Ping: The One True Dark Jedi - Page 8

NevStar · 06-30-2004, 08:18 PM

Dean Houston sucks.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivnLegend

I'm a "crybaby" for standing up for morality and my own beliefs?

Morality?? You're a thief for christs sake. You can cry all you want too about what's been done to you but you're a thief.

I don't care if you painted the car, changed the engine and rotated the tires, you still stole the car. Trying to jsutify it because you did work on it is the height of immorality at best, base stupidity at worst.

Got that everybody who talks about how much work he did. He stole the images. He's a thief. Period.

Now, I don't give a flip about the files or the issues involved but don't you dare bring morality in it because you obviously don't understand the term nor do you even inadvertantly practice it. Not on this issue anyway.

Damn, thanks for reminding me yet again why I hate people. Now go pat yourself on the back for how moral you are and how well you can selectively practice enforcing them and believing in them, thief.

Others can see right through the act.

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

Morality?? You're a thief for christs sake. You can cry all you want too about what's been done to you but you're a thief.

I don't care if you painted the car, changed the engine and rotated the tires, you still stole the car. Trying to jsutify it because you did work on it is the height of immorality at best, base stupidity at worst.

Got that everybody who talks about how much work he did. He stole the images. He's a thief. Period.

Now, I don't give a flip about the files or the issues involved but don't you dare bring morality in it because you obviously don't understand the term nor do you even inadvertantly practice it. Not on this issue anyway.

Damn, thanks for reminding me yet again why I hate people. Now go pat yourself on the back for how moral you are and how well you can selectively practice enforcing them and believing in them, thief.

Others can see right through the act.

While you're at it, don't forget to rant on Skydog for being a thief as well if you're going to use that logic.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

While you're at it, don't forget to rant on Skydog for being a thief as well if you're going to use that logic.

Sorry Chubby, I didn't read Skydog say he was taking the moral high ground. That's what I'm talking about. If he does I'll call him on it. Until then, at least he's not being a hypocrite. As I said, I don't use the files so the issue is moot to me. I just can't stand hypocrites pretending to be moral.

Screw that.

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

Sorry Subby, I didn't read Skydog say he was taking the moral high ground. That's what I'm talking about. If he does I'll call him on it. Until then, at least he's not being a hypocrite. As I said, I don't use the files so the issue is moot to me. I just can't stand hypocrites pretending to be moral.

Screw that.

ewww don't confuse me with Subby

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

ewww don't confuse me with Subby

Sorry, I'll fix it.

I am typing quick because my lunch break is almost over and it's too busy right now to post while I'm working.

Radii · 06-30-2004, 08:35 PM

I just felt left out not having a post in this thread. But now I have to go make two posts in Senator's 14 year old thread b/c I really do like that one better.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aadik

Fair enough SD, but I think he was perfectly legitimate in protesting his work being packaged into something else. Like countless people have suggested, if Killbrew, DD, and LL had been cited first, then this would be less of an issue.

Ok, now I'm confused, would that be the work he stole or the coat of paint, new engine etc that he added to the stolen work???

I'm not saying that SD shouldn't have done what you said but still, legitimately protesting the stealing of stolen material? THIS is irony my friends.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

Ok, now I'm confused, would that be the work he stole or the coat of paint, new engine etc that he added to the stolen work???

I'm not saying that SD shouldn't have done what you said but still, legitimately protesting the stealing of stolen material? THIS is irony my friends.

I think your frayed logic is pretty much keeping you one of the lone shouters of the "stolen property" bullcrap. He took pictures from various internet sites, that i'm sure neither the owners or photographers of would give a good god damn that he took them. It is nothing akin to stealing something from someone else. By your logic we are all stealing if were using wallpaper that was a jpeg that was scanned or put up by a magazine.

Draft Dodger · 06-30-2004, 08:59 PM

wow - Axxon sure knows how to come in and give a few kicks to a dead horse, eh?

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draft Dodger

wow - Axxon sure knows how to come in and give a few kicks to a dead horse, eh?

There is a night time crowd here ya know.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buddy Grant

I'm not sure what the majority thinks about this facepack but here are my positive and negative thoughts:

Positive:
- It's a different way to get these pictures without having to download the individual facepacks.
- SD and/or his affiliated Christian Youth web site is providing the online storage of the file so no costs are being passed on to anyone else.

Negative:
- No permission or credit given to the folks who found, cut/cropped/centered/resized/color enhanced/color-reduced/named-numbered/tested and originally posted these images.

