OT:Hattrick Training, Non-Poll Poll

mrushh · 02-26-2003, 03:47 AM

I don't really like the polls. I like reading opinions and helpful hints. Ergo, no poll, just discussion, hopefully, and help for those of us willing to learn from others.............

Training in Hattrick seems to be the thing that I may or may not be doing properly, so I thought (that could be the problem, thinking too much) maybe other players could benefit also from a discussion or just a posting of what others do.

So, what do you train, and why? Do you train to make your team better or to make players better to sell them? Do you train for GK, Def, Wing, MF, Stikers or what? Do you have a several week variant that you use to get the whole team some training, or stick with one thing? Ever do General? Stamina? You hopefully get the idea.

As for me, I have trained Playmaking every week, and it doesn't seem to do much good that is visible (hence, my desire to hear from y'all). I have done this training out of the belief that midfield is the key to a winning Hattrick team, which is what I have been told, but may also be a fallacy. I train for my team, not to sell, at least up to this point.

P.S.- Since I seem to be a natural born thread kill (never get too many replies to anything), pretend that ardent or someone that knows what they are dooing started this thread.

vex · 02-26-2003, 04:00 AM

I trained playmaking this season for a while, and will continue at the beginning of next season probably, but right now my team needs in in the little areas(stamina, form, passing). I agree that midfield is the key because if you don't have opportunities, you can't score.

Has your midfield improved star-wise since you started training playmaking? If so, then you're seeing results, just not in the form of them "popping". Just be patient I would guess.

3ric · 02-26-2003, 04:55 AM

How often do you get improvements from training? I had a guy whose playmaking went up to "outstanding" late last year. Since then, he's consistently been my best midfielder, but I've yet to see some improvement in that area from any of the other guys playing midfield who has had about as many games.

Is 8 weeks training about the minimum required time provided you have a passable coach?

vex · 02-26-2003, 05:08 AM

It's also according to how old he is. So yes, it can/will be longer.

vex · 02-26-2003, 05:14 AM

Oh, sorry, I read your question wrong.

Yeah, that's about the minimum, not sure on the exact.

condors · 02-26-2003, 07:06 AM

i would recommand training in stamina unless every player you are going to play is at least passable also remember to play your backups in friendlies else they won't get any results

vex · 02-26-2003, 07:09 AM

Doesn't training stamina decrease form?

the_meanstrosity · 02-26-2003, 08:00 AM

I train based on my formations (3-5-2 and 4-5-1) which means I have an opportunity to train UP TO 10 midfielders (3 inner mids at full and 2 wingers partially per game) with PLAYMAKING. I'll normally train playmaking for 5-7 weeks and then throw in a STAMINA or GENERAL for a couple of weeks.

It's slow going, but I've definitely shown some improvement in my midfielders play. A couple of my midfield youth pulls have even gotten pushed up to starters which has been a very pleasant surprise. So I'd say stick with it. You'll see improvement over time. And as another poster said, make sure you put some young guys at midfield for the friendlies.

Owner of the MoKan Mighty Bastards (70338)

QuikSand · 02-26-2003, 08:48 AM

I have heard elsewhere that the formula for "weeks needed to advance a full catgeyr by training" is as follows:

Weeks = (player's age - 10) + coach's ranks below "solid"

So, with a solid coach, a 17 y/o advances in 7 weeks, a 20 year old in 10, and so forth.

Players supposedly begin a gradual decline after age 27, so that factors in as well - meaning that older players may not advance at all, just stave off their decline.

I haven't played long enough to know if this holds true, but it's probably at least in the ballpark.

- - -

FWIW, I have been training playmaking, but probably unwisely so, as I have just bee churning my players this year - I probably should be training passing or stamina, just to boost player vaolues more quickly. I don't have too many players that are "keepers" for my long upward haul ahead.

QuikSand · 02-26-2003, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by the_meanstrosity
I train based on my formations (3-5-2 and 4-5-1) which means I have an opportunity to train UP TO 10 midfielders (3 inner mids at full and 2 wingers partially per game) with PLAYMAKING. I'll normally train playmaking for 5-7 weeks and then throw in a STAMINA or GENERAL for a couple of weeks.

I thought playmaking only trained your inner midfielders, and not your wingers (meaning you're training up to 6, not 10) I could be wrong, though.

the_meanstrosity · 02-26-2003, 09:07 AM

From the HATTRICK rules:

Playmaking IMPROVES Midfield
which includes:
Inner midfielders
(Wingers)
((Others))

Brackets indicate small effects. Double brackets indicate very small effects.

