RaychelSnr's Blog
Tuesday is d-day baseball fans.
Well…at least for those of you who own a PS3. The question is simple: should you buy the perennial champion of Baseball, MLB: The Show or should you delve into the world of the feisty upstart MLB 2K11?
Well in the next few paragraphs, I'll try to explain the best choice for you. I must admit this is a nearly impossible task simply because there are more situations possible here than I could ever come up with, but I think my guide below should help you out a bit.
Please note that this guide is only meant to help you make a purchasing decision on launch day and are the result of a guy who has seen both games in action about as much as the rest of you guys at this point. We will have full and awesome coverage starting Tuesday of each game, leading to their reviews. If you can afford to wait a few days, I'd keep an eye out for that.
Who's got the realism?
This is the topic that has the entire community at odds with one another and the rhetoric seems to be more fit for political theater than baseball video games -- but this is an important consideration for a lot of baseball purists.
Trying to wade through this minefield is going to be difficult, and I'm sure someone from both sides are going to take what I say the wrong way -- but that's the breaks of writing here at OS.
Taking the track record combined with my impressions of the demos into account, the most realistic game this year will without a doubt be MLB: The Show. Few sports games can approach the things that The Show does, which I think is partially due to it being a platform specific title and also for having a great group of developers who understand that platform behind it.
The Show is a more deliberately paced game, just like the real game of baseball is, and it requires a bit more mental aptitude of the game to be able to succeed on many levels. Add in the thousands of little touches that just help to engross you which are the result of tweaking and adding items on top of a game which was solid several years ago, and you simply just have a much more complete version of baseball. For some players of The Show, this evolution (rather than revolution) has resulted in a feeling of staleness -- which might be a good argument for you to take a dip in 2K's title this year.
That's not to say MLB 2K11 won't be realistic in it's own right -- but it's a different kind of realism. The game is made for a different crowd that wants to sit down and play a game of baseball a bit faster and it's made to play more like a video game. You can and will get realistic results out of 2K11 this year, moreso than previous years. However, the game has had some serious flaws in several past editions -- enough so that you have to worry about this year's title having 'something' wrong with it. I'm sure there's a psychological term for that feeling of doom I can't just shake, as last year's title was particularly quality outside of the flaws.
Take away the flaws and 2K10 played a good game of hardball. So if you have played The Show for several years, and you feel you want something a bit faster and quicker to play through, along with something that just plays a different brand of baseball, 2K11 is your game. That's not to say 2K11 is arcadey, it's just that it doesn't play as close to the sport as The Show will in terms of pacing and whatnot. For some The Show's deliberate pace is a huge turn off, even though they're big baseball fans. I think 2K11 will suit baseball fans just fine -- but it's still not quite on the same level as The Show in terms of pure engrossing realism when it comes to the total experience put together.
….But does more realism equal more fun?
Despite what I just said about 2K11, I think it might get more of my time this year moreso than The Show. It's fun: the pitching mechanics, the analog swing controls, it all just works for me. So long as the game's AI doesn't make absolutely terrible decisions that no manager would ever make in any setting of baseball (who valued their jobs at least), I like the pick up and play aspect of 2K11 a bit more right now. I'm a busy guy these days, and my gaming time has been getting stretched a bit more -- and The Show just plays slower compared to 2K.
That's not a knock against The Show either from a quality standpoint, it's more of a personal preference at this time. As I said before, The Show's pacing really lends itself to be a bit better experience for the complete baseball purist given the full effort there from gameplay, realism, graphics, and audio. But I'm sure if you sat down and timed it, MLB 2K's games would be significantly shorter -- which lends itself to be a more convenient title for busy people given that it already looks to put out pretty darned solid numbers statistically.
So you mean both games are good buys?
It seems baseball gamers have found themselves in a great position because that's exactly what I'm saying. Both games have differentiating aspects to them, and I think it's best to sum it up like this: The Show is more realistic, but it's pacing and whatnot might turn some off. 2K may lack some of the extremely polished touches of The Show when it comes to realism, but it's control scheme and general pacing make it a game which you could easily describe as more fun to play for some --especially people who aren't hardcore baseball purists who can forgive some AI flaws which have been present in the past.
