Favre to Retire...

[rkmsuf]

If the hall of fame had any sense of humor at all they'd elect him for enshrinement and the day of the ceremony announce that they have changed their mind and he's actually not in the hall of fame.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by molson

Right, they could just keep him and offer him the backup job if they wanted, knowing that would keep him retired.

I question if Favre really has all the cards here. If he wants to play, and the Packers don't want him to start, could anyone really blame them for not releasing him to play for a division rival?

You don't know your PR very well, do you? The media would crucify the Packers. Not to mention the fact that Rodgers will have enough to deal with considering the opening games on the schedule. How comfy would he feel to see #4 sitting on the sidelines?

Favre holds all the cards here. The Packers know it. He knows it. Having him on the roster without being a starting QB would be professional suicide for both coach and GM. Paying him 12 million to sit on the bench? That isn't going to happen either. Let's face this guys, Favre is either going to be the Packers starter or he's going to play whereever the hell he damned well pleases. I'm not saying it's fair or right. I'm saying it's reality.

I'm entirely mixed on all of this. Favre is being a jerk by putting the Packers in this situation. On the other hand, he has earned the right to retire for good whenever he wants to do it. If he went back home and decided he really wanted to play again, who the hell am I to tell him he can't do it? It's not like we are talking about a guy who sucked up the league last year. You are talking about a QB who made the pro bowl, threw for over 4,000 yards, helped the team get to the NFC Championship game and was sacked 15 times in 16 games. (one sack for every 36 pass attempts, Rodgers will be sacked double that amount, if not triple his first year)

At the end of the day, all you have is the reality. Reality is that Favre is getting his way. He's either starting for the Packers. . . or he's going to the highest bidder. The Packers GM already knows this. The fans will know it soon enough.

[gstelmack]

Justice would be him coming back, starting for the Packers, and reverting to his form from 2-3 years ago, causing him to get benched in favor of Rodgers...

[Eaglesfan27]

Good post, Troy. As usual, I agree with you completely. Favre deserves the right to come back if he wants to. I can only imagine how hard it is to leave a job a person loves at such a young age to never do it again, not to mention all of the peripheral things such as the fame and adulation that athletes receive. Everything else you said is right on the money. Favre has all of the power in this situation.

[molson]

Originally Posted by TroyF

You don't know your PR very well, do you? The media would crucify the Packers.
.

I have no idea what the scene is like in Wisconsin but I think the latest news has pushed the national media closer to the "Farve is a jerk" consensus that you see in this thread.

Favre isn't that beloved that the people will go along with whatever he does here. Most have turned on him already.

The issue to me isn't that Favre has the "right" to come back - he can play until he's 60 if somebody wants to pay him to. I'm sure it's hard to retire from what you love so young. He couldn't have thought about the previous 2-3 times he retired? It's an enormous burden on the team that has employeed him for so long, and 99% of other star athletes have managed to leave the game with more class.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by molson

I have no idea what the scene is like in Wisconsin but I think the latest news has pushed the national media closer to the "Farve is a jerk" consensus that you see in this thread.

Favre isn't that beloved that the people will go along with whatever he does here. Most have turned on him already.

The issue to me isn't that Favre has the "right" to come back - he can play until he's 60 if somebody wants to pay him to. I'm sure it's hard to retire from what you love so young. He couldn't have thought about the previous 2-3 times he retired? It's an enormous burden on the team that has employeed him for so long, and 99% of other star athletes have managed to leave the game with more class.

I'm not disagreeing with you on the last paragraph.

On the first? Please. Spare me the drivel. He's a superstar. He's getting the benefit of the doubt. If the Packers let him go to the Vikings and the Vikings beat the Packers on opening Monday night, nobody will give a damn about what he did in July. (ok, the Packers fans will, and some people who hate him or the Vikings. . . but the majority of the country? Please. . . )

There is only one single way the Packers will come out ahead by dumping Favre. That's if Rodgers plays like an absolute stud and the Packers have a terrific regular season.

