NFL Playoff Round I Thread - Page 10

RainMaker · 01-10-2010, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fonzie

Am I the only one who saw a facemask to Rodgers on that play?

And helmet-to-helmet on the previous play?

Helmet to helmet was a coin flip and I'm glad they didn't call it. But they did miss the facemask.

ColtCrazy · 01-10-2010, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mauboy1

First to 50 wins?

Another good call. Yes, first to 50 won.

Senator · 01-10-2010, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Okay, GB looks like they will win this. I wouldn't want to be Rackers right now.

What kind of odds would it take for you to be on Arizona right now?

A golden god???

Thomkal · 01-10-2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Okay just about all the "experts" have picked the Packers-reminds me of last year right about this time doesn't it? Will be tough without Boldin, but they won a playoff game without him last year. Go Cards!

to all those "experts"!

Sorry Packers Fans, this was a tough one to lose after all those comebacks and then getting the ball in OT

cuervo72 · 01-10-2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fonzie

Am I the only one who saw a facemask to Rodgers on that play?

And helmet-to-helmet on the previous play?

Nope - I mentioned that to my wife (well, or at least muttered it in her presence).

tucker rocky · 01-10-2010, 07:07 PM

Early prediction for Arz/NO:

63-60 NO in OT, Carney with a winning FG from a chip-shot spot.

Rackers will have an opp, but miss badly.

M GO BLUE!!! · 01-10-2010, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

who would have guessed it'd be a turnover that won it, wow!

It's a Crapshoot.

Cringer · 01-10-2010, 07:09 PM

Fuck. I'm going to bed now.

Thomkal · 01-10-2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M GO BLUE!!!

It's a Crapshoot.

heh

Logan · 01-10-2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mauboy1

First to 50 wins?

Another prophet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fonzie

Am I the only one who saw a facemask to Rodgers on that play?

And helmet-to-helmet on the previous play?

Might need Sak to weigh in...he hit the facemask after he had already hit the ball out. Not sure if that changes anything.

tucker rocky · 01-10-2010, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

I AM A GOLDEN GOD!

I need advice on lucky lotto numbers.

What will the weather be like tomorrow?

Who will win the SB?

What lays ahead for this year?

bhlloy · 01-10-2010, 07:14 PM

The helmet to helmet on the previous was definitely a penalty the way they call it nowadays but the ref was looking at the hold on the ground and throwing the flag. Unfortunate for the Pack.

I'd love to hear what the correct call should have been on the facemask because I can see a bunch of ways it could go. My logical guess is personal foul, 15 yards but the Cardinals take possession because the ball was already loose, but I have absolutely no idea.

Wolfpack · 01-10-2010, 07:14 PM

Hm. Initially I would have thought it was incidental since the ball was up by Rogers's head and going for the ball would have made it hard not to make contact with the facemask, but looking at it again, he doesn't really let go once he's made contact and does use it to help leverage Rogers away from the ball. Blown call, but unreviewable so nothing to be done for it, much like what happened in the San Diego-Colorado playoff game in MLB back in '07 where Holliday was declared safe even though all the replays eventually showed he never tagged home.

Thomkal · 01-10-2010, 07:14 PM

yeah that was really a facemask there.

Drake · 01-10-2010, 07:22 PM

Arizona winning always makes me smile because I know Thomkal will be happy. It's like watching a kid on Christmas morning.

gstelmack · 01-10-2010, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColtCrazy

Who else thinks that either NFC road team could win next week, but the AFC road teams should be done?

I would not count out Baltimore against Indy given how the end of Indy's season went down. But I don't give the Jets much of a chance against the Chargers given San Diego's momentum right now. The Jets may well put up a fight, but the Chargers should beat them.

Dr. Sak · 01-10-2010, 07:26 PM

I actually didn't see the play so I am going off what has been said. I'm assuming the facemask did not cause the fumble and happened while the ball was loose. That being said it would still be Arizona's ball but they would be penalized 15 yards from basic spot, and in this case it would be the end of the run.

gstelmack · 01-10-2010, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

I actually didn't see the play so I am going off what has been said. I'm assuming the facemask did not cause the fumble and happened while the ball was loose. That being said it would still be Arizona's ball but they would be penalized 15 yards from basic spot, and in this case it would be the end of the run.

