OT: The Wheel of Time

[AnalBumCover]

All this talk of movies, and now books (see: OT: The Dark Tower), I'd like to know who's read The Wheel of Time series by Robert Jordan? I've got the first seven books, but have only read up to book four, The Shadow Rising.

Anyone else reading this epic fantasy?

[Vince]

Fantastic series...a friend turned me on to the series, and I mowed through the whole thing in about a month and a half. I couldn't put them down.

In my opinion, the story started to weaken around book 5, but in the later books bring the intensity level right back up.

[sabotai]

I've always thought about reading those, but I've got too many books to read as it is. (Have been reading my Allen Steele books. He's become my favorite sci-fi writer)

[Leonidas]

The series was great for about 5 books, then it got really bad. I read one book that seemed like a fantasy version of Little Women. He devoted great amounts of time to describing the clothes various females in the book were wearing and how they worried about whether Rand was kissing some other girl or not. The books are great when there's a lot of ass kicking going on and from 6-8 I saw very little of that so I gave up due to boredom.

[AnalBumCover]

I just noticed there's a new book out... a prequel called New Spring.

[Raiders Army]

Only read the first few due to a MUD I was playing...no pink ice rings????

[-Mojo Jojo-]

It's complete worthless fluff... like 90210 goes to Middle Earth... and yet horribly addicting..

[Eaglesfan27]

I LOVED this series and consider it my favorite series of all time. I agree a few of the books slowed down (books 6 and 7 in particular.) However, the last two books have been excellent in my opinion. My roommate started me on this series about 10 years ago in college. The first four were out I think when I started and I went through them in a few weeks as I just couldn't stop reading these books, and I've anxiously awaited each new book in the series for the past several years. The first 50 or so pages of the first book is a little hard (slow) for many people to get through, but if you get past that the first few books are really great. I've been riveted by the developments in the last two books and I've partaken of a lot of speculation with friends regarding various implications in the books.

[Schmidty]

It was good until the 5th book. At that point I got tired of the characters (except for Perrin), and got extremely tired of Jordan's overwrought writing style.

Just my opinion.

[WSUCougar]

I really enjoy the series...in fact, I'm reading the most recent one even now.

I think Jordan is a very good writer and storyteller. His problem (if a multi-million selling author has a problem) is that in the later books of the series he advances the story too slowly. He's got so many characters and sub-plots working that the main tale has been dragging. I need a freakin' scorecard to keep track of the Aes Sedai alone.

[Coffee Warlord]

The first 6 were very, very good. I read those fuckers to *death*.

They went progressively downhill after that. Jordan now seems content passing time in the series by about...3 days per book. I'm not even exagerrating. Absolutely jack shit has happened in like the last 2 books.

[the_meanstrosity]

I've really liked the Wheel of Time by Jordan. Yes, the books do slow down a bit in the later stories, but I still thought they were entertaining. It's similar to Terry Goodkind's books, another great fantasy author.

[Glengoyne]

Interesting how people's opinions vary. In my opinion the fifth book did drag a little, but I muddled through. The end of book six I think maybe it was seven was simply spectacular, the battle of Dumai's wells. At that point I felt the series compared favorably to the Lord Of the Rings. Since then I think it went downhill quite a bit. I find it unbelievable that Eaglefan thinks the last two books are an improvement. I do admit I haven't been able to slog through the last offering. I always seem to get distracted about a third of the way in. Plus I have such disdain for the previous volume, I refuse to look back to check facts.

In my opinion Jordan started letting the publisher dictate too much. The first several books all topped 1000 pages in a reasonably sized smallish font. I think starting with book 7 the books have been much smaller and utilized larger fonts. Also starting in book 7 he started devoting "coverage" to sets of characters. I think books seven and eight should have released as a single volume. The same for nine and ten. That is what I mean by letting the publisher dictate. I would have rather waited years longer and read two good books than get a "quick" fix of lesser stuff every two to three years.

I once saw an argument on a message board about which series was better(WoT or LoTR). I weighed in that although I loved LoTR, when I compared the highlights of the two series I found myself favoring WoT. My conclusion therefore was that at that time (Book 7) Jordan was ahead in the race, but the best thing Tolkien had going for him was that he was done writing. My feeling now, is that Jordan is keeping Tolkien in the game, and has actually fallen behind. I really do hope he pulls it out of the flames though. It is a fantastic series, and more than well worth reading the first six books. I dare you to stop at that point.

