Lakers vs Magic and the 2008-2009 NBA Playoffs/Finals Thread

[larrymcg421]

What did Perkins do to get a technical?

[SirFozzie]

Technical Foul for swearing about a Bull hurting his shoulder? Are you fucking KIDDING me?

[DaddyTorgo]

that's a bullshit call by the fucking refs

[DaddyTorgo]

how is that

a) a technical?

b) a technical on the guy who GOT fouled?

that's exhibit A for "Why I hate the nba" - makes ZERO fucking sense

[hoopsguy]

Doc, please put in Tony Allen. K, thx.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Doc, please put in Tony Allen. K, thx.

Um please do not listen to him Doc. Keep Tony right where he is.

[SirFozzie]

Gordon should be VERRRRRRRRY careful he just grabbed the ref by both hands.

[hoopsguy]

I'm calling game. Not enough time, and Vinny is drawing up a play in huddle. I think the latter is a bigger issue than the former.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Gordon should be VERRRRRRRRY careful he just grabbed the ref by both hands.

Well at least he didn't swear.

[Radii]

my summary of the series:

the success of the bulls is inversely proportional to how often Ben Gordon has the ball in his hands during the final two minutes of a game/OT Period.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Gordon should be VERRRRRRRRY careful he just grabbed the ref by both hands.

at least he didn't grab the refs crotch.


Gorden has to make that 5 foot floater.

[SirFozzie]

Come on C's.. don't DO this to me.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Radii

my summary of the series:

the success of the bulls is inversely proportional to how often Ben Gordon has the ball in his hands during the final two minutes of a game/OT Period.

I probably like Gordon less than just about anyone in Chicago, but I don't think this is fair based on his production earlier in the series. He was out of control hot in Games 2 and 3 and probably has been limited by the hamstring over the past couple of games.

However, when he has to create his own shot against a set defense then bad things usually happen. When he is in on defense in crunch teams bad things invariably happen. When the other guys sit around and wait for Ben to throw one in, bad things happen about 100% of the time.

[SirFozzie]

Hoops: Is it me, or do the Bulls do a lot more 1 on 1, make your own space type things, compared to the Celtics, who run a lot more plays/screens to give people space?

[Radii]

Yeah to be fair I am not an NBA fan but got into this series based on the rose/rondo fun early on. It is the 1 on 1, Gordon forcing things in tight situations when Rose was having much better games and seemed a better option that is what I'm primarily reacting to.

[hoopsguy]

SirFozzie, I think that is a fair point. Rondo is a much more pure PG than Rose at this point in their careers and Pierce really does a nice job at playing the point forward role. Both of those guys help establish easier shots for their teammates better than anyone on the Bulls right now.

The Bulls definitely do try to create shots for Gordon off of screens, and Rose/Miller run a fair amount of pick-and-roll, but the team does have a bunch of guys who put the ball on the floor and go to the rim. They then look to pound the offensive boards with Noah (who gets a bunch of them), Thomas (who really disappeared as this series went on, and is frustrating because people project him to his potential rather than what he is) and Rose.

Well, those are my impressions based on watching less Bulls games this year than I have in quite some time. From what I've read on here guys like RainMaker, Neuqua, and Coffee Warlord have probably seen a few more games start to finish than I have this year.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Radii

Yeah to be fair I am not an NBA fan but got into this series based on the rose/rondo fun early on. It is the 1 on 1, Gordon forcing things in tight situations when Rose was having much better games and seemed a better option that is what I'm primarily reacting to.

Honestly, you take Gordon shooting the ball rather than passing it because he is pretty frightening when he tries to create for his teammates. Very high turnovers, which is disappointing because he is vertically challenged for a SG. You would like him to have a bit better handles.

Rose is going to get better, and more assertive, over the next couple of years. But he is not there yet, at least not every night. He seemed to be hiding from the ball at the end of Game 6, to pick one example. And this was after having a great first half.

[RainMaker]

I know a lot of people like Gordon but I still believe he is actually bad for this team. Yes he gets hot and can single handidly win you a game from time to time. But he's also a guy who can get real cold and won't stop shooting (tonight for example). His defense is horrible and the Celtics exploited him regularly on that end. He's also a me-first player who doesn't involve his teammates in the game. There are just some trips down the floor that he's got it engraved in his head that he has to shoot.

