Football sims dead?

[MizzouRah]

2012 Champions - Detroit Lions

[Philliesfan980]

Can you play the games, or do you just literally sim them?

[MizzouRah]

Oh.. and Tebow is a BEAST!

[MJ4H]

Is there video of some of the 2D game interface somewhere I can look at?

edit: preferably some from one of the more current versions?

[Philliesfan980]

Rushing stats seem low for any QB, even the most immobile guys out there would run more than that. Not a deal breaker, just wanted to point it out.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

Is there video of some of the 2D game interface somewhere I can look at?

edit: preferably some from one of the more current versions?

Just download the demo and look for yourself.

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by Philliesfan980

Rushing stats seem low for any QB, even the most immobile guys out there would run more than that. Not a deal breaker, just wanted to point it out.

Yeah, even Marino "ran" an average of 1.25 per game.

[Philliesfan980]

I hate to keep on asking questions without buying first, but Mizzou, would you be able to tell us Tebow's attributes in the game?

If it's simply a matter of Tebow being rated as an immobile, highly accurate passer, then that's perfectly fine. I would question the draft class, and the rosters in general, but I can understand it.

Now if Tebow is rated as a run first type guy, then the game has issues. At a bare minimum, I would want my player to play as advertised.

[Ben E Lou]

There's a very wide variety on rushing for QBs. I'm guessing it's a player creation issue on Tebow. I ran 25 years with the latest patch this morning, and there's this guy in the sim...

[Ben E Lou]

Dola...

Reason #2482845 why I don't use "real" roster files.

[Philliesfan980]

Now that guy sound like Tebow! 6"4, 240 and a lot of rushes! I imagine him bowling over guys Ben R style.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Philliesfan980

Now that guy sound like Tebow! 6"4, 240 and a lot of rushes! I imagine him bowling over guys Ben R style.

What's pretty fun over a fair short league history is that he is by *far* the best rushing QB. #2 guy has 402 carries for 1,774 yards. I like having outliers. Brooks mentioned that he didn't do a good job of documenting the changes in this patch, and I know that I've been pushing on him to include some real outliers. Maybe it's in there now. From a coding perspective, it *can't* be that hard to do. I mean, just roll 1d10000 (or whatever the number that ends up working) every time you create a player, and if it comes up max, make him a crazy-good once-in-a-generation player. The engine can already handle that kind of player (at least in one of the more recent versions, haven't tested it for this one.) When I tested by putting very high ratings for players, "appropriate" outlier stats showed up IIRC, a maxed-out running QB could get in the 1000-1200 yard range. I'll max a guy out now and see what happens...

[Ben E Lou]

Maybe a little less now, but still serious outlier. I bumped up a "solid starter, nothing special" QB to 100 speed, 100 agility, and left his strength where it was (50), and ran five seasons. His best rushing year in that span was 144 carries for 895 yards. Interestingly enough, he became a much better passer, too. I don't know if the engine takes into account him being a rushing threat, if maybe all that speed and agility is buying him extra time, or if maybe the team just happened to draft/sign some weapons for him at the time I made the edit (didn't look that carefully,) but the bottom line is that in addition to the great rushing numbers, he went from a guy usually in the 80-85 QB rating range to breaking 95 three of the next five seasons, including 107.0 and 119.2 ratings in two of them.

[Julio Riddols]

If this PFS keeps getting better and gets on par with FOF from a realism and stability standpoint, I might have to take the plunge. I like that tab I see that says "ratings progression".

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

If this PFS keeps getting better and gets on par with FOF from a realism and stability standpoint, I might have to take the plunge. I like that tab I see that says "ratings progression".

It's a little weird, but nice to have. The biggest issue with ratings in general for a seasoned FOFer is getting used to the scales. If you use "relative," the best player in the league at his position is always a 100. If you use "absolute," the scale is much more like Madden than FOF, which is disappointing. The very worst player in the league is rated 57 overall. Why claim to use a 1-100 scale if you're only going to use a small fraction of the scale?

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

If this PFS keeps getting better and gets on par with FOF from a realism and stability standpoint, I might have to take the plunge. I like that tab I see that says "ratings progression".

[Ben E Lou]

Methinks RB careers may be too long still. Just did a 100-year sim, and came up with one guy wtih 30,000 rushing yards, because he started 13 games or more at RB for *20* straight seasons. I'm all for outliers, but that's, um, a bit much.

[MJ4H]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Just download the demo and look for yourself.

I did. It was terrible Is that demo representative of the updated product?

And I would prefer a video over installing it and wading through all that I have to wade through to simply take a look at what the on the field action looks like at present. If a video exists. So is there one?

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

I did. It was terrible Is that demo representative of the updated product?

I have no idea. I have zero interest in sitting through a 2D presentation, so I've never looked at it. Is the version you have 1.1.86? That's the latest version.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Philliesfan980

Can you play the games, or do you just literally sim them?

Just sim/watch them.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Philliesfan980

I hate to keep on asking questions without buying first, but Mizzou, would you be able to tell us Tebow's attributes in the game?

If it's simply a matter of Tebow being rated as an immobile, highly accurate passer, then that's perfectly fine. I would question the draft class, and the rosters in general, but I can understand it.

Now if Tebow is rated as a run first type guy, then the game has issues. At a bare minimum, I would want my player to play as advertised.

Seeing these ratings, looks more like a pocket passer to me. Check out that accuracy!

