New Car Decision - HELP!

Blackadar · 07-11-2003, 08:35 PM

Ok, it's time for the family to buy a new car. I have a Subaru Forester and the Wife has a Nissan Sentra. Hers is 11 years old, so it's time to dump it. Trade-in is about $400.

We're down to 4 choices:

Hyundai Sonata, a good looking mid-sized sedan for about $19,000.

Nissan Altima, a pratical mid-sized sedan at about $20,000.

Chysler PT Cruiser, an average if attractive small/mid-sized sedan at $19,000

Subaru WRX, an awesome sports car at $23,000 with the sports shifting package.

I think we're really down to the PT Cruiser and WRX. This should be my wife's car and she wants something that's not a MommyMobile. She knows that if we get the WRX, I'm going to end up driving it a lot because it's one of my dream vehicles. Since I want my car payment between $400-$450, the difference is about 1 years' payments - 48 or 60 months. Since we have a child, the PT Cruiser is much more practical. The WRX is a vastly superior car and my Forester is practical enough. We tend to buy a car and hold onto it for 10 years, so trade value is of little importance. The only reason the WRX is priced that low is because the color isn't great (yellow) and it's an '03 and the '04s are out. The PT is also an '03, but the '04s aren't coming for a while. Suggestions or comments?

Swaggs · 07-11-2003, 08:51 PM

Forgive me for intruding, but did you and your wife reconcile?

I would stick with Subaru (I own a Forester) and get the WRX, and then swap your wife.

Blackadar · 07-11-2003, 08:56 PM

Yes, we did.

Axxon · 07-11-2003, 08:57 PM

Are you still King of the Sodomites then???

Blackadar · 07-11-2003, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Axxon
Are you still King of the Sodomites then???

Fuckin-A

Axxon · 07-11-2003, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Blackadar
Fuckin-A

Erm, precisely.

Swaggs · 07-11-2003, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Blackadar
Yes, we did.

Congrats.

Looks like things are swinging back up for you.

tucker342 · 07-11-2003, 09:21 PM

Oh god, don't get a PT Cruiser! I can't stand those fuckin cars! Get WRX.

condors · 07-12-2003, 12:15 AM

i would go with the wrx i used to have an ouback sport a few years ago and really liked the car great in the snow!

CamEdwards · 07-12-2003, 12:27 AM

I have no idea about the cars... just wanted to say contratulations on the reconciliation.

Shkspr · 07-12-2003, 01:12 AM

When I went looking for a new car last month, I noticed a lot of 2002 Sonatas on the lots in my area with 5-15000 miles on them - apparently used as some sort of program car. I ended up haggling them down to $12,000 for the Sonata, and ended up thrilled with the purchase so far. Plus, the cash I saved let me pay off my honeymoon trip this fall in advance, and we'll be able to get my new bride a new car in a year or two.

The reason I wasn't too concerned about the car being a 2002 rather than a 2003 is because the Hyundai full warranties are for 5 yr/60K miles rather than the 3 yr/36K mile warranties I'm used to. From a cheap repair standpoint, it's a wash, and the price difference was enough for me. The early returns on the Sonatas after the 2002 redesign were very good in terms of reliability, if I recall my research correctly.

Might be worth it to see how low they'd go on the Sonata and if you get enough of a deal, you can drop the payments really low.

Godzilla Blitz · 07-12-2003, 02:11 AM

One of the things you might look at, especially if you are going to own a car ten years, is the frequency of repair. Spending the $25 to sign up for Consumer Reports online so you can examine the repair records for the four models you are thinking of might be a good investment. It really is a great way to get unbiased stats on what cars have the most problems, and gets you out of the trap of relying on individual, anectdotal evidence.

