NFL Week 1

[Draft Dodger]

I was kind of neutral to the addition of Dan Patrick to the Sunday night game, but I have to say I absolutely loved having him and Olbermann doing the highlights. I'm still going to FF through the Bettis, Barber and Collinsworth circle jerks, but Patrick and Olbermann made my night.

In a way, I think those two are responsible for the slide in quality of SportsCenter, because everyone coming after them seems to think they need to copy them, but just don't have the chops.

[Fighter of Foo]

DE's and DT's aren't the same position. I suppose it doesn't matter much though.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Radii

I'm setting myself up to get called a douchebag by everyone here, but /shrug, here goes.

Injuries are part of football. Teams that suffer the most injuries struggle a lot, teams that suffer injuries to key players struggle like hell to overcome. There's a difference to me between rooting for a specific individual human to experience suffering, and being happy that a team you dislike has to deal with an injury.

For a few years, every time Carolina and Atlanta played, I wanted to see Julius Peppers knock Michael Vick out. I rooted heavily against Vick, didn't like that Carolina struggled against Atlanta, and hated that Vick scrambled and ran wild and would have been genuinely pleased had my team been the one to catch up to him and lay a (legal) legit hit on Vick that simply took him out for awhile.

Also, the notion of wanting to beat a team at their best is horseshit to me. I want my team to win, and I want teams that I dislike to lose. Carolina has had ridiculous QB/RB injury issues the last few seasons, but its no excuse for losing to me. They faced adversity, and failed to rise above it. A win is a win, a title is a title, and that's all that matters.

Molson mentioned something earlier about whether, if you had the ability/choice, would you personally cause injury to Brady(or anyone). No, i wouldn't, not at all. But since injuries are part of the game, I hope teams I dislike suffer more injuries than teams I like. For various reasons, I root against the Patriots, therefore, to me its a good thing to see them facing more adversity than any other team at a key position right now. I'm not specifically glad Tom Brady is hurt, but I'm glad the Patriots have to deal with losing a key player because that makes it more difficult for them to win.

I don't see why this attitude is considered douchebaggery by anyone, honestly.

I don't think it makes you a douchebag, I think you bring up alot of good points.

Noble got jumped on because he was genuily happy about Bradys injury and felt he deserved it and that makes him a bad person IMO.

As a Giants fan the times McNabb got hurt through his career I was glad he wasn't playing but not pleased the man was hurt.

As far as "beating the best" I totaly disagree with you. Granted, if I had to pick between the Giants losing to a team with Brady or winning against a Brady-less team I take the win. But it is far sweeter to do it against the best.

I am a big Devils fan and they won the cup in the shortened season in the mid 90's and nothing got more frustrating then hearing bitter Rangers/Flyers/Red Wings fans make their comments about winnng half a cup.

Say what you want, had the Giants beaten a Brady-less Pats team people would have been saying "sure they won, but if Brady played..."

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I am a big Devils fan and they won the cup in the shortened season in the mid 90's and nothing got more frustrating then hearing bitter Rangers/Flyers/Red Wings fans make their comments about winnng half a cup.

Winning half a cup? I've never heard or even considered such a comment. I wouldn't put it pass people, I suppose, but that's very weird. It certainly didn't feel like the Wings lost half a cup after that.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

I'm sorry but I don't see where a single game costs $45.

it was an onscreen info box that appeared when I tuned to one of the 700 channels, but only on the standard def version, the same as if you tune to a PPV movie channel and havent paid for the movie.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Winning half a cup? I've never heard or even considered such a comment. I wouldn't put it pass people, I suppose, but that's very weird. It certainly didn't feel like the Wings lost half a cup after that.

really?

It's all you hear in NJ, even today Rangers/Flyers fans say it.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Lathum

really?

It's all you hear in NJ, even today Rangers/Flyers fans say it.

you are forgetting "patrick roy is better than brodeur, because the devils play the trap"....you love when people say that too.

[molson]

The Pats are working out Chris Simms today.

Still no word about what Brady's injury actually is - I don't doubt the speculation that he's done, but it's still just "Trent Dilfer talked to an unnamed Patriots player who said Matt Cassel is our QB".

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by molson

The Pats are working out Chris Simms today.

Still no word about what Brady's injury actually is - I don't doubt the speculation that he's done, but it's still just "Trent Dilfer talked to an unnamed Patriots player who said Matt Cassel is our QB".

I was shocked that "sources in the organization" said anything. I am pretty sure Belichick was not happy at all with someone breaking the code of silence.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Lathum

really?

It's all you hear in NJ, even today Rangers/Flyers fans say it.