As I noted above, the wingers will get partial training. So you could potentially have 6 inner mids trained fully and 4 wingers trained partially in a 5 midfield formation. Plus OTHERS will get trained minimally.

Aylmar · 02-26-2003, 09:13 AM

Here's the training breakdown that I use:

skill/weeks
Goalkeeper 5
Defending 8
Playmaking 7
Scoring 6-7
Winger 7
Passing 6
those values are for players aged 17-19 years and at a training intensity of 100%. each additional year of age should add one week to the values provided above.

The chart also says that each level below solid for a coach adds a week.

Here's the URL...lots of (to me) useful information...

http://www.databased.at/hattrick/index.asp

Edited to make the link live...

Poli · 02-26-2003, 09:56 AM

I train forwards, because my best youth players are forwards. I plan on selling my backups Vien-Van and Vang once they hit solid.

I haven't been training scoring for an extremely long time, but I have for almost this entire season.

Last season I trained playmaking most of the season, and saw three improvements...including Jerome Bettis.

When I first started, I trained form. I did this because every team in my division was new. Every team. I felt that if I trained form and got immediate results, I would have a leg up on the competition. I did, and I feel that helped me win D5.92 last season.

During the off weeks this upcoming season, I'll train stamina. For the first two weeks of the regular season, I'll train form. After that, I'll probably go back to scoring, however, Horned has me thinking of passing for two weeks.

Regardless, I train scoring to improve my two stars, and to sell off youth players.

DataKing · 02-26-2003, 10:09 AM

The link that Aylmar posted has a lot of useful information. I use it frequently.

As any of you who have read my dynasty report will surely recall, I train defending. I do this because I am defensive-minded, and chose to build my team with a "back-to-front" philosophy. My training program is definitely a long-term one, and I intend to train defenders for a full four seasons (I am nearly halfway done). By the time I am finished, my starting defenders should all be either formidable (9) or outstanding (10), and putting up roughly four stars each.

I train defending primarily to improve my team, but with the possibility of making some long-term money as well. I run a 3-5-2 formation during league matches, and 5-4-1 in friendly matches. This means that I train eight defenders, but I will only need six once the training program is complete. I will keep the six best that I have then (3 starters and 3 backups) and sell the remaining two.

Once I am done with defensive training, I will most likely move to training playmaking to boost my midfield.

My training has been almost exclusively defending, but I have trained stamina and general on occasion. The off-season is a popular time to train stamina. During the off-season, you only play a friendly match (unless you have a qualifier), so you can only train 11 players. Stamina is a popular choice because players do not need to play a match in order to receive stamina training. If you train stamina for a week, every player will receive training, whether or not they play in a match.

Stamina training tends to do some damage to your team's form, but not extensive damage. Alot of people do a week of general training right after stamina training to help counteract this. I have done this a couple of times, but only if the damage to form from stamina training was particularly bad.

dacman · 02-26-2003, 10:13 AM

Good input, everyone.

I have a question. What intensity do you use?

I've read on the HT forums that 90+# of physios is a good formula to use. Does it help a lot to get intensity higher? Or would it be a waste of money to hire 10 physios and train 100% (if it doesn't kill your team with injuries).

Poli · 02-26-2003, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DataKing

My training has been almost exclusively defending, but I have trained stamina and general on occasion. The off-season is a popular time to train stamina. During the off-season, you only play a friendly match (unless you have a qualifier), so you can only train 11 players. Stamina is a popular choice because players do not need to play a match in order to receive stamina training. If you train stamina for a week, every player will receive training, whether or not they play in a match.

Stamina training tends to do some damage to your team's form, but not extensive damage. Alot of people do a week of general training right after stamina training to help counteract this. I have done this a couple of times, but only if the damage to form from stamina training was particularly bad.

Very good point! I forgot to mention that during my post. That's why I train stamina during the offseason.

Dacman, I have 5 physios and train 100%. I have heard the formula you mentioned before. I don't feel I have enough injuries to warrant hiring more physios. I believe my team is doing just fine as is.

vex · 02-26-2003, 10:24 AM

I use 100. I started out with 92 or 95. I increased that gradually and haven't noticed any difference injury-wise.

DataKing · 02-26-2003, 10:24 AM

I currently have 7 physios on my payroll, and train at 97% intensity. Last season I had 3 physios and trained at 93% intensity, and I can see the difference. But at the same time, you don't want to hire more physios than you can realistically afford.

