Vanilla Flavored Werewolf-Villagers Win

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Had you wolves figured out who the cultist was prior to EF making it clear with his switch the other day?

EF was on my personal shortlist, but I think we both were leaning more toward Danny when I bought it. Not sure what brit thought right then or after that.

You had us fooled on seer. I thought both you and Autumn were vanilla.

[Zinto]

Sorry guys I like to make you wait

[Zinto]

There comes a complete consensus for the first time. After looking through the complete evidence you decide Britrock is the hopefully last member of the murderers. DaddyTorgo comes out and claims that he had searched through Brit's things and found plans that Chief Rum and Brit had made to execute their contract with We All Scream for Ice Cream. Specifically it points to letting fate decide the outcome of the finger as much as possible.

As everyone decides that Brit is the culprit, Eaglefan jumps up and tells Brit to run away. He is quickly backed into a corner where as fate strikes again he is hit with a stone scoop of ice cream on the head.

Quickly everyone chases down Brit and just as he is about to be caught you discover the recipe for the illusive chocolate ice cream! Torn between chasing after him and stopping to get the recipe you quickly realize that there is nothing more important then chocolate ice cream and you let Britrock get away.

Later everyone becomes millionaires for their awesome discovery....

Brit was a wolf

Villagers win

[Chief Rum]

Congrats village! I would have liked to give this a go without being offed by the tie vote, but it is what it is. When something fortuitous happened, you guys jumped on it and made it work for you.

I enjoyed wolfing with you, brit!

And thank you, Zinto. I enjoyed the game and theme.

[Chief Rum]

Oh, Zinto, what were the exact tie rules, and how far did you set them out prior to the game? I wouldn't have blamed you for not having more than one tiebreaker rule, as it is rare to have even one in a game at all.

To have three is just, well, mystifying.

[Autumn]

Phew. I was a bit worried this morning because I honestly had forgotten that the cultist didn't know who the wolves were. I had based my vote largely on the fact that there was no one who could be cultist if DT was a wolf, but I hadn't really thought enough about a confused cultist. Glad that wasn't the case.

Great game Danny and DT. I get worried whenever Danny starts making too much sense, unfortunately his wolf rep undermines his villager skills. But you guys had it nailed.

[path12]

Yay! Enjoyed the game Zinto, thanks for putting it together.

[EagleFan]

Thanks for the game.

Hated not knowing the wolves. I had no idea if I should break that tie for DT or not that night and then screwed up forgetting about the sal vote I had placed already. If I don't screw up there we win.

I never pegged DT as the seer. How do you not reveal by then?

[EagleFan]

dola: Then when Danny came out with his list of CR/DT I couldn't tell if he was just a wolf that was trying to push for endgame or not.

[mauchow]

I was shocked to find out that dt was the seer after my death.. I was thanking my lucky stars that I voted five seconds too late. Whew !

[JAG]

I got the feeling the village wasn't urgent enough D4 in realizing it was do or die day. If I had been alive I would have pointed out that the martyr and seer had to reveal because a villager lynch plus night kill would leave a 2-2-1 situation where the cultist self-votes with nightfall and the wolves win. So at least all the reveals come on the table accompanied by probable fake reveal(s) by the wolves and/or cultist.

[JAG]

And yeah, from the end of N1 on I figured DT was the cultist, so he did a great job of fooling me.

Speculation thread reading for any interested parties:

Vanilla Flavored Werewolf

[JAG]

Thanks for running the game Zinto, definitely a memorable one.

[Autumn]

Definitely showed that you don't need fancy rules to have an entertaining game.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

EF was on my personal shortlist, but I think we both were leaning more toward Danny when I bought it. Not sure what brit thought right then or after that.

You had us fooled on seer. I thought both you and Autumn were vanilla.

Glad to hear I had you fooled . That was my hope with being under the gun so much.

[Autumn]

JAG, I'm reading through your thread. This was a fantastic catchof yours:

"In fact, pretty sure you can take CR = wolf to the bank. The wolves have been seer hunting the past two nights judging by their targets. Why did they kill RA? Because out of the blue, he voted for CR when no one else was that day."

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Thanks for the game.

Hated not knowing the wolves. I had no idea if I should break that tie for DT or not that night and then screwed up forgetting about the sal vote I had placed already. If I don't screw up there we win.

I never pegged DT as the seer. How do you not reveal by then?

My reasoning in-game for not revealing was the truth. I think I was aided by being on a business trip though - I was so busy that I didn't actually have time to follow along post-by-post and make a hasty reveal.