Huh. Maybe it's just a regional thing. They still talk about winning "half a cup," despite the fact that the Devils went on two win two more "full cups"?

That's incredibly lame. I thought that East Coast sports fans were much better at smack talking then that.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

It'll be somewhat nice to have a team with lowered expectations for a bit. Maybe I'll enjoy this season a bit more than the last.

If I were a Lions fan I would punch you in the face.

[MikeVic]

That'll teach the Pats not to list Brady on the injury report!

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

That'll teach the Pats not to list Brady on the injury report!

They still won't. Week 2 injury report will list him as probable.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Mustang

If I were a Lions fan I would punch you in the face.

If you were a Lions fan, you'd be like me, really excited for the 2009 draft already.

Can I get an Andre Smith or Michael Oher amen?!

[DaddyTorgo]

WBZ's Dan Roche has confirmed that the initial diagnosis on the injury Tom Brady suffered in Sunday's game is a torn ACL -- anterior cruciate ligament -- to his left knee, and he is likely done for the season.

press conference in like 30 mins supposedly

say hello to a 5-11 season --- 6-10 if we're lucky

[FrogMan]

Bill Belichick is supposed to give an update on Brady at 3, so yeah, about 30 minutes...

FM

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

WBZ's Dan Roche has confirmed that the initial diagnosis on the injury Tom Brady suffered in Sunday's game is a torn ACL -- anterior cruciate ligament -- to his left knee, and he is likely done for the season.

press conference in like 30 mins supposedly

say hello to a 5-11 season --- 6-10 if we're lucky

I think that is an over-exaggeration. I don't think you all will go 5-11, as watching the Dolphins and Jets yesterday, I still think your team is still night and day better than either of them. Bills are the only one that I think in the AFC East that might benefit the most from this injury. They looked really good from the limited part of the game I saw.

The Pats will obviously not win as much, but I think before doom and gloom, it probably is best to see how Cassell does out there.

[DaddyTorgo]

I'd rather go 2-12 and grab a high draft pick and just say "yeah this was a freak down season cuz of brady's injury" and have a silver lining to the season then end up middle-of-the-pack and flame out in the first round of the playoffs

[gstelmack]

Pats just need the defense to step up and have Cassel play like Brady did his first two seasons: don't make mistakes, and come through with the occasional clutch play when we really need it. The team won a pair of Super Bowls with that formula...

I was just reading Don Banks snap judgements on CNN, and loved that while extolling the virtues of Ryan and Flacco in their inaugural debuts, he points out that the last QB to win his opener as a rookie was David Carr, and the last rookie QB to throw a TD in his first NFL pass was Michael Bishop. Um, yeah, this sounds promising...

[DaddyTorgo]

heyyy...Matty "Ice" Ryan looked fuckin diesel yesterday. That kid is going to be a hell of a player (says the BC alum).

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

-1

Come on man, stick with your team!! You really want to watch them stink up the place for the next 4 months? I'd much rather have something to play for.

hahaha -1. nice

no really...if "something to play for" = a middle-of-the-road 7-9 or 8-8 season and a midlevel draft pick, or at best a first round playoff loss, I'd rather see the team just perform poorly all season so they can write it off as "oh brady was injured" and see what BB can do with a top-5 draft pick.

*shrugs*

[DaddyTorgo]

Brady's on IR

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

heyyy...Matty "Ice" Ryan looked fuckin diesel yesterday. That kid is going to be a hell of a player (says the BC alum).

ICE?
Really?
Really!?!

This coming from the guy who puked on national television when he knew he had to go in and win a game?

Ice?


BWAHAHAHAH

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by Fighter of Foo

DE's and DT's aren't the same position. I suppose it doesn't matter much though.

True, but it becomes a tough definition.
Many were DTs in college who were drafted to play DE or vice versa in the NFL.

And the position listing on NFL.com isnt consistent with college or pro position.

[DaddyTorgo]

re: Pats

The team will bring in quarterback Chris Simms for a workout Monday. ESPN's Chris Mortensen reported the Patriots will also look at journeyman Tim Rattay.


really? Chris Simms? Tim Rattay? I think I'm going to puke...

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Dear AFC East Members,

You're welcome.

Sincerely,
The Kansas City Chiefs


FWIW.......KC and NE are both looking for QB's this week on the free agent market. Brody Croyle is out for at least half the season.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

heyyy...Matty "Ice" Ryan looked fuckin diesel yesterday. That kid is going to be a hell of a player (says the BC alum).

I hope you are right but am not holding my breath just yet as a Falcons fan considering they played Detroit on Sunday (says the GT alum)

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Dear AFC East Members,

You're welcome.