Also, training at 97% intensity, I have noticed that I have had very few injuries this season. Perhaps there is a bit of luck involved in that, but I have been amazed at how infrequently my players have been hurt.

I intend to hire 3 more physios and go to 100% intensity next season.

Aylmar · 02-26-2003, 10:27 AM

I train defending exclusively...except the offseason, when I do a little stamina work. I run the 5-4-1 in both types of matches, but I am currently working on getting my experience up with the 4-51 so that I can start using it in league play (I am competitive with the 5-4-1, I just feel as if I need to change things up a bit).

I've been training at 100% intensity since I took over the team and I don't believe that I've had any serious injury issues in that time frame. There has been a player here and there, but nothing serious or often enough to make me bump down my training intensity (I only have two Physios on staff and one Doctor).

Coffee Warlord · 02-26-2003, 10:33 AM

My current training schedule is playmaking. I'll be training that through the remainder of the season (took 1 week for a stamina break). Offseason, stamina.

My current plan is to go a few weeks of passing in the beginning of next season, and then either switch back to playmaking, or work on scoring. Prolly playmaking.

Poli · 02-26-2003, 10:35 AM

Run and shoot coaches should train scoring. Chicks dig goals.

Qwikshot · 02-26-2003, 11:57 AM

Will you have to scan over your players to see improvements, or will it be noted somewhere..?

Poli · 02-26-2003, 12:01 PM

You should be able to tell improvements from HAM, otherwise, get a pen and paper handy, it'll be a long day =-).

vex · 02-26-2003, 01:07 PM

Or put their skills in your team notes or a dynasty or word. Maybe even excel.

moriarty · 02-26-2003, 01:13 PM

Does the training have to occur in consecutive weeks?

Let's say it takes 7 weeks (or whatever) to go from inadeq. to solid defending. If I train defending for 3 weeks, stamina for 3 weeks, and defending for 4 weeks will I still get the 7 week 'pop' in skill?

Poli · 02-26-2003, 01:14 PM

Training from what I read doesn't have to be consecutive.

the_meanstrosity · 02-26-2003, 02:16 PM

Has anyone tried Absolut Manager yet? Not a bad utility...not as nice as HAM, but free, lol.

bbor · 02-26-2003, 03:09 PM

My team still sucks

daedalus · 02-26-2003, 03:57 PM

I originally trained defense a lot 'cuz I tend to approach sports (and, thus, sport games) that way. Once I had a decent core group of passables, I switched away from it to improve another area. I also trained playmaking quite a bit since a lot of my younger players at the beginning had skills matched that.

I did a lot of stamina at the beginning of this season, then a bit of general to bring form back to some normalcy. Currently training winger for a bit to get a few players up to passable and will be going back to either playmaking and passing soon.

02-26-2003, 04:55 AM	#3
3ric College Starter Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Sweden	How often do you get improvements from training? I had a guy whose playmaking went up to "outstanding" late last year. Since then, he's consistently been my best midfielder, but I've yet to see some improvement in that area from any of the other guys playing midfield who has had about as many games. Is 8 weeks training about the minimum required time provided you have a passable coach? __________________ San Diego Chargers (HFL) - Lappland Reindeers (WOOF) - Gothenburg Giants (IHOF) Indiana: A TCY VC - year 2044 - the longest running dynasty ever on FOFC!

02-26-2003, 07:06 AM	#6
condors College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000	what i am doing i would recommand training in stamina unless every player you are going to play is at least passable also remember to play your backups in friendlies else they won't get any results

02-26-2003, 09:13 AM	#12
Aylmar High School Varsity Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Los Angeles	Here's the training breakdown that I use: skill/weeks Goalkeeper 5 Defending 8 Playmaking 7 Scoring 6-7 Winger 7 Passing 6 those values are for players aged 17-19 years and at a training intensity of 100%. each additional year of age should add one week to the values provided above. The chart also says that each level below solid for a coach adds a week. Here's the URL...lots of (to me) useful information... http://www.databased.at/hattrick/index.asp Edited to make the link live... __________________ "At its best, football is still football, an amalgam of thought and violence, chess with broken bones and shredded ligaments." -- Dave Kindred Last edited by Aylmar : 02-26-2003 at 09:16 AM.