On D1 I had zero information, so at most I get one scan for the village before dying (and cost them the martyr).

On D2 I honestly thought I could swing things away from me enough, plus I had only the scan of Danny as "not a wolf." The craziness there at the end really had me panicking and really close to reveal though actully. I was beat though after waking up at 3am, and went to bed really early (this was Tuesday right?)

On D3 I think I was sort of committed to the strategy of "not revealing", plus it seemed clear to me with the shenanigans going on with EF that either Danny or EF was the cultist, so my info about the two of them not being villagers felt only half-useful. This was really the "go big or go home" moment of the idea of not-revealing in my mind though. I just kinda said to myself "This is either super ballsy or super bad." Probably also affected by having woken up at 4am that day, so my thinking was a bit crazed.

On D4 I was totally just sitting tight - I had thought I had made enough of a case for Path that he wouldn't be NK'd and my scan of him would reveal useful info (in which case I would have revealed), but when he was NK'd I just decided to sit tight.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Autumn

JAG, I'm reading through your thread. This was a fantastic catchof yours:

"In fact, pretty sure you can take CR = wolf to the bank. The wolves have been seer hunting the past two nights judging by their targets. Why did they kill RA? Because out of the blue, he voted for CR when no one else was that day."

Damn - that's a hell of a catch JAG. Too bad you were dead!!

[DaddyTorgo]

LMAO - I love that so many people thought I was a wolf. This "switching up my playing style" thing is definitely going to help my game!!

[Autumn]

Well, except next time I'm going to assume you're either a wolf or a roled villager, lol

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Congrats village! I would have liked to give this a go without being offed by the tie vote, but it is what it is. When something fortuitous happened, you guys jumped on it and made it work for you.

I enjoyed wolfing with you, brit!

And thank you, Zinto. I enjoyed the game and theme.

Likewise, CR. Thanks for your veteran insight, and sorry I dropped the ball with the D4 vote.

[Autumn]

When Dannyhad his DT/CR theory, I totally thought you were a wolf, DT, especially when CR came right out then with his longest post of the game, it seemed, and voted me, and EF joined right in. The rest of the game I just thought you were a better vote than whoever else was up at the time. And to think I started the whole trend of voting you D1 because I usually find myself having to poke you in games.

[britrock88]

Autumn -- would a "negative scan" on DT have made you look at EF/Danny instead?

[Chief Rum]

I was actually wondering if anyone would catch that. Heck, I myself even brought up what RA's significant posts were and pointed out that he voted for me. I was pretty much going to argue if anyone challenged me on it that that would be a rather too obvious wolf move, wouldn't it?

I saw JAG's post, but since he never went at me directly on that, and no one else really questioned it, I ignored it.

[britrock88]

And man, those tiebreakers did not work out well for us. A no-lynch and a wolf in 3 ties.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by britrock88

Likewise, CR. Thanks for your veteran insight, and sorry I dropped the ball with the D4 vote.

You got nothing to be sorry about. We just got unlucky. Whoda thunk the village would tie it three freakin' times, lol?

[JAG]

One thing I think Danny does really well as a villager is to take in new information and not let it be clouded by his previous theories. I was immediately dismissive of DT's reveal when it happened, but Danny took a much more serious look at it. I remember him changing his mind on the last day in the Breakout Kings game EF ran a while back too, correctly looking at the available info and switching from his previous idea of who was a wolf.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Well, except next time I'm going to assume you're either a wolf or a roled villager, lol

My new plan is to have 3 distinct playing styles and pick one at random before i find out my role. That way it'll be impossible to link my role to a style.

[mauchow]

The no lynch and random lynch worked in your favor imo

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

You got nothing to be sorry about. We just got unlucky. Whoda thunk the village would tie it three freakin' times, lol?

Without ties though we might have actually had some voting-record info to work with...

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Autumn

When Dannyhad his DT/CR theory, I totally thought you were a wolf, DT, especially when CR came right out then with his longest post of the game, it seemed, and voted me, and EF joined right in. The rest of the game I just thought you were a better vote than whoever else was up at the time. And to think I started the whole trend of voting you D1 because I usually find myself having to poke you in games.

Incidentally, I aligned myself with DT there on purpose because it seemed like no one was supporting him. I figured it might make me look better to him, and kept me away from having to spotlight britrock (my wolf partner), or Danny/EF (one of whom I thought was the cultist, but wasn't sure which).

Plus, I always know that when you find the time to do some analysis, you do thorough analysis and make your case well, so I viewed you as a ticking time bomb that needed to go at some point.