Correct, he hit the ball while the QB's arm was in the air, knocked it loose, and the continued motion of the arm hit the QB's facemask, then he grabbed on and pulled him down.

However, the end of the run was a TD (that won the game), so what happens then?

jbergey22 · 01-10-2010, 07:30 PM

Lines for next week are
Chargers -9 42.5
Colts -6.5 44.5
New Orleans -7 56.5
Minnesota -2.5 46.5

Loving the Vikings/Cowboys under at first glance

Dr. Sak · 01-10-2010, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Correct, he hit the ball while the QB's arm was in the air, knocked it loose, and the continued motion of the arm hit the QB's facemask, then he grabbed on and pulled him down.

However, the end of the run was a TD (that won the game), so what happens then?

The end of the run was the place where Rodgers fumbled. Thats where the ball became loose and the foul occurred right after that...everything after that point is considered null.

BrianD · 01-10-2010, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

I actually didn't see the play so I am going off what has been said. I'm assuming the facemask did not cause the fumble and happened while the ball was loose. That being said it would still be Arizona's ball but they would be penalized 15 yards from basic spot, and in this case it would be the end of the run.

How does a ball change possession when there is a foul by a team before securing possession?

jbergey22 · 01-10-2010, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrianD

How does a ball change possession when there is a foul by a team before securing possession?

It doesnt

Dr. Sak · 01-10-2010, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrianD

How does a ball change possession when there is a foul by a team before securing possession?

The act of the foul did not cause the ball to be fumbled...the ball was loose before the foul and no one had possession.

jbergey22 · 01-10-2010, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

The act of the foul did not cause the ball to be fumbled...the ball was loose before the foul and no one had possession.

Packers would keep possession if the foul occurred before the ball was recovered.

Dr. Sak · 01-10-2010, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Packers would keep possession if the foul occurred before the ball was recovered.

Nope. The Packers would keep possession if the foul occurred before the fumble happened.

jbergey22 · 01-10-2010, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Nope. The Packers would keep possession if the foul occurred before the fumble happened.

Incorrect. If there was a ball scrambling free on the ground and a defender held an offensive player from getting the ball the offense would keep possession. How is this different?

At the time of the foul no one has possession it then goes back to the offense.

With that said its possible you are correct but it just wouldnt make any sense to me. Suppose the defender was grabbing Rodgers facemask to keep him from getting the ball back. It wouldnt seem right that the defense could do this to recover the ball and only lose 15 yards for it.

BrianD · 01-10-2010, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

The act of the foul did not cause the ball to be fumbled...the ball was loose before the foul and no one had possession.

I so want to disagree with you, but I know your credentials are much better than mine.

Thomkal · 01-10-2010, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drake

Arizona winning always makes me smile because I know Thomkal will be happy. It's like watching a kid on Christmas morning.

Awww thanks Drake.

I feel like I just found one last present from Santa right now lol.

Dr. Sak · 01-10-2010, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Incorrect. If there was a ball scrambling free on the ground and a defender held an offensive player from getting the ball the offense would keep possession. How is this different?

At the time of the foul no one has possession it then goes back to the offense.

With that said its possible you are correct but it just wouldnt make any sense to me. Suppose the defender was grabbing Rodgers facemask to keep him from getting the ball back. It wouldnt seem right that the defense could do this to recover the ball and only lose 15 yards for it.

You are correct. I read my bin book wrong.

tucker rocky · 01-10-2010, 07:47 PM

GB/Arz 1-10-2010

"The Shootout in the Desert"
"The Good, The Bad, The Fumble"

Anybody think of some more?

PackerFanatic · 01-10-2010, 07:49 PM

Ugh...

Dr. Sak · 01-10-2010, 07:51 PM

I will say this...I was watching the youtube clip of the replay. He does hit the facemask but is the pull down on the bottom part of his mask or the neck of the shoulder pads?

I can see why the call was missed (if it was indeed missed). The Referee is throwing his bag for the fumble spot and he's really the only one who will see it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXhyA3a-WlY

jbergey22 · 01-10-2010, 07:57 PM

Looked like he got the facemask right away then let go and got the shoulder pad. Hard to get a clear look though.

