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MLB 14 The Show: Debating the Merits of Quick Counts

How is everyone finding the quick counts in MLB 14: The Show? I've certainly heard several opinions on this new wrinkle to the gameplay for the 2014 version of Sony's baseball franchise, including a spirited discussion on the most recent Press Row Podcast. I can certainly appreciate both sides of the argument, as there is a definite trade-off when activating the feature. The idea of speeding up the game and forcing some realism may end up diminishing the control someone has over the game — and it's certainly not realistic. Then again, it serves an important function: speeding up the game.

The basic idea of quick counts is that each batter who comes up to the plate will have a randomly generated pitch count that infuses a bit of “forced realism” into the game while supposedly speeding things up. Players will see most count types, except for 1-0 and 0-1 counts. There always has to be 2 pitches in the count, so that means there will be every count from 0-2 and 1-1 all the way up to 3-2. Sometimes a good hitter will come up and face a 1-2 count; other times a weaker hitter will saunter up to the dish and get shown a 3-1 count. I get the feeling there is some kind of logic informing who gets what counts, but I've still seen some fairly erratic hitting scenarios.

The big benefits of quick counts are brevity and realistic hitting situations. I would say that quick counts manage to succeed in both of those areas. The games do certainly move along faster with the feature turned on, as I have found that some innings will last only 60 seconds if you get some 1-2 counts or if you swing at a bad pitch or two. The pace is quickened further if you actually skip a lot of the presentation elements, which definitely varies from user to user. I find myself taking in the atmosphere at certain points of the game; other times I just want to develop a rhythm for pitching and keep things moving.


Having some pre-fabricated counts also assists in getting a pitcher's overall pitch count to where it should be, as most baseball games struggle to have an accurate number of balls compared to strikes. By enforcing some 1-ball, 2-ball and 3-ball counts, it helps create the illusion that the at-bat has progressed in a realistic way, and it forces the batter to pay attention to the situation each time he comes up to the plate. I've always found The Show to have some challenging pitch speeds, and it can be difficult to pick up the ball on the way in. When facing a pitcher with insane velocity, it makes it hard to lay off pitches and be choosy. The quick counts alleviate some of this by spotting the batter a ball or two once in a while so that it's easier to work a count and actually compete against the game's elite hurlers.

However, the inclusion of quick counts has several unintended consequences. For starters, it takes away a good deal of agency from both the batter and the pitcher, as they are forced to deal with lots of random scenarios that they had no control over. A batter wanting to bunt, for example, may find himself with a 1-2 count, nullifying the possibility of moving the runner along. Just the same, someone who wants to work a count and wait for a steal opportunity may be given an 0-2 count and have to swing desperately to stay alive. For the pitcher, things are just as complicated. They may want to throw passively against a certain batter, but a 3-1 count may force them to put something in the zone at a crucial point in the game. Sometimes it's even possible to miss the pitch count and throw a ball on the outside edge, conceding a walk right away. Then again, the pitcher can surprise some batters by throwing a strike right away and getting a K on an 0-2 count.


I certainly applaud the efforts of Sony San Diego in trying to address the issue of brevity and realism in baseball videogames, and I think they've found an intriguing option. It fixes a lot of problems, but it does (by its nature) introduce some new ones. This sort of innovation is welcome, though, just like the dynamic difficulty option. I've said before how it's hard for developers to mitigate the fact that user input is always going to mess with the realism in sports games. When a player can swing as much as he wants in baseball, hit as much as he wants in hockey and spin as much as he wants in basketball, it creates certain scenarios where the developer just can't find a solution.

For game designers, there almost has to be something of a compact between them and the end user: if you're playing the game and expecting realism, play it realistically. When a developer gives a player too much agency, the opportunity exists to stretch and bend the rules. By enforcing some realism, the developer can at least control the optics of the sport and instill some realistic stats and scores.

If nothing else, quick counts seem like a successful first step in addressing not so much a problem but a reality. Sports games are always going to struggle with some aspect of the competition they're representing, whether that be presentation, realism, feedback, immersion or idiosyncrasy. The question is: what tools do developers have to address each of these unique problems? I think we're still in the process of finding out.