[britrock88]

And man, was I disappointed in the rapid change of opinion after the D4 result. From "IT'S DT!" to his reveal and "It's Brit!" in a matter of minutes.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Without ties though we might have actually had some voting-record info to work with...

Perhaps, but you might have been dead. I'll take the seer dying on Day One or Day Two and the following unknown votes that would have resulted.

Plus, before I bought it, while I certainly came up occasionally, I was pretty far down the list for viable candidates.

[Zinto]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Oh, Zinto, what were the exact tie rules, and how far did you set them out prior to the game? I wouldn't have blamed you for not having more than one tiebreaker rule, as it is rare to have even one in a game at all.

To have three is just, well, mystifying.

I actually had a tie break rule that could have been used for ties everyday for the next year since it was just a random role on a six-sided die for one of six tie breaks:

1.No lynch
2.Both People in the lead would be lynched
3.The next highest vote getter would be lynched
4.A random player would be lynched
5.One of the two players would be randomly lynched
6.The last player to vote causing the tie would be lynched

On the day Chief died it was a random player and I just rolled an eight sided die and made eight a roll again and it ended up on him.

[Zinto]

I posted the tie-break rules on Jags forum after the first day thinking that there was zero percent chance of there being a tie again. Boy, was I wrong.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by mauchow

The no lynch and random lynch worked in your favor imo

I would disagree, considering the seer was up for lynch in both of those situations, and in the third, I was nabbed despite probably at best being 4th or 5th on most suspicion lists.

[path12]

Originally Posted by mauchow

I was shocked to find out that dt was the seer after my death.. I was thanking my lucky stars that I voted five seconds too late. Whew !

Yeah, as it turned out if I would have decided to break that tie day 1 I would have lynched our seer right off the bat.

That would have went well. I boxed myself in there anyway -- originally as the hunter I wanted to stay pretty UTR but being in thread at the tie deadline meant that strategy wasn't going to play.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Incidentally, I aligned myself with DT there on purpose because it seemed like no one was supporting him. I figured it might make me look better to him, and kept me away from having to spotlight britrock (my wolf partner), or Danny/EF (one of whom I thought was the cultist, but wasn't sure which).

Plus, I always know that when you find the time to do some analysis, you do thorough analysis and make your case well, so I viewed you as a ticking time bomb that needed to go at some point.

FWIW I always find you frigging hard to read, and your alignment with me definitely had me jumping to thinking you were good. You were totally an early scan target - I actually talked myself out of scanning you earlier in the game (on D2 when I scanned EF after his late flip-flopping around). So the cultist did save your ass in that regard - after that chaos I got derailed in my thinking and didn't go back to you.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by path12

Yeah, as it turned out if I would have decided to break that tie day 1 I would have lynched our seer right off the bat.

That would have went well. I boxed myself in there anyway -- originally as the hunter I wanted to stay pretty UTR but being in thread at the tie deadline meant that strategy wasn't going to play.

Haha path, I'm sorry, bro. I totally went hard at you on the vote to keep attention off of us UTR wolves. You were doing the mea culpa for not breaking that tie, and I felt bad I had to use it to leverage the vote against you. Didn't work anyway--you got traction, but the village ended up going in another direction.

I was also the one who got you NK'd. Brit and I were going to NK Danny, but brit thought he might be the cultist. So I reconsidered late and switched to you. I was always thinking the seer was playing UTR-ish, which is why I didn't really look at DT for that role (again, good job with that, DT).

I was shocked DT didn't come out at all on D4.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

FWIW I always find you frigging hard to read, and your alignment with me definitely had me jumping to thinking you were good. You were totally an early scan target - I actually talked myself out of scanning you earlier in the game (on D2 when I scanned EF after his late flip-flopping around). So the cultist did save your ass in that regard - after that chaos I got derailed in my thinking and didn't go back to you.

Thanks, and yeah, EF did a great job except for the letting you live part on Day 2 (not that he could have known he had seer versus wolf in that vote).

I told brit right from the start to expect to be the last remaining wolf, because it was only a matter of time before I was scanned.

[path12]

Originally Posted by JAG

One thing I think Danny does really well as a villager is to take in new information and not let it be clouded by his previous theories. I was immediately dismissive of DT's reveal when it happened, but Danny took a much more serious look at it.

I was really impressed by that as well. People tend to get locked into their theories.

The fact that even after pushing the "DT is a wolf" theory he was able to dispassionately go back and take the reveal seriously deserves huge respect.

