As a mob raided the Capitol, a Capitol Police officer gave them directions to Chuck Schumer's office, per this Times report: "But they could not find Mr. Schumer’s office. He said they asked a Capitol Police officer, who tried to direct them." https://t.co/suzMuEDHU9

— Jennifer Epstein (@jeneps) January 8, 2021

Senator on MSNBC this morning (before Morning Joe) said there were conflicting reports on what the National Guard (and think she said other police, secret service etc. support units) did or did not do in mobilizing.

I don't know the chain of events, how long it took etc. and not sure if NG is even supposed to get involved in these matters in DC, but looking forward to the findings re: the points of failure in the response.

Not accusing the Cruz led senators with treason but read that anagram for "Senator" is "Treason". Thought that was interesting and funny FWIW.

That's not how that works.

yeah i know but would be funny.

There have been 10 formal investigations into Benghazi (so far. I fully expect the GOP to launch another one when they get control of a house of Congress).

So that's a good starting point, IMO.

The people need faith in their government after all. And if the reports of off-duty police joining the riots, etc. are true, we really need to figure out why.

Ummmmm...

*So far 40 people have been charged with unlawful entry of public property.
*One person was charged with possessing a “military style automatic weapon” and 11 molotov cocktails.
*Another defendant needed a Russian interpreter.https://t.co/P87ltFsETs pic.twitter.com/xTc6FKu418

— Jim Roberts (@nycjim) January 8, 2021

Is it ironic that they'd be a lot harder to identify if they had been wearing COVID masks?

Nothing towards you personally but it amazes me how complex these things become after the fact when the process is so simple.

First let me quote the DC National Guard's own website to address the activation/mobilizing piece.

"This authority to activate the D.C. National Guard has been delegated, by the President, to the Secretary of Defense and further delegated to the Secretary of the Army. The D.C. National Guard is the only National Guard unit, out of all of the 54 states and territories, which reports only to the President."

So at any point, the people in these positions of power or whoever they further delegated that the task to could have activated the DC National Guard at the first sign of trouble.

Or they have fucking activated all of them BEFORE TUESDAY! Again from the DC National Guard website.

"More than 300 Guardsmen are supporting the District of Columbia from Jan. 5 to 7, 2021, at the request of Mayor Muriel Bowser and Dr. Christopher Rodriguez, Director of the D.C. Homeland Security and Emergency Management Agency, on behalf of the D.C. Metropolitan Police Department and D.C. Fire and Emergency Services."

So DCNG were already there. But of course, they were wearing their traditional uniform. I assume they did this as not to be threatening or to antagonize the protestors. Hmm, novel concept. That is why there was so much significance put on about the President activating "the whole DC National Guard" to deal with the situation. Once activated, all they have to do is pull the plans for dealing with riots and protecting the Capitol off the shelf and execute the plans that they train for all year.

Finally as to whether they should or should not be involved in these matters. Again, from the DCNG website,

"The 273rd Military Police Company is a unit aligned under the 372nd Military Police Battalion, District of Columbia Army National Guard. The 273rd Military Police Company is one of the most esteemed units of the District of Columbia Army National Guard. The company supports and augments nearly all major federal events occurring in the District of Columbia. Historically, the company plays a key role in supporting Presidential Inaugurations and the Independence Day celebrations by providing traffic control points, as well as security and mobility support in coordination with local and federal law enforcement agencies. The unit has also been tasked for assistance in supporting community events and overseeing peaceful marches and rallies in the Nation’s Capital. The unit has received two Army Superior Unit Awards, streamer embroidered, in 1996-1997 and in 2008-2009."

This is what they do beyond about anything else. They have been awarded as the best at what they do. Once again, they had already activated 300 of them. The process was not foreign to anyone who cared. To not have the DCNG completely activated (not necessarily deployed) and involved in dealing with this particular rally from the very beginning especially with all the information available about the potential threats is negligence at best and willful dereliction of duty at worst IMO.