As a general rule of thumb, I believe Toyotas and Hondas tend to have the best repair records, while Hyundai, if I'm not mistaken, has a disastrous repair record with most of their models. Another thing to consider is that even if a car is under warranty, the monetary cost of repair is only part of the total "cost" of a car problem: there's also taking the car in to get it fixed, waiting for it to get fixed, doing it all over again if the problem isn't fixed the first time, not to mention the possibility of the car breaking down when you are trying to get somewhere, which is a royal pain in the ass.

Godzilla Blitz · 07-12-2003, 02:30 AM

dola...

I just went and looked up the four you're thinking of buying. Their scores, based on Consumer Reports' "predicted reliability" rating:

Hyundai Sonata: 21% better than average
Nissan Altima: 20% better than average
Chysler PT Cruiser: 34% better than average
Subaru WRX: 8% worse than average

For reference, very few models rate better than 50% better than average; likewise, very few rate more than 50% worse than average.

I stand corrected on the Sonata, which looks to be a pretty reliable car, although I was right about the Toyotas, which pretty much own the top of the charts.

The Lexus RX300 gets the best score, with a 78% better than average rating.

The worst car out there, in terms of predicted reliability?

The winner is...

Oldsmobile Bravada, with a whopping 191% worse than average score. Yee gads. Can you even get it out of the dealer's lot without it breaking down?

GrantDawg · 07-12-2003, 08:43 AM

Drive a Toyota Camry before you buy anything else. I wouldn't buy a Subaru, though. As Godzilla pointed out they have a very bad service record, and are expensive to fix. PT Cruisers are much smaller on the inside for that type of vehicle.

Congrats on getting back with the wife, by the way. I'm happy to hear it.

Ryan S · 07-12-2003, 08:59 AM

I think Blackadar already knows he is buying the Subaru.

Blackadar · 07-12-2003, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by GrantDawg
As Godzilla pointed out they have a very bad service record, and are expensive to fix.

BTW, I've owned a Subaru for 15 years. They're great cars and I've never had any problems at all. They're a bit more expensive to fix, but they don't break down very often.

EagleFan · 07-12-2003, 09:49 AM

Go witht he WRX. Subarus tend to run forever. I remember back in college my friend had his parents old subaru wagon. We used to beat the hell out of that thing and it just kept on going.

tucker342 · 07-12-2003, 09:58 AM

Your wife would probably really like Toyota Camry. Perfect chick car.

If you haven't already looked at one, you probably should.

Craptacular · 07-12-2003, 11:02 AM

Do not get that ugly P.O.S. called the PT Loser. I'd be all over a WRX, if they didn't have that ugly hood scoop or whatever you call it. Other than looks, everything I've read about the WRX has been great. Hyundai has made great strides in the last few years on some of their cars, and I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Sonata or Elantra (which is what I'll probably be buying soon). The biggest downside to Hyundai is still future worth, but if you're planning on driving it into the ground like you said, then you obviously don't have to worry about it. Yes, the Toyotas and Hondas are generally reliable and keep their value, but everyone and their grandma and their mother-in-law and their younger brother and their friends drives one of those.

GrantDawg · 07-12-2003, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Blackadar
BTW, I've owned a Subaru for 15 years. They're great cars and I've never had any problems at all. They're a bit more expensive to fix, but they don't break down very often.

Well, good for you! I'm just going on the fact that I had bank actually want to increase my interest rate if I bought one, and refused to give me a loan on a used one. That has to be a pretty bad record.

bigdawg2003 · 07-12-2003, 11:19 AM

My future cousin in law has a PT Cruiser with flame decals running down the side of it. It looks pretty badass. Small though.

Qwikshot · 07-12-2003, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bigdawg2003
My future cousin in law has a PT Cruiser with flame decals running down the side of it. It looks pretty badass. Small though.

Well it's based on the Neon platform...

I love my Passat...just saw the new Toureg (based on the Porsche Cayenne), very nice but too expensive...

I like the ugly Honda Element but that's just me.

But if the car is meant for your wife (glad to hear you are back together) then I would seriously consider the implications should you bogart her vehicle...anyways good luck.