He has a ton of talent and is one of a handful of guys in the league that can put 40 up on you any night. But I feel he needs to play within the flow of the game better. If teams are rushing to trap him off the screens, he needs to pass out of it. He needs to get more shots off of kickouts from his PG. He goes into every game thinking he must take 20 shots when he should determine those shots based on what's best for the team.

But most importantly, he hurts Rose. There are times where Rose won't be involved in the offense for 5-6 consecutive trips. He's the most athletic player in the league and the future of your organization. The offense should for the most part revolve around him.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Thomas (who really disappeared as this series went on, and is frustrating because people project him to his potential rather than what he is) and Rose.

Thomas has problems on offense. He think he's an outside shooter despite what the coaches have told him. I think the team just gave up on him and his lack of playing time in the playoffs has been a sign of that.

It's sad because he's got a ton of potential. I would have loved to have seen him out there more in this game when we were getting killed inside. But Vinny is clueless and refused to put Tyrus in when we needed a shotblocker so badly.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Mostly Bulls fans elsewhere (the ones who are saying Stern and the Celtics are in cahoots, yadda yadda yadda )

I never said they were in cahoots. I said there was a huge double standard with Stern and how he disciplines players.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Karlifornia

Ben Gordon is going to shoot the Bulls out of this one.

Ugh, seriously. I really hope they don't bring him back next season, or at least if they do, it's only as a backup -- no wait, the guy is just poison.

[Big Fo]

On the bright side for Bulls fans, the goodwill generated by a long playoff run might have given del Negro an extra year in the future before his eventual firing/resignation. Maybe he'll improve in the future but right now I wouldn't be happy with him in charge of my team.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

On the bright side for Bulls fans, the goodwill generated by a long playoff run might have given del Negro an extra year in the future before his eventual firing/resignation. Maybe he'll improve in the future but right now I wouldn't be happy with him in charge of my team.

It's bad enough we took the Celtics to 7. People actually think Del Negro is competent and "learning". The whole hiring was a slap in the face to Bulls fans. He is one of the worst coaches in the league.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I know a lot of people like Gordon but I still believe he is actually bad for this team. Yes he gets hot and can single handidly win you a game from time to time. But he's also a guy who can get real cold and won't stop shooting (tonight for example). His defense is horrible and the Celtics exploited him regularly on that end. He's also a me-first player who doesn't involve his teammates in the game. There are just some trips down the floor that he's got it engraved in his head that he has to shoot.

He has a ton of talent and is one of a handful of guys in the league that can put 40 up on you any night. But I feel he needs to play within the flow of the game better. If teams are rushing to trap him off the screens, he needs to pass out of it. He needs to get more shots off of kickouts from his PG. He goes into every game thinking he must take 20 shots when he should determine those shots based on what's best for the team.

But most importantly, he hurts Rose. There are times where Rose won't be involved in the offense for 5-6 consecutive trips. He's the most athletic player in the league and the future of your organization. The offense should for the most part revolve around him.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I don't watch much basketball, but it seems like Gordon is not good enough to carry this team to dominance alone, and not willing to play as a team. Plus from the looks of it, I'm pretty sure Salmons hates him.

[Groundhog]

Ben Gordon is the Zach Randolph of perimeter players.

[bhlloy]

Yeah, really seems like there are two ways to look at this series. One is that the Bulls did an awesome job taking the defending champions to seven games. The other is that the Celtics are hugely weakened without Garnett (and his backup), didn't play to their best and any team that was semi-decently coached would have wrapped it up in 5.

The best thing for this Bulls team IMO is that Gordon leaves, and they get an experienced coach to mentor Rose, Thomas and Noah. Seems like they have a great young core of players, but some of Vinny's decisions in this series were just bizarre. How many minutes did Lindsay Hunter play again?

[RainMaker]

I think the Celtics are still the 2nd best team in the conference even without Garnett. I just think the Bulls were a really bad matchup for them based on their style of play.

[bulletsponge]

my bold prediction for next season: Vinny DelNegro will be fired before the end of next season

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by bulletsponge

my bold prediction for next season: Vinny DelNegro will be fired before the end of next season

Can we make that 'Vinny will be fired now?', please?

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Yeah, really seems like there are two ways to look at this series. One is that the Bulls did an awesome job taking the defending champions to seven games. The other is that the Celtics are hugely weakened without Garnett (and his backup), didn't play to their best and any team that was semi-decently coached would have wrapped it up in 5.