I've been thinking about the way out for the GOP. They can't easily get rid of Trump because of his continued popularity with the base, but why not jettison Cruz and Hawley? Nobody likes Cruz and Hawley was abandoned yesterday by all of the power brokers in MO. The GOP would replace both of them, so there's no loss of seats and given the numbers currently there's no functional difference between 50 and 48.

Ditching those two would allow Collins and Murkowski and Romeny and even McConnell to go on TV and say they've purged the extremists and are now once again the party of Ronald Reagan. They could even challenge Dems to denounce and remove the extremists in their party. Then they go back to business like it's 2009 and obstruct everything they can.

I'm quite certain the media would eat that up.

The only reason this shit party has survived this long is because they protect their own, no matter how bad. It's only when their members prove to be moderate or reasonable that they are rejected, not when they are more extreme.

This is a really good thread with a timeline of the insurrection. It has a lot of videos of various angles of the breach that I hadn't seen yet. It's fascinating how few officers were available.

https://twitter.com/_esaliba/status/1347451397755842560

What a complete joke.

“I disagree with it, and I have disagreed with the president's language and rhetoric for the last four years,” he said. https://t.co/M4v1fmVgj2

— Manu Raju (@mkraju) January 8, 2021

Another reason Trump desperately needed to stay in power.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-b1782723.html

The more and more that comes out, the more and more this looks like intentional neglect and an attempted coup only the mob wanted Instagram selfies and to continue to play the aggrieved card, not the actual risk, work, and responsibility of overthrowing government. We've created such a decadent society that they had the keys to the Bastille and all they did was livestream playing dress-up at the seats of power and taking pictures with the cops that were supposed to protect it.

SI

When I said "do or not do in mobilizing", I mean after the Capitol was stormed. There is no doubt there was failure in planning & prep to safe guard the Capitol.

After it went to hell ...

Who called and spoke to whom at the National Guard. What did the NG guy say. How long did they take to respond and why did it take so long?

Rinse and repeat for Secret Service, rinse and repeat for more local cops/SWAT etc. That's what I would like to know.

My favorite Cruz bit is that G.W. Bush personally disliked him so much that he pulled strings to get him named Solicitor General of Texas just to get Cruz out of Bush's White House.

You hear stories about the personal likeability and magnetism of people like Reagan and Bill Clinton and how you just wanted to be in the room with them.

Cruz seems to have the exact opposite of whatever that is. The closer people are to him, the more they seem to just be revolted by him personally.

Rafael taking a lot of heat on Twitter today for his obvious two-facedness

SI

He seems like this mix of a power hungry sort who has no scruples and you have to watch your back and that dork in the front of the class who thinks he's smarter than he is so he always corrects the teacher but not before asking her why she forgot to do the quiz at the start of class.

SI

So, it's darkly humorous in a "you get what you deserve sort of way", I guess. But I just feel more pity than anything.

And concern: this is how people get radicalized. Trump is just a morally bankrupt carnival barker who used these people for crass political gain. But, down the road, there may be a genuine true believer who can rally these people as zealots. Would anyone be really shocked to find out that a disproportionate number of future mass shooting or suicide bomb incidents come from people who were a part of this?

Or, if we're in the darkest timeline, this was the Beer Hall Putsch for these people and 20 years down the road when the new Nazis take over - we're going to find out that a lot of the major players were at the Capitol on Wednesday connecting up or solidifying a connection they had made online.

SI

In good senate news, Lt. Gov. John Fetterman is looking like he will run for the open senate seat in 2022 (currently held by Pat Toomey-R, who is retiring): Pennsylvania Lt. Gov. John Fetterman eyes 2022 Senate run | Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

The bigger concern are the clips I see in churches where there is blatant political discussion. It's been years since I regularly attended church, but I don't recall anything like that and I'd walk out if it happened. The intersection of religion and politics is where the real danger lies. Not that history hasn't already shown us that multiple times over.

