OOTP 7 Development Update From Markus

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Sorry that it took so long, but the worst flu I had in years floored me for over a week. Well, here is a little update:

The league builder of OOTP 7 has been completed, featuring standard leagues (like MLB, Japan, Korea etc.), fictional leagues and historical MLB seasons that can be imported from the freeware Baseball Archive Database. The league builder allows you to set up an OOTP game using virtually every combination of leagues possible.

Once you have added a league to your game, you may edit the most important league options. These options include:

- Names: You can assign names to the league, divisions, teams, awards and playoff rounds. Nicknames and abbreviations may be edited as well.

- Basic Rules & Options: These are the basic league rules. For example, the designated hitter rule, whether the league features a draft, how many games are played per season, how the schedule is set up and the format of the playoffs. Split season formats are now supported as well as some Minor Leagues use them in real life.

- Roster & Financial Rules: All roster and financial rules from OOTP 6 are present here, with some additions. You may set foreigner limits for the roster for example as Japanese Baseball has such restrictions. Also, a free agent compensation model is now present and you may enter typical salaries for different player values so that financial systems from the past may be recreated. New as well is the ability to edit certain dates, like the draft date, the Rule 5 draft date, the trade deadline date or the roster expansion date.

- League Strategy & MLB equivalencies: These global strategy settings were called 'Era Settings' in OOTP 6, and they basically reflect the way baseball is played in this league. All basic strategies and some other settings can be adjusted and will be used by the game engine and the AI. The MLB equivalencies set the level of player quality in that league compared to real life MLB. This can be used for player creation and also for the roster AI of teams that have minor league affiliates.

Fictional leagues feature a structure and affiliations editor as well. You may set up a league of your desired structure, and the only limits are a maximum of 2 sub-leagues and a maximum of 20 divisions per sub-league. There is no maximum number of teams.

Now if you have set up a fictional league, you may add minor leagues to that league as well, either automatically (so the generated minor leagues have the same structure as the parent league) or manually. Affiliations may be edited although there is a limit of 10 affiliated teams for one parent team.

Importing historical seasons is just as easy as in OOTP 6 but 10 times faster! You select the path to the database and the import options (I have added the option to base talent ratings on the peak years of a player's career) and half a minute later the league has been imported and added to the game.

The beauty about the new database of OOTP is that you can have any number of leagues in your game. So you may for example have a game with the 1923 MLB league, the 1977 MLB league (with fictional minor leagues applied) and a fictional league in every country of this world. The only limit is the memory of your PC.

Andreas is currently developing a pretty powerful XML-based text engine, which will be used in OOTP in various places, mainly the play-by-play commentary and the news engine. It allows user customization since all the text will be read from a relatively simple XML file.

Cheers,
Markus

.

[Crapshoot]

Ben, I understood the point you were making with your last post, but I think that the nature of OOTP has been so based on continuity, you would be hard pressed to have many people continue without their multiplayetr leagues. Hell, I hated MP for a long time - only played solo, but after joining a league, I can't imagine going back to solo gaming because the game isnt strong enough as a sim (as opposed to a recreator). Im glad Markus is taking steps to improve the solo game, but I wonder if its too little, too late with regards to the direction.

[GoldenEagle]

I am not real excited about the new version of OOTP. The features listed just do not appeal to me. They seem like some people would like them, but not me. I know the new game of OOTP will be pretty but that is not going to be enough to push me over the top. If I buy it, I will be waiting for reviews before hand. I will not buy it right away like I did with previous versions.

I am also concerned that the play by play will not be ‘Americanized’. The game engine already had some issues that did not accurately reflect MLB baseball, including the PBP. I think that will eb the same, if not worse, in this version.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

but I wonder if its too little, too late with regards to the direction.

Highly doubtful considering he now has the resources of the most popular solo game in the history of sports text sims.

[Ben E Lou]

What Danny said.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by Danny Drickman

Highly doubtful considering he now has the resources of the most popular solo game in the history of sports text sims.

Fair point Danny- Im referring to the fan base Markus has built up - and that group. Baseball doesnt have the cross-cultural appeal of football - and the American market is far less friendly to text-sims as is, except as a small niche.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Fair point Danny- Im referring to the fan base Markus has built up - and that group. Baseball doesnt have the cross-cultural appeal of football - and the American market is far less friendly to text-sims as is, except as a small niche.

