2012-13 NBA Regular Season Thread, Feel the Heat

[HeavyReign]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

You can have the Clippers?

Deal?

[HeavyReign]

The problem here is Hansen/Ballmer were straightforward with their intentions. If they did what Bennett did with the Sonics the sale would already be approved and they'd be moving after next year. Its been thrown out that maybe they do that anyways by trying to get the sale to go through still as I mentioned above or with the Maloofs who knows. Sounds like expansion won't get any discussion until 2015 when they start negotiating the next TV deal. That's really the only way a team is coming at this point. So frustrating. I'll probably take a few days of avoiding anything to do with the NBA so not much happening on a programming front right now.

[Young Drachma]

Seattle group raises bid on Sacramento Kings to $625*million | SI Tracking Blog – Tracking MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL, and NCAA On Twitter

Hansen and company raise bid to $625m

Days before the final owner vote, the Seattle group raised their bid on the Kings to $625 million. Chris Hansen, the leader of the Seattle group, announced he was raising his offer for 65 percent of the Kings from $358 million to $406 million, bringing the total bid of the Seattle investors from $550 million to $625 million.

I think the idea here is simple. He figures even if Stern and Co. ramrod the Sacramento bid through despite it's stupidity (but publicly financed arena) that the owners won't be able to resist what amounts to an expansion fee for a Supersonics team that starts next year.

He's basically banking on their greed and calling their bluff. I like it.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/92...gs-625-million

This ESPN article has more depth, including apparently Sacramento forfeiting revenue sharing money by keeping the team there, while you have Hansen saying that he'd end up paying into it.

[dawgfan]

My read on this is Hansen & Co. are going all out to expose the anti-trust behavior of the league, with the intent of essentially blackmailing them into granting them an expansion team. If they don't, Hansen will proceed with his purchase and sue the shit out of the league if they continue to interfere, knowing that the league is certain to lose and possibly exposing themselves to damages far beyond the specifics of this case.

The Maloofs are going to make out like bandits either way, because with the binding purchase agreement already in place, they should have legal standing to demand their 67% share of the now $625M total valuation offer. I can't say I'm happy that these d-bags will benefit from this power struggle between Seattle and the NBA, but, whatever.

I really can't see any reason the league wouldn't opt to just cave and award Hansen an expansion team given the financial commitment his group is willing to make, other than spite. I'm sure Stern hates with every fiber of his being facing a guy with as much balls as he does, and someone who probably has the upper hand. He doesn't strike me as a guy that enjoys losing.

[Young Drachma]

Yeah, seems fitting he's going out of the door now. But akin to Bettman returning the Jets to Winnipeg and showing up there, this will be Stern's chance to do the same. I am curious to see how Durant will be received the first time he arrives to town with OKC.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

Yeah, seems fitting he's going out of the door now. But akin to Bettman returning the Jets to Winnipeg and showing up there, this will be Stern's chance to do the same. I am curious to see how Durant will be received the first time he arrives to town with OKC.

As much as it would pain me to have to acknowledge the existence of the Oklahoma City team, I have no ill will towards the players. Durant was our guy, and he should have been Seattle's superstar. I can't hold it against him that Howard Schultz was such a raging asshole that he sold the team to out of town franchise thieves without thoroughly vetting the locals for a group that would keep the Sonics in town.

[Young Drachma]

Sources -- Maloof family cuts new deal for Sacramento Kings - ESPN

Maloofs have a backup deal to sell the Ballmer/Hansen group 20% of the team if the main deal fails, which would enable the Maloofs to keep running the team in Sacto.

[Jon]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

Sources -- Maloof family cuts new deal for Sacramento Kings - ESPN

Maloofs have a backup deal to sell the Ballmer/Hansen group 20% of the team if the main deal fails, which would enable the Maloofs to keep running the team in Sacto.

And the relocation committee is apparently going to meet again to consider the new offer, which includes a 125 million dollar relocation fee.

Hansen is going all hedge fund manager in this...

[Young Drachma]

Owners don't change stance on move of Sacramento Kings - ESPN

[korme]

What are the odds that we would actually get another expansion team? Alignment would be weird and Stern has been extremely adament about seeing no new teams in the near future.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by korme

What are the odds that we would actually get another expansion team? Alignment would be weird and Stern has been extremely adament about seeing no new teams in the near future.

Depends. From strictly a financial perspective, not sure if the math pencils out to add another team. Hansen is throwing a lot of money at the issue and would probably be willing to pony up a substantial expansion fee, and adding the Seattle market should raise the amount the league will get in their next TV deal (though probably not by a whole lot). Would it be enough to offset having one more team splitting the pot? Would it be worth the weird alignment and scheduling issues that would likely result?

