Let the trades begin

kingfc22 · 07-13-2005, 10:07 PM

The Rockies dealt Preston Wilson to the Nats and then got Eric Brynes from the A's.

hxxp://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2107378

Crapshoot · 07-13-2005, 10:18 PM

Jim Bowden is an idiot- but that's hardly news. Preston Wilson is hardly better than your average schlub OF at this point - and he's going to sit Ryan Church, a better hitter, for this.

Ksyrup · 07-13-2005, 10:18 PM

Boston and the A's completed the Payton/Bradford deal, but now Payton may be going to the Yankees.

Nationals signed Mike Stanton.

Blue Jays and Marlins might have a deal for AJ Burnett, but only if he agrees to a contract extension.

Red Sox may trade Millar to Houston.

Devil Rays pick up of Borowski means Baez is even more likely to be shipped to the Marlins, Braves, Cubs, or Rangers.

korme · 07-13-2005, 10:19 PM

WOW to every trade so far

Arles · 07-13-2005, 10:26 PM

I like what the Rockies did. Getting Byrnes, Day and a couple prospects for Wilson, Kennedy and Whitasick seems like good value for them. I don't think the A's did all that badly and it seems that Nationals are hoping Wilson follows what Burnitz is doing out of Coors field.

Balldog · 07-13-2005, 10:38 PM

Typical Bowden, I don't think he realizes you can only play 3 OFers at a time in the NL. He now has Wilkerson, Church, Guillen, Byrd, and Wilson.

Fouts · 07-13-2005, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

I like what the Rockies did. Getting Byrnes, Day and a couple prospects for Wilson, Kennedy and Whitasick seems like good value for them. I don't think the A's did all that badly and it seems that Nationals are hoping Wilson follows what Burnitz is doing out of Coors field.

Byrnes is a fan favorite in Oakland, surprised they traded him. There goes half of their in-between inning highlights. I suppose they made out though, if you count the payton deal.

Crapshoot · 07-13-2005, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles

I like what the Rockies did. Getting Byrnes, Day and a couple prospects for Wilson, Kennedy and Whitasick seems like good value for them. I don't think the A's did all that badly and it seems that Nationals are hoping Wilson follows what Burnitz is doing out of Coors field.

You're kidding right ? The wilson deal was decent, but Day is at best a mediocre starter- should have seen what kind of loot the Yanks would have offered. As for the A's trade- all they did is trade for what BP aptly called a HTWG - Hustling Telegenic White Guy. Not much in the way of skill, but people love em!

Toddzilla · 07-13-2005, 10:59 PM

The Preston Wilson move was idiotic, but then again Day and Davis were never going to play in DC anyway. However, like Balldog said, The Nats now have too many outfielders. For the time being Wilkerson moves to virst, but what happens when Nick Johnson comes back? Who's the odd man out? Johnson? Byrd?

Arles · 07-13-2005, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

You're kidding right ? The wilson deal was decent, but Day is at best a mediocre starter- should have seen what kind of loot the Yanks would have offered. As for the A's trade- all they did is trade for what BP aptly called a HTWG - Hustling Telegenic White Guy. Not much in the way of skill, but people love em!

Wilson and Kennedy (lost his starting spot on the Rockies) are way overrated, IMO. Whitasick (aging middle reliever) was a waste of space on the Rockies roster given their team right now. Day and Burns are decent value, plus the prospects. I think the A's did well too and the Nationals got their bat. Still, I don't think anyone was going to overpay in a trade for Wilson and I think Byrnes probably had more value.

Buccaneer · 07-13-2005, 11:11 PM

I'm anxiously awaiting the news of Adam Dunn being traded to the Pads.

bbor · 07-13-2005, 11:11 PM

Any idea who the Jays are giving up for Burnett?.....I imagine it's Orlando Hudson plus???

MikeVic · 07-13-2005, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbor

Any idea who the Jays are giving up for Burnett?.....I imagine it's Orlando Hudson plus???

Ahh.. I like Burnett, but I really like O-Dog.

korme · 07-13-2005, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

I'm anxiously awaiting the news of Adam Dunn being traded to the Pads.

Don't know how well he'd do in Petco.

Travis · 07-13-2005, 11:26 PM

As far as the Jays are concerned, rumors were surrounding Hudson, Batista and Chacin as the main possible proponents in the deal. The Jays were hoping to make Lilly or Bush the main player on their side of the deal, but I would hope that they make it Hudson and swing one of the two young guys over to 2B as we have 3 guys to man the corners and play DH (plus an extra OF body or two).