My guess is the Packers will take the easy way out on this and let him come back. If he comes back and they suck, they can blame it on him. They may even get an EXTRA year to get over the Favre mess. If they let him go and Rodgers isn't quite ready while Favre is leading his new team to the playoffs, the GM and coach are in trouble.

Again, Brett holds the cards here. Anybody thinking otherwise is in a dreamland.

[Jas_lov]

I agree Troy! If Favre comes back he's starting for the Packers and they have to take him. They're a top 3 NFC team with him and Favre had maybe his best year last season since the 2 superbowl years. Once the season starts Packers fans who are upset will forget and rally behind him like always.

Do you think Rogers would gladly sit out another year or would he ask to be traded to a team not within the division where he can compete for a starter's job? His contract runs through the '09 season and they drafted Brohm in the 2nd round last year so maybe he becomes the new heir apparent.

[molson]

Originally Posted by TroyF

On the first? Please. Spare me the drivel. He's a superstar. He's getting the benefit of the doubt. If the Packers let him go to the Vikings and the Vikings beat the Packers on opening Monday night, nobody will give a damn about what he did in July. (ok, the Packers fans will, and some people who hate him or the Vikings. . . but the majority of the country? Please. . . )

But that was the point of my first point you responded to - why should the Packers let him go to the Vikings? Public pressure? I don't buy it. Tom Brady could decide tomorrow he wants to play for the Dolphins but it would never happen as long as he's under contract with the Patriots. Perhaps Barry Sanders would have played longer if he were simply allowed to walk to another team.

The Packers could either bring him back as a starter, trade him to a non-rival, or allow him to negotiate with a non-rival and let him out of his contract if he makes a deal. The media wouldn't "crucify" them if they refused to trade him to the Vikings or release him outright. If they do that under some kind of media pressure they're a joke.

What's the downside for the Packers if they stick to their guns? It's not as bad as the downside if he comes back and beats them as a Viking.

Or maybe the Packers are ballsy enough that they figure Favre in their division at this point in his career means two guaranteed wins a year ('ala Bellichick trading Bledsoe to the Bills)

[Zelig]

Please come back Favre. You make football threads go BOOM.

[CU Tiger]

I heard earlier that he had a 7.5 million roster bonus effective July 1.
If he unretires and is on the roster 24 hours later the Pack owes him 7.5 million even if he later retired this same offseason.

in fact they were speculating the whole thing may be a cash grab...

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by molson

But that was the point of my first point you responded to - why should the Packers let him go to the Vikings? Public pressure? I don't buy it. Tom Brady could decide tomorrow he wants to play for the Dolphins but it would never happen as long as he's under contract with the Patriots. Perhaps Barry Sanders would have played longer if he were simply allowed to walk to another team.

The Packers could either bring him back as a starter, trade him to a non-rival, or allow him to negotiate with a non-rival and let him out of his contract if he makes a deal. The media wouldn't "crucify" them if they refused to trade him to the Vikings or release him outright. If they do that under some kind of media pressure they're a joke.

What's the downside for the Packers if they stick to their guns? It's not as bad as the downside if he comes back and beats them as a Viking.

Or maybe the Packers are ballsy enough that they figure Favre in their division at this point in his career means two guaranteed wins a year ('ala Bellichick trading Bledsoe to the Bills)

Big difference here between Brady and Favre. The Patriots (nor the Lions with Barry) had "moved on" from those players. (or would have moved on in the Pats case) If Barry would have come back, he'd have been the starter, no questions asked. In other words, they were both assets. This IS NOT a hold out. It's the opposite. It's a player coming back to a team that wishes he'd stay away. Favre WANTS to start for the Packers, he doesn't want to go away.

What does that make Favre if you bring him back and he's sitting on your roster but not starting? A distraction. A gigantic distraction. A monumental distraction. First INT Rodgers throws? The crowd starts chanting FAVRE, FAVRE, FAVRE. How does that make Rodgers feel? It's not IF Rodgers struggles. He's a young NFL QB about to start his first season. He's GOING to have some struggles.