Oh in serious hopes that I don't thread jack with this thought. Anyone who read this series have an opinion about J.R.R. Martin's "A Song of Ice and Fire"?

[oykib]

I think Mrtin's series has the same too mny chracters, not enough focus problem that Jordan has. The difference is that Martin is a better writer.

I actually like epic fantasy much more than the pseudo-realistic fntasy that Martin writes. But I prefer Martin's series now. Jordan has gone somewht downhill. There are some really greaat moments early in the WoT series, though. Some of the best stuff I had read to that point.

[Eaglesfan27]

I don't want to give away spoilers, but I really liked what happened at the end of book 9... As for book 10, there were several things about it I really liked, but again I don't want to give away any spoilers for those who haven't read it.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

I have read the first 3 books in the series and have just bought The New Spring .

[GrantDawg]

I'm re-reading them right now and am about halfway through book 9. I have yet to read 10. I agree with the "everything after 5 has been down-hill" camp. I don't see 9 as an improvement. I actually think it is worse. How many freaking characters is he going to introduce? I wish he had stuck with the group from Edmond's Field and those who are immediately connected with them. I'm getting tired of the number of sub-plots he keeps adding.

As for the "prequel," I can't believe he hasn't progressed the story any more than he has and he is already going back. As it is, this series will not come to any type of conclusion in Jordan's lifetime.

On a side note, I'm seriously considering starting a campaign in the "Wheel of Time" roleplaying game. It is based on the 3rd edition D&D rules, but with several changes (all new classes and etc.).

[GrantDawg]

dola...I would love to see a premium cable network create a extended mini-series of the "Wheel of Time." Of course, it would be hard to do since there is no ending coming soon.

[AnalBumCover]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

dola...I would love to see a premium cable network create a extended mini-series of the "Wheel of Time." Of course, it would be hard to do since there is no ending coming soon.

I always thought this might work with an anime mini-series (a la, Record of Lodoss War)

[sachmo71]

Jordan is great, but Martin is better. I bought the last Jordan book (before Spring Dawn), started reading it, decided I wanted to read other stuff, and haven't picked it up since. One of these days I'll muddle through it.

But Eddings is the one who brought me completely into the fantasy fold. Great stuff.

[Vince]

On Eddings (not to thread jack) -

David Eddings was the first time I ever bought a book based upon the cover of the novel. I was deep into Anne Rice's vampire series (Body Thief, I think), and I picked up the recent one for a road trip when my mom was driving. She told me to pick up a book for Ronnie (my lil' bro), and I ended up picking up 'Castle of Wizardry' because it had a picture of Belgarion with the Sword all lit up in his hands on the cover. I figured Ronnie would like that. Well, I read the book, and was really sorry that I had read it (it is I think book 4 of the Belgariad) out of turn. But I was incurably hooked. I read it, the Malloreon, and his other two series' as well (Sapphire Rose trilogy and it's sequel trilogy...I don't remember what they're called, exactly). I've read each series at least three times each...they never get old.

[Peregrine]

I'm not sure about all the Eddings stuff. I admit I was really into them back when they were about the only fantasy books available, but I tried to re-read them last year and felt they really don't stand up to the caliber of current work. IMO a classic example of books that seemed good when I was 15 but when I read them now I just go bleah.

[oykib]

Originally Posted by Peregrine

I'm not sure about all the Eddings stuff. I admit I was really into them back when they were about the only fantasy books available, but I tried to re-read them last year and felt they really don't stand up to the caliber of current work. IMO a classic example of books that seemed good when I was 15 but when I read them now I just go bleah.

I'd have to agree with you about those series. They don't stand up to adult scrutiny very well. Also, I was more than a little disturbed by the blatant racism against Arabs in the Elenium and the Tamuli.

Also, Eddings shares Jordan's problem of creating super races in his novels. I have trouble taking thw WoT seriously every time we are confronted with the various feats of the Aiel. The Tamuls are just as bad in the Tamuli.