So what game should you buy? That's the million dollar question which I think is a tough question to really answer for any one person. You cannot go wrong with either game -- and getting caught up on little issues as to whether you should buy one game or the other is the wrong approach. I think what game you should choose ultimately comes down to the time and energy you want to put into the game. The Show lends itself towards a more hardcore type of person investing a lot of time into statistics and the more cerebral parts of baseball while 2K11 is geared a bit more towards the baseball fan who wants an authentic experience that's more convenient to play.
However, I don't think it's possible you can go too wrong with either title this year -- and I'll have both titles in my gaming library when they hit store shelves Tuesday, a choice I'd recommend for anyone who can afford such a move.
# 17
sportyguyfl31 @ Mar 6
im buying both games.
I wont ever play a single second of MLB2k11 online, but I will be active in a OS online league for MLB The Show.
So why play 2k11?
I want a franchise mode I can get through.
I dont sim games, and I cant play a 162 game season.
When I play franchise mode, in any game, I jsut want to sit down, and be in and out in about an hour or so.
I dont want to mess with sliders, I just want to go and get my hacks...and I want to be ablie to play a shorter schedule so I can play multiple seasons
I wont ever play a single second of MLB2k11 online, but I will be active in a OS online league for MLB The Show.
So why play 2k11?
I want a franchise mode I can get through.
I dont sim games, and I cant play a 162 game season.
When I play franchise mode, in any game, I jsut want to sit down, and be in and out in about an hour or so.
I dont want to mess with sliders, I just want to go and get my hacks...and I want to be ablie to play a shorter schedule so I can play multiple seasons
# 18
statum71 @ Mar 6
I'm liking 2K because I'm so impressed with the presentation. But The Show is my game.
# 19
Eski33 @ Mar 6
The Show is my game of choice. Having played baseball at the collegiate level, The Show's developers do an awesome job with the nuances and the little things that make baseball such an awesome and unpredictable sport.
I won't knock those that are leaning towards 2K. For me, the demo was terrible. Again, it is the little things. The pitch speed is brutal (except when hitting), the runners not rounding the bases but rather making 90-degree angle turns (all I can say is WOW), and I definitely am not a fan of the pitching mechanic. I don't need some fancy way of maneuvering sticks to throw a curve ball.
The Show's presentation (minus the commentary, which isn't horrible but just recycled) is outstanding. The intro into each game is excellent and seeing the players move is almost like watching a game on TV.
The list that CoreyMac posted is just a little of what makes The Show outstanding. The day to night transitions with dynamic weather in the game this year, the umpires' variable strke zones and sometimes missing a call adds realism and the overall gameplay is just solid.
I won't knock those that are leaning towards 2K. For me, the demo was terrible. Again, it is the little things. The pitch speed is brutal (except when hitting), the runners not rounding the bases but rather making 90-degree angle turns (all I can say is WOW), and I definitely am not a fan of the pitching mechanic. I don't need some fancy way of maneuvering sticks to throw a curve ball.
The Show's presentation (minus the commentary, which isn't horrible but just recycled) is outstanding. The intro into each game is excellent and seeing the players move is almost like watching a game on TV.
The list that CoreyMac posted is just a little of what makes The Show outstanding. The day to night transitions with dynamic weather in the game this year, the umpires' variable strke zones and sometimes missing a call adds realism and the overall gameplay is just solid.
# 20
ggazoo @ Mar 6
" For some players of The Show, this evolution (rather than revolution) has resulted in a feeling of staleness -- which might be a good argument for you to take a dip in 2K's title this year."
This describes me exactly this year. The Show is an amazing game, but even with the new analog controls, recycled commentary and cutscenes from previous incarnations are leading me to 2K for the first time in 8 years.