If it turns out that leagues aren't able to be carried over to OOTP7, it will be a very small minority of OOTP6 buyers who decline to purchase it. Many leagues will decide to just stick with OOTP6, obviously, but even the "multiplayer-only" crowd will buy OOTP7 our of either curiosity, or to get in a v7 league as well as their v6 league.

[GoldenEagle]

Originally Posted by Danny Drickman

Highly doubtful considering he now has the resources of the most popular solo game in the history of sports text sims.

That is true but I do not think that know what we know as baseball. I do not think they fully understand the free agent system as opposed to the transfer system. I am not sure if they understand the strategy of the game and the deep levels that are involved. If I want my pitcher to take a pitch then bunt, I should be able to do that. I want my first baseman to be a big bulky power hitter and not some speedy contact guy. Those guys play in the outfield.

If my use of the term those guys seems derogatory, it was not meant to be. SI Games makes outstanding simulations. However, I am concerned about them going into the baseball market without the proper tools, so to speak.

[miked]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

I am also concerned that the play by play will not be ‘Americanized’. The game engine already had some issues that did not accurately reflect MLB baseball, including the PBP. I think that will eb the same, if not worse, in this version.

Well you're in luck. I think he said somewhere in the thread that PBP and news modules will created with much input from people on the forums, so you can get rid of the pesky PBP issues. It will also be an XML file which means you can probably take whatever you don't like out.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

If it turns out that leagues aren't able to be carried over to OOTP7, it will be a very small minority of OOTP6 buyers who decline to purchase it. Many leagues will decide to just stick with OOTP6, obviously, but even the "multiplayer-only" crowd will buy OOTP7 our of either curiosity, or to get in a v7 league as well as their v6 league.

Or some will just stick with v5....

[sovereignstar]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

However, I am concerned about them going into the baseball market without the proper tools, so to speak.

Just curious here - what kind of "proper tools" you are referring to?

[cartman]

Originally Posted by sovereignstar

Just curious here - what kind of "proper tools" you are referring to?

I think he's referring to the in-depth knowledge of the sport. It would be kinda like us over here on this side of the pond trying to make a cricket game. Sure we could get the basics down, but we would miss most of the nuances.

That's been my big beef with OOTP in regards to in-game management. If you want to call a hit and run or a steal, you always have to make the decision with a 0-0 count. The only other time you might get to make a change is if there is a 2 strike foul ball. It's things like that I believe GE is referring to.

[Hammer755]

Originally Posted by cartman

I think he's referring to the in-depth knowledge of the sport. It would be kinda like us over here on this side of the pond trying to make a cricket game. Sure we could get the basics down, but we would miss most of the nuances.

That's been my big beef with OOTP in regards to in-game management. If you want to call a hit and run or a steal, you always have to make the decision with a 0-0 count. The only other time you might get to make a change is if there is a 2 strike foul ball. It's things like that I believe GE is referring to.

But that really is a design decision, not a flaw in the game. There are pitch-by-pitch modes, and there are batter-by-batter modes. OOTP just happens to be a batter-by-batter. Frankly, I prefer this way. I know it is not ideal because of exactly the points you bring up, but to me pitch-by-pitch would get very tedious very quickly.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Hammer755

pitch-by-pitch would get very tedious very quickly.

Not to mention that it would slow things down *tremendously* for those of us who sim every game.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cartman

It's things like that I believe GE is referring to.

I can't speak for GE but it's "things like that" that keep me from being much more than remotely interested in OOTP at this point.

[Tekneek]

I think it sounds very interesting. Aside from being in the RWBL, OOTP has been about creating fictional baseball leagues, as well as many aborted attempts to run from 1901 to present day with the Lahman DB. I am reading the feature list and imagining just how massive a fictional basball WORLD I could create, where players potentially move overseas, or sign with an independent league, etc. If it works as advertised, I would intend to buy it.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Fair point Danny- Im referring to the fan base Markus has built up - and that group. Baseball doesnt have the cross-cultural appeal of football - and the American market is far less friendly to text-sims as is, except as a small niche.

Markus is well aware of his existing fan base and I'm sure he won't do anything much differently this time around than he has in the past (apart from making the game more realistic and faster).

Yes it will have a few extra leagues in it - ie. Japan, Korea, but this won't make the MLB any less realistic, with regards to in-game text I'd expect this to be pretty much wholly Americanised to be honest (although in Japanese it'll look different ).