[path12]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Haha path, I'm sorry, bro. I totally went hard at you on the vote to keep attention off of us UTR wolves. You were doing the mea culpa for not breaking that tie, and I felt bad I had to use it to leverage the vote against you. Didn't work anyway--you got traction, but the village ended up going in another direction.

I was also the one who got you NK'd. Brit and I were going to NK Danny, but brit thought he might be the cultist. So I reconsidered late and switched to you. I was always thinking the seer was playing UTR-ish, which is why I didn't really look at DT for that role (again, good job with that, DT).

I was shocked DT didn't come out at all on D4.

Ha! I was hoping to play that D3 very calmly and hope that there was late momentum in another direction -- though I was this close to revealing as non-vanilla as the afternoon went along.

I was also going to push back at you with a big analysis but as I was putting it together I realized it was horrible reasoning so didn't bother. Not the first time that game where I started thinking "goddamn I'm rusty at this!"

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by path12

I was really impressed by that as well. People tend to get locked into their theories.

The fact that even after pushing the "DT is a wolf" theory he was able to dispassionately go back and take the reveal seriously deserves huge respect.

Yeah - Danny was really awesome at constantly reevaluating. Kudos to him...MVP of the game?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Yeah - Danny was really awesome at constantly reevaluating. Kudos to him...MVP of the game?

I would give the MVP of the game to EF for tying it twice, lol.

Seriously, though, this was a strong team effort, and you probably played the best in doing what you intended to do and carrying it out.

[Chief Rum]

I will have a new game thread up in the next day or so. Should be up tomorrow, but Sunday at the latest.

Sorry, JAG, but I am going to hold off on Game of Thrones just yet and run that during the show run. I'll put myself back on the list and try to get back to GMing a game around May, when GOT craziness should be at its height.

My theme will be the old WWF Royal Rumble a la Hulk Hogan, Macho Man, Ultimate Warrior, etc. It will combine wrestling mano-y-manos with standard WW play.

And, yes, everyone will be able to pick a wrestler.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I would give the MVP of the game to EF for tying it twice, lol.

Seriously, though, this was a strong team effort, and you probably played the best in doing what you intended to do and carrying it out.

I was pleased that I was able to "hide in a high traffic area" so to speak, and get all those scans in without having to reveal. Fact of the matter is that if it wasn't endgame-reveal it seems I would have been okay even longer, which is pretty cool, considering how much heat I was drawing (which to be honest, was more heat than I wanted to/expected to draw).

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I will have a new game thread up in the next day or so. Should be up tomorrow, but Sunday at the latest.

Sorry, JAG, but I am going to hold off on Game of Thrones just yet and run that during the show run. I'll put myself back on the list and try to get back to GMing a game around May, when GOT craziness should be at its height.

My theme will be the old WWF Royal Rumble a la Hulk Hogan, Macho Man, Ultimate Warrior, etc. It will combine wrestling mano-y-manos with standard WW play.

And, yes, everyone will be able to pick a wrestler.

DIBS ON RIC FLAIR!!!!!!

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by britrock88

Autumn -- would a "negative scan" on DT have made you look at EF/Danny instead?

It would have made a big difference, yes. I had tried to talk myself through all he possible theories, no matter how paranoid. I am always very aware of being bamboozled by Danny, and I was very worried he and DT had somehow pulled something. If you had "scanned" DT as a villager, I would have looked strongly at the possibility of him being cultist, and Danny the wolf. To me that was the only other variation that made any sense, since i could see Danny pushing DT and then switching when he realized DT was the cultist.

And I echo the others that it's very impressive how Danny can let go of pet theories. Makes him hard to read sometimes, but makes him one of the worst villagers a wolf can have in the game.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Sorry, JAG, but I am going to hold off on Game of Thrones just yet and run that during the show run. I'll put myself back on the list and try to get back to GMing a game around May, when GOT craziness should be at its height.

That's probably a good call.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Thanks, and yeah, EF did a great job except for the letting you live part on Day 2 (not that he could have known he had seer versus wolf in that vote).

I told brit right from the start to expect to be the last remaining wolf, because it was only a matter of time before I was scanned.

I had no idea what to do around deadline time because at that point you and brit were nowhere on my radar of wolves. I was afraid of accidentally lynching a wolf. I hoped tie would be no lynch which would keep giving you a free day to kill while I tried to find the seer. I didn;t even bother scanning DT or Autumn because I assumed that one of them would have revealed on day one being up for lynch.