Godzilla Blitz · 07-12-2003, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GrantDawg
I wouldn't buy a Subaru, though. As Godzilla pointed out they have a very bad service record, and are expensive to fix.

If I remember right, a lot of the Subaru's scored well with regards to repair, but the particular model that Blackadar is considering has not scored well.

One of the things that struck me when I was looking over the records last night was that the reliablity ratings can vary widely within the same company. They'll make one model that scores great, then have another model that is a doggie. Toyota seems to be the exception: they really seem to rule the reliability charts.

And yes, congrats on getting back together with your wife!

GrantDawg · 07-12-2003, 04:14 PM

Just ignore me. I was thinking of Suzuki, not Subaru. They all look alike to me.

Rich1033 · 07-12-2003, 04:20 PM

I would bet that some of the problems with the WRX come from people just beating the hell out of it. Those commercials comparing it to a rally car dont exactly inspire conservative driving.

Blackadar · 07-12-2003, 04:58 PM

Well, we're now the proud owners of a new WRX. Man, is that thing fast! It has the short-shifter, the monster turbo - everything but the nitro to be in The Fast and the Furious. We got an awesome deal on it, too. It's an '03 and with the '04s coming out, they were desperate to sell. Also, it had all the racing stuff on it, but no leather seats. And it's a stick. And it's yellow.

So I got it not only below dealer invoice, but I got all of the dealer holdback and pretty much everything else, too. And made them give me $800 for an 11 year old Sentra that's leaking oil, trannie fluid and needs a new clutch. So I got a monster of a steal. The sticker is $26,000 and I got it for less than $22,000 before taxes.

tucker342 · 07-12-2003, 07:20 PM

Congrats

good choice

Blackadar · 07-12-2003, 07:56 PM

Man, that thing mooooooooooves. It's like driving a toy.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-12-2003, 08:00 PM

Just be careful with that toy. Here is hoping you many years of safe, happy driving it

Ryan S · 07-12-2003, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Blackadar
Well, we're now the proud owners of a new WRX.

I knew you had made up your mind before you had even posted this thread.

Blackadar · 07-12-2003, 08:03 PM

Well, I've wanted a WRX since they came out, but it was the wifes' decision. I think she made the right one.

We went out to get ice cream tonight with the little one. I turned onto the road and looked down - I was doing 60 in 3rd gear in about 5 seconds. Unbelievable.

EagleFan · 07-12-2003, 08:03 PM

Nice choice, enjoy. Now I'm jealous.

Blackadar · 07-12-2003, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EagleFan
Nice choice, enjoy. Now I'm jealous.

If you have the opportunity, test drive one. It's sweet.

JeeberD · 07-12-2003, 11:31 PM

Congrats about you and the wifey!

Glad you got yourself a nice car. Just glad you didn't get a PT Cruiser. Those things are so ugly...

Have fun!!!!

07-11-2003, 08:51 PM	#2
Swaggs Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Forgive me for intruding, but did you and your wife reconcile? I would stick with Subaru (I own a Forester) and get the WRX, and then swap your wife. __________________ DOWN WITH HATTRICK!!! The RWBL Are you reading In The Bleachers?

07-11-2003, 08:57 PM	#4
Axxon Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Phoenix, AZ	Are you still King of the Sodomites then??? __________________ There are no houris, alas, in our heaven.

07-12-2003, 12:27 AM	#10
CamEdwards Stadium Announcer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Burke, VA	I have no idea about the cars... just wanted to say contratulations on the reconciliation. __________________ I don't want the world. I just want your half.