Sincerely,
The Kansas City Chiefs


FWIW.......KC and NE are both looking for QB's this week on the free agent market. Brody Croyle is out for at least half the season.

don't be classless and celebrate the fact you injured brady. you don't see pats fans celebrating the fact they injured croyle.

[molson]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

hahaha -1. nice

no really...if "something to play for" = a middle-of-the-road 7-9 or 8-8 season and a midlevel draft pick, or at best a first round playoff loss, I'd rather see the team just perform poorly all season so they can write it off as "oh brady was injured" and see what BB can do with a top-5 draft pick.

*shrugs*

A playoff run would be a fun accomplishment, and once you're there, anything can happen. And it's interesting - an explosive offense with an unknown QB.

Top 5 picks are a horrible value. BB would probably trade down anyway (if he could). If rookie salaries continue to escalate we're going to start seeing teams passing up their picks and using them later in the first round.

This "all or nothing" mentality some fans have when their team has a little success is kind of sad - they probably weren't winning the super bowl this year anyway. If that kills your enjoyment of the team, then this team does more harm than good to your emotional state.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by molson

A playoff run would be a fun accomplishment, and once you're there, anything can happen. And it's interesting - an explosive offense with an unknown QB.

Top 5 picks are a horrible value. BB would probably trade down anyway (if he could). If rookie salaries continue to escalate we're going to start seeing teams passing up their picks and using them later in the first round.

This "all or nothing" mentality some fans have when their team has a little success is kind of sad - they probably weren't winning the super bowl this year anyway. If that kills your enjoyment of the team, then this team does more harm than good to your emotional state.

haha - valid point.

i'm just on the doom-n-gloom express today anyways, because my laptop is busted. that's probably coloring my mood pretty severely.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

don't be classless and celebrate the fact you injured brady. you don't see pats fans celebrating the fact they injured croyle.

I didn't take it as him celebrating. I just thought it was a funny joke. That's far different from the comments earlier in the thread.

As for Croyle, why would anyone celebrate or even care about that outside of Chiefs fans? If you don't think there'd be some Pats fans laughing or celebrating a Manning injury, then you're kidding yourself.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

... see what BB can do with a top-5 draft pick.

You mean how many picks will he get for it? 'cause he's not drafting anyone in the top 10.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Dear AFC East Members,

You're welcome.

Sincerely,
The Kansas City Chiefs


FWIW.......KC and NE are both looking for QB's this week on the free agent market. Brody Croyle is out for at least half the season.

That sucks for Croyle, but hopefully it means Coastal Carolina's Tyler Thigpen will get into some games for the Chiefs now!

[molson]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

You mean how many picks will he get for it? 'cause he's not drafting anyone in the top 10.

He hasn't done that since 2008.

And they wouldn't draft that high this year if they had Jeff George at QB.

[BishopMVP]

How did the Culpepper-Moss relationship end in Minnesota? I realize he doesn't fit the spread very well, but he did have obscene success throwing bombs to Moss before, and that alone could probably get us into the playoffs with our schedule. Even with Cassell, it's hard for me to see less than 9-7 with our schedule. Drew Bledsoe's out there too I suppose haha.

Question two - any chance Brady could make it back for the playoffs? I know RB's take 9 months or less now (although 2 years before they're really back was the rule of thumb), could a QB do it in 4? I guess IR precludes it anyway, but it just seems like recovery times are improving rapidly (quick - get the HGH and Hyperbaric chambers).

[DeToxRox]

Culpepper to the Pats would make total sense. He has no mobility but they have a good OL and good weapons at his disposal. They can keep running Moss deep and let him hit the checkdowns to keep the chains moving. You'd take away his biggest weakness, mobility, and keep his biggest strength, his cannon. He'd be solid.

[MikeVic]

Culpepper would be interesting.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

I would be SHOCKED if Culpepper went to the Pats. BB likes guys who know his system and can work within those confines. I really think Cassel is the QB.

He might bring in a retread to be the backup (3rd string, probably), but ya, Culpepper ain't happening. BB has kept Cassel around 4 years for exactly this situation (just like he kept Brady on the roster as the 4th string QB in 2000).

If BB thought there was someone better than Cassel to be the QB, that guy would have been brought in during training camp.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

He might bring in a retread to be the backup (3rd string, probably), but ya, Culpepper ain't happening.

This comment made me curious about something so I went and looked it up.
I was wondering how many QB's other than Brady & Cassell had taken a snap for the Pats since the Brady era began with Cassell on the roster. To my surprise, there was more than I realized/remembered. Doesn't mean anything really, I just thought it was interesting to see how much I didn't remember.