RainMaker · 01-10-2010, 08:39 PM

THE CURSE OF FAVRE

Fonzie · 01-10-2010, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mauboy1

Hits to the head will always be called.

I guess I'm not quite understanding the meaning of the word "always".

stevew · 01-10-2010, 10:46 PM

There was some really shitty horsecollar tackle called later in the game. Now I understand why that's a rule, because Roy Williams was intentionally trying to hurt people. But the call on Arizona was pretty poor.

CU Tiger · 01-10-2010, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

You are correct. I read my bin book wrong.

Not sure how to take this.
An actual mistake, or I thumb my nose at you I am a ref and you are not.

I mean, I am reading along snickering at how someone is challening the football ref on the rule, and then I am confused.

Cuckoo · 01-10-2010, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

Now I understand why that's a rule, because Roy Williams was intentionally trying to hurt people.

Do people really think this?

jbergey22 · 01-10-2010, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Not sure how to take this.
An actual mistake, or I thumb my nose at you I am a ref and you are not.

I mean, I am reading along snickering at how someone is challening the football ref on the rule, and then I am confused.

I didnt realize he was a ref, thanks for letting me know that before I challenge him again. He could have been being sarcastic I am not positive that I was correct. It just seemed to make sense to me. Of course other rules dont make sense to me either and they are still called the non logical way.

Front Office Midget · 01-11-2010, 01:54 AM

Ugh... what an emotional game. I can't believe I gave up on this game in the 3rd quarter and then all the sudden the Packers came back! Truly an unforgettable game.

Oh well... I guess I'll cheer for the Vikings the rest of the way.

Senator · 01-11-2010, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Front Office Midget

Ugh... what an emotional game. I can't believe I gave up on this game in the 3rd quarter and then all the sudden the Packers came back! Truly an unforgettable game.

Oh well... I guess I'll cheer for the Vikings the rest of the way.

You might want to get another back up team.

RedKingGold · 01-11-2010, 07:26 AM

Quote:

After further review, Packers got screwed

Posted by Mike Florio on January 11, 2010 7:50 AM ET
We've received more than a few e-mails in the aftermath of Sunday night's for-the-ages battle between the Packers and the Cardinals regarding the non-call on the play that delivered victory for the home team via a sack, fumble/interception, and 17-yard sprint for a score.

At first, the words "tuck rule" dominated the discussion.

Then, the focal point became the blow to the head and the yanking of the facemask that Green Bay quarterback Aaron Rodgers endured as Arizona defensive back Michael Adams collided into Rodgers.

Here's the video.

As one league source said via e-mail, "It should have been a personal foul grabbing the face mask and 15-yard penalty and a first down for Green Bay."

And we agree, completely. The incidental facemask call disappeared a couple of years ago, replaced by a rule that even a minor grab of the bars attached to the helmet triggers the major infraction.

Moreover, we've routinely seen quarterbacks take minor blows to the head and draw flags for roughing the passer.

So what happened? Though the tuck rule didn't matter because the ball bounced off Rodgers' foot before it was caught by Cardinals linebacker Karlos Dansby, the official undoubtedly was watching Rodgers' arm and the ball for any evidence of the convoluted mechanical process that makes a fumble not a fumble when the quarterback was in the process of moving his arm forward but hadn't released the ball before having the ball knocked out.

The bigger problem is that the FOX announcers and the folks talking into their ears didn't bother to delve into the question of whether not one but two penalties had occurred. Joe Buck said "Rodgers gets a hand to the face" during the live call, but Buck and his producer(s) blew an excellent opportunity to explain first that the tuck rule didn't matter in this case and second that what did matter was the failure of the men in black and white to see that Adams had not only hit Rodgers in the head but also had grabbed and tugged his facemask.

So, yes, Packers fans, you have every right to be upset.

Then again, watch the video. Adams didn't get a free release from Rodgers' blind side. He had to cut in front of an underneath receiver before circling into the backfield, and Rodgers could have (and should have) seen Adams coming.

By our count, Rodgers had the ball in his hands for three full seconds before getting hit.