With regards to implementing other leagues, this is simply an easy and sensible way of getting the game out to more people in a manner which they want it, simply put there are huge baseball audiences in some countries outside of America and it'd be silly not to model those leagues in the game (we have to recoup the dev costs somehow ... selling the game sort of helps ).

This not only helps sales outside of America, but will also make the game much more realistic imho as you'll have a whole 'world' available rather than just the MLB, even if you rarely look into it, it will help players who start outside of the MLB and move into it progress more realistically ...

Hope this helps,

Marc

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

That is true but I do not think that know what we know as baseball. I do not think they fully understand the free agent system as opposed to the transfer system. I am not sure if they understand the strategy of the game and the deep levels that are involved. If I want my pitcher to take a pitch then bunt, I should be able to do that. I want my first baseman to be a big bulky power hitter and not some speedy contact guy. Those guys play in the outfield.

If my use of the term those guys seems derogatory, it was not meant to be. SI Games makes outstanding simulations. However, I am concerned about them going into the baseball market without the proper tools, so to speak.

Hmmmm - SI didn't have the 'tools' to make a baseball game and I was well aware of this and wouldn't have dreamt of us doing so without Markus's assistance.

If you've liked Markus's previous games then I'd definitely suggest at least trying a demo of OOTP7 when its available.

Markus is again creating the game, just this time he's got the benefit of our tool-base (GUI engines, code libraries etc.) and experience (basically he goes through his design plans with us and we try and suggest ways to make things more efficient etc.) ... he has full control over the game and its approach to gameplay etc. ... so nothing has changed there, after all if I hadn't thought Markus was the right person to make a Baseball sim he wouldn't have joined us, as I do think he's the right person to do it it'd be pointless me getting in the way of letting him do it ...

[jbmagic]

i dont get the multiple leagues.


are they going to have different talent per different league.

like will MLB league have more talent than the foreign leagues?

[cartman]

Originally Posted by Hammer755

But that really is a design decision, not a flaw in the game. There are pitch-by-pitch modes, and there are batter-by-batter modes. OOTP just happens to be a batter-by-batter. Frankly, I prefer this way. I know it is not ideal because of exactly the points you bring up, but to me pitch-by-pitch would get very tedious very quickly.

Maybe that's so, but that's one of the reasons I never got into the coaching mode of OOTP. To me, having to coach like that would be like only getting to choose the plays you are going to run for a series in football on 1st and 10. It wouldn't matter if you got sacked, had penalties, or if it was 2nd and 1 or 3rd and 9. All of your decisions would be made on 1st and 10. That's been my biggest beef. There's a world of difference calling a steal on a 0-0 count versus a 0-2 count versus a 3-2 count.

[Senator]

I have always found I got my money's worth from this series. I will support it.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

i dont get the multiple leagues.


are they going to have different talent per different league.

like will MLB league have more talent than the foreign leagues?

From this: "The MLB equivalencies set the level of player quality in that league compared to real life MLB," it sounds like you can scale them in relation to the MLB. So, maybe the Japanese league's great players would be good to very good in the MLB, while a great player in a Dutch league would be a AAA-type player. I think that sounds awesome.

It also sounds like you will be able to stick your own fictional league into a universe with the real MLB, which would be neat (if I am understanding it correctly).

[sabotai]

FWIW, I think at some point Markus or one of the OOTP guys mentioned that OOTP7 is going to be pitch-by-pitch, not batter-by-batter.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

i dont get the multiple leagues.

are they going to have different talent per different league.

like will MLB league have more talent than the foreign leagues?

It'll be realistically modelled as closely as possible to real-life ... with real players throughout if we can acquire the licences (note: option will be available for fake players).

[lighthousekeeper]

Originally Posted by Senator

I have always found I got my money's worth from this series. I will support it.

I'm going to second this and go even further. I consider myself a pretty skeptical guy, but I really think this is going to be the greatest baseball sim ever made.

Even if it only achieves 60% of what it is attempting, it will still be amazing: it is attempting something that I don't think has ever been attempted before in an major american sports sim - simulate the entire planet's baseball universe. If I had known 5 years ago that this game was coming, I never would have moved out of my parents house and got a job, so I could play all day long.