The best thing for this Bulls team IMO is that Gordon leaves, and they get an experienced coach to mentor Rose, Thomas and Noah. Seems like they have a great young core of players, but some of Vinny's decisions in this series were just bizarre. How many minutes did Lindsay Hunter play again?

The best thing for the Bulls will be if they learn from the mistakes of a couple of years ago. Good young team coming off a playoff sweep against the defending champs (Heat) and a 4-2 series lost against the Pistons. All of a sudden, they are trying to trade half the team for Kobe, guys were turning down contracts etc. Hopefully they build on this performance.

[Passacaglia]

So a lot of weekdays had 3 games going on, but on the weekend we get one game on Saturday and two on Sunday? What genius let this happen?

[whomario]

Chris Andersen is sporting like the most ridiculous haircut ever, that Gel-Hawk is hideous ... Totally changed the game with his energy though, could be that the Mavs were busy laughing ...

In related news, Nuggets and Mavs is close right now at the half. Got Anthony in foul trouble held to 4 points in 11 minutes. And Billups hasn´t got going yet as well with only 3. Nene though has been a beast with 18.
Nuggets go from 16-24 to 51-47 in the 2nd quarter.

And Atlanta advances behing an efficient 27/5/4 with 5 steals and just 1 TO on 11/19 FG by Joe Johnson. Made 6 of 8 thress. Smith was pretty good as well today.
The Heat were a typical one-man-operation tonight and Wade couldn´t come through enough to make it work, they basically ran the same play over and over and over ... Made the Trail Blazers look creative.

[whomario]

some of the shots Nowitzki sinks are just sick, other players that height would like twist an ankle or snap their back taking those off-balance fadeshots off of one leg.

And a 7 footer taking 20 shots a game while handling the ball all the time and being doubled constantly shouldn´t be able to average below 2 TOpg ...

Nice run by the Mavs with Kidd hitting his shots, came back from down 10 now to go up 2.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Quirky stat from the Hawks-Heat series

There were only 15 lead changes in seven games -- not one of them after the opening period.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Quirky stat from the Hawks-Heat series

Admittedly I didn't watch any of this series but based off the stats this seems to be the worst seven game series in any sport ever. Just fascinating how it went.

[Big Fo]

Awesome first half from Orlando. Keeping big leads was a problem against the 76ers though so this one isn't over. Marbury was Boston's best guy in the first half.

[DaddyTorgo]

C's looking VERY lifeless tonight. Not surprising - I will give them the first half of game 2 to see if they've got energy and some type of plan to contain orlando

[Big Fo]

JJ Redick makes it a 28 point lead. This is beautiful.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

JJ Redick makes it a 28 point lead. This is beautiful.

C's are exhausted AND they just don't have the horses to keep up with orlando i think, even if they weren't all tired (emotionally and physically)

[Big Fo]

What did I say about Orlando and holding leads. Down to 16.

[Big Fo]

Reddick had all ball there. Might as well let Usain Bolt be an NBA point guard if all you have to do is run fast and barge into people to get calls.

[Galaxy]

The Celtics are certainly making this interesting.

[Easy Mac]

I don't think I've seen a made Fg in the 4th quarter

[DaddyTorgo]

wow - the C's aren't making it easy (if they'd hit shots they'd be ahead by now) but it's now 89-83 magic with 2:40 to go!!!

could be another tight finish!

[DaddyTorgo]

2 mins to go, 4pt lead with orlando...6 now with 1:47 to go

[DaddyTorgo]

lol

4pt game and orlando commits an 8 second violation with 35 seconds left

ray allen just had a 3 rattle and fall off the rim that woulda cut it to 1 right before

[Big Fo]

Boston fans with the audacity to criticize the reffing after this second half

[larrymcg421]

How the fuck is that not a foul on Howard? Seriously, I'd like to hear an explanation as to why that's not a foul.

[Easy Mac]

Because it wasnt?

[whomario]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

How the fuck is that not a foul on Howard? Seriously, I'd like to hear an explanation as to why that's not a foul.

If a defender goes straight up and stays in "his area" there can be as much contact as you want as long as it´s not by the hand. It gets whistled a lot, but it shouldn´t by the rules and it didn´t this time. Fair Call.