I was one of those folks, I spent over 200 hours putting together nearly half of the images in the "SkyDog Compilation of Fictional Photos", and I don't think it's unreasonable for me to be annoyed when he spends a few hours on this project and then puts his name to it. If the individual facepacks he took images from were hard to find that would be another thing entirely, but these facepacks are easy to find. I think a little effort to credit the folks who did the actual work on these would have been easy to do. SkyDog, if you see this post, is there any reason you did not provide a readme crediting the folks who did the actual work?

Lets replace found with the proper term. Stole. Used without permission.

See, every time someone says something like

Quote:

If the individual facepacks he took images from were hard to find that would be another thing entirely

it's illogical. Stealing is stealing. There aren't 5 levels of stealing, Larry Miller, there just aren't.

Again, no reason he shouldn't have credited his fellow thieves but as the thread showed, he gave almost the verbatim credit that the original thief gave. If we try and go down the erroneous road of assuming levels of theft and why LL and your theft was perfectly fine and his wasn't then we're following an unsupportable logic.

The proof is in this simple question. Did you or LL or any of the original face pack creators have the expressed consent of the creators of the content you provided?

As far as I know, the answer is no, therefore really, the issue, once all the superfluous crap is boiled away is exactly the same so how can anyone work up a legitimate outrage???

You can't if you're being ethical and honest.

I don't mean this as a slam to you or anyone else, btw. I'm pointing out the fallacy that drives those who support the original hissy fit. I wouldn't have even done that, even though the lack of logical thought was sticking in my craw big time, but he had to go and say he had the moral high ground.

Senator · 06-30-2004, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radii

I just felt left out not having a post in this thread. But now I have to go make two posts in Senator's 14 year old thread b/c I really do like that one better.

It is self motivated posters like this that give me hope for this great country.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

I think your frayed logic is pretty much keeping you one of the lone shouters of the "stolen property" bullcrap. He took pictures from various internet sites, that i'm sure neither the owners or photographers of would give a good god damn that he took them. It is nothing akin to stealing something from someone else. By your logic we are all stealing if were using wallpaper that was a jpeg that was scanned or put up by a magazine.

So, stealing isn't stealing if the original owners don't complain?? See, they weren't even consulted so how could they complain? Your logic makes no sense. Ever heard the term "without the express written consent of..."?? It means something and the original poster himself stated that he cropped out "team logos" so it's stealing. Lets not call it ok because the one stolen from doesn't know it's stolen. That's stupid.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

There is a night time crowd here ya know.

Thanks. You said that far nicer than I would have but I would mean the same thing.

HornedFrog Purple · 06-30-2004, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senator

It is self motivated posters like this that give me hope for this great country.

Cease and desist from lobbying in my thread looking for stragglers for a lost cause. Take your medicine like a man!

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

So, stealing isn't stealing if the original owners don't complain?? See, they weren't even consulted so how could they complain? Your logic makes no sense. Ever heard the term "without the express written consent of..."?? It means something and the original poster himself stated that he cropped out "team logos" so it's stealing. Lets not call it ok because the one stolen from doesn't know it's stolen. That's stupid.

Is there a difference between speeding 5 MPH over the speed limit and speeding 40 MPH over the speed limit?

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

So, stealing isn't stealing if the original owners don't complain?? See, they weren't even consulted so how could they complain? Your logic makes no sense. Ever heard the term "without the express written consent of..."?? It means something and the original poster himself stated that he cropped out "team logos" so it's stealing. Lets not call it ok because the one stolen from doesn't know it's stolen. That's stupid.

So by that logic, every single art mod made for FOF and OOTP is stolen material?
My logic makes perfect sense, your making a very, very, very, very big stretch by calling what LL did stealing.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

Is there a difference between speeding 5 MPH over the speed limit and speeding 40 MPH over the speed limit?

Nope.

I've been busted for both and I didn't complain either time. I may not be particularly moral but I do try and be intellectually and morally honest and consistant.

JeeberD · 06-30-2004, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senator

It is self motivated posters like this that give me hope for this great country.

When you are elected as President twenty years down the road I'll be expecting to hear a shout out to Radii during your inaugural address...

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

So by that logic, every single art mod made for FOF and OOTP is stolen material?
My logic makes perfect sense, your making a very, very, very, very big stretch by calling what LL did stealing.

If it uses someone elses art then yes, it is. I don't have a problem with that, honestly. It's stealing and it's minor, etc, etc but it's stealing. It only burns me when the thief then complains when someone does similar to them and even then it only bugs me when they claim the moral high ground where it doesn't exist.

All I can say about your logic, you know, it isn't stealing if the victim doesn't find out, is that's the very reason I have to lock my doors at night.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:18 PM

BTW, just thought of this, but if the pages he took the pages from did not have a note saying that the pics were copyrighted material or a price tag, then yes, i would assume that they are free to use.