02-26-2003, 09:56 AM	#13
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	I train forwards, because my best youth players are forwards. I plan on selling my backups Vien-Van and Vang once they hit solid. I haven't been training scoring for an extremely long time, but I have for almost this entire season. Last season I trained playmaking most of the season, and saw three improvements...including Jerome Bettis. When I first started, I trained form. I did this because every team in my division was new. Every team. I felt that if I trained form and got immediate results, I would have a leg up on the competition. I did, and I feel that helped me win D5.92 last season. During the off weeks this upcoming season, I'll train stamina. For the first two weeks of the regular season, I'll train form. After that, I'll probably go back to scoring, however, Horned has me thinking of passing for two weeks. Regardless, I train scoring to improve my two stars, and to sell off youth players. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

02-26-2003, 10:09 AM	#14
DataKing Pro Rookie Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Chicago	The link that Aylmar posted has a lot of useful information. I use it frequently. As any of you who have read my dynasty report will surely recall, I train defending. I do this because I am defensive-minded, and chose to build my team with a "back-to-front" philosophy. My training program is definitely a long-term one, and I intend to train defenders for a full four seasons (I am nearly halfway done). By the time I am finished, my starting defenders should all be either formidable (9) or outstanding (10), and putting up roughly four stars each. I train defending primarily to improve my team, but with the possibility of making some long-term money as well. I run a 3-5-2 formation during league matches, and 5-4-1 in friendly matches. This means that I train eight defenders, but I will only need six once the training program is complete. I will keep the six best that I have then (3 starters and 3 backups) and sell the remaining two. Once I am done with defensive training, I will most likely move to training playmaking to boost my midfield. My training has been almost exclusively defending, but I have trained stamina and general on occasion. The off-season is a popular time to train stamina. During the off-season, you only play a friendly match (unless you have a qualifier), so you can only train 11 players. Stamina is a popular choice because players do not need to play a match in order to receive stamina training. If you train stamina for a week, every player will receive training, whether or not they play in a match. Stamina training tends to do some damage to your team's form, but not extensive damage. Alot of people do a week of general training right after stamina training to help counteract this. I have done this a couple of times, but only if the damage to form from stamina training was particularly bad. __________________ Current Games Diablo III (BattleTag: DataKing#1685) Allegiances: Chicago Bears - Detroit Red Wings - Kansas Jayhawks Awards: 2011 Golden Scribe - Other Sports Category (The Straight(away) and Narrow - A Forza Motorsport 3 Dynasty) Last edited by DataKing : 02-26-2003 at 10:11 AM.

02-26-2003, 04:00 AM	#2
vex Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tulsa	I trained playmaking this season for a while, and will continue at the beginning of next season probably, but right now my team needs in in the little areas(stamina, form, passing). I agree that midfield is the key because if you don't have opportunities, you can't score. Has your midfield improved star-wise since you started training playmaking? If so, then you're seeing results, just not in the form of them "popping". Just be patient I would guess.

02-26-2003, 05:08 AM	#4
vex Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tulsa	It's also according to how old he is. So yes, it can/will be longer.

02-26-2003, 05:14 AM	#5
vex Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tulsa	Oh, sorry, I read your question wrong. Yeah, that's about the minimum, not sure on the exact.

02-26-2003, 07:09 AM	#7
vex Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tulsa	Doesn't training stamina decrease form?

02-26-2003, 08:00 AM	#8
the_meanstrosity College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2002	I train based on my formations (3-5-2 and 4-5-1) which means I have an opportunity to train UP TO 10 midfielders (3 inner mids at full and 2 wingers partially per game) with PLAYMAKING. I'll normally train playmaking for 5-7 weeks and then throw in a STAMINA or GENERAL for a couple of weeks. It's slow going, but I've definitely shown some improvement in my midfielders play. A couple of my midfield youth pulls have even gotten pushed up to starters which has been a very pleasant surprise. So I'd say stick with it. You'll see improvement over time. And as another poster said, make sure you put some young guys at midfield for the friendlies. Owner of the MoKan Mighty Bastards (70338)

02-26-2003, 08:48 AM	#9
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	I have heard elsewhere that the formula for "weeks needed to advance a full catgeyr by training" is as follows: Weeks = (player's age - 10) + coach's ranks below "solid" So, with a solid coach, a 17 y/o advances in 7 weeks, a 20 year old in 10, and so forth. Players supposedly begin a gradual decline after age 27, so that factors in as well - meaning that older players may not advance at all, just stave off their decline. I haven't played long enough to know if this holds true, but it's probably at least in the ballpark. - - - FWIW, I have been training playmaking, but probably unwisely so, as I have just bee churning my players this year - I probably should be training passing or stamina, just to boost player vaolues more quickly. I don't have too many players that are "keepers" for my long upward haul ahead.