07-12-2003, 02:11 AM	#12
Godzilla Blitz College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000	One of the things you might look at, especially if you are going to own a car ten years, is the frequency of repair. Spending the $25 to sign up for Consumer Reports online so you can examine the repair records for the four models you are thinking of might be a good investment. It really is a great way to get unbiased stats on what cars have the most problems, and gets you out of the trap of relying on individual, anectdotal evidence. As a general rule of thumb, I believe Toyotas and Hondas tend to have the best repair records, while Hyundai, if I'm not mistaken, has a disastrous repair record with most of their models. Another thing to consider is that even if a car is under warranty, the monetary cost of repair is only part of the total "cost" of a car problem: there's also taking the car in to get it fixed, waiting for it to get fixed, doing it all over again if the problem isn't fixed the first time, not to mention the possibility of the car breaking down when you are trying to get somewhere, which is a royal pain in the ass. __________________ Current Blog Projects: Final Fantasy: Lost in Japanese Kaboom Review

07-12-2003, 02:30 AM	#13
Godzilla Blitz College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000	dola... I just went and looked up the four you're thinking of buying. Their scores, based on Consumer Reports' "predicted reliability" rating: Hyundai Sonata: 21% better than average Nissan Altima: 20% better than average Chysler PT Cruiser: 34% better than average Subaru WRX: 8% worse than average For reference, very few models rate better than 50% better than average; likewise, very few rate more than 50% worse than average. I stand corrected on the Sonata, which looks to be a pretty reliable car, although I was right about the Toyotas, which pretty much own the top of the charts. The Lexus RX300 gets the best score, with a 78% better than average rating. The worst car out there, in terms of predicted reliability? The winner is... Oldsmobile Bravada, with a whopping 191% worse than average score. Yee gads. Can you even get it out of the dealer's lot without it breaking down? __________________ Current Blog Projects: Final Fantasy: Lost in Japanese Kaboom Review

07-11-2003, 08:56 PM	#3
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Yes, we did.

07-11-2003, 09:21 PM	#8
tucker342 Pro Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Iowa City, IA	Oh god, don't get a PT Cruiser! I can't stand those fuckin cars! Get WRX.

07-12-2003, 12:15 AM	#9
condors College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000	i would go with the wrx i used to have an ouback sport a few years ago and really liked the car great in the snow!

07-12-2003, 01:12 AM	#11
Shkspr College Benchwarmer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Amarillo, TX	When I went looking for a new car last month, I noticed a lot of 2002 Sonatas on the lots in my area with 5-15000 miles on them - apparently used as some sort of program car. I ended up haggling them down to $12,000 for the Sonata, and ended up thrilled with the purchase so far. Plus, the cash I saved let me pay off my honeymoon trip this fall in advance, and we'll be able to get my new bride a new car in a year or two. The reason I wasn't too concerned about the car being a 2002 rather than a 2003 is because the Hyundai full warranties are for 5 yr/60K miles rather than the 3 yr/36K mile warranties I'm used to. From a cheap repair standpoint, it's a wash, and the price difference was enough for me. The early returns on the Sonatas after the 2002 redesign were very good in terms of reliability, if I recall my research correctly. Might be worth it to see how low they'd go on the Sonata and if you get enough of a deal, you can drop the payments really low.

07-12-2003, 08:43 AM	#14
GrantDawg World Champion Mis-speller Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Covington, Ga.	Drive a Toyota Camry before you buy anything else. I wouldn't buy a Subaru, though. As Godzilla pointed out they have a very bad service record, and are expensive to fix. PT Cruisers are much smaller on the inside for that type of vehicle. Congrats on getting back with the wife, by the way. I'm happy to hear it.

07-12-2003, 08:59 AM	#15
Ryan S Quarterback Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London, England	I think Blackadar already knows he is buying the Subaru.

07-12-2003, 09:49 AM	#17
EagleFan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Mays Landing, NJ USA	Go witht he WRX. Subarus tend to run forever. I remember back in college my friend had his parents old subaru wagon. We used to beat the hell out of that thing and it just kept on going. __________________ The EagleFan YouTube Channel - Reactions Soarin' & Scratchin' YouTube Channel - We react to music, videos, TV, we talk, we are planning some field trips Soarin' & Soothin' - Meditation, Relaxation, and Sleep Aid; mental health is important

07-12-2003, 09:58 AM	#18
tucker342 Pro Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Iowa City, IA	Your wife would probably really like Toyota Camry. Perfect chick car. If you haven't already looked at one, you probably should.