This describes me exactly this year. The Show is an amazing game, but even with the new analog controls, recycled commentary and cutscenes from previous incarnations are leading me to 2K for the first time in 8 years.
# 21
enice128 @ Mar 6
I don't mean to knock Xbox's version of what they call an MLB game but all it has going for it is the commentary. The game every year including his years demo is HORRIBLE! None of the players look real as well as AT&T Park. For casual baseball fans this game will do if ur into an arcade style of play but The Show is the obvious choice if u want a true representation of an MLB game! Just looking at all the videos & screenshots of all MLB stadiums with The Show on OS I cannot wait till Tuesday! I give the 360 a chance EVERY year but the 2k11 demo I just laugh at. MLB the Show is so REALISTIC it's freaking scary! The stadiums, player models, animations & now with the analog controls it's gonna be SICK! Dont get me wrong, I prob use my 360 much more. I buy many more games & play online but never for baseball. It's crazy how NBA 2k11 is so realistic & the baseball version so terrible! So as a baseball purist I gotta go with Sonys version, sorry xbox!
# 23
Raskal @ Mar 7
If I'm reading this right, buy 2K if all you do is play Exhibition games, and the Show for everything else?
# 24
supermanemblem @ Mar 7
Sixty pieces of dust is too much money to buy a game for expanded commentary and a better pitching mechanic. Eventually the commentary is going to get stale too, especially if you play with the same team mist of the time. After you throw a pitch and it gets hit, you will wish you had bought The Show. Some people just love being different. Well this year it's going to cost you.
# 25
smearz @ Mar 7
"Yeah, the show may have more realistic/better real time presentation, but is that really the same as more realistic gameplay? I say it's not. What game plays more realistic "between the lines" when the controller is actually in your hands? Please, someone explain how the Show is so much more realistic from that POV"
"6) Much more true to life pitch speeds and bat speeds"
To me, this is the number one most important difference between these two games.
And I'll add to that the animation of the pitches themselves. Just like everything else, it's all a matter of preference. I think the pitch animations in 2K11 are very deliberate and exaggerated, and when you combine that with the slow pitch speeds, it gives the batter/pitcher matchup a less realistic feel, but makes determining pitches out of the pitchers' hands much easier. The Show's pitch animations are so deadly accurate and realistic. Add that to the much much faster pitch speeds and you have a combination that provides a more realistic recreation of the stress that is involved in hitting a baseball. I've never once thought that a particular pitch in 2K11 felt "nasty", but I get that feeling all the time playing The Show.
An example: 2K - Jonathan Sanchez' slurve (which should be a slider) VS. The Show - Cliff Lee's cutter. When throwing the slider from Sanchez, it feels like his lazy windup hurls this ball toward the plate and that ball follows some lazy curved path out of his hand, which allows the slider to be easily distinguished from a fastball right away. The cut-fastball from Cliff Lee, however, looks the same coming out of his hand as his normal fastball, is hard to pick up right away, explodes in the last third coming towards the hitter, and causes many more broken bats and called third strikes. This pitch, is nasty.
Here's a test: Tim Lincecum's 2-seam fastball. Go play both games. Face Tim Lincecum through at least 9 at bats and come back and tell us which game makes it easier to pick his 2-seamer and make consistent contact.
The batter/pitcher confrontation in violent and stressful, and The Show gets it right. My opinion of course, but there is evidence that gives me this opinion.
"6) Much more true to life pitch speeds and bat speeds"
To me, this is the number one most important difference between these two games.
And I'll add to that the animation of the pitches themselves. Just like everything else, it's all a matter of preference. I think the pitch animations in 2K11 are very deliberate and exaggerated, and when you combine that with the slow pitch speeds, it gives the batter/pitcher matchup a less realistic feel, but makes determining pitches out of the pitchers' hands much easier. The Show's pitch animations are so deadly accurate and realistic. Add that to the much much faster pitch speeds and you have a combination that provides a more realistic recreation of the stress that is involved in hitting a baseball. I've never once thought that a particular pitch in 2K11 felt "nasty", but I get that feeling all the time playing The Show.