[Fidatelo]

I haven't tried to read WoT yet, it is just too daunting. I can chime in about the George RR Martin series though... it is by far the best fantasy series ever. And I mean no slight to Lord of the Rings, which was my previous favorite, but it can't hold a candle to the stuff Martin writes. I just love that anything can (and will) happen, at any time, to anyone. The political maneuverings are fantastic, and the writing is awesome in that he spends his time telling a story, not describing the way the light reflects off the grass in the nearby meadow as a lot of fantasy writers tend to do.

Another good series (although one that can be a little too wordy) is the Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn trilogy by Tad Williams. Very cool stuff.

[sachmo71]

Right now I'm reading The Fifth Sorceress by Robert Newcomb. I am not impressed, but I'll finish the book before declaring my time totally lost. I don't like his style of writing at all, I have a hard time believing the characters, and it's rather stereotypical.

[Abe Sargent]

Okay, so here's my problem with The Wheel in Time stuff.

So, I'm reading along at a decent enough pace. And the story is progressing with one or two of the (Maybe mis-remembering the names here) Forgotton getting taken care of each novel. Nice and smooth. And then, in the prelude to, I think, book 6, two of the deceased Forgotton are freakin' brought back to life! I set the book down right there and I've never again felt the need to pick up the series.

I hear a lot of people tell me that after that book, and maybe another, the series picks up again but, my general rule is that I don't read 2000 pages of text so that a story gets better. 2000 pages? Sheesh.

Want good fantasy that moves at a somewhat quicker clip? Go read Tad Williams Memory, Sorrow and Thorn series (a trilogy with the third book so large it's split into two books, so a four book series). That ends.



-Anxiety

[MacroGuru]

I could never get into the wheel of time, I think it deals with getting by the first book. It was....slow to me. I like the world, the concept, and everything behind it. I have read up to the 3rd book, and I have to say, I honestly think it was the 1st book that killed me.

George RR Martins series was excellent.

Another writer you guys might like, if you haven't read him yet is Raymond Feist, and his Riftwar Saga. First books is Magician, Second is Silverthorn, and Third is Darkness At Sethanon. A great series, and after that he has written several other books that tie into the world, and some of the great characters he has created. He is by far, my favorite Fantasy Author.

[Thomkal]

I have just finished Book 3 of Jordan's and likely will pick up Book 4 today. His early books are so huge I kept putting them down to read shorter books that interested me more at the time. But I really got into Book 3, so I'm looking forward to Book 4. (I'd appreciate no more spoilers about future books here though, Anxiety I'm talking to you. ) I find myself getting rather annoyed reading Jordan's books because men are basically treated as idiots, and not very good ones at that throughout the whole series so far. Perhaps because I'm a man.

I've read and liked Martin's series so far, its probably a notch above Jordan's books so far. But the last book was very depressing (and shocking) in terms of what happens to some of the characters and it kind of turned me off. Oh and if you like superheroes, the Wild Cards series edited by Martin is a must read. Read the main Eddings series too, and they certainly kept my interest, but not as intelligently written as these two series. Could never get into Goodkind or Williams series at all, though I was really hoping to like them based on what I had heard.

If you are looking for a couple slightly older "epic" fantasy series you might want to check out Jennifer Roberson (sp?) Chronicles of the Cheysuli, a 7 book series I believe with the first book being called Shapechangers I think. Guy Gavriel Kay writes very "high-brow" stuff. His first series was the Fionavar Tapestry Trilogy with the first book being The Summer Tree. I really have had the urge to reread it, wish I could find it. And of course there's my favorite author and series Anne McCaffrey's Dragonriders of Pern.

[Bonegavel]

I used to be a huge Conan fan (Howard, et al) and in the late 80s picked up a new conan book by a Robert Jordan. I liked his writing style so much, when I saw his name on a book Entitled, The Eye of the World, i had to have it. I loved it and I have since picked up every book and read them in a matter of days.

I think he is a top-notch author, but enough is enough already. This series would have been Awesome at a trilogy, great at a quadrilogy, decent at fivilogy, and after that.... it is getting really old.

Now, after book 11, I simply have to buy each book (all the while hoping he doesn't die before the last) so I can add some closure to this story i have devoted over a decade of my life to. I used to clamour for info on the next release, now I clamour only to hope the next is the last.

having said all that, I think this is the most detailed and diverse setting I've ever read. The way he has woven together the different cultures, politics, men/women, past/present/future is the most amazing I have ever seen. It is hard to believe that one person has created all of it, there is so much.

but please, Robert.... end the frickin' story!!