On the other hand, the league is setting themselves up for a helluva lawsuit if they keep attempting to strong-arm the Maloofs. How afraid are they of going to court over all of this, and would they be willing to swallow their pride and blink, i.e. giving Hansen a team in one form or another?

[Groundhog]

I'm sort of torn on the whole thing. I would love a return of the Sonics and I think Seattle needs a team. Having said that, I would hate the Kings to leave town and drop the Kings name. I also don't really want to see expansion as I feel the last 5 years has seen some of the best basketball the league has seen in a long time, and it would be a shame to water that down with expansion.

So I don't know. I guess if I had to choose between expansion or Kings in Seattle, I'd vote for Kings in Seattle.

[Young Drachma]

One more team isn't going to make things exponentially worse and the NBA has done the odd numbered team thing for a while in the past. But it seems like Stern is doing the same thing Bettman did with keeping Phoenix in Phoenix despite how illogical that whole thing has turned out to be.

Seattle has basically had to sue for every team it currently has in the NFL (Seattle Kings debacle) and Mariners were the replacement after the Pilots up and ditched the city after one year. So it would be fitting that it'll take litigation to get a 3rd major league team back to the city that should usher an eventual return of the NHL there too.

But we'll see. Just can't see how they don't eventually end up with a team. But Stern won't be able to bully Hansen and that's becoming more apparent, even if the conventional wisdom is you don't want to piss off Chancellor Stern for fear of upsetting future chance at a team.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

But we'll see. Just can't see how they don't eventually end up with a team. But Stern won't be able to bully Hansen and that's becoming more apparent, even if the conventional wisdom is you don't want to piss off Chancellor Stern for fear of upsetting future chance at a team.

This is the part that entertains me the most. I know that nationally, there's a perception among some (many?) that Hansen is "bullying" the NBA, and that it's poor form for someone representing Seattle to be trying to steal a team from another city after going through the pain of losing the Sonics.

While I'm sympathetic to the stealing aspect, I find it laughable that anyone would frame this situation as Hansen "bullying" the NBA; or more accurately, that anyone would be offended by such. The NBA (as well as the other leagues, but none quite so aggressively) has lived off their ability to bully local governments into subsidizing their enterprises and making very rich men even more rich. So to see someone with the money and balls to turn the tables on Stern is terrifically entertaining.

[JonInMiddleGA]

How epic a fail is it if the Thunder don't even make the conference finals?

[Groundhog]

Well, without Westbrook it's not so epic a fail really. Reggie Jackson has a few moments of Westbrookness - mainly one nice dunk he had right down the middle of the key today - but Memphis are just too good for the one man show Thunder. Grizzlies are a bit of a darkhorse really... They can beat anyone in a 7 game series and even matchup pretty well with the Heat IMO.

[Crapshoot]

Also, Derek Fisher is just awful. Great turnover there. Karma is biting them in the ass via the Harden trade.

[Young Drachma]

Sources -- NBA owners back recommendation to keep Kings in Sacramento - ESPN

[Jon]

Stern apparently is also saying that any business deal between Maloofs and Hanson is dead. Next 24-48 hours he will work to "convince" the Maloofs to sell to Sacramento group.

[HeavyReign]

Not really a shock today. It is more about what happens next. Maloofs likely won't just accept 100m less on the valuation. That could still be messy even if Seattle isn't involved. Maloofs have already said they still hope to include Chris Hansen in a sale of the Kings. That would likely be the 20% option while they wait a year and see if the Sac Arena deal gets done or falls apart. There is still plenty of negotiation to go there with the non-binding arena term sheet.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Jon

Stern apparently is also saying that any business deal between Maloofs and Hanson is dead. Next 24-48 hours he will work to "convince" the Maloofs to sell to Sacramento group.

I'm no lawyer, but this sure screams lawsuit by the Maloofs.

[Young Drachma]

Report: Seattle group swallows pride, talks to NBA about expansion team | Seattle Sonics Blog - seattlepi.com

“It was conveyed to me that H&B (Hansen and Steve Ballmer) have told the Maloofs that they needed to take a few days to reconsider their position ahead of Wednesday,” Montemayor tweeted, “and that discussions surrounding expansion have now become a two way communication with H&B shifting their tone to returning the NBA … to Seattle by any available means.”

“My sources tell me that H&B took the day (Tuesday) to reach out and talk to NBA people they trust who made it clear they were rapidly losing the chance to own an NBA team,” Montemayor continued, “they were told expansion is a real option, they were told the Maloofs appear to be manipulating them.”