When Rodgers was getting thrown around like a rag doll in the first half of the season, he quietly was being criticized within the locker room for holding the ball too long. And that's the biggest thing that the Packers need to address this offseason in order to make Rodgers into a guy who can deliver consistently in the clutch.

After further review, Packers got screwed | ProFootballTalk.com

.

Butter · 01-11-2010, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPhillips

dola

Please let this (Bengal) loss bring the joy of a Bratkowski firing. This offense is painful.

Please listen to this man. He is wise.

mauchow · 01-11-2010, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fonzie

I guess I'm not quite understanding the meaning of the word "always".

when seen by the officials, sorry.

Galaril · 01-11-2010, 08:58 AM

I still can get over how much the Ravens dominated the Pats especially in the running game and on the defensive side of the ball. I know Brady apparently has been banged up with broken ribs or something but really it was less about the Pats playing poorly as it was the Ravens making them look so bad.

Thomkal · 01-11-2010, 09:56 AM

I agree RedKingGold that a penalty should have been called on that play and probably the one before it too with the head to head of the QB hit on Rodgers. But if Rodgers had hit a wide open Jennings on the first play of overtime, the game would have been over already. And then he probably held on to the ball too long on the play where he fumbled.

So yes Packer fans have a right to be angry at the officials, but they should be angry at Rodgers too for his play in overtime.

It's too bad really that such a great game had to end on such a controversial play.

BrianD · 01-11-2010, 10:07 AM

I don't think we Packer fans have a right to be angry. Disappointed maybe, but not angry. While the last two plays contained penalties that should have been called, neither caused Green Bay to lose the game. The only thing that would have resulted from calling the penalty on the last play was nullifying a mistake. I don't feel that you can ever blame the refs for not nullifying a mistake. If you want to win, you have to avoid those mistakes at the crucial situations.

MikeVic · 01-11-2010, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galaril

I still can get over how much the Ravens dominated the Pats especially in the running game and on the defensive side of the ball. I know Brady apparently has been banged up with broken ribs or something but really it was less about the Pats playing poorly as it was the Ravens making them look so bad.

I don't know, Flacco's stellar line makes me lean towards it being Pats playing poorly. Yeah, Ravens played well too, but I don't think you can overlook Welker being gone and Brady having all those injuries.

flere-imsaho · 01-11-2010, 10:16 AM

According to Peter King, the reason why the Jets' punter didn't play wasn't merely because he "felt ill", but because he was found to have a racing and irregular heartbeat just prior to the game.

So, a little less mystery there.

flounder · 01-11-2010, 10:21 AM

Jason Statham didn't let an irregular heartbeat stop him in Crank: High Voltage. Rub some dirt on it and get out there and play!

01-10-2010, 07:09 PM	#458
Cringer Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Edinburg,TX	Fuck. I'm going to bed now. __________________ You Stole Fizzy Lifting drinks! You bumped into the ceiling which now has to be washed and steralized, so you get NOTHING! You lose!

01-10-2010, 07:49 PM	#481
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Ugh... __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

01-10-2010, 07:07 PM	#456
tucker rocky Pro Rookie Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Of no particular interest	Early prediction for Arz/NO: 63-60 NO in OT, Carney with a winning FG from a chip-shot spot. Rackers will have an opp, but miss badly.

01-10-2010, 07:14 PM	#462
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	The helmet to helmet on the previous was definitely a penalty the way they call it nowadays but the ref was looking at the hold on the ground and throwing the flag. Unfortunate for the Pack. I'd love to hear what the correct call should have been on the facemask because I can see a bunch of ways it could go. My logical guess is personal foul, 15 yards but the Cardinals take possession because the ball was already loose, but I have absolutely no idea.

01-10-2010, 07:14 PM	#463
Wolfpack Pro Rookie Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Raleigh, NC	Hm. Initially I would have thought it was incidental since the ball was up by Rogers's head and going for the ball would have made it hard not to make contact with the facemask, but looking at it again, he doesn't really let go once he's made contact and does use it to help leverage Rogers away from the ball. Blown call, but unreviewable so nothing to be done for it, much like what happened in the San Diego-Colorado playoff game in MLB back in '07 where Holliday was declared safe even though all the replays eventually showed he never tagged home.