[Bad-example]

I read the first 4 or 5 books of the WoT series. I give the guy credit for his imagination, but I would agree that he doesn't do a good job developing characters, and also I found that every so often he would drop in a sentence so awkward I wanted to just slap him.

I think if he had a better editor I would have enjoyed the ones I read more.

[cincyreds]

Will there ever be a "The Wheel of Time Movie" perhaps?

[Aylmar]

My favorite quote from the series (it occurs at Dumani's Wells). "They will pay for this. I am the Lord of the Morning."

[the_meanstrosity]

How much have you read of Goodkind and Tad Williams? The early parts of their first books were rather slow, but once they get going they are strong books. If you've read the entire book then those authors may simply not be your cup of tea. Though I will say their sequels are improved over the first books.

[hukarez]

Originally Posted by AnalBumCover

All this talk of movies, and now books (see: OT: The Dark Tower), I'd like to know who's read The Wheel of Time series by Robert Jordan? I've got the first seven books, but have only read up to book four, The Shadow Rising.

Anyone else reading this epic fantasy?

I've heard about this on the MUX community somewhere awhile ago, and felt compelled to check it out. Went to a Borders to buy the 1st book (I think), called 'The Eye of the World' and all...but I honestly have to say, I haven't quite picked up into it yet.

I think I read the first 20 or 30 pages while waiting in line at the porcelain bank, but I haven't really picked it up since. I do want to get into it...and I'm sure if I read it just a bit more, I'll end up going through the book like water.

[ausonny]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I don't want to give away spoilers, but I really liked what happened at the end of book 9... As for book 10, there were several things about it I really liked, but again I don't want to give away any spoilers for those who haven't read it.

I have to agree with this. Without spoilers, I really, really enjoyed the end of book 9.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

How much have you read of Goodkind and Tad Williams? The early parts of their first books were rather slow, but once they get going they are strong books. If you've read the entire book then those authors may simply not be your cup of tea. Though I will say their sequels are improved over the first books.

Mean,

Everybody I've talked to about the problems I was having with Goodkind and Williams said the exact same thing about the first part of the book being slow and such. So I've kept reading them from time to time, but never seem to get interested enough to keep going when something else I want to read comes out. I have Tad Williams The Dragonbone Chair (when I can find it that is) and Goodkind's Wizard First Rule. I'm a little over halfway through WFR, and it has gotten better, just not enough to grab my attention completely. I'll keep plugging away at it though.

Dan

[Mota]

I enjoyed the first several books but I agree that it is dragging. You can read a 30 page chapter and realize that the only thing that happened was a conversation between 2 people. Also the sheer abundance of characters is overwhelming, I don't remember who the hell any of these Aes Sedai are, especially with all these hidden good / bad guys. They'll drop a hint in one book and then you don't see the person for 2 books, do you really expect we'll remember that hint that we read a few years ago?

Don't write for the sake or writing, tell me a story.

[Eaglesfan27]

I definitely would agree that there are a lot of characters and it can be hard to keep them straight without effort. However, I actually find the speculation regarding the character's identies very interesting. I find it necessary to read either on a website or in a book a compendum of the world to help me keep some things straight and further understand some of the plots, subplots, and characters in the book. However, I really enjoy all of these aspects of the series.

[Glengoyne]

Originally Posted by ausonny

I have to agree with this. Without spoilers, I really, really enjoyed the end of book 9.

I can't say how much the ending of book 9 disappointed me. I think it was because it removed something people had been struggling with for ages, with a plot hatched, fostered, and executed in the space of less than 300 pages. I liked the old way of doing things, if this had happened in book 6(not possible I know) I think he would have developed it over the course of at least a full book.

Also disappointing about book 9 was the way Jordan treated sexuality. Back when Rand lost his virginity it was almost completely symbolic. Everything was left to the imagination. When he starts getting his groove on in book 9 I felt like I was reading some of Piers Anthony's juvenile sexy Xanth stuff.

Just a couple of pet peeves I guess. I do love the series, I just hate the way it's being finished.

[kurtism]

Film rights acquired, Wheel of Time movies to come?

http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/index...d=58590&type=0