Favre isn't Bledsoe. He's a hall of fame QB coming off of a pro bowl season. This isn't some injury prone, immobal QB. And the Vikings aren't the Bills. They have a great RB. A rock solid D-Line. A solid O-Line. They really only lack a legitimate QB from being the Super Bowl favorites (along with Dallas) in the NFC. (the Packers fit that mold too)

You aren't going to bring Brett Favre back, pay him about 12 million next year and sit him on the bench. It is NOT happening. Good luck trading him where he doesn't want to go. A simple, "I'm not really interestes in playing for them" is going to be good enough to scare off any team.

If the Packers held their ground, it'd be both gutsy and extraordinary. Your goal is to win. That means you put the players out there who give you the best chance to do that. To keep a hall of fame QB on the sidelines who had a great year last season (even for a game, much less 16) while you have an unproven starter taking snaps? If the Packers went 8-8, both the GM and the coach would be fired. It's just not going to happen.

So this comes back to the same thing. Either he's starting for the Packers or he's starting for the team he wants to start for not named the Packers. I don't think they have the guts to do any of that. They are going to take him back and he'll be the starter. Then they'll wait until the offseason and ship either Rodgers or Brohm to someone else.

[BrianD]

There are already a few billboards in the Green Bay area requesting Ted let Farve back on the team. I haven't been following the local news, but it seems that the city has already decided they want him back...which isn't terribly surprising.

[mauchow]

A few fans I know don't want him to come back for all the reasons already stated. I don't care if he comes back as a Vikings fan. It's always fun to watch Favre. Hopefully the Vikings can get the best of him next season, which I'm sure they will.

[Arles]

As long as the situation is resolved in next few weeks, I really don't have a problem with the likely outcomes:

1. Favre wants to come back and is the starter. As much as I like the potential of Rodgers, Favre is a better QB right now. So, this gives GB the highest chance to win in 2008. And, if Rodgers gets pissed and wants out, they have a comparable option in Brian Brohm to go to. Probability: 47%

2. Favre decides not to come back and just wanted his ego stroked by ESPN, John Madden and other news outlets. Hey, no skin off GB's back. They've been preparing for Rodgers to be starter all summer and will be OK with him (as long as Aaron stays healthy ). Probability: 43%

3. GB trades Favre to an AFC team like KC, Jets or Baltimore. They probably get a 3rd or 4th pick at best, and he gets to pull a Joe Montana and try to win on another team. Doesn't really impact GB other than some complainers if he does real well and GB struggles, but those complainers would have been there anyway if GB struggled. Probably: 10%

I just don't see how any of these three put GB is a much worse situation than they were back in June. Either they are the same they were before (#2), have a slightly better QB this year and comparable QB in Brohm for the future if Rodgers is pissed (#1) or end up just like before - except with an extra draft pick (#3).

[Shkspr]

Reality of the situation is this: the Madden curse is working its voodoo to get Favre to come back so that he can blow out a knee in the third preseason game.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by Shkspr

Reality of the situation is this: the Madden curse is working its voodoo to get Favre to come back so that he can blow out a knee in the third preseason game.

That would be Ted Thompson's best outcome. He can go with Rodgers, Favre is done and he didn't have to trade or cut him.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Mustang

That would be Ted Thompson's best outcome. He can go with Rodgers, Favre is done and he didn't have to trade or cut him.

SWEEP THE LEG!!!!

[Kodos]

Actually, Ted Thompson's best outcome is Favre leads them to a championship (over the Patriots again) and rides into the sunset Elway-style.

[Shkspr]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

SWEEP THE LEG!!!!

Why, yes, the Packers will in fact be facing the Broncos in the third preseason game. But Favre won't be playing against Denver's O-line.

[Ksyrup]

Let the barrage of PR from the Pack begin, in anticipation of the likely scenario that Favre's agent sends an official request to remove him from the retired list:

Current team president and CEO Mark Murphy and chairman emeritus Bob Harlan, appearing at a charity auction in Fond Du Lac, Wisc., as part of the team's "Tailgate Tour" through the state, said they took Favre at his word when he said in March that he was done with professional football.