01-10-2010, 07:14 PM	#464
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	yeah that was really a facemask there.

01-10-2010, 07:22 PM	#465
Drake assmaster Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Bloomington, IN	Arizona winning always makes me smile because I know Thomkal will be happy. It's like watching a kid on Christmas morning.

01-10-2010, 07:26 PM	#467
Dr. Sak Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Stuck in Yinzerville, PA	I actually didn't see the play so I am going off what has been said. I'm assuming the facemask did not cause the fumble and happened while the ball was loose. That being said it would still be Arizona's ball but they would be penalized 15 yards from basic spot, and in this case it would be the end of the run.

01-10-2010, 07:30 PM	#469
jbergey22 Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Minnesota	Lines for next week are Chargers -9 42.5 Colts -6.5 44.5 New Orleans -7 56.5 Minnesota -2.5 46.5 Loving the Vikings/Cowboys under at first glance

01-10-2010, 07:47 PM	#480
tucker rocky Pro Rookie Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Of no particular interest	GB/Arz 1-10-2010 "The Shootout in the Desert" "The Good, The Bad, The Fumble" Anybody think of some more?

01-10-2010, 07:51 PM	#482
Dr. Sak Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Stuck in Yinzerville, PA	I will say this...I was watching the youtube clip of the replay. He does hit the facemask but is the pull down on the bottom part of his mask or the neck of the shoulder pads? I can see why the call was missed (if it was indeed missed). The Referee is throwing his bag for the fumble spot and he's really the only one who will see it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXhyA3a-WlY

01-10-2010, 07:57 PM	#483
jbergey22 Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Minnesota	Looked like he got the facemask right away then let go and got the shoulder pad. Hard to get a clear look though.

01-10-2010, 08:39 PM	#484
RainMaker General Manager Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	THE CURSE OF FAVRE

01-10-2010, 10:46 PM	#486
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	There was some really shitty horsecollar tackle called later in the game. Now I understand why that's a rule, because Roy Williams was intentionally trying to hurt people. But the call on Arizona was pretty poor.

01-11-2010, 01:54 AM	#490
Front Office Midget High School Varsity Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Manitowoc, Wisconsin	Ugh... what an emotional game. I can't believe I gave up on this game in the 3rd quarter and then all the sudden the Packers came back! Truly an unforgettable game. Oh well... I guess I'll cheer for the Vikings the rest of the way.

01-11-2010, 08:58 AM	#495
Galaril Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2004	I still can get over how much the Ravens dominated the Pats especially in the running game and on the defensive side of the ball. I know Brady apparently has been banged up with broken ribs or something but really it was less about the Pats playing poorly as it was the Ravens making them look so bad.

01-11-2010, 09:56 AM	#496
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	I agree RedKingGold that a penalty should have been called on that play and probably the one before it too with the head to head of the QB hit on Rodgers. But if Rodgers had hit a wide open Jennings on the first play of overtime, the game would have been over already. And then he probably held on to the ball too long on the play where he fumbled. So yes Packer fans have a right to be angry at the officials, but they should be angry at Rodgers too for his play in overtime. It's too bad really that such a great game had to end on such a controversial play.

01-11-2010, 10:07 AM	#497
BrianD Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	I don't think we Packer fans have a right to be angry. Disappointed maybe, but not angry. While the last two plays contained penalties that should have been called, neither caused Green Bay to lose the game. The only thing that would have resulted from calling the penalty on the last play was nullifying a mistake. I don't feel that you can ever blame the refs for not nullifying a mistake. If you want to win, you have to avoid those mistakes at the crucial situations.

01-11-2010, 10:16 AM	#499
flere-imsaho Coordinator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Chicagoland	According to Peter King, the reason why the Jets' punter didn't play wasn't merely because he "felt ill", but because he was found to have a racing and irregular heartbeat just prior to the game. So, a little less mystery there.

01-11-2010, 10:21 AM	#500
flounder High School Varsity Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Lynchburg, VA	Jason Statham didn't let an irregular heartbeat stop him in Crank: High Voltage. Rub some dirt on it and get out there and play!

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