the chance to head up to Orlando yet to try this out, but I will soon.

It almost sounds like this ride is just a play on the old Gravitron, where the spinning plastered you against the wall and you rose off the floor. Disney just changed the ride vehicle and threw in the theme.

The problem with shutting a ride like this down for good is that you pretty much have to shut down most of the new roller coasters built in the past few years. Several coasters now exceed speeds of over 100 mph. Others drop guests down 400+ foot drops, some 90 degrees vertical. They produce excessive Gs.

I think in the case of this attraction, the motion is intensified over something like Gravitron. They're adding in the intensity of something like Star Tours too. Perhaps that is too much for some guests.

Also, many are making an argument for the physical effects. One has to also consider the mental/emotional effects. You can go into cardiac shock by simply through fear. Ever hear the phrase "scared to death?"

Given the boy's age, that is a real possiblity. Perhaps Disney will have to raise the minimum age on the ride and/or increase the minimum height. Of course, it's not hart to beat height requirements. Many Disney travel guides tell parents how to beat the rules, by putting inserts, cotton, wood, etc. into shoes.

Sad that this happened, but I think the bigger problem is when people don't think before they ride. Disney offers so much more at its Florida theme parks, that missing one ride shouldn't ruin the trip.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by ShaqFu

Given the boy's age, that is a real possiblity. Perhaps Disney will have to raise the minimum age on the ride and/or increase the minimum height. Of course, it's not hart to beat height requirements. Many Disney travel guides tell parents how to beat the rules, by putting inserts, cotton, wood, etc. into shoes.

True, but if the parents "beat the rules", then Disney wouldn't be responsible.

[astrosfan64]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Simple, don't design a ride where there is a chance of DEATH because of the ride.

Of course people keel over but I'm talking about as a result of G forces or something like that.

I really think these "engineers" are pushing the limits of reasonable entertainment. This isn't an isolated incident.

Cancel football season please. "sarcasim"
I mean there is a chance of someone dying playing football for our entertainment.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by astrosfan64

Cancel football season please. "sarcasim"
I mean there is a chance of someone dying playing football for our entertainment.

Well, that DID happen in the Arena Football League this year...

[JeffR]

Originally Posted by ShaqFu

Given the boy's age, that is a real possiblity. Perhaps Disney will have to raise the minimum age on the ride and/or increase the minimum height. Of course, it's not hart to beat height requirements. Many Disney travel guides tell parents how to beat the rules, by putting inserts, cotton, wood, etc. into shoes.

Really, I'm surprised they don't enforce it a lot more strictly already. A friend of mine was in middle management at Universal Studios Florida for a few years. From the stories she tells, a good chunk of the serious ride injuries come from dumbass parents dragging their small kids onto thrill rides. One that sticks in my mind was a grossly obese guy who had his young son sitting next to him on a ride. The restraining bar was the kind that covers everybody in the whole car. Fatso's stomach blocked it from going down all the way, somehow that wasn't detected by the ride operator, and the kid went flying at the first sharp turn. They replaced the restraint system after that, but the kid (who survived) and his family lost their court case.

Which, I suppose, might be why they don't get too harsh with the enforcement. A good legal department and plenty of warning signs might be working fine for them financially.

[ShaqFu]

Originally Posted by JeffR

Which, I suppose, might be why they don't get too harsh with the enforcement. A good legal department and plenty of warning signs might be working fine for them financially.

The best warning is on the back of the admission ticket, where the park usually puts disclaimers about injuries and such. The parks can treat that as a contract that is in effect the moment you pass the turnstyle.

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

WTF...do they have to make rides like this. I mean come on. This is awful...it's supposed to be a FUN park.

Yes. Shame on Disney for creating a ride that they knew would kill people. And I'm sure no-one found this ride run. No one at all.

I'll lay heavy money the kid has some medical condition and the timing was coincidental.

[CraigSca]

My wife and I both said, "you put a 4 year old on that ride?!". Having a 4 year old daughter, we can relate and know damn well we would never put the child on a ride that provides barf bags and warnings to senior citizens.

That being said, unless there was some gross negligence on Disney's part (falsification of test records or the like), I just seem this as a purely random occurrence. As others have suggested, the child probably had some ailment or condition that, unfortunately, remained undetected until his demise.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Samdari

Well, being subjected to forces they don't normally face is the allure of thrill rides. People are paying those huge fees specifically for the opportunity to be subjected to those forces.

Now, maybe Disney did irresponsibly design this ride, or set the requirements for riding it irresponsibly. We don't know nearly enough to decide that yet though. This could have been a random death that happened to occur on a perfectly safe ride. We just don't know yet. But, because his mother happened to say he was "perfectly healthy," we can't just jump to the conclusion that this ride is extremely dangerous. After all, we do know millions of people have ridden it without dying.

This I agree with.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

I was surprised they opened it the next day, too. But maybe they thought it'd be admitting guilt.

Under Florida law (and, I assume, many other states' laws), any actions undertaken after an accident which causes injury or harm to remedy the problem (otherwise known as subsequent remedial measures) are inadmissible to prove negligence, defect, or culpable conduct. This is a public policy consideration so that problems are not left unfixed for fear of losing a lawsuit, thereby leaving potentially dangerous conditions unchecked. So even if Disney had found a problem and fixed it, it couldn't be used against them in court (generally speaking, anyway. There are other ways to get it before the jury/judge).

[wbatl1]

Just some stats I heard this morning for those of you who think this ride should be closed. 8.6 million people have ridden the ride. 6 have had to go to the hospital with minor injuries(diziness, ect.) and one death. That is less than one in a million chance of even having a minor injury, much less death.

[rkmsuf]

Cross off the Log Flume

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Family Injured Because N.J. Water Ride Was Dry
Ride To Remain Closed Pending Probe

POSTED: 6:33 am HST June 19, 2005
UPDATED: 6:41 am HST June 19, 2005

ATLANTIC CITY, N.J. -- A ride on the Atlantic City, N.J., boardwalk is expected to stay closed until state officials finish investigating a mishap that left a family injured.



City fire officials said the five family members from Philadelphia were hurt on the Big Splash log flume ride Saturday.

The car the five were riding in went down an incline and into a basin that was supposed to be filled with water but was apparently empty.

The father was thrown from the ride.

Authorities said he was hospitalized, but hospital officials would not release his condition.

The mother and three children suffered minor injuries in the accident, which happened about 2:30 p.m.

The family members' names were not released.
Copyright 2005 by The Associated Press. All rights reserved

[ShaqFu]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Cross off the Log Flume


The car the five were riding in went down an incline and into a basin that was supposed to be filled with water but was apparently empty.

Huh?

[Wolfpack]

The car the five were riding in went down an incline and into a basin that was supposed to be filled with water but was apparently empty.

Umm...how is this possible? Were they like the first riders of the day and the people didn't check the pool for water or something? Even if there were prior boats that pushed water out, usually the flue that sends people in is also contributing water to re-fill the basin. Strange.

[QuikSand]

This has great potential to become an ongoing forum quest for rkmsuf. May I be the first to suggest a dedicated thread in the Dynasty section? "My Crusade Against Thrill Ride Injuries" has a nice ring to it, though I suspect he could work in a movie quote and make it even wittier.