US Soldiers: No baths without baptisms!

[JPhillips]

From the Miamai Herald. I don't even know how to express my anger at this. Not only should soldiers not have to except a baptism to get a bath, what the hell does this guy do with Jewish or Muslim soldiers? Do they just get a big, "Accept Jesus or be dirty you pagan. God bless!"


Army chaplain offers baptisms, baths

BY MEG LAUGHLIN
[email protected]

CAMP BUSHMASTER, Iraq - In this dry desert world near Najaf, where the Army V Corps combat support system sprawls across miles of scabrous dust, there's an oasis of sorts: a 500-gallon pool of pristine, cool water.

It belongs to Army chaplain Josh Llano of Houston, who sees the water shortage, which has kept thousands of filthy soldiers from bathing for weeks, as an opportunity.

''It's simple. They want water. I have it, as long as they agree to get baptized,'' he said.

And agree they do. Every day, soldiers take the plunge for the Lord and come up clean for the first time in weeks.

''They do appear physically and spiritually cleansed,'' Llano said.

First, though, the soldiers have to go to one of Llano's hour-and-a-half sermons in his dirt-floor tent. Then the baptism takes an hour of quoting from the Bible.

''Regardless of their motives,'' Llano said, ``I get the chance to take them closer to the Lord.'

[damnMikeBrown]

This can't be real. Having been in the Army, the chaplains were a function of the military. They acted non-denominationally, and as a kind ear, counsellor, or confessor. Not only do I not believe that a Company Commander would tolerate his troops to be hijacked for 2 1/2 hours, but the idea that this military officer (chaplains are officers) somehow has procured 500 gallons of water, to be used in this manner, is ridiculous. I'd like to see said Commander when his men came back, some clean, some not, after a promised bath. The reason being religous discimination.

I appreciate fully the rise you got out of this. Got me too for a moment. It, simply put, is a profound exageration, or an outright lie. This one stinks like week old fish. I wouldn't believe it.

[JPhillips]

Well I did a bit more research on this . Meg Laughlin is actually a reporter for Knight-Ridder. This story has made the rounds of several US papers. I can't find much on Llano, but I have found his name on an evangelical mission website that denotes him as a chaplain. This doesn't prove the story, but there is at least some factual basis.

I found the second half of this story as well. This is from the original Knight-Ridder story.


A blue-eyed 32-year-old with an abundance of energy, Llano goes out every day to drum up grimy soldiers for his pool. He talks to truck drivers, tank drivers, computer specialists - anyone and everyone. He goes out to the combat zone to the fighting soldiers and the combat support soldiers who keep them in supplies.

"You have to be aggressive to help people find themselves in God," he said.

He calls himself a "Southern Baptist evangelist," and justifies the war and killing with a verse from the Gospel of Matthew, which he often recites: "Give unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and unto God the things that are God's."

"This means we are called upon by our government to fight and that is giving unto Caesar, as the Bible tells us," he said.

Earlier this week, word went out that portable showers might be installed here soon, but Llano was undaunted.

"There is no fruit out here, and I have a stash of raisins, juice boxes and fruit rolls to pull out," he said optimistically.

[rexalllsc]

I would smack the guy and use his shower.

[GrantDawg]

If this guy is doing what this article says, it is pretty offensive.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally posted by GrantDawg
If this guy is doing what this article says, it is pretty offensive.

Agreed.

[RawIsDan]

I second Mike Brown on this, being an ex-squid. Chaplains don't do that. If this is true then he won't be doing it for long.

[sabotai]

There are reporters all over the place there (for TV news). I'd be interesting to see if any of them confirm this story or not and get actual footage of it. The first step would obviously to find this chaplain and ask him about it.

[tucker342]

If it's true, than that is fuckin sick...

[mrskippy]

I hope this guy isn't doing what's in the article. If a soldier wants water you give him his water. And later if a soldier wants the Gospel, you give him the Gospel. If the chaplain invites a troop, without condition, to his service that's fine as well.

Time, I believe, had pictures of troops being baptized in the field (with a makeshift baptismal). It was a montage of spirituality in the field and covered the bases.

Again, I hope this guy is doing is job right and not putting conditions on people.

BTW, when we had the thread about the prayer cards. Apparently a Jewish organization sent out mini Sedar kits. Passover starts here in the coming days. I noticed in Time, one soldier with a Jewish head cover (in camaflouge of course).