How about you, OSers? What are your feelings on quick counts?

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Member Comments
# 21 eaw913 @ 05/15/14 09:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGuinta1
I don't like the unrealistic aspect of subbing a picture after he has already thrown 2 pitches but other than that love it. Thank you SCEA!
Quick way to alleviate this is go in and select the option "Schedule to Put in Game" before the inning begins. It's what I do!
 
# 22 steelerfan @ 05/15/14 10:03 PM
I am finally getting to play a baseball game that has BBs and I love it. Through 22 games in my Astros Franchise, there were a total (between both teams) of 141 Walks (6.41 per game). I have been playing baseball games since the early 80s and have never been able to get a realistic number of Walks or Walks Allowed.

I agree that it would be better with an "override" feature and with some 0-0, 0-1, 1-0 counts. However this feature (along with, surprisingly, Dynamic Difficulty) has given me the most realistic and statistically-accurate baseball that I have ever played.

And, for the record, it's not about saving time with me. I still play with Broadcast Presentation ON. My games take over an hour to complete. It doesn't bother me, it's ALL about Bases on Balls!

One last note, it would be nice if you had to press a button to confirm that I was ready to start the next half inning. That way you could make substitutions before the inning started.
 
# 23 bkrich83 @ 05/15/14 10:04 PM
Quick counts were a game changer for me. Love them, and couldn't go back to not having them.
 
# 24 LingeringRegime @ 05/15/14 10:40 PM
Love it. More difficult for me than using every pitch.
 
# 25 michaelherrmann @ 05/15/14 11:58 PM
Was so incredibly excited for them and I just can't stand them. I've tried them in about 9-10 games now and it screws my rhythm up to the point where I can't even connect with the ball. I mainly just use fast play on with quick counts off, with the occasional game with broadcast on and quick counts on.
 
# 26 THESHAMISASHAME @ 05/16/14 01:57 AM
I LOVE IT ! Literally a game saver for me and its not for the time factor either its more about SCEA putting together each at bat and compressing it into one pitch and for me that eliminates alot of the long drawn out stuff that bores me after awhile game in and game out so if you want that play the regular way .

This mode has been the greatest addition for me since NHL 07 skill stick
 
# 27 GrandMaster B @ 05/16/14 05:07 PM
It is a great new feature. I can play a series in the morning before work and a series or two after. Otherwise I could only get 1 done in the morning before work and a few after. So 6 games a day compared to 3. It's a no-brainer.
 
# 28 sportyguyfl31 @ 05/16/14 07:53 PM
I want to be able to play a full and even multiple seasons for once. This seems like the only way, if you don't want to sim games
 
# 29 mjm76 @ 05/16/14 09:37 PM
I did not think I would like QC but I love it now! It really speeds up the game, I do not want to spend 2 plus hours playing a video game. I enjoy playing for 30 to 40 minutes like the QC games last. I also enjoy the short length of the FIFA 14 online games (20-25 min.)

Loving MLB 14 so far! Great game!
 
# 30 bfielder @ 05/16/14 11:56 PM
Overall it is good, but it has it's flaws like anything else. I use it every game now just because I enjoy how much quicker i can get through a game, but as stated in the article it sucks in bunting and base stealing situations.
 
# 31 KingV2k3 @ 05/18/14 03:21 PM
QC (along with Dynamic Difficulty) is a "Game Saver" for me...

Before this feature, I not only had ker-azy looooong game times, but I couldn't get the walk totals or strike percentages close enough for my liking...

Neither feature is "perfect", but they're def impressive initial efforts, that I hope SCEA builds off of going forward...
 
# 32 m1ke_nyc @ 05/18/14 04:29 PM
I love it but feel it can be improved. This game seems to embrace giving us options, so what I would like is the option to choose a quick count or not before the at bat. How that would work I dont know and is something to be discussed. I pretty much only play with quick counts now but in some situations I prefer to start with a 0-0 count. Ive been using quick counts with fast play and games take 25 minutes. With traditional broadcast its about 45 minutes.

