The next shoe will be the second wave of the housing bubble. Commercial Real Estate really isnt an issue, who cares if office and retail space is being wasted.

If they really cared about this country they would have never wasted, spilled, ruined and pillaged through our nations treasures like they were the Taliban West.

Far as Republicans helping us out of the ditch they put us in.

Would you ask the guy who put your house on fire to help you put out the fire. There useless.

I think your saying that if you were wrong on every major issue for 8 years you really should just STFU.

# 7 bfindeisen: What does Iraq have to do with terrorist attacks on our country. It never did. Your ignorance is silly.

nuwriter (#16):

First off, I like how you've assumed I'm a raving liberal just because I made comments critical of the Republicans in Congress. He's not MY Barney Frank. I never voted for the man. The banking crisis was caused by members of both parties, who flirted with the crazy idea that left to their own devices, financial institutions and other companies would do what was in the best interest of everyone, not just their own wallets. Which, as this and other events have proven, is patently false.

Second: I really suggest that you go look up the definition of Socialism, because liberal/progressive policies are nothing of the sort. Nationalizing things like the banks (temporarily, until they can get their act together) and healthcare (something done by every other industrialized nation at some form or another) is NOT socialism. Socialism would be if there were a law passed abolishing private property. The regulatory laws being talked about are not designed to tell people what to do, they are designed to protect people from institutions that may wish to violate the trust that their very industry is dependent on.

Interesting theory. I fail to notice where incentive is being removed here. What I do see is the fact that, left unchecked, those with power will screw over those without. Take health care. Right now, heaven help you if you get cancer or some other serious disease. Because insurance companies go out of their way to deny coverage to people. Their business is making a profit, not keeping people healthy. There's no profit in having to pay for coverage, therefore, the entire industry is a farce.

You say that government should just butt out of citizen's lives. Well, it's a shame that Bush's privatization of social security never happened. I mean, with the way the stocks have been booming, all that money we've paid into the system would be growing exponentially.

Funny. First of all, given the latest demographics, there wouldn't be that many people to contribute to the GDP. Second of all, having lived in Canada for the past three years, I kind of like the idea of free health care. My mother in law went through breast cancer treatment about 10 years ago and it didn't cost her a dime. In the states, my wife's family would have been bankrupt. Sure, we pay a little more in taxes, but guess what? You take an extra couple hundred dollars a year from every citizen, and suddenly you don't have to pay $12,000 in health care a year. And neither does your employer if you're lucky enough to have health care benefits. And guess what? You take that $12,000 or so saved per employee, and that goes to profit...as in GDP.

Just going to throw out some ideas here. First off, I really enjoy the discussion that is going on here. If every citizen took the time and energy to research and debate legislature, we would be in a much better place as a nation. I say this as a former aid to a California State Senator. However, there are certain things that, as pointed out by the original post, are not helping to solve things. It is posts like the one from nuwriter (#16) that really seem to harm notions around legislature and the political process. It is posts like that one that only fuel the bipartisan nature of our country and our government, which in turn creates a whole realm of new issues that government has to deal with. I totally respect and even advocate the idea of dissenting, but to do so in a manner that does not cite any resources or even provide insight as to [i]why[i] certain claims are made is completely detrimental to any progress created by discussion. So I urge you to continue this discussion, as it is completely valid (truly, no one knows what's going to happen with this issue), but I strongly encourage you to:

a. Back up your ideas and notions with facts if possible, or at least prior experiences
b. Try and see the other side of the argument before simply launching into a bipartisan tirade

That said, continue on and live democracy!

Regarding universal health care in the U.S, Bill Clinton had planned to do this, never happened. I'm sure the Dems will play the blame game and say the Repubs didn't allow Billy to do this or that... And according to this blog's topic, any blame placed either way would be considered 'whining'. And Hillary tried to use it as part of her run for office. Is it possible that hard working people don't want more government intervention and the lazier folks want all the help they can get. Seems that way to me.

The best quote so far that I've read on this blog is, "Democrats make an art form of hypocrisy." As a non-partisan, hard working American citizen, who pays close attention to daily politics, I couldn't agree more. Just my opinion. By the way, this is a Sports Video Gaming site isn't it?

nbluedevils (#25): I appreciate that. To be fair, people on both sides of the spectrum are guilty of closed-minded partisanship, which does nothing but create arguments where nothing actually is accomplished. Jon Stewart famously helped bring down CNN's Crossfire by pointing that out.

Actually it was the pharmaceutical and healthcare lobby, who were in bed with congressmen/women on both sides of the aisle that blocked the idea of universal health care. Their business is to make money, not provide health care, and if the government took over that responsibility, they wouldn't have as much profit.

I wasn't talking about blame, I was talking about saying legislation is doomed to failure after it has passed. This is especially bad when the problem is caused in large part by public perception and confidence.

You're right, she did. And it was one of the reasons why I never supported her.