However many Jewish soldiers requested that their notation of being a Jew is removed from dog tags, for fear of retribution from an Iraqi. I guess some Christians have done the same.

[mrskippy]

Here's the link to The Miami Herald article:

Army chaplain offers baptisms, baths

[JPhillips]

Here's an update from the Houston Chronicle. It looks as if the Army is going to get to the bottom of this.



A chaplain from Houston assigned to the Army V Corps support unit in Iraq is now the focus of an Army inquiry for his practice of offering soldiers a dip into his 500-gallon pool if they agree to be baptized.

A newspaper article about Josh Llano, 32, generated numerous e-mails and phone calls, said Lt. Col. Eric Wester, a chaplain and spokesman for the Chaplain Corps based in Virginia.

Wester said the article, and the response, got the immediate attention of the corps' chief, Maj. Gen. Gaylord T. Gunhus, who has requested that top chaplain officials looked into whether the article was accurate.

"The chief was immediately concerned about the nature of this article and negative reflection that it casts," Wester said. "The question then arose to what degree is the information in the article accurate. The content of the article clearly raises immediate questions."

One question is how did the chaplain get access to 500 gallons of water, which Wester said was "unusually large" for a baptismal pool.

Also, the article indicated that a water shortage kept the soldiers from bathing for weeks. Wester said he was not sure whether the unit Llano is assigned to indeed lacks water.

He said the unit is supposed to be a support unit whose mission is to resupply troops. Wester also noted that chaplains do not typically receive their own supply of water.

Wester would not say what punishment, if any, could be taken if Llano indeed did do what the article described. He said the chief wants more information before any action is taken.

He said Gunhus' response can be read two ways.

"It's good in the sense that it shows his commitment to the standards we have about free exercise of religion," Wester said. "It's bad because it's bringing very negative public perception on Army chaplaincy."

Monday's Miami Herald article described how Llano required the soldiers to first listen to an 1 1/2-hour sermon in his dirt-floor tent. The actual baptism took an hour as Llano read from the Bible.

Llano, who described himself in the article as a Southern Baptist evangelist, was quoted as saying: "You have to be aggressive to help people find themselves in God."

Wester said, "As I've read the article and discussed with other chaplains, the implication of the story is this was a kind of situation of coercion or bribery."

The story generated outrage online -- one person who posted a message on one Web site described the article as "disturbing." Another unidentified person posted a letter addressed to Gunhus that cited the Army's requirement that chaplains be "sensitive to religious pluralism and be able to provide for the free exercise of religion."

"It is my hope and my request that you will take immediate action to put an end to Chaplain Llano's tactics and remind him of his obligation," the e-mail stated.

Wester said many of the e-mails to Gunhus echoed the same sentiment and seemed to read like a chain letter. He said chaplains are required to abide by the First Amendment right of freedom of religion.

"It's very important and absolutely critical chaplains uphold the highest standard in terms of respect for not only performing rites and sacraments of their own faith, but providing for religious needs of all in that area of operation," Wester said.

He could not answer how long Llano has served as a chaplain or provide other details about his background.

[GrantDawg]

What kills me about this is if this guy gets court-martialed for this, he is going to become a "hero" among some as someone who was persecuted for his faith. It is guys like this (if this is true, again this might all be a gross exaggeration) that hurts the cause of Christ more than anything a non-Christian can do.

[mrskippy]

Originally posted by GrantDawg
What kills me about this is if this guy gets court-martialed for this, he is going to become a "hero" among some as someone who was persecuted for his faith. It is guys like this (if this is true, again this might all be a gross exaggeration) that hurts the cause of Christ more than anything a non-Christian can do.

I agree.

There's nothing wrong with chaplains or sharing the Gospel with troops in the field. To bring someone to salvation is a wonderful thing, something i'm sure GrantDawg and SkyDog can both agree with.

But to do what this guy did (if he did) is sickening. To set these alleged conditions on getting a bath, food, or anything is wrong.

And a 500-gallon baptismal does seem like much. Immersion baptisms don't require much.

A baptismal also can double as a pool if necessary. To this day, the Jordan River is still used for baptisms. And it's not the cleanest of rivers and is used for for more than sacred purposes.

Of course, the baptisms also can (and probably should) wait until after the war.

As a Southern Baptist, this minister should know that baptism isn't a credential for salvation (OK, some churches do believe it is). It's more symbolic than anything.

But a Christian soldier, who wasn't baptised, and dies in battle goes to Heaven ... with or without baptism.