He's a shit weasel and has been that way since the beginning.

Christ, I should run for congress as a Republican, complain about Democrats, throw shade on minorities, get into office off the racists goobers, obstruct, and then complain that Democrats keep you from doing anything except giving the elite deep tax cuts.

Rinse, repeat, re-elect...you don't have to do anything but complain on those trying to establish policy because conservatives literally want nothing to change the power structure.

You gotta love it:

My goodness…

Dominion Voting Systems files $1.3 billion defamation lawsuit against pro-Trump election attorney Sidney Powell https://t.co/dHPeolpGPF via @businessinsider

— Nicholas Carlson (@nichcarlson) January 8, 2021

Good, he's got my vote.

I think a small number of them had a clear plan to destroy the ballots and take people hostage. They just couldn't get there in time.

He'll be the first politician I've contributed money to in a very long time.

Maybe, but here is the good news...these cockroaches have to deal with social media...so they all get outed and they're losing their jobs. Their dear leader just turned on them, and some of them are going to be rounded up on murder charges...and if that Russian is a spy, then perhaps espionage aid as well....I'd throw the book at them and then see how they handle a taste of prison with the ones they call "animals".

There are always extremists...the next administration needs to hunt and destroy the militia groups, need to defund them, and when we see who they fund (media or political) shine the light hard.

I remember Waco, Oklahoma City, and 9/11. The perpetrators aren't different...

Yes, it a humorous look at something that is actually sad/dangerous. Further, I imagine we are entering the good news/bad news faze of combating these extremest.

Good news: The new administration is going to take these threats seriously. The FBI and Justice department is going to be taken off the leash and start bringing many groups down. That should drive them deeper underground and make recruiting harder.

Bad News: Government crack-down just feeds the radicalization. It will be used as proof that the government is over-bearing, and push them to more extreme acts.

I remember all the stories in the 90s after OKC where stuff like 60 Minutes was investigating militias so it's not new at all. And if 60 Minutes was reporting on it, it was probably already stale news that was out there and law enforcement had been working on for years.

SI

There will be secession / Civil War if one of these "smart" Nazis makes his way into power just by demonizing the right people.

I don't even understand what there is to demonize. I guess any and all groups that are non-white, non-straight, non-cis, non-male, non-GOP, non-Christian. But most people fall into one of these buckets. It makes no sense.

It will be interesting to see if this officer's tragic murder will result in more significant felony charges for some or all of those who illegal raided the Capitol. If the officer died inside the building during the insurrection, I think an argument could be made that everyone who illegal entered could be charged with a felony due to the loss of life.

It's similar to the notion that if you participate in a robbery, and someone is killed during the robbery, even if you didn't kill the person and had nothing to do with the death, you can still be charged with a more serious offense for simply participating in the underlying crime.

TRUMP IS BACK ON TWITTER!!!!

Though I think that could be legally argued (they all could be charged with Murder in the commision of a felony), it isn't likely. It probably just be just a handful of the "leaders."

Major Southern Baptist voice:

Mr. President, people are dead. The Capitol is ransacked. There are 12 dangerous days for our country left.

Could you please step down and let our country heal? https://t.co/wP3niITQv6

— Russell Moore (@drmoore) January 8, 2021

Least shocking news ever...

To all of those who have asked, I will not be going to the Inauguration on January 20th.

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) January 8, 2021

I am a public defender.

The feeling the GOP Leadership has upon learning that Trump is tweeting again is the same feeling I have when a client tells me "I just wrote a letter to the judge . . . "

Nothing good will come of this for America, the GOP, or Trump.

I'd think it depends on the laws and jurisdiction (is the Capitol federal or D.C.?) I know that in Georgia, if you commit any felony and someone dies--not even directly from your hand--you can be charged with felony murder. (That's how they're charging all three guys in the Arbery killing, for example.) But I'd think it'd have to be a law already on the books.

https://apnews.com/article/andy-kim-...ef7e1a17509371

This is my homeowner's Congressperson. This story made me quite emotional to be honest.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

Someone with Trump's ear needs to convince him that quitting is the power play.

