What does Turkey have to gain by going into Iraq?

GoldenEagle · 03-22-2003, 01:48 AM

For those of you under rock, Turkey has sent a good number of trrops into Nothern Iraq. Now what is their thinking? The Kurds and Turks dont get along and hostillites could break out. Is Turkey trying to gain territory from Iraq? Surely the Turks that the US have the situation under control and dont need any help.

Thoughts?

GoldenEagle · 03-22-2003, 01:51 AM

Dola. Turkey says they want to stop potential attacks from terriorists and stop refuges from going into Turkey.

I just dont buy it.

Chief Rum · 03-22-2003, 01:59 AM

My understanding is that Turkey has long claimed much of northern Iraq as theirs historically. I believe this is an attempt at a landgrab. The reason they have problems with the Kurds is exactly the reason that Turkey has laid claim to Kurdish lands.

The U.S. has warned Turkey of the potential for dire consequences of they make more than small moves across the border with Iraq, but I don't know if we cut a deal at all to get Turkey's air space.

Chief Rum

Anthony · 03-22-2003, 02:04 AM

they don't want the Kurds to get control of some oil fields and use those to barter sovereignity for their own land. Turkey wants to effectively stop them from trying to declare their own state. i'm thinking this is Turkish payback for us not giving them the economic package they wanted.

what does that say about the French when a country like Turkey commits troops to the war effort?

Anthony · 03-22-2003, 02:09 AM

from CNN.com:

"He made no mention of what has been considered another Turkish concern: that if Iraqi President Saddam Hussein is toppled, Kurds in northern Iraq would gain control of Iraqi oil fields and use them as leverage to create an independent Kurdish territory that might stretch into Kurdish areas of southeastern Turkey."

GoldenEagle · 03-22-2003, 02:22 AM

I would guess that Kurds will have a voice when and if a new regime comes about in Iraq. But I can see why they would want to start their own state.

I tend to agree with Chief, I think its an attempt at a land grab. Certaintly the UN will object to this. It should be interesting to see how Turkey and the US play it out

ISiddiqui · 03-22-2003, 02:23 AM

Well, its the obvious answer , the Turks don't like the Kurds, don't want to see a Kurdistan rise up (or the rise of Kurdish nationalism), so they want to put down any chance of a pro-Kurdish movement. They saw what happened with Kosovo, they don't want another one.

Oh, and it most definetly is NOT a land grab. That would be an idiotic move (it'd never work). The Turks don't want MORE Kurds, but want to stop the ones that will be around in the aftermath to rise the flag of Kurdistan and talk about the nation of the Kurds.

cthomer5000 · 03-22-2003, 07:07 AM

this is why that animated thing someone posted a few days ago wasn't so outrageous. This really has the potential to snowball into a disastorous middle-east scenario.

Alf · 03-22-2003, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cthomer5000
This really has the potential to snowball into a disastorous middle-east scenario.

How surprising would that be ?

ACStrider · 03-22-2003, 07:56 AM

Update: latest reports are that Turkey has not entered Iraq as was originally thought

Tekneek · 03-22-2003, 08:00 AM

The Turks are looking to come across the border and kill some Kurds, to put it simply. The US government has looked the other way regarding much of the treatment of Kurds inside Turkey, while continuously harping on Saddam for what he has done to Kurds. It is those kinds of political games that have done a lot to contribute to the dislike people have for the US.

The insisting that Iraq become a democratic nation is another example of this. We are attacking them to give them that, but we will tolerate different kinds of governments in Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait because they are friendly to our government. Don't they understand these contradictions are going to be called out eventually? Apparently not, or they do not care to have a consistent and clear policy with regards to the entire world.

CAsterling · 03-22-2003, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tekneek
The US government has looked the other way regarding much of the treatment of Kurds inside Turkey, while continuously harping on Saddam for what he has done to Kurds.

Actually at the end of the first gulf war, the US tried to get the Kurds to overthrow Saddam, and gave them every assistance short of actual help. If my memory serves me correctly, when the Kurds got attacked by Saddam just after the war, Bush the elder ordered all allied troops out of the area just before the attack and allowed a massacre to occur.

I can't remember the exact details but I remember compliants of the British forces at being extracted 30 minutes before the attack occurred and not being allowed to assist.

Back to the actual subject, it wouldn't suprise me if/when Turkey does this, nor would a land grab by Syria and Iraq suprise me - winning the war might be easier than winning the aftermath.

The Afoci · 03-22-2003, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by GoldenEagle
I would guess that Kurds will have a voice when and if a new regime comes about in Iraq. But I can see why they would want to start their own state.