Actually, I think that most hard working people would like to not have to worry about things like what happens if I get sick? According to the Center for American Progress, Americans are losing employee-based health care benefits at a rate of around 14,000 people A DAY. Here in Canada, if you get sick, you're covered at no cost to you. There's no government man standing in the corner reviewing every decision the doctors make. If you want to talk about intervention in health care, how about the insurance companies that pour over records looking for (and sometimes inventing) prior existing conditions so they can deny claims after treatment?
Sure is, but my understanding was that these blogs exist as an open forum. I've posted mainly about sports and gaming so far, but not exclusively. Plus, I made sure that I wasn't going to be the only one with a politics-oriented post before I put this one up. Besides, if you don't like having this sort of discussion here, no one is forcing you to read it

Here is the problem which I and almost every Republican has with this bailout: the bottom dollar does not make sense. We are adding in 75 billion dollars to the bailout to help 13 million people in trouble with their mortgage. So, do the math. Also, that 75 billion is not going to the people to "bail them out", it is going to the banks, who are the ones responsible for the problem in the first place. They are giving each bank a 1000 bucks for every loan they re-mortgage. Do you not see how idiotic this is?!? The amount of money in this so called bailout is attroucious to say the least. In a time of economic crisis, they see it fit to spend hundreds of millions on hybrids, 100s of billions to banks that are the seed of the problem, and countless more to programs that have no right to my money. I could care less if the American auto industry fails; its a dinosaur and has been for along time. Terrible business practices and crappy products have ruled their reign on the american public, so not I have to give them my hard earned money so they can do it all over again. This is a sad state of affairs, and the liberals think that all you have to do is throw money at it and it will go away. Bigger governnment, beter unions = death to the American dream. Those that state this is Bushs fault are completely and utterly insane. He stated 6 years ago that the government needed to have a sector in place to watch over the banking industry, and look what has happened now. Mark my words, this plan will do nothing to help our economy, but in the end will only make it much worse then we already are. You can try to look at history and see what other leaders did, but this time it is much different. We are 10 trillion in debt without the bailout. Obama said he wont raise taxes, but where in the world does that money come from then? All those that voted for him are going to be in for a hell of a shock when all his promises of "change" fall through the roof when you look at your paychecks.

Good points and counter-points all around. Keep up the mature discussions people.

I think the main problem with this blog is the word 'whining'. Some people like this word, some would prefer 'heated debates or discussions, others would use the word 'passion'. Do you see where I'm going with this? It's all semantics. No matter what word we choose to define these debates, to me it's all simply an opinion one has and it doesn't matter how you express it, within reason of course, meaning no violence necessary.

Tell me how you feel when you realize Bin Laden has won.

Way to go Bushies.

Poppy Harlow: A former presidential candidate and a Republican congressman from Texas, Ron Paul, has some serious opinions about the economy and just how it should be handled. He even says we’re doing just what Osama Bin Laden wanted us to do. Let’s bring him in to talk about that. Congressman, thanks for being here, I appreciate it. Well right, let’s just address that off the bat. We are handling our economy like Osama Bin Laden would like us to?

Ron Paul: Yes, he actually said it that he would like to drag us into a war in the Middle East. That he was pleasantly surprised that we did as much as we did after 9/11, because his plan is to bog us down and bankrupt our country and diminish our morale and he’s doing exactly the same thing because we were his ally when he used the same strategy against the Soviets. So, this is not strange, we should easily understand it, and he’s doing a very good job. We are bankrupt and he is participating in it and laughing at us.

http://www.ronpaul.com/2009-01-28/di...-to-its-knees/

And I'm not a Ron Paul fan but the truth hurts.

Did you miss this line.
" he’s doing exactly the same thing because we were his ally when he used the same strategy against the Soviets"

7stringking: The last 16 years were not a disgrace. Clinton's spending in our own country resulted in the largest surplus, and created 23 million jobs which were the biggest job gain in the history of this country.

The last 8 years have been treasonous. Not one job created, largest deficit ever, two unfinished wars costing billions a week, inventing a reason to invade Iraq, massive fraud on Wall street and Iraq Rebuilding projects. . All of this happened in the last 8 years.

How you can compare Clinton's 8 to Bush's 8 is crazy.

But you are the guy who supported a Doofus so what would you know.

Simply stating the market will correct itself is wrong. That only works when the banks and other people leading the market aren't morons and aren't lying and cheating. Corruption can doom a lot of things. Having government imposed restrictions in the market place is a good thing, not a bad thing. It's the lack of restriction in money lending practices that got these banks in this mess in the first place. If the govt didn't step in, this whole thing would have gotten a lot worse. Maybe we should have let the market correct itself without the bailout and watch the country crumble around itself? The great depression was made worse by a lack of credit being available. Govt intervention is necessary at times.

And I agree with the Pitt - only positive focus can help. I also think spending this amount of money is a bit insane and the average debt per person is sky rocketing. Who knows what the future will hold though but being negative doesn't help.

Unfortunately, "positive thinking" is not what this country needs. This isnt third grade, and we arent playing with toy monopoly money here. This is my, yours, and everyone elses money, as well as our national debt. Also, government regulation of private sectors is the last thing we need, and regardless of what others say, it is one of the last steps to socialism. The lack of restricting banks to loaning money is NOT THE GOVENTS JOB!!! If they screw up, they go out of business, just like the company any of us work for.