"The Corrupt Democrat Party (and China) wants to impeach your favorite President to play political games. SICK. I won't let them. Today we begin to MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN. Sorry to ruin your party, Nancy! See you in 2024!!!"

So let me guess...Trump tried to pull a coup, his followers were too stupid to effectively do what I'm sure was "unwritten", he left the Capitol to burn out of spite. Pence actually did his job, and even with some dumb fuck Republicans, Congress recognized the EC.

Jump to Trump's attorney's telling him he had to say something to stand the violence for the purposes of legal reasons (not because he's a human being).

His expectation was that Republicans in Congress would do the same as his idiot followers, they didn't...

SO, after playing "nice" dumb fuck Jack Dorsey withdraws the restriction , he's back on twitter...

The purpose is clear, after trying to burn the nation down, he wants to burn the Republican party down...it's clear that he's forcing them to join him in the phase of the party or he's taking the party with him.

They'll fall in line like the weak pieces of shit they are...

Or, Trump will take the true believers and splinter the GOP.

My Young Life leader, the man who led me to Jesus, the man who would later become my pastor, the man who years later was the hospital chaplain when my mother died, the man who was the first person to contact me and ask what he could do when my niece committed suicide and I was in a car en route to Columbus, a man whom I've been in continual close contact for 33 years, is a man I've only heard curse once, in the spring of 2016: "Ted Cruz is a 100% thoroughbred asshole!"

That dear man can always be counted upon to speak truth into my life. :)

Awww poor little trumpy won't attend the inauguration. No surprise at all from the coward in chief.

Nobody cares if the President who led an insurrection on the Capitol is not attending an inauguration.

Every single person that was inside the Capitol can be charged with a felony already, as it is a felony in and of itself to forcefully enter the Capitol Building specifically.

Absolutely true. Although I kinda hope he says one or two more things that pushes GOP approval of impeachment to the tipping point.

This will only happen (and it would definitely happen) if there was any chance the Senate would convict. There isn't so he won't. There still maybe a chance that he will resign for a Pence pardon, but I don't think that is a shoe-in to happen. I think he sends out a roll of pardons that includes himself on January 20 at 11:59 am, and he will use any attempt at over turning his self-pardon as proof of political persecution.

Dominion suing Sidney Powell for over 1 billion dollars.

Yeah I have no idea what the law in DC is on felony murder, but I hope it is applied here.

Back in law school, I had a classmate who was kidnapped at gunpoint after his late-night shift at Steak and Ale. They wanted him to go to the ATM and take out money. He didn't have his bank card with him, so they directed him to drive home to get it. At home was his wife and newborn. One dude was in the front passenger seat, the other dude in the backseat. When he took the ramp onto I-10 there was a semi parked on the shoulder. He floored it and drove straight into the back of the semi, killing the guy in the front seat. He and the dude in the backseat survived. They charged and convicted the survivor on a felony murder charge.

I also had a classmate who was convicted of putting a hit out on a law school administrative assistant. Quite an interesting 3 years I spent at FSU law school, lol.

This was all part of the plan to get Trump's evidence of voter fraud heard!

Same here

Holy hell, only in Florida LOL

In terms of general criminal liability for what happened, from the snippets I saw of the pre-riot rally, I think Rudy is in trouble. In the context of what happened, encouraging "trial by combat" immediately before is going to be extremely difficult to get around.

But it's clear there was a loose plan/understanding that this wasn't just a rally or protest. Some woman from the Dallas area who flew to DC on a private plane was posting on social media about storming the capitol before they left Dallas. I think the whole thing was a mix of serious insurrectionists, "regular" (non-violent) Trump supporters, carnival sideshow observers, and some form of CFB tailgate-like partiers.

Rioting, trespassing, destruction of property, etc., aren't predicate felonies for felony murder. Maybe if someone committed armed robbery (meaning taking property by use of force or threatened force - not just looting).