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

Nope.

I've been busted for both and I didn't complain either time. I may not be particularly moral but I do try and be intellectually and morally honest and consistant.

There isn't? The law would beg to differ. Somehow I doubt you got the same amount of fines/points for both.

McSweeny · 06-30-2004, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

Is there a difference between speeding 5 MPH over the speed limit and speeding 40 MPH over the speed limit?

no... they are both illegal

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

If it uses someone elses art then yes, it is. I don't have a problem with that, honestly. It's stealing and it's minor, etc, etc but it's stealing. It only burns me when the thief then complains when someone does similar to them and even then it only bugs me when they claim the moral high ground where it doesn't exist.

All I can say about your logic, you know, it isn't stealing if the victim doesn't find out, is that's the very reason I have to lock my doors at night.

Again, there is a difference that you don't see that others (including me) do.

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McSweeny

no... they are both illegal

Again, yes there is.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

If it uses someone elses art then yes, it is. I don't have a problem with that, honestly. It's stealing and it's minor, etc, etc but it's stealing. It only burns me when the thief then complains when someone does similar to them and even then it only bugs me when they claim the moral high ground where it doesn't exist.

All I can say about your logic, you know, it isn't stealing if the victim doesn't find out, is that's the very reason I have to lock my doors at night.

That is not what i'm saying and equating me to someone who'll sneak in your house at night is another giant stretch in a series of them from you.
Dude, it's the internet, i'm pretty sure that the guys making the website realize that those pics are gonna be downloaded. Calling someone immoral because they download and use pictures of baseball players in a baseball game is just........dumb.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

BTW, just thought of this, but if the pages he took the pages from did not have a note saying that the pics were copyrighted material or a price tag, then yes, i would assume that they are free to use.

Well, damned, I'd better label everything in my house when you come to town then. You're liable to just help yourself to anything of mine you want because I don't have either on them. Want my car too? It doesn't have a price tag on it and if you don't look in the glove box you won't even see that it belongs to anybody. That's cool, right??

Right???

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

Again, yes there is.

No, there isn't. There's NO sliding scale of legality or morality. People invent the sliding scale to protect their own ego's and justify their own actions/thoughts. I'm not bad but Joey over there, he's a jerk.

I'm just being honest about it. I steal, I break the law, I break a commandment or two. I'm just not going to bullshit myself and say it's ok because it's only 5 mph. I abhor that and it's one of the main reason people are so screwed up IMHO. If we agreed to the same set of rules then maybe we'd treat each other a little bit better.

We don't though and we get problems like today.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

Well, damned, I'd better label everything in my house when you come to town then. You're liable to just help yourself to anything of mine you want because I don't have either on them. Want my car too? It doesn't have a price tag on it and if you don't look in the glove box you won't even see that it belongs to anybody. That's cool, right??

Right???

Yes, thats the perfect equation. It's so dumb it doesn't even deserve the smiley.

Calis · 06-30-2004, 09:31 PM

At least there's one thing every one in this thread can agree on...

Infogrames rocks our world.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

No, there isn't. There's NO sliding scale of legality or morality. People invent the sliding scale to protect their own ego's and justify their own actions/thoughts. I'm not bad but Joey over there, he's a jerk.

And the biggest irony? My name is Joey!!!! Now that's bizzare.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

That is not what i'm saying and equating me to someone who'll sneak in your house at night is another giant stretch in a series of them from you.
Dude, it's the internet, i'm pretty sure that the guys making the website realize that those pics are gonna be downloaded. Calling someone immoral because they download and use pictures of baseball players in a baseball game is just........dumb.

So then we agree, calling SkyDog immoral because he downloaded and used pictures of baseball players in a baseball game is just....dumb.

That's exactly what he did, you know.

My work here appears to be done.

JeeberD · 06-30-2004, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

And the biggest irony? My name is Joey!!!! Now that's bizzare.

And you're a jerk, Joey...A JERK!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Yes, thats the perfect equation. It's so dumb it doesn't even deserve the smiley.

You said that if you didn't see a copywrite notice or a price tag you'd assume it was free, not me. That is indeed dumb and that's why I didn't use a smiley.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

So then we agree, calling SkyDog immoral because he downloaded and used pictures of baseball players in a baseball game is just....dumb.

That's exactly what he did, you know.

My work here appears to be done.

Yes, but by your logic, in order for you to be right, you would have to be wrong. I win.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

And the biggest irony? My name is Joey!!!! Now that's bizzare.

That is bizarre indeed.