EDIT: the one moment it would suck to have quick counts is game 7 of the world series your pitching, game tied with 2 outs and the bases loaded in the 9th and you get handed a 3-0 count. I'd go crazy lol.
 
# 33 N51_rob @ 05/19/14 01:55 PM
I really like to idea of QC and applaud SDS for finding a way to make the game quicker for those that enjoy it. I don't use them and probably won't because Since MLB 07 on the PS2 and MLB 08 on the PS3 I have been working to train my hitting eye to lay off the low change up and the slider tailing away. It took me a long time, but I am now able to work counts, foul off pitches and drive up pitch counts organically through the game, that I can't go away from it knowing all the work I put in.
 
# 34 Spanky @ 05/19/14 08:28 PM
I tried one game of quick counts, and that's enough for me. It's good that they added the feature for those who like it, but to me it just feels like an incomplete game. One of the great things about baseball is pitcher vs. hitter battle and the build up to it -- working the count, fouling off pitches to stay alive, nibbling the corners, deciding which pitch to throw and what location, etc. It just doesn't feel the same when you walk up there with a 3-2 count.

Good for those who can now play 162-game seasons with this feature. But the bottom line for me is I'd rather play fewer games as long as they're complete games, with the full complement of pitches.
 
# 35 LowerWolf @ 05/19/14 09:23 PM
I'm glad it's in for those that enjoy it/want quicker games. The more options the better.

But for me? I can't use it. Starting in the middle of an at-bat would be like starting on second or third down in Madden. I need the control that a regular game provides.
 
# 36 THESHAMISASHAME @ 05/21/14 03:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanky
I tried one game of quick counts, and that's enough for me. It's good that they added the feature for those who like it, but to me it just feels like an incomplete game. One of the great things about baseball is pitcher vs. hitter battle and the build up to it -- working the count, fouling off pitches to stay alive, nibbling the corners, deciding which pitch to throw and what location, etc. It just doesn't feel the same when you walk up there with a 3-2 count.

Good for those who can now play 162-game seasons with this feature. But the bottom line for me is I'd rather play fewer games as long as they're complete games, with the full complement of pitches.
But the pitcher vs batter battle is still there ??? its just compressed and intensified based off attributes as a start and then you work from that scenario thats presented to you .

I mean the cpu still bunts when it wants to sacrifice and so do I and the same with stealing but once again its compressed so you better make each pitch count and choose carefully or have some reasoning.

I think theres even more strategy involved when using quick counts then the regular full games as you have little room for error because each pitch can make or break you .

I also play full broadcast and dont skip scenes so gameplay time is better but not under a hour most games and I mainly play QC for its excellent programming and I feel nothing being forced which leads to zero frustration for me win or lose and thats my key as its very solid stat wise on straight allstar default using timed hit and classic pitch .
 
# 37 cws @ 05/22/14 11:54 PM
I absolutely hate it! I want a REALISTIC game. Baseball is a slow game - it is supposed to be slow and not made quicker to finish. Quick counts and player lock does not belong in a baseball simulation video game. Save it for an arcade game!
 
# 38 cardinalbird5 @ 05/23/14 12:27 AM
My only complaint is too many 3 ball and/or 2 strike counts. There should be more 1-1 counts than any other count especially 3-2 counts.
 
# 39 heater26_99 @ 05/23/14 04:04 PM
I really enjoy the quick count feature, but I do believe a bit more logic can be built it. I.E. Runners on base: maybe limit the batter count, 0-1, 1-1, 1-0. that should alleviate the concern with bunting, stealing, etc.
 
# 40 Armor and Sword @ 05/23/14 06:56 PM
No question there is some give and take. But I feel the love of this feature. I love playing multiple seasons in my franchise and playing multiple classic roster seasons......this feature along with cross platform saving has taken The Show to new heights for me!

I only expect quick counts to be further tweaked and tuned going forward.
 


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