Steroids and/or creatine for dummies

panerd · 03-31-2009, 03:55 PM

Okay I admit that I have been following the baseball steroids scandal for years and still don't really understand what they do. I have three different ideas and was wondering which one is true...

Say I can bench 100 pounds before steroids and I start taking steroids...

1) I can now magically bench 150 pounds (it still feels like 100 felt) and show muscle gain from that.
2) I still bench 100 pounds but can last longer, hence more muscle gain.
3) I still bench 100 pounds for the same amount of time but my muscles gain just due to the drugs.

Is the same true for creatine? (which I see at Walmart so I have to assume is legal) Why wouldn't all athletes use creatine?

JediKooter · 03-31-2009, 04:04 PM

I believe creatine is a banned substance in baseball. Plus, you'll blow out your hammy. Ask Ken Caminiti...oh wait, he's dead, nevermind.

McLovin · 03-31-2009, 04:05 PM

1 is true.

creatine is not a drug or hormone. It's a supplement that I believe pushes water into your muscles giving you a bloated/ bigger pump.
I use creatine and if you don't keep yourself hydrated while working out you get really nasty cramps.

CU Tiger · 03-31-2009, 10:50 PM

double post

CU Tiger · 03-31-2009, 10:51 PM

Lets leave creatine out of the equation we will get there in a minute.

As far as "steroids" go there is no magic answer. there are more than a dozen compounds commonly referred to as anabolic steroids. Each has unique and totally separate properties. For example Winstrol V which ben johnson was caught taking was developed (this is debateable)as a horse steroid and was fine tuned in the horse racing circuits. It increases muscle speed and endurance but does not lead to increased "strength" or muscle growth per se.

Compared to something like Deka, which is/was (out of production) a mega bulking agent that lead to extreme muscle growth and strength building.

One can not simply say that steroids do XYZ as there are so many formulations and different drugs that fall under "steroids". that is akin to asking how effective pain relievers are. i think we would all agree that aspirin is different from advil which is different from an opiate.

There are a number of factors in steroid productivity. the first is to increase testosterone production, the 2nd to increase luetinizing hormone production(which allows additional T to be absorbed by your muscles) and finally to alteer the muscle receptors.

All of this needs to be qualified, if you can bench press 100lbs today and you take a given steroid you will most likely be able to bench 100 or maybe 105lbs today. But the steroids will allow you to more completely push those muscles and will then help to more efficiently repair the workout damage and growth (anabolic) cycles to those muscles. This is one reason I personally do not have an issue with performance enhancing drug athletes. they work out harder than any other, they may use chemical means to facilitate that work but they still have to do the workouts and feel the burn/pain.

Creatine is a legal substance that has no effect on Testosterone levels. Creatine works (at last in theory and there are still debates to its effectiveness which is foolish in my opinion) by increasing muscle "fullness" by filling partially hydrated muscle cells with super hydrated molecules. This allows the muscles to work more efficiently, cool and repair quicker and has the added benefit of giving a "bigger" appearance by the full hydrated muscles.

The results seen from creatine supplementation are in no way similar to those seen from anabolics.

If one wanted to see "steroid" like results from over the counter products just a few short years ago it was totally possible by taking a combination of the various androstene adrogens (androstenedione, androstenediol in various nor19 and 3 combinations) in massively inflated quantities. I know first hand of several failed anabolic and T levels drug tests resulting from mega stacking andros. But to be fair I am talking about 8-10 times the label dosages.

thesloppy · 03-31-2009, 11:30 PM

There's a wonderfully entertaining and informative doc about steroids called 'bigger, stronger, faster', that touches on a lot of those subjects (as well as a few others along the way).

Subby · 04-01-2009, 08:18 AM

The short answer is that steroids allow for less recovery time between workouts, therefore you can do a much greater volume of strength training.

A common misconception is that steroids automatically make you stronger. You still have to put in the work. In fact, guys who take steroids still work there asses off in the gym to get the desired results.

