OT: The BCS is to college football as the Electoral College is to elections

[Vegas Vic]

Think about it. Al Gore got half a million more votes than George W. Bush, but Bush occupies the White House. The founding fathers deemed it worthy to install a system that would eliminate popular will.

The founders of the BCS had a similar philosophy when they created the BCS. Popular will would be part of the equation, but it would be balanced with other methods of assessing the teams. Pollsters, who sometimes get caught up in the heat of the moment, tend to give too much credence to the final game of the season, without assessing the season in its entirety.

In the final analysis of this year’s BCS rankings, the human polls will have their rightful portion of the equation. They will recognize that USC and LSU had impressive wins on the final weekend of the season, and that OU got blown out. The computer rankings will also take this weekend’s games into account, except they will recognize that they were 1/12th or 1/13th of the season, and they will evaluate them accordingly. They will see three teams with one loss. One of them (USC) lost to an unranked six-loss team (Cal-Berkley). Another (LSU) lost to #17 Florida. Another (Oklahoma) lost to #10 Kansas State.

One more point. I’ve heard a lot of grumbling that margin of victory should now be put back in to the computer rankings. Fine. If you do that, Oklahoma actually INCREASES their lead in the computer polls. Their average margin of victory during the 12-0 run was 34 points. Look at the Sagarin ratings. In the BCS/ELO Chess (no margin of victory), OU has a smaller edge than in the “Predictor” (margin of victory included).

I think that it’s a shame that USC will not get a chance to play in the Sugar Bowl. They certainly could be the best team in the country. Unfortunately, there is no playoff in Division I. They will have their chance to win a split national title if they beat Michigan in the Rose Bowl. If they lose to Michigan, I don’t want to hear another peep from them.

End of sermon.

[Easy Mac]

beating Oregon State is an impressive win?

[panerd]

Everyone keeps talking about how USC and LSU will be atop the polls. I say OU will still be on top on both polls (as well they should be) and all of this bickering is kind of counterproductive.

Just like Northern Illinios, just like TCU, just like the SEC North tiebreaker. Interesting fodder for debate, but in the end meaningless.

[Easy Mac]

ummm... the coaches poll is out, it goes USC, LSU and Oklahoma

[panerd]

Originally posted by Easy Mac
ummm... the coaches poll is out, it goes USC, LSU and Oklahoma

OK, I stand the corrected. The coaches are a bunch of morons.

[cthomer5000]

Originally posted by panerd
OK, I stand the corrected. The coaches are a bunch of morons.

No, but they do have televisions. OU was fucking whipped last night, how did you expect them to stay at #1?

[Easy Mac]

I was whipped the other night, but my lady said I was still #1.

[panerd]

Originally posted by cthomer5000
No, but they do have televisions. OU was fucking whipped last night, how did you expect them to stay at #1?

I won't go over the same points that have been made in about 30 other threads and I will also admit big 12 bias. But look at all three teams seasons, their wins, their games against ranked opponents, and their one loss. OU just picked the wrong time to lose. There is a legit argument for LSU #1 and OU #2, but USC is about as undeserving as Michigan of the #1 ranking.

[cthomer5000]

Originally posted by panerd
I won't go over the same points that have been made in about 30 other threads and I will also admit big 12 bias. But look at all three teams seasons, their wins, their games against ranked opponents, and their one loss. OU just picked the wrong time to lose. There is a legit argument for LSU #1 and OU #2, but USC is about as undeserving as Michigan of the #1 ranking.

Except their loss means THEY ARE NOT CONFERENCE CHAMPIONS.

[panerd]

Originally posted by cthomer5000
Except their loss means THEY ARE NOT CONFERENCE CHAMPIONS.

They are the regular season champs of the Big 12, just like USC. Everyone always wants to use basketball analogies. Mizzou used to win the big 8 tournament all of the time and were crowned big 8 champs, but Kansas was always regonized as the champs and given the higher seed and ranking. I look at the conference championships as just another game to make money. (But I will agree with you if you argue that the Big 12 shot OU in the foot in an attempt to make more money.)

[Easy Mac]

I think OU shot itself in the foot by wanting more money.

[The_herd]

The Big 12 title game is not a post season tournament. It crowns the regular season champion. K-State is the team that will go down as the 2003 champions of the Big 12. The only place Oklahoma will be mentioned is 2nd place.

[cthomer5000]

Originally posted by panerd
They are the regular season champs of the Big 12, just like USC. Everyone always wants to use basketball analogies. Mizzou used to win the big 8 tournament all of the time and were crowned big 8 champs, but Kansas was always regonized as the champs and given the higher seed and ranking. I look at the conference championships as just another game to make money. (But I will agree with you if you argue that the Big 12 shot OU in the foot in an attempt to make more money.)

They are not, in any way, Big 12 champions. If you play in a conference, you work within the rules of that conference. Kansas State is the Big 12 champ, that is an indisputable fact. USC and LSU on the other hand, are both officially conference champions.

[Airhog]

Originally posted by cthomer5000
They are not, in any way, Big 12 champions. If you play in a conference, you work within the rules of that conference. Kansas State is the Big 12 champ, that is an indisputable fact. USC and LSU on the other hand, are both officially conference champions.

Actually you are wrong there. While KSU is technically the big 12 champs, OU is also the Big 12 south champion.

[cthomer5000]

Originally posted by Airhog
Actually you are wrong there. While KSU is technically the big 12 champs, OU is also the Big 12 south champs. On in reality ther are in one form, Big 12 champions.

So even if the AFC champion lost the Super Bowl, you would consider them "NFL Champion?"


This "OU is Big 12 champion" is the worst argument I've ever seen. They didn't win their conference, that is a fact.

[Airhog]

sorry you replied before I had a chance to correct my mistake. I dont deny the fact that they arent the big 12 champs. But I also dont deny the fact that they won their conference ethier

[NoMyths]

OU won their division, not their conference, Airhog.

[sooner333]

Okay, OU is not the Big 12 Champion. But, let's just say if the Big 12 Championship game were another conference game, OU would still have won the conference. Is Cal all of the sudden Pac 10 conference champs because it beat USC? No.

Anyway, the best argument for OU fans, is that the BCS was created for the express purpose of not having the human polls mean as much. It would be EASY to have a system where the human polls decided who would go to the National Championship game. The reason there are computer polls, SOS, Loss, and quality win points is to put other factors to create a well-rounded source of input. The human polls still count, contrary to popular belief today. So do the computer polls, which put Miami of Ohio higher than USC in the Sagarin. That may seem "stupid" to some people, but people "wanted" margin of victory taken out after something they didn't want to happen happened. BTW, in the Sagarin, the orginal poll used has OU, LSU, USC (and if you look at just the predictor...Texas finishes higher than USC). The Massey has LSU, OU, USC in both the BCS and the original formula. In fact, if you look at a average of all computer polls, you can see that OU finishes well above LSU and USC. OU has more quality win points, the same amount of losses, and a better strength of schedule. It beats both teams in 3 of the components, ties in 1, and finishes behind in 1.

Here's the deal, after this year there will be more rules made to make sure that the undesirable doesn't happen again. This delegitimizes the BCS each time. I don't agree with it, if you're trying to make a system to make a national championship game so that it's unbiased, don't change it each year to conform to biased opinions. If you pick a system, have the balls to stick with it.