No way can we afford to lose Batista if they want to try and make a run this year, and to lose Lilly or Chacin at this point hurts the rotation as much as you're helping it. Now if you can throw a rotation of Halladay, Lilly, Burnett, Chacin and Towers (if they are still in it once Roy returns), they've got a helluva chance so long as the mid relievers don't lose them a glut of ball games.

bbor · 07-14-2005, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Travis

As far as the Jays are concerned, rumors were surrounding Hudson, Batista and Chacin as the main possible proponents in the deal. The Jays were hoping to make Lilly or Bush the main player on their side of the deal, but I would hope that they make it Hudson and swing one of the two young guys over to 2B as we have 3 guys to man the corners and play DH (plus an extra OF body or two).

No way can we afford to lose Batista if they want to try and make a run this year, and to lose Lilly or Chacin at this point hurts the rotation as much as you're helping it. Now if you can throw a rotation of Halladay, Lilly, Burnett, Chacin and Towers (if they are still in it once Roy returns), they've got a helluva chance so long as the mid relievers don't lose them a glut of ball games.

I dunno if they'd give up anyone in their starting rotation right now....i think they want Burnett to replace Halladay until he comes back.Giving up a starter for him would make the deal redundant.I think Hudson,Catalanoto,Rios,Gross could be on they way out.I wish i could add Hinske to that list,but who would want him?

Travis · 07-14-2005, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbor

I dunno if they'd give up anyone in their starting rotation right now....i think they want Burnett to replace Halladay until he comes back.Giving up a starter for him would make the deal redundant.I think Hudson,Catalanoto,Rios,Gross could be on they way out.I wish i could add Hinske to that list,but who would want him?

You forget, you're using logic and common sense

From what I've read, Florida is looking for pen help, but Batista's salary is pretty prohibitive for him to be involved (which is nice because really, other than him, who do we have in the pen?).

Chacin seems to be one that Florida wants, though the Jays would rather offer Bush (giving up too quickly?) or Lilly (older more expensive lefty, not sure if I'd be in favor of this over Chacin though, he's been on fire lately).

I'm with you in wishing we'd package something of Hudson, Hinske and Catalanotto (have Johnson, Wells and Rios starting with Gross possibly platooning with Reed). Could move one of the young guys to second with Koskie coming back to play 3B, that'd bump Shea to DH with Hinske (just can't see anybody biting on him) at 1B.

I really hope we don't move Lilly/Chacin/Rios. I really think Rios could develop into a great 3 or 5 hitter, and if we're going to get through the month without Halladay, a lot of it will come down to Lilly maintaining the hot streak he's riding right now.

JeeberD · 07-14-2005, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

I'm anxiously awaiting the news of Adam Dunn being traded to the Pads.

Sorry, but he's coming to Houston...

MIJB#19 · 07-14-2005, 06:57 AM

Why the [bleep] haven't these MLB teams given me a phone call? There a potential dream job for me there! (Yeah, I may not like baseball that much, but I know the basics a bit and can learn to at least appreciate the game...)

Ksyrup · 07-14-2005, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbor

I dunno if they'd give up anyone in their starting rotation right now....i think they want Burnett to replace Halladay until he comes back.Giving up a starter for him would make the deal redundant.

Apparently not...

With The Blue Jays reeling from Roy Halladay's injury, they could be the favorites to land AJ Burnett. The key would be Burnett agreeing to a contract extension with the Blue Jays.
Apparently the Marlins covet Toronto's rookie left-hander Gustavo Chacin and Toronto will part with him if it lands them Burnett. ''If [Toronto] could sign Burnett, the deal would get done now,'' the source said. Stay tuned. Jul. 13 - 11:38 am et

ice4277 · 07-14-2005, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Apparently not...

With The Blue Jays reeling from Roy Halladay's injury, they could be the favorites to land AJ Burnett. The key would be Burnett agreeing to a contract extension with the Blue Jays.
Apparently the Marlins covet Toronto's rookie left-hander Gustavo Chacin and Toronto will part with him if it lands them Burnett. ''If [Toronto] could sign Burnett, the deal would get done now,'' the source said. Stay tuned. Jul. 13 - 11:38 am et

The Marlins also are apparently trying to land Mike Maroth from the Tigers to help cover the loss of Burnett.

Chas in Cinti · 07-14-2005, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

The Preston Wilson move was idiotic, but then again Day and Davis were never going to play in DC anyway. However, like Balldog said, The Nats now have too many outfielders. For the time being Wilkerson moves to virst, but what happens when Nick Johnson comes back? Who's the odd man out? Johnson? Byrd?