Game of Shadows gives great insight into the world of sports and steroids.

03-31-2009, 04:04 PM	#2
JediKooter Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: San Diego via Sausalito via San Jose via San Diego	I believe creatine is a banned substance in baseball. Plus, you'll blow out your hammy. Ask Ken Caminiti...oh wait, he's dead, nevermind. __________________ I'm no longer a Chargers fan, they are dead to me Coming this summer to a movie theater near you: The Adventures of Jedikooter: Part 4

03-31-2009, 04:05 PM	#3
McLovin Mascot Join Date: Feb 2008	1 is true. creatine is not a drug or hormone. It's a supplement that I believe pushes water into your muscles giving you a bloated/ bigger pump. I use creatine and if you don't keep yourself hydrated while working out you get really nasty cramps. Last edited by McLovin : 03-31-2009 at 04:07 PM.

03-31-2009, 10:50 PM	#4
CU Tiger Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Backwoods, SC	double post Last edited by CU Tiger : 03-31-2009 at 10:52 PM.

03-31-2009, 10:51 PM	#5
CU Tiger Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Backwoods, SC	Lets leave creatine out of the equation we will get there in a minute. As far as "steroids" go there is no magic answer. there are more than a dozen compounds commonly referred to as anabolic steroids. Each has unique and totally separate properties. For example Winstrol V which ben johnson was caught taking was developed (this is debateable)as a horse steroid and was fine tuned in the horse racing circuits. It increases muscle speed and endurance but does not lead to increased "strength" or muscle growth per se. Compared to something like Deka, which is/was (out of production) a mega bulking agent that lead to extreme muscle growth and strength building. One can not simply say that steroids do XYZ as there are so many formulations and different drugs that fall under "steroids". that is akin to asking how effective pain relievers are. i think we would all agree that aspirin is different from advil which is different from an opiate. There are a number of factors in steroid productivity. the first is to increase testosterone production, the 2nd to increase luetinizing hormone production(which allows additional T to be absorbed by your muscles) and finally to alteer the muscle receptors. All of this needs to be qualified, if you can bench press 100lbs today and you take a given steroid you will most likely be able to bench 100 or maybe 105lbs today. But the steroids will allow you to more completely push those muscles and will then help to more efficiently repair the workout damage and growth (anabolic) cycles to those muscles. This is one reason I personally do not have an issue with performance enhancing drug athletes. they work out harder than any other, they may use chemical means to facilitate that work but they still have to do the workouts and feel the burn/pain. Creatine is a legal substance that has no effect on Testosterone levels. Creatine works (at last in theory and there are still debates to its effectiveness which is foolish in my opinion) by increasing muscle "fullness" by filling partially hydrated muscle cells with super hydrated molecules. This allows the muscles to work more efficiently, cool and repair quicker and has the added benefit of giving a "bigger" appearance by the full hydrated muscles. The results seen from creatine supplementation are in no way similar to those seen from anabolics. If one wanted to see "steroid" like results from over the counter products just a few short years ago it was totally possible by taking a combination of the various androstene adrogens (androstenedione, androstenediol in various nor19 and 3 combinations) in massively inflated quantities. I know first hand of several failed anabolic and T levels drug tests resulting from mega stacking andros. But to be fair I am talking about 8-10 times the label dosages. Last edited by CU Tiger : 03-31-2009 at 10:54 PM.

04-01-2009, 08:18 AM	#7
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	The short answer is that steroids allow for less recovery time between workouts, therefore you can do a much greater volume of strength training. A common misconception is that steroids automatically make you stronger. You still have to put in the work. In fact, guys who take steroids still work there asses off in the gym to get the desired results. Game of Shadows gives great insight into the world of sports and steroids. __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com

03-31-2009, 11:30 PM	#6
thesloppy Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: PDX	There's a wonderfully entertaining and informative doc about steroids called 'bigger, stronger, faster', that touches on a lot of those subjects (as well as a few others along the way).

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