07-12-2003, 11:02 AM	#19
Craptacular College Starter Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: The Mad City, WI	Do not get that ugly P.O.S. called the PT Loser. I'd be all over a WRX, if they didn't have that ugly hood scoop or whatever you call it. Other than looks, everything I've read about the WRX has been great. Hyundai has made great strides in the last few years on some of their cars, and I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Sonata or Elantra (which is what I'll probably be buying soon). The biggest downside to Hyundai is still future worth, but if you're planning on driving it into the ground like you said, then you obviously don't have to worry about it. Yes, the Toyotas and Hondas are generally reliable and keep their value, but everyone and their grandma and their mother-in-law and their younger brother and their friends drives one of those.

07-12-2003, 11:19 AM	#21
bigdawg2003 High School Varsity Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Austin, Texas, USA	My future cousin in law has a PT Cruiser with flame decals running down the side of it. It looks pretty badass. Small though. __________________ I didn't even know Elvis was from Memphis. I thought he was from Tennessee.

07-12-2003, 04:14 PM	#24
GrantDawg World Champion Mis-speller Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Covington, Ga.	Just ignore me. I was thinking of Suzuki, not Subaru. They all look alike to me.

07-12-2003, 04:20 PM	#25
Rich1033 High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Sylvania, Ohio	I would bet that some of the problems with the WRX come from people just beating the hell out of it. Those commercials comparing it to a rally car dont exactly inspire conservative driving.

07-12-2003, 04:58 PM	#26
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Well, we're now the proud owners of a new WRX. Man, is that thing fast! It has the short-shifter, the monster turbo - everything but the nitro to be in The Fast and the Furious. We got an awesome deal on it, too. It's an '03 and with the '04s coming out, they were desperate to sell. Also, it had all the racing stuff on it, but no leather seats. And it's a stick. And it's yellow. So I got it not only below dealer invoice, but I got all of the dealer holdback and pretty much everything else, too. And made them give me $800 for an 11 year old Sentra that's leaking oil, trannie fluid and needs a new clutch. So I got a monster of a steal. The sticker is $26,000 and I got it for less than $22,000 before taxes.

07-12-2003, 07:20 PM	#27
tucker342 Pro Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Iowa City, IA	Congrats good choice

07-12-2003, 07:56 PM	#28
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Man, that thing mooooooooooves. It's like driving a toy.

07-12-2003, 08:00 PM	#29
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	Just be careful with that toy. Here is hoping you many years of safe, happy driving it __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

07-12-2003, 08:03 PM	#31
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Well, I've wanted a WRX since they came out, but it was the wifes' decision. I think she made the right one. We went out to get ice cream tonight with the little one. I turned onto the road and looked down - I was doing 60 in 3rd gear in about 5 seconds. Unbelievable.

07-12-2003, 08:03 PM	#32
EagleFan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Mays Landing, NJ USA	Nice choice, enjoy. Now I'm jealous. __________________ The EagleFan YouTube Channel - Reactions Soarin' & Scratchin' YouTube Channel - We react to music, videos, TV, we talk, we are planning some field trips Soarin' & Soothin' - Meditation, Relaxation, and Sleep Aid; mental health is important

07-12-2003, 11:31 PM	#34
JeeberD General Manager Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The Town of Flower Mound	Congrats about you and the wifey! Glad you got yourself a nice car. Just glad you didn't get a PT Cruiser. Those things are so ugly... Have fun!!!! __________________ UTEP Miners!!! I solemnly swear to never cheer for TO Last edited by JeeberD : 07-12-2003 at 11:31 PM.

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