An example: 2K - Jonathan Sanchez' slurve (which should be a slider) VS. The Show - Cliff Lee's cutter. When throwing the slider from Sanchez, it feels like his lazy windup hurls this ball toward the plate and that ball follows some lazy curved path out of his hand, which allows the slider to be easily distinguished from a fastball right away. The cut-fastball from Cliff Lee, however, looks the same coming out of his hand as his normal fastball, is hard to pick up right away, explodes in the last third coming towards the hitter, and causes many more broken bats and called third strikes. This pitch, is nasty.
Here's a test: Tim Lincecum's 2-seam fastball. Go play both games. Face Tim Lincecum through at least 9 at bats and come back and tell us which game makes it easier to pick his 2-seamer and make consistent contact.
The batter/pitcher confrontation in violent and stressful, and The Show gets it right. My opinion of course, but there is evidence that gives me this opinion.
# 26
sportyguyfl31 @ Mar 7
^^^ Smearz that is a point a do agree with. I remember in The Show, some of the pitchers that gave me trouble, were often guys that had mediocre stuff, but had a release I couldnt pick up well, and as a result, I was slow to identify a pitch.
I had a few games, where I couldnt time a guy like friggen Livan Hernandez for a good 6 innings. When I got him down, I shelled him, but for most of the game, I was like "What the hell..why cant I pick up this guy?"
I had a few games, where I couldnt time a guy like friggen Livan Hernandez for a good 6 innings. When I got him down, I shelled him, but for most of the game, I was like "What the hell..why cant I pick up this guy?"
# 27
SDwinder @ Mar 7
Smearz has it right. Can't say it any plainer. When you are looking for a more realistic on the field, in the moment sim experience that duplicates what you see and feel in a real game played at the higher levels, The Show gets it much better. It just does. No need to make excuses or rationalize. Those are the facts, not opinion. Those that have played the real game at the higher levels see it immediately. 2K is dumbed down. It is what it is. If it was the other way around, we would be stating just the opposite. Just the facts. Don't let your egos get in the way of them. If you prefer a game with slower pitch speeds and less accurate physics, more power to you. If it makes the game easier for you to be successful and feel good, wonderful. Some of us prefer a higher, realistic level of challenge, like we are used to in real life. The nice thing about The Show though is it does scale down nicely for the less experienced out there as well. It will serve to teach and reinforce what they have learned and been coached too, literally making them better ballplayers mentally and physically on the field as well. A solid baseball sim with good AI will do that. Also, a goofy analog pitch mechanic like 2K has just takes me out of the game. It is an arcade element that does not translate well for a sim experiece and never has. Sometimes less is more.
Anyway, Smearz has it right. His posts are well thought out, detailed, but most important, accurate based on the facts and a guy that apparently gets it. His baseball "instincts" shine through.
Anyway, Smearz has it right. His posts are well thought out, detailed, but most important, accurate based on the facts and a guy that apparently gets it. His baseball "instincts" shine through.
# 28
cadarn @ Mar 7
I'm going to rent them both and see which I prefer. I agree with the author that the show can be too time consuming for a casual gamer.
# 29
dannyheck @ Mar 7
LOL.... so people think THE SHOW is getting stale? Wait til you play 2k baseball. John Kruk SUCKS as a commentator. I am a 360 owner is sick and tired of 2k baseball, and I'm shelling out the dough to FINALLY get THE SHOW. Cannot wait!! Christmas comes early for me.
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Working...
/QUOTE]
1) Warm Up Pitches
2) Check Swings
3) Practice Cuts with bat between pitches
4) Balks
5) Batters calling time when a pitcher takes too long
6) Much more true to life pitch speeds and bat speeds
7) Cancelling throws when fielding
etc. etc.
Contrary to what you say also, animations do play a part in the actual realism / gameplay of the game in your hands. The way outfielders attempt at cutting off balls in gaps for example allows for plays that are far more natural to the real game of baseball.