"I keep going back to his retirement announcement and how sincere and heartfelt that was," Murphy said, according to the report. "I think it's pretty reasonable that, as an organization, we're going to move on."

"What I remember about him is he was ready to retire, and that's how I feel today,” Harlan added, according to the newspaper. "I think down deep, that's exactly how he feels."

I'm a little surprised that Favre has waited so long to move on this, if everything we've heard is correct. Maybe he is caught off-guard by the fact that they don't appear to want him back.

[Surtt]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I'm a little surprised that Favre has waited so long to move on this, if everything we've heard is correct. Maybe he is caught off-guard by the fact that they don't appear to want him back.

Wasn't the reason he retired because he didn't think Green Bay wanted him back?
hxxp://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=724366

[Ksyrup]

Looks like this is going to be an interesting (if not played out) storyline for the upcoming season. First, what will the Pack do; second, where does Favre go; and third, how does he do, and how does the Pack do without him?

[molson]

"Played Out" is going to be an understatement. I figure by week 3 ESPN won't be covering anything else.

[albionmoonlight]

If they release him, does he go on waivers or become an immediate UFA?

And, if he does go on waivers, would any team claim him, or is his salary prohibitive?

[Kodos]

I think his salary is prohibitive.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Yes! Make it so, Favre! Come back! Please!

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

So, if he's given unconditional release, where will he choose to go?

No chance he gets it. If he did, he'll be in Minnesota in a heartbeat.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Looks like this is going to be an interesting (if not played out) storyline for the upcoming season. First, what will the Pack do; second, where does Favre go; and third, how does he do, and how does the Pack do without him?

I'll take a stab at them.

1) The Pack will release him. They've moved on and they won't find a trading partner.
2) He's going to Minnesota. It makes the most sense. Winning team, revenge factor, money to give him. The Ravens could be in the picture, but I don't see Favre as a good fit there.
3) He'll be fine. He was clearly ok last year and his skills won't have a huge drop off this year. he goes to the Vikings, they become Super Bowl favorites with the Cowboys in the NFC.
4) The Packers are going to struggle without him. Not "struggle" to 3-13 by any stretch. They have a great defense and a solid group of WR. But Aaron Rodgers is going to have growing pains. Their schedule early is brutal. They'll likely be 3-4 after 7 weeks. I think they go 9-7 and miss the playoffs.

I'll add one more:

If Favre does well and the Packers don't, anyone involved in that decision making process will see their careers come to a screeching halt. This is a win now industry. They are making a choice to start fresh with a new QB when a HOF one wanted to play for them. If Favre does well and the Packers don't, this doesn't end pretty for the GM. If Rodgers is a flop, they will never have jobs within the league again.

[molson]

The '08 Packers are obviously better with Favre, but the '09 Packers are probably better if Rodgers plays in '08.

It sucks for Rodgers and really the whole team. He'll be compared to Favre which isn't fair, because they're at completely different stages of their career.

And Favre is a diva douchebag. I never got why he was so beloved.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by TroyF

I'll take a stab at them.

1) The Pack will release him. They've moved on and they won't find a trading partner.
2) He's going to Minnesota. It makes the most sense. Winning team, revenge factor, money to give him. The Ravens could be in the picture, but I don't see Favre as a good fit there.
3) He'll be fine. He was clearly ok last year and his skills won't have a huge drop off this year. he goes to the Vikings, they become Super Bowl favorites with the Cowboys in the NFC.
4) The Packers are going to struggle without him. Not "struggle" to 3-13 by any stretch. They have a great defense and a solid group of WR. But Aaron Rodgers is going to have growing pains. Their schedule early is brutal. They'll likely be 3-4 after 7 weeks. I think they go 9-7 and miss the playoffs.

I'll add one more:

If Favre does well and the Packers don't, anyone involved in that decision making process will see their careers come to a screeching halt. This is a win now industry. They are making a choice to start fresh with a new QB when a HOF one wanted to play for them. If Favre does well and the Packers don't, this doesn't end pretty for the GM. If Rodgers is a flop, they will never have jobs within the league again.

Ding ding ding.