I could be wrong here, but I think the Kurds are the largest race of people without a country that they have a leading role in. So I suppose there are lots of Kurds that would like to make Kurdistan or something like that.

ACStrider · 03-22-2003, 10:04 AM

I think we really dropped the ball with the resistance in Iraq following the first Gulf conflict. Maybe you know something that I don't CA (I'll admit that on this topic I'm not to well read up on), but it seems that there were commitments that we didn't follow up on.

Tekneek · 03-22-2003, 11:43 AM

No real committments, just some implied ones.

03-22-2003, 01:51 AM	#2
GoldenEagle Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Little Rock, AR	Dola. Turkey says they want to stop potential attacks from terriorists and stop refuges from going into Turkey. I just dont buy it. __________________ Xbox 360 Gamer Tag: GoldenEagle014

03-22-2003, 01:59 AM	#3
Chief Rum Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Where Hip Hop lives	My understanding is that Turkey has long claimed much of northern Iraq as theirs historically. I believe this is an attempt at a landgrab. The reason they have problems with the Kurds is exactly the reason that Turkey has laid claim to Kurdish lands. The U.S. has warned Turkey of the potential for dire consequences of they make more than small moves across the border with Iraq, but I don't know if we cut a deal at all to get Turkey's air space. Chief Rum __________________ . . I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.

03-22-2003, 02:22 AM	#6
GoldenEagle Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Little Rock, AR	I would guess that Kurds will have a voice when and if a new regime comes about in Iraq. But I can see why they would want to start their own state. I tend to agree with Chief, I think its an attempt at a land grab. Certaintly the UN will object to this. It should be interesting to see how Turkey and the US play it out __________________ Xbox 360 Gamer Tag: GoldenEagle014

03-22-2003, 02:23 AM	#7
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Well, its the obvious answer , the Turks don't like the Kurds, don't want to see a Kurdistan rise up (or the rise of Kurdish nationalism), so they want to put down any chance of a pro-Kurdish movement. They saw what happened with Kosovo, they don't want another one. Oh, and it most definetly is NOT a land grab. That would be an idiotic move (it'd never work). The Turks don't want MORE Kurds, but want to stop the ones that will be around in the aftermath to rise the flag of Kurdistan and talk about the nation of the Kurds. __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams Last edited by ISiddiqui : 03-22-2003 at 02:25 AM.

03-22-2003, 07:56 AM	#10
ACStrider High School JV Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX	Update: latest reports are that Turkey has not entered Iraq as was originally thought __________________ "I'm evil." "Oh you are not!" "Oh I am too." -- Brak

03-22-2003, 02:04 AM	#4
Anthony Banned Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Astoria, NY, USA	they don't want the Kurds to get control of some oil fields and use those to barter sovereignity for their own land. Turkey wants to effectively stop them from trying to declare their own state. i'm thinking this is Turkish payback for us not giving them the economic package they wanted. what does that say about the French when a country like Turkey commits troops to the war effort?

03-22-2003, 02:09 AM	#5
Anthony Banned Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Astoria, NY, USA	from CNN.com: "He made no mention of what has been considered another Turkish concern: that if Iraqi President Saddam Hussein is toppled, Kurds in northern Iraq would gain control of Iraqi oil fields and use them as leverage to create an independent Kurdish territory that might stretch into Kurdish areas of southeastern Turkey."

03-22-2003, 08:00 AM	#11
Tekneek Pro Rookie Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: USA	The Turks are looking to come across the border and kill some Kurds, to put it simply. The US government has looked the other way regarding much of the treatment of Kurds inside Turkey, while continuously harping on Saddam for what he has done to Kurds. It is those kinds of political games that have done a lot to contribute to the dislike people have for the US. The insisting that Iraq become a democratic nation is another example of this. We are attacking them to give them that, but we will tolerate different kinds of governments in Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait because they are friendly to our government. Don't they understand these contradictions are going to be called out eventually? Apparently not, or they do not care to have a consistent and clear policy with regards to the entire world.

03-22-2003, 10:04 AM	#14
ACStrider High School JV Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX	I think we really dropped the ball with the resistance in Iraq following the first Gulf conflict. Maybe you know something that I don't CA (I'll admit that on this topic I'm not to well read up on), but it seems that there were commitments that we didn't follow up on. __________________ "I'm evil." "Oh you are not!" "Oh I am too." -- Brak

03-22-2003, 11:43 AM	#15
Tekneek Pro Rookie Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: USA	No real committments, just some implied ones.

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