02-26-2003, 09:07 AM	#11
the_meanstrosity College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2002	From the HATTRICK rules: Playmaking IMPROVES Midfield which includes: Inner midfielders (Wingers) ((Others)) Brackets indicate small effects. Double brackets indicate very small effects. As I noted above, the wingers will get partial training. So you could potentially have 6 inner mids trained fully and 4 wingers trained partially in a 5 midfield formation. Plus OTHERS will get trained minimally.

02-26-2003, 10:13 AM	#15
dacman College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: speak to the trout	Good input, everyone. I have a question. What intensity do you use? I've read on the HT forums that 90+# of physios is a good formula to use. Does it help a lot to get intensity higher? Or would it be a waste of money to hire 10 physios and train 100% (if it doesn't kill your team with injuries). __________________ No signatures allowed.

02-26-2003, 10:24 AM	#17
vex Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tulsa	I use 100. I started out with 92 or 95. I increased that gradually and haven't noticed any difference injury-wise.

02-26-2003, 10:27 AM	#19
Aylmar High School Varsity Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Los Angeles	I train defending exclusively...except the offseason, when I do a little stamina work. I run the 5-4-1 in both types of matches, but I am currently working on getting my experience up with the 4-51 so that I can start using it in league play (I am competitive with the 5-4-1, I just feel as if I need to change things up a bit). I've been training at 100% intensity since I took over the team and I don't believe that I've had any serious injury issues in that time frame. There has been a player here and there, but nothing serious or often enough to make me bump down my training intensity (I only have two Physios on staff and one Doctor). __________________ "At its best, football is still football, an amalgam of thought and violence, chess with broken bones and shredded ligaments." -- Dave Kindred

02-26-2003, 10:33 AM	#20
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	My current training schedule is playmaking. I'll be training that through the remainder of the season (took 1 week for a stamina break). Offseason, stamina. My current plan is to go a few weeks of passing in the beginning of next season, and then either switch back to playmaking, or work on scoring. Prolly playmaking.

02-26-2003, 10:35 AM	#21
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	Run and shoot coaches should train scoring. Chicks dig goals. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

02-26-2003, 11:57 AM	#22
Qwikshot Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: ...down the gravity well	Will you have to scan over your players to see improvements, or will it be noted somewhere..? __________________ "General Woundwort's body was never found. It could be that he still lives his fierce life somewhere else, but from that day on, mother rabbits would tell their kittens that if they did not do as they were told, the General would get them. Such was Woundwort's monument, and perhaps it would not have displeased him." Watership Down, Richard Adams

02-26-2003, 12:01 PM	#23
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	You should be able to tell improvements from HAM, otherwise, get a pen and paper handy, it'll be a long day =-). __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

02-26-2003, 01:07 PM	#24
vex Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tulsa	Or put their skills in your team notes or a dynasty or word. Maybe even excel.

02-26-2003, 01:13 PM	#25
moriarty College Starter Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: A negative place	Does the training have to occur in consecutive weeks? Let's say it takes 7 weeks (or whatever) to go from inadeq. to solid defending. If I train defending for 3 weeks, stamina for 3 weeks, and defending for 4 weeks will I still get the 7 week 'pop' in skill? Last edited by moriarty : 02-26-2003 at 01:13 PM.

02-26-2003, 01:14 PM	#26
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	Training from what I read doesn't have to be consecutive. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

02-26-2003, 02:16 PM	#27
the_meanstrosity College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2002	Has anyone tried Absolut Manager yet? Not a bad utility...not as nice as HAM, but free, lol.

02-26-2003, 03:09 PM	#28
bbor Pro Starter Join Date: May 2001 Location: toronto	My team still sucks __________________ Pumpy Tudors Now that I've cracked and made that admission, I wonder if I'm only a couple of steps away from wanting to tongue-kiss Jaromir Jagr and give Bobby Clarke a blowjob.

02-26-2003, 03:57 PM	#29
daedalus Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	I originally trained defense a lot 'cuz I tend to approach sports (and, thus, sport games) that way. Once I had a decent core group of passables, I switched away from it to improve another area. I also trained playmaking quite a bit since a lot of my younger players at the beginning had skills matched that. I did a lot of stamina at the beginning of this season, then a bit of general to bring form back to some normalcy. Currently training winger for a bit to get a few players up to passable and will be going back to either playmaking and passing soon.

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