Aaron Rodgers is royally fucked. He is in a no win situation now. Every mistake will be nitpicked even more then it already was going to be, and wherever Favre goes, Rodgers will be compared to him without question.

Unless Rodgers has a 3500 yard, 25 TD season, it won't be good enough for most Pack fans.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

Are you basing the "revenge factor" on anything concrete? Isn't it possible that he realizes the impossible situation he's put the Packers in and would (reasonably) avoid their division and go to the Ravens, or Redskins, or some other mid-level team? I agree that the Vikings are the most attractive choice, however.

If they're stupid enough to grant him a release, this thought will never cross his mind (to be reasonable to the Packers).

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by TroyF

I'll take a stab at them.

1) The Pack will release him. They've moved on and they won't find a trading partner.
2) He's going to Minnesota. It makes the most sense. Winning team, revenge factor, money to give him. The Ravens could be in the picture, but I don't see Favre as a good fit there.
3) He'll be fine. He was clearly ok last year and his skills won't have a huge drop off this year. he goes to the Vikings, they become Super Bowl favorites with the Cowboys in the NFC.
4) The Packers are going to struggle without him. Not "struggle" to 3-13 by any stretch. They have a great defense and a solid group of WR. But Aaron Rodgers is going to have growing pains. Their schedule early is brutal. They'll likely be 3-4 after 7 weeks. I think they go 9-7 and miss the playoffs.

I'll add one more:

If Favre does well and the Packers don't, anyone involved in that decision making process will see their careers come to a screeching halt. This is a win now industry. They are making a choice to start fresh with a new QB when a HOF one wanted to play for them. If Favre does well and the Packers don't, this doesn't end pretty for the GM. If Rodgers is a flop, they will never have jobs within the league again.

Is something else going that I missed? Is Favre asking for his release because the Packers have already said "Thanks, but no thanks?"

If not, (or even if so) I really don't think that, even if Favre does well and the Packers struggle, "anyone involved in that decision making process will see their careers come to a screeching halt."

Can't the Packers' brass just spin this as a "We would love to have him back" but either (a) Favre didnt' want to come back (see, his letter asking for a release) or (b) it just wasn't going to work, we moved on.

If it's (a), they should be fine. They can spin this as a totally pro-Favre thing to do. "Brett was a great player, we love him, he asked to move and we're granting his wish. We wish him all the best."

I can see where (b) is quite a bit more dicey, but I don't think it's completely catastrophic. While folks in Green Bay may get all crazy, I think most sensible NFL types (or anyone outside of Wisconsin) could totally understand the horrible position Favre put these guys in and sympathize with their choice. Hell, even if the Packers don't succeed this year, not bringing Our Farve back may be the best thing, in the long term, for the franchise. Sure, some Cheesheads will likely never see it that way, but to say that anyone in the Packer front office will "will never have jobs within the league again" is a bit over the top, in particular, in a league where the Ford family owns a franchise.

That said, I agree with pretty much everything else.

[Jas_lov]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

No chance he gets it. If he did, he'll be in Minnesota in a heartbeat.

Right. The Packers will not let him go to Minnesota where he would be playing them twice including MNF week 1 when they were suppose to honor him and retire his jersey. The Vikings are a good fit though because they have a great defense and running game and Childress is part of that Holmgren coaching tree. The Vikings like to sign players the Packers don't want anymore so it wouldn't surprise me if they have interest, but it ain't gonna happen.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

If they release him, does he go on waivers or become an immediate UFA?

And, if he does go on waivers, would any team claim him, or is his salary prohibitive?

There's no waivers for players with something like 4+ years in the league, so upon his release he would be a UFA.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Is something else going that I missed? Is Favre asking for his release because the Packers have already said "Thanks, but no thanks?"

Yes. According to Mort, they had a call on Tuesday and he was basically told to stay retired.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

Are you basing the "revenge factor" on anything concrete? Isn't it possible that he realizes the impossible situation he's put the Packers in and would (reasonably) avoid their division and go to the Ravens, or Redskins, or some other mid-level team? I agree that the Vikings are the most attractive choice, however.