And a tad more from Montemayor: “My sources tell me the NBA has been talking about how to ‘shake Chris Hansen out of this trance’ for a month and that the Monday (committee) conference … call focused heavily on how to salvage H&B as an ownership group. While I do not know who did what specifically it was made clear to me … several NBA owners and executives put a lot of effort in to opening a new dialogue with Hansen and it worked.”

[dawgfan]

I'm sure the NBA would love to spin it as they've been pressuring H&B to stand down, but there's no doubt in my mind that they are the ones afraid of a lawsuit and looking for a way to avoid that. I'm sure they can placate H&B by promising an expansion team; where they are still running into problems (and why they likely are pissed at H&B) is that they are going to have to figure out a way to pay off the Maloofs so they don't sue. H&B raising their offers for the Kings has put the NBA in a tough spot.

[Desnudo]

I haven't been following the drama. Why does Stern have it in for Seattle?

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I haven't been following the drama. Why does Stern have it in for Seattle?

He reportedly got his nose bent out of shape when, lobbying on behalf of then-owner Howard Schultz, he got the cold shoulder from Washington State lawmakers.

Considering that the region had just finished spending roughly $1B of public money between building Safeco Field & Seahawks Stadium, and that KeyArena had just been renovated less than 10 years prior, it was rather understandable that lawmakers had stadium fatigue and were not really interested in giving another handout to a professional sports league.

[Young Drachma]

Sacramento-based group agrees to purchase Sacramento Kings, according to sources - ESPN

[dawgfan]

So were the Maloofs in on the fix the whole time? Obviously they benefited tremendously from Hansen's pursuit which drove up the pricetag of the Kings a great deal.

That said, I still have to think that they weren't happy to leave ~$70M or so on the table (whatever the actual difference was between Hansen's last offer and what Ranadive is actually willing to pay). Is Stern funneling them some extra money on the side to keep them from going to court? Did they promise to go along with whatever Stern negotiated, knowing that Stern would use the Hansen interest to drive up the return they'd get in selling the team?

It amazes me how brazen Stern & the NBA are about their cartel and anti-competitive practices, but if nobody is willing to raise a stink, it'll never change. Clearly Stern & the league have bully power over regions in their ability to yank franchises and manipulate which regions get teams. Maybe it will require lawmaker action from a region that has no hope of a franchise - a Senator from Vermont, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Wyoming, Montana, Alaska, etc - to step up and pursue anti-trust inquiries against the league.

Stern was able to extract money out of Sacramento's populace to fund a new arena (though we'll see if this latest arena deal succeeds where past efforts faltered), money that region probably can't afford, and a much worse deal for Sacramento residents than the proposed Seattle arena. This is exactly what he wants - continuing the precedence that municipalities have to subsidize on a significant level the operations of private NBA franchises for the enrichment of their owners.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

So were the Maloofs in on the fix the whole time? Obviously they benefited tremendously from Hansen's pursuit which drove up the pricetag of the Kings a great deal.

That said, I still have to think that they weren't happy to leave ~$70M or so on the table (whatever the actual difference was between Hansen's last offer and what Ranadive is actually willing to pay). Is Stern funneling them some extra money on the side to keep them from going to court? Did they promise to go along with whatever Stern negotiated, knowing that Stern would use the Hansen interest to drive up the return they'd get in selling the team?

It amazes me how brazen Stern & the NBA are about their cartel and anti-competitive practices, but if nobody is willing to raise a stink, it'll never change. Clearly Stern & the league have bully power over regions in their ability to yank franchises and manipulate which regions get teams. Maybe it will require lawmaker action from a region that has no hope of a franchise - a Senator from Vermont, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Wyoming, Montana, Alaska, etc - to step up and pursue anti-trust inquiries against the league.

Stern was able to extract money out of Sacramento's populace to fund a new arena (though we'll see if this latest arena deal succeeds where past efforts faltered), money that region probably can't afford, and a much worse deal for Sacramento residents than the proposed Seattle arena. This is exactly what he wants - continuing the precedence that municipalities have to subsidize on a significant level the operations of private NBA franchises for the enrichment of their owners.

Yes...They couldn't afford lawyers to fight the NBA, they are that strapped for cash... How can a league be anit-trust when the NFL is a non-porfit organization according to the laws (that's right, a 9 billion dollar industry is non-profit for tax purposes)... I really think Stern wants it to be someone else's problem. He won't be the one who has to answer the how can the NBA expand when you just had a labor contract which said everyone lost money.

Seattle can't get an expansion team after what happened last year... or can they...