But I think they'd have to be working in particular concert with whoever specifically killed anyone or was killed, being a part of the same giant mob doesn't seem like it would fit to me. There is a timing and proximity component that goes with someone being killed in the perpetration of a violent underlying predicate felony.

I don't know how the officer or any others there died, but if there was also a serious felony committed in the circumstances of his death like an attempted armed robbery, than those who committed that felony could be on the hook. But not someone who just is also rioting somewhere in the general area.

Are you saying you know that's the case in DC? Because in Georgia it is any felony.

Rudy is getting a pardon, so he has little to worry about.

That's what I couldn't remember. But this was more than just trespassing. They forcibly entered and often used violence to continue moving in to restricted areas. Granted, I think the conduct of the police is going to come into play here, what with the moving barricades and taking selfies, letting them walk through the velvet ropes like on a field trip.

Meanwhile the impeachment talk appears to be growing in strength while also moving suspiciously farther away. We WILL impeach tomorrow....I mean Monday....I mean 'mid next week'.

The suggestion that he absolutely needs to be dealt with in the 13 days before his term ends, but also can wait until the middle of next week is fundamentally baffling.

I think it is a waste of time and it might backfire. If they actually had a chance to remove him, sure. As a symbolic gesture, the first one didn't make difference how will the second?

If Trump is impeached can he run again in 24?

If convicted, and then the Senate votes to not allow him. Just impeached? No.

The Waist of TIme

Cute. I hate auto-correct.

It looks like these are the federal law predicates for felony murder:

arson, escape, murder, kidnapping, treason, espionage, sabotage, aggravated sexual abuse or sexual abuse, child abuse, burglary, or robbery; or perpetrated as part of a pattern or practice of assault or torture against a child or children.

I think time and proximity would still be a big thing too. I'm never dealt with this issue in particular in a brief. But just scanning elements and jury instructions from various states real quick, the defendant or their "accomplice" has to commit the murder in furtherance of whatever the underlying crime is. I think that's a stretch if we're talking people who haven't even necessarily met, and where the underlying crime (even if it could be breaking a window and trespassing), isn't really related to the murder itself even if it's all in the same big riot.

When you REALLY hate a defendant, and I hate all of these fuckers, you have to take a step back and imagine the same kind of charge where you have more sympathy for the defendant. We're skeptical enough of the felony murders statutes when they fit the statute clearly, like when three guys break into a house, and in the commission of that crime, one of the accomplices kills the homeowner.

Edit: The most controversial applications of the rule in those situations is usually when one kid is waiting as the getaway driver outside. But he's still clearly an accomplice to the burglary, and the people who had different roles in it. If that's kind of close to the line of fitting the statute, then this seems way, way beyond it. Again, unless the particular circumstances of anyone's death there is connected with another felony crime. It wouldn't take much to establish people as accomplices committing a crime.

This is a cult of personality surrounding a quivering jelly of ego. A symbolic gesture is absolutely worth it. Symbols are practically driving that mob. Put twice impeached next to his name in the history books, put the undisputed Worst President Ever title belt on the man. Let him carry it forever.

I think you could make a "burglary" case for many in that crowd, but regardless it is unlikely they will charge anyone with murder except those directly involved. Because there are camera everywhere, they will probably have some hard visible evidence to go on to see who who was there.

I think they missed the window, but if they had impeached yesterday I'm pretty sure the Senate would have convicted and removed today. Each day, though, makes it less likely to happen. I don't know what craven or self-serving interests Pelosi is beholden to, but she doesn't seem to have any desire to move forward.

If there were 6 or 8 rioters they may charge them all with murder, but they aren't going to charge a couple of hundred or more.

But if you are going to something symbolic, why not censure? That would be bi-partisan, and piss him off as much.