2008 - Kevin O'Connell (0g yet)
2007 - Matt Guiterrez - 1g
2006 - Testaverde - 3g
2005 - Flutie - 5g

And pre-Cassell?
2004 - Rohan Davey - 4g
2003 - Davey - 1g & Damon Huard 2g
2002 - Davey - 2g
2001 - Bledsoe - 2g

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

I would be SHOCKED if Culpepper went to the Pats. BB likes guys who know his system and can work within those confines. I really think Cassel is the QB.

I know that, but we undoubtedly need to sign a 3rd QB, even if O'Connell (who looked quite a bit better than Cassell in the parts of preseason I saw) is bumped to backup. Gutierrez could be brought back if no one else has signed him, but then we get to the rumors of Chris Simms and Tim Rattay, or maybe Vinny Testaverde wants to re-unretire. I think Simms is the best of the lot, but I'd still take Culpepper over him.

One bonus now is that our bye week is so early. Two shitty teams (Jets/Miami iirc) and then week 4 bye will allow for more reps for the backup and any changes in offensive formations/timing.

I will bet now, based solely on how terrible he has looked in preseason for several years, that Cassell is not starting by the end of the season. The most likely replacement is O'Connell, but Simms, Culpepper and mystery door #5 are all options.

[CU Tiger]

FWIW BB said in his press conference today that barring injury Cassell would be thee starting QB for thee remainder of the season.

Given as how BB never lies or misleads the media it must be so.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

FWIW BB said in his press conference today that barring injury Cassell would be thee starting QB for thee remainder of the season.

Given as how BB never lies or misleads the media it must be so.

Even if it wasn't Belichick, what is any coach going to say? "We don't really know how good he's gonna be, but we're already looking for a replacement so we can pull him if/as soon as he does poorly."

In a sense, it's actually an advantage for Cassell that he/whoever is replacing a QB as good as Brady. Everyone assumes a huge dropoff, it's not like a SF or Chicago situation where everyone expects you to step in and immediately be better than the other guy.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Huh. Maybe it's just a regional thing. They still talk about winning "half a cup," despite the fact that the Devils went on two win two more "full cups"?

That's incredibly lame. I thought that East Coast sports fans were much better at smack talking then that.

It's a phrase I have never heard before. You have to understand that Devils fans have an inferiority complex (oddly as they have Cups to their names) and may hear one person say something once and claim that "everyone always says it".

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

It's a phrase I have never heard before. You have to understand that Devils fans have an inferiority complex (oddly as they have Cups to their names) and may hear one person say something once and claim that "everyone always says it".

Inferiority?

I have heard that said more times then I can count, usualy by jealous flyers fans whose team hasn't won dick in 30 years.

Thank god for the AFL, at least they brought a title to Philly

[molson]

So when was the last time at QB who never started a college game started an NFL game? Why haven't I heard this trivia like 1,000 times already?

There's an excellent chance that Matt Cassel has a better 2008 than either Matt Leinart or Carson Palmer.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

It's a phrase I have never heard before. You have to understand that Devils fans have an inferiority complex (oddly as they have Cups to their names) and may hear one person say something once and claim that "everyone always says it".

it was actually a pretty common dig against devil fans for quite a while...even philly and new york sports radio guys that were anti-devils would throw it around....i always thought it was pretty dumb, however that has never stopped me from saying it just to get a rise out of lathum

[EagleFan]

I listen to sports talk regularly and have not heard that phrase one time. Maybe my memory isn't what it used to be but it's pretty sad when someone whose team has several championships gets so worked up over something like that and starts throwing out insults to others. Maybe "half" was referring to something else, that would explain the defensiveness.

[Travis]

So Nate Burleson is apparently done for the season making Courtney Taylor, Jordan Kent and Logan Payne the only healthy WR's on the Seahawks roster right now.

And if they want to trot out a 4 WR set, then they've got to put out Seneca Wallace (yes, the backup QB) who might just end up as one of the two starters next week anyway.

So yeah, Engram, Branch, not too much pressure, but you know, get healthy and fast okay.

[molson]

Remember when everybody here thought the Pats were assholes for not giving Branch enough money?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I listen to sports talk regularly and have not heard that phrase one time. Maybe my memory isn't what it used to be but it's pretty sad when someone whose team has several championships gets so worked up over something like that and starts throwing out insults to others. Maybe "half" was referring to something else, that would explain the defensiveness.

I never insulted anyone.

Unless you count anyone who is a fan of a team from Philly, we all know they are douchebags.