I would think that baseball is the world's 2nd most popular sport.(?) If so, this has the makings of having a HUGE impact.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Senator

I have always found I got my money's worth from this series. I will support it.

Ditto. Furthermore, I'm among those who are excited to see what the SI group can help add to the experience.

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I would think that baseball is the world's 2nd most popular sport.(?) If so, this has the makings of having a HUGE impact.

Basketball, methinks. Leagues in more countries than baseball...

[Buccaneer]

As long as I can import from Lahman and create a 19xx historical league (along with a good FA and trade AI), nothing else matters to me. But first I'll see what would make this experience different in this version as I got tired of playing OOTP with v.6.

[Young Drachma]

I think it'll be cool. It's not perfect, but it's still comprehensive and when I'm in the mood..OOTP really does fill my fix for baseball simming.

[KWhit]

I'll get it I'm sure (but probably wait for a review or two from players I trust). I'd love to see some 2D graphics like FM, though.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by KWhit

I'll get it I'm sure (but probably wait for a review or two from players I trust). I'd love to see some 2D graphics like FM, though.

Me too. What they did with FM 2005 and what Gary has done with TPB has really added to the immersion of those games. Again, I point to FPS as that was a perfect representation of a great sim engine, right before your eyes.


Todd

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I
I would think that baseball is the world's 2nd most popular sport.(?) If so, this has the makings of having a HUGE impact.

Sports more popular than baseball: real football, cricket, basketball, athletics, and so forth- far, far more popular.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Klinglerware

Basketball, methinks. Leagues in more countries than baseball...

Yeah, it's basketball. Remember, baseball was the sport the Olympics wanted to drop. It's popular in certain countries - but it's still got a lot of progress to make in other countries, in terms of major organization and such. Baseball, I mean.

[lighthousekeeper]

Originally Posted by me

I would think that baseball is the world's 2nd most popular sport.(?) If so, this has the makings of having a HUGE impact.

I knew when I wrote that sentence that there would be posts that point out the other sports more popular than baseball, culminating in a link to a UN report showing a 2001 survey of world sport popularity. But my use of the hyperbole was just to stress how baseball is popular and has a fan base outside of the US.

[yabanci]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

.... I am not sure if they understand the strategy of the game and the deep levels that are involved......

Hit the nail on the head.

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

I knew when I wrote that sentence that there would be posts that point out the other sports more popular than baseball, culminating in a link to a UN report showing a 2001 survey of world sport popularity. But my use of the hyperbole was just to stress how baseball is popular and has a fan base outside of the US.

Point taken, baseball is typically a significant part of the culture in countries where it is played...

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

.... I am not sure if they understand the strategy of the game and the deep levels that are involved......

Originally Posted by yabanci

Hit the nail on the head.

Probably true. But with that being said, there are differences in baseball strategy in other countries where it is played.

In an unrelated note, watching Japanese baseball is like watching baseball played on another planet. Even the way the televise it is different--I didn't hear any play by play or commentators during live action (but they do it between innings and after the game). However watching Bobby Valentine and Benny Agbayani reunited was amusing, and almost touching...

[Ben E Lou]

Markus mentioned this little gem deep in a thread at OOTPDev. Thought it was worth mentioning. If implemented properly, this would be *very* nice:

Yes, that is an option. Each manager, scout, GM in OOTP 7 will have their own abilities and style of managing... some prefer speed to power, or OBP to AVG, or youth to veterans. So basically, since computer controlled teams have GMs and managers, you have different team personalities

[kserra]

As one of those many "solo" league players, my biggest issue, which many have brought up since version 4 or so...

We need different GM's and strategies for running teams...baseball is special because try as we might, there really isn't a "perfect" way to run a team, and this needs to be reflected by having different "personalities" running teams...

I have no interest in Pitch-by-Pitch mode...give me a sim that recreates 30 DIFFERENT people running teams, with different ideas on how to be successful, then I'll be a happy camper...

Please, please, please, add this to Version 7...

I played version 6 less than any other because of my frustration with "more of the same"...

The game is great, but it needs to take a step forward in terms of total immersion and give us what many solo leaguers have been asking for years...

Kevin

[kserra]

whoops...I swear...I did not see Sky Dogs previous message (the one right before mine)

I'm an arse if that's true...a happy arse...but still a stinkin' arse...

If true, that's all I needed to know before deciding to pre-order...

Thanks SkyDog for that update...you made my day...

Kevin