I didn't mean you, honest.

We're just having a discussion.

Suicane75 · 06-30-2004, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

You said that if you didn't see a copywrite notice or a price tag you'd assume it was free, not me. That is indeed dumb and that's why I didn't use a smiley.

No no no, i said a picture on the internet. For you to make the leap of logic that it would stretch to your car, your tv or your toilet paper is dumb.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Yes, but by your logic, in order for you to be right, you would have to be wrong. I win.

Look, my brain hurts enough balancing both full time work and an internet discussion at the same time. This one is just toooo much.

The_herd · 06-30-2004, 09:36 PM

And now this thread is dumb...

VPI97 · 06-30-2004, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

My work here appears to be done.

Well played.

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

No, there isn't. There's NO sliding scale of legality or morality. People invent the sliding scale to protect their own ego's and justify their own actions/thoughts. I'm not bad but Joey over there, he's a jerk.

I'm just being honest about it. I steal, I break the law, I break a commandment or two. I'm just not going to bullshit myself and say it's ok because it's only 5 mph. I abhor that and it's one of the main reason people are so screwed up IMHO. If we agreed to the same set of rules then maybe we'd treat each other a little bit better.

We don't though and we get problems like today.

Again, if it's the same thing then the fine is the same right?

McSweeny · 06-30-2004, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Yes, but by your logic, in order for you to be right, you would have to be wrong. I win.

hahahaha! that makes my head hurt

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicane75

No no no, i said a picture on the internet. For you to make the leap of logic that it would stretch to your car, your tv or your toilet paper is dumb.

Again, only because you subscribe to a sliding scale of morality and I don't. I think stealing is stealing and stealing is wrong, whether it's a picture on the internet, a piece of candy or my car.

Yes, there are degrees of theft but they are ALL morally wrong and therefore if you're in that glass house you shouldn't throw stones. That's what I've been trying to say. It's not a difficult concept.

You, amongst many, seem to be saying that certain theft is indeed morally correct because it's so minor. This is what I object to.

Strongly.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

Well played.

Thank you very much.

Axxon · 06-30-2004, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

Again, if it's the same thing then the fine is the same right?

How does that follow?

Read my second to last post to see my answer to this. I'm not retyping it.

vtbub · 06-30-2004, 09:43 PM

*is glad he drinks bottled water*

cthomer5000 · 06-30-2004, 09:46 PM

man, I don't think any post after Subby tearing into Noop was really worth reading here. If you got that far, the rest is just redundant.

Chubby · 06-30-2004, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

Again, only because you subscribe to a sliding scale of morality and I don't. I think stealing is stealing and stealing is wrong, whether it's a picture on the internet, a piece of candy or my car.

Yes, there are degrees of theft but they are ALL morally wrong and therefore if you're in that glass house you shouldn't throw stones. That's what I've been trying to say. It's not a difficult concept.

You, amongst many, seem to be saying that certain theft is indeed morally correct because it's so minor. This is what I object to.

Strongly.

If you feel so strongly about it I would hope you don't ever use and roster packs/face packs/tweaked sliders/mods without express written consent from the appropriate people.

EDIT: And, according to you a theif can't call another person a theif even when they are?

Buzzbee · 06-30-2004, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noop

Wow I was getting hammered for a sentence mistake god forbid i should every mess up a sentence.

The hits...they keep on coming!!

noop is at least golden for UIC!

06-30-2004, 08:18 PM	#351
NevStar High School Varsity Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Raleigh, NC	Dean Houston sucks. __________________ I can't think of a clever signature.

06-30-2004, 08:59 PM	#360
Draft Dodger Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Keene, NH	wow - Axxon sure knows how to come in and give a few kicks to a dead horse, eh? __________________ Mile High Hockey

06-30-2004, 09:36 PM	#390
The_herd College Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Fort Lackland, Texas (San Antonio)	And now this thread is dumb... __________________ Oakland Raiders: HFL's 1970 AC West Champs

06-30-2004, 09:43 PM	#397
vtbub College Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Burlington, VT USA	is glad he drinks bottled water __________________

06-30-2004, 08:35 PM	#357
Radii Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	I just felt left out not having a post in this thread. But now I have to go make two posts in Senator's 14 year old thread b/c I really do like that one better.

06-30-2004, 09:18 PM	#372
Suicane75 Coordinator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NJ	BTW, just thought of this, but if the pages he took the pages from did not have a note saying that the pics were copyrighted material or a price tag, then yes, i would assume that they are free to use.

06-30-2004, 09:31 PM	#381
Calis College Starter Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Kansas	At least there's one thing every one in this thread can agree on... Infogrames rocks our world.

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