Joke I heard last week (Spoiler about The Mandalorian)

Pretty amazing letter: Dear Colleague on Events of the Past Week | Speaker Nancy Pelosi

Because censure is a complete waste of time

So is impeachment when there is no chance of conviction.

No, it isn't. History books won't mention censure, but they'll sure mention impeachment even if there is no conviction

I fundamentally disagree that censuring him would be in any way comparable to a second impeachment.

Actually, history books do mention censure. It is just as much history as a impeachment.

The closest situation I've heard to a felony murder was those people that were trying to break down that one barrier to get to where Pence was, and the one lady got shot and killed. Maybe everyone participating in that particular breach is a lot closer to being a felony murderer. There may have been other individual situations like that. But I don't think you can bring in hundreds of others under the felony murder statute just because they were also trespassing at the time.

I also wonder if, with so many GOPers speaking out, impeachment will be enough to get him to resign if he believes he might actually be convicted.

And we will disagree. Having a majority of Republicans as well as Democrats officially condeming the act will have much more weight than a largely Democrat only impeachment that will be chalked up to partisanship.

That you have to point this out should speak for itself.

Looks like McConnell isn't going to talk to his BFF on the phone anymore

OK. I literally have no idea if any presidents have ever been censured. Perhaps history majors know. I understand this is my own personal bias showing through, but I was a political science major. It's just not as important.

Censure is just "I don't like that thing he said and he shouldn't say it again". It is very easy for GOP to vote for that.

Impeachment is "that thing he said should require him to be removed from office." And will require people to go on the record with their support of it. Important.

He would resign long before conviction, but they are not getting 19 Republicans to convict. They might get 4 or 5.

FFS. If you believe this you must impeach immediately. It isn't someone else's job to save us.

Agreed.

She. Is. Grandstanding.

At this point, I doubt McConnell would even put the impeachment up for a vote. Why make his members take such a politically fraught vote.

My sense is that no one is quite sure what to do at this point, and maybe they are all just kind of hoping that Trump makes the decision for them by resigning or by tweeting something so abhorrent that they can use that as cover for removal.

Actually, it doesn't. There has only been one censure in history that was directly of a President, and that was Andrew Jackson. I am far from a history major, or even that smart, but I knew that. Censure is always mentioned when talking about Jackson, just like impeachment.

If you truly thought him so dangerous that he might cause the end of the world...

1. You'd have kept your butt in the Capitol after the certification and moved toward impeachment ASAP.
2. You wouldn't scare the crap out of the American people by making it public that you had to make that call.

I would impeach in the House even if there's no chance of conviction in the Senate. It's the right thing to do for one, and you want all the Rs on record. If they want to defend the coup then they're on the record. My guess is the Senate won't want to defend it. Whether there's enough to convict or not I dont know. I would hope the Toomeys and Sasses would vote to convict but if not they're on the record defending treason.

You vote to impeach. If McConnell sits on it and then Trump does something worse, then you have your election fodder for the next decade on how the Republicans helped a madman stay in office.

You do it and then take over the title party of Law and Order.

Also Ben, you do realize they were rushed out because of a fascist mob then they reconvened, and they still had dickheads like Hawley and Jim Jordan drag out the process until like 4 in the morning. Boyfucking Matt Gaetz was applauded stating it was Antifa and not Trump's shit eaters.

Look at the whole picture...Trump wasn't even silenced by his own party, he was silenced by social media companies.

The American people I'm pretty sure were fucking relieved when the Orangucon was on time out for 24 hours...

You're in a discussion with multiple people insisting that censure totally has the same cultural & historical impact as impeachment because, out of that group, only you remember that Andrew Jackson was censured. You're still not seeing the irony there?

Because we aren't thinking about Jackson. In 150 years, people won't readily thinking about Trump either. But those that do, will remember if he was censured.

It's certainly not worth arguing further, but your argument is baffling to me.

I don't know if they'll remembered he was censured; I hope they remember he was an idiot asshole

You're forgetting one thing, Ben. The weekend! And it's Super Wildcard Weekend to boot!