I like using real players to start off and I don't mind variance.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

If this PFS keeps getting better and gets on par with FOF from a realism and stability standpoint, I might have to take the plunge. I like that tab I see that says "ratings progression".

I love this tab too.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Methinks RB careers may be too long still. Just did a 100-year sim, and came up with one guy wtih 30,000 rushing yards, because he started 13 games or more at RB for *20* straight seasons. I'm all for outliers, but that's, um, a bit much.

Let Brooks know, I was seeing way too many good players retiring, so he changed some things in this last update, I don't think there is a differential on player positions when determining retirements, although I hope/could be wrong here.

Most of these guys could start on most teams and they are retired - a 100 rated WR (Reggie Wayne) who caught 88 passes for 943 yards and 2 TD's decides to hang them up at 33 years old and no ratings decline?

Hopefully, you are seeing an improvement with your tests?

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

It's a little weird, but nice to have. The biggest issue with ratings in general for a seasoned FOFer is getting used to the scales. If you use "relative," the best player in the league at his position is always a 100. If you use "absolute," the scale is much more like Madden than FOF, which is disappointing. The very worst player in the league is rated 57 overall. Why claim to use a 1-100 scale if you're only going to use a small fraction of the scale?

I love the "realative" scale, that way I know a player at 50 is "average" and can go from there.

I also really like having a practice squad and being able to change the league to use "sudden death" in OT so there are no ties.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

If this PFS keeps getting better and gets on par with FOF from a realism and stability standpoint, I might have to take the plunge. I like that tab I see that says "ratings progression".

I'm with ya. But every time I start seriously considering it, I read/hear about some absurd stat or bug that holds me back. I'm only going to play it in single player, so it needs to hold up there too.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

I'm with ya. But every time I start seriously considering it, I read/hear about some absurd stat or bug that holds me back. I'm only going to play it in single player, so it needs to hold up there too.

I'm in season 3 of solo play and there is a dynasty thread you can check out from Dolemite73.

If are a really huge number cruncher - I would ask Ben any questions you might have.

For me, so far.. the game has been very believeable in terms of statistical output goes and definitely playable for solo play.

[MJ4H]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I have no idea. I have zero interest in sitting through a 2D presentation, so I've never looked at it. Is the version you have 1.1.86? That's the latest version.

The question is basically is the demo being updated with the full version you guys are using? 2D presentation is precisely the only reason I'd ever consider this game. Otherwise I'd just play FOF.

[Ben E Lou]

Does the demo not have a version number if you look at Help-->About? (Again, no idea since it's been so long since I had the demo version.)

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

Is there video of some of the 2D game interface somewhere I can look at?

edit: preferably some from one of the more current versions?

Nothing has changed with the 2d representation except the pbp has some new lines.

I've posted some things I would like to see added to 2d, but I don't believe it's a priority at this time.

In other words, continue to play FOF. I only use the 2d display to look at the big plays for the current weeks games and it still needs some major work imho.

[MJ4H]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

Nothing has changed with the 2d representation except the pbp has some new lines.

I've posted some things I would like to see added to 2d, but I don't believe it's a priority at this time.

In other words, continue to play FOF. I only use the 2d display to look at the big plays for the current weeks games and it still needs some major work imho.

OK, thanks. I'll check back in a couple of months to see if there's been any progress. And to Ben, I don't currently have it installed.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

OK, thanks. I'll check back in a couple of months to see if there's been any progress. And to Ben, I don't currently have it installed.

Here was a quote from Brooks awhile back:

The 2d viewer doesn't cover all plays because some plays in PFS do not have the detailed x/y point data needed to render on the screen. I've looked at replacing those plays with some stock animations so it's not so jarring, but I'm not a graphics guy, so until I find someone with those skills to help I think 2d will have to remain as-is.

[MizzouRah]

Jinxed myself...

Buffalo has all 3 of their QB's hurt and they are starting CJ Spiller as the QB, he's started 6 games now and Buffalo is getting murdered. Must be a bug somewhere that doesn't have the AI sign a stop gap QB.

First time I've seen this as having all 3 of your QB's hurt is pretty rare.

[MJ4H]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

Here was a quote from Brooks awhile back:

Thanks

That pretty much ends my interest in the game.

[MizzouRah]

Love the new personality system:

Leadership – Allows player to improve the team’s morale. Motivates players to play better.
Work Ethic – How hard the player works in the offseason to improve.
Competitiveness – How hard the player plays during the game. Affects morale when winning or losing.
Team Player – Plays to win and less for accolades.
Sportsmanship – Players attitude towards the other team. Affects penalties.
Disposition – Temperament of the player, good locker room influencer, also affects penalties.
Values Money – How much the player values money in contract negotiations.
Values Security – How much the player values long term contracts and security in negotiations.
Values Loyalty – How much the team values their current team in negotiations.
Values Winning – How much the player values a winning atmosphere.
Values Playing Time – How much the player values more playing time.
Values Close to Home – How much the player values being close to their home town. (Not currently implemented.)
Values Market Size – How much the player values larger market sizes. (Not currently implemented.)
Morale – Affects player temperament and performance. Signing contracts, winning games, winning awards all improve morale. Losing or getting injured can detract from morale. If morale gets low enough the player is more likely to retire.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

Thanks

That pretty much ends my interest in the game.

That actually is disappointing if he does not have x/y data for incomplete passes, one of the big play types I complained about missing and which makes the 2D display useless as it just skips those plays.

[johnnyshaka]

Curious as to why this thread went silent along with the test league. Anybody know why?