People sometimes rip my dumb ass analogies, but this one is easy and evident:

You are a hall of fame QB who helped resurrect a football team that hadn't went deep into the playoffs in a couple of decades. You lead them to a Super Bowl win, a Super Bowl loss, stay with them your entire career (after that brief stint with the Falcons) and break pretty much every passing record in the game.

Then that team says "Sorry Brett, we don't want you back, we wanna go with a QB with 1 career game under his belt"

You think you aren't going to be a little offended? Please.

At the end of the day, Favre will go to whichever team he feels can win AND offer him the most money will be. But don't doubt for a second he's going to be a little pissed off at the Packers.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by molson

The '08 Packers are obviously better with Favre, but the '09 Packers are probably better if Rodgers plays in '08.

It sucks for Rodgers and really the whole team. He'll be compared to Favre which isn't fair, because they're at completely different stages of their career.

And Favre is a diva douchebag. I never got why he was so beloved.

Because he played the game with enthusiasm. People love to see that. It's why people love college vs. pro sports. The emotion of the game.

Favre is a douchebag. None of my comments are meant to put him into sainthood. But the reality is, he put up an all pro season last year. If Packers management chooses to say good bye to him and go with Aaron Rodgers, Rodgers had better be a complete and total stud.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Yes. According to Mort, they had a call on Tuesday and he was basically told to stay retired.

Sweet.

[gstelmack]

Is everyone forgetting the sucky years he had before last year? He's also the Packer who led them to their first ever home playoff loss.

It will be interesting to see if Minnesota gets the '07 Favre or the '03-'06 Favre...

[Honolulu_Blue]

If Favre did end up in Minnesota, that would likely make that first Monday night game the highest rated cable TV program. Ever.

[Front Office Midget]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Is everyone forgetting the sucky years he had before last year? He's also the Packer who led them to their first ever home playoff loss.

It will be interesting to see if Minnesota gets the '07 Favre or the '03-'06 Favre...

Favre was fine in 03 and 04.

Man, I would hate to see Brett in Minnesota. Would ruin everything I believe about football.

It will also be rough for Aaron. I'd like to think that Wisconsin fans aren't that way, but I know that most of them are drunk hicks with no patience.

[Cork]

I will chime in as a long time Packer fan and say that I hope and pray that Favre will not return to the Packers. He had a great career, but it is time to move on.

-Cork

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by TroyF

At the end of the day, Favre will go to whichever team he feels can win AND offer him the most money will be. But don't doubt for a second he's going to be a little pissed off at the Packers.

If he did that, his image in Wisconsin would be tarnished perhaps beyond repair. Joining the Vikings goes beyond jabbing the Packer's organization. If he doesn't care about everyone that has backed him in the state for all these years, helped his charities, bought his autographs and signs with Minnesota then Wisconsin has wasted 17 years cheering for someone that truly only cares about himself.

[Kodos]

A little overdramatic?

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by Kodos

A little overdramatic?

Nope, not at all.

[Zelig]

Cowboy up

[Eaglesfan27]

Driving home from work, I was listening to Fox Sports Radio. Jay Glazer (sp?) is reporting that the Packers have told him they will not release Favre under any conditions, but that Favre is welcome to come back to the team as Rodgers' backup. Also, the report was saying that Favre told the team he wanted to come back in March and the team was ready to welcome him back, but he backed out of it 2 days later.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Driving home from work, I was listing to Fox Sports Radio. Jay Glazer (sp?) is reporting that the Packers have told him they will not release Favre under any conditions, but that Favre is welcome to come back to the team as Rodgers' backup. Also, the report was saying that Favre told the team he wanted to come back in March and the team was ready to welcome him back, but he backed out of it 2 days later.

Nice - I think the Pack are my new favorite NFC team.

[Kodos]

Brett Favre can't hold Rodgers' jock.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

How long would he remain the backup? This is the solution that puts the MOST pressure on Rodgers. I don't think that's a tenable situation, but more of a bluff.

It's not really a bluff, it's just the only alternative to releasing him and having him sign with a rival (if they're committed to Rodgers)