Wilson's knee has been progressing like gang-busters the past month and his performance has began to rebound. I think you'll see him in left, with Wilkerson and Guillen, respectively completing the outfield. Johnson will regain his 1B job upon his return from injury (and why not, he's been on base in all but 4 games he's played) and Byrd and Church will take their well-earned positions next to Wil Cordero on the pine...

Regards,
Chas

MikeVic · 07-14-2005, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Apparently not...

With The Blue Jays reeling from Roy Halladay's injury, they could be the favorites to land AJ Burnett. The key would be Burnett agreeing to a contract extension with the Blue Jays.
Apparently the Marlins covet Toronto's rookie left-hander Gustavo Chacin and Toronto will part with him if it lands them Burnett. ''If [Toronto] could sign Burnett, the deal would get done now,'' the source said. Stay tuned. Jul. 13 - 11:38 am et

What the fuck. I don't understand the logic in this trade then... Chacin is a rookie, and is doing fairly well. Why trade him for another pitcher? It doesn't add another capable body to the rotation...

I also heard from somewhere that the Jays would like to add a #4 bat in the best scenario... Dunn's name was brought up.

jeff061 · 07-14-2005, 08:34 AM

I can't wait to get rid of Millar, I hate that whiny dick.

Balldog · 07-14-2005, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeeberD

Sorry, but he's coming to Houston...

Whoever gets him better enjoy his 200 Ks a year.

John Galt · 07-14-2005, 09:12 AM

Bowden sucks.

I knew he was going to start making crappy trades sooner or later. If there ever was a case of a team succeeding despite their GM, it would be this year's Nats. Guzman - the worst regular in MLB signed for 4 years; Castilla - sucks donkey balls; and Wilson - broken player with Coors numbers (obviously no lesson learned from Castilla). If all 3 of those players are in the starting lineup, the Nats will continue to be among the worst offenses in the league. You just can't win with that.

Here are Wilson's road stats this year: .224/.280/.411 for a booming .691 OPS. And he has a gimpy knee to boot.

Church is not a long term answer and is playing above his head, but here is what he has done (while playing in a pitcher's park): .325/.381/.544.

The New Bowden offense:

CF Wilkerson .271/.376/.433
2B Vidro .288/.368/.480
1B Johnson .320/.444/.508
RF Guillen .310/.360/.539 (Bowden's only good move, but no one ever doubted Guillen's ability)
LF Wilson .224/.280/.411 (we can only hope he improves on those road stats)
3B Castilla .253/.330/.397
C Schneider .263/.323/.412
SS Guzman .201/.239/.291
P

The dropoff between the top 4 in the lineup and the bottom 5 is ridiculous.

And an interesting tidbit. The 2005 salaries of the top 4 in the lineup: 15 million (7 mill to Vidro).

The 2005 salaries for the 4 through 8 hitters: 21.7 million (12.5 mill to Wilson).

If though the Nats aren't paying all of Wilson's salary, it is embarrasing that any of those players (except Schneider) is getting paid for what they do.

Bee · 07-14-2005, 09:40 AM

I thought picking up Mike Stanton was a decent gamble with little downside. He may be washed up, but for a minsal experiment it's worth taking a long shot gamble.

As far as the Wilson for Day and Davis trade...it doesn't upset me like it seems it does some here. Day looked like a below average pitcher to me and I don't know if Davis will ever be more than a minor leaguer. Wilson is average at best and way overpaid, but the Rockies are picking up some of his salary. This trade looks to me more like a couple teams moving around crappy players than anything else...

John Galt · 07-14-2005, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bee

I thought picking up Mike Stanton was a decent gamble with little downside. He may be washed up, but for a minsal experiment it's worth taking a long shot gamble.

As far as the Wilson for Day and Davis trade...it doesn't upset me like it seems it does some here. Day looked like a below average pitcher to me and I don't know if Davis will ever be more than a minor leaguer. Wilson is average at best and way overpaid, but the Rockies are picking up some of his salary. This trade looks to me more like a couple teams moving around crappy players than anything else...

Stanton is probably useless, but not the worst gamble. It isn't as though the bullpen is a need area, so as long as Frank doesn't put him in high leverage situations, it isn't a big deal.

The problem I have with Wilson is just the opportunity cost. Day is nothing special, but may have had slightly more value. Davis was never given a chance, but he could do well in Colorado (and follow the Guillen Rule 5 pick career path if he is REALLY lucky). My problem is the way Bowden used a little extra money under his new budget. Instead of using it to improve the team, he allocates it to a player that is a downgrade from Church. The team gets worse at the cost of more money. That just doesn't make sense to me.

Bee · 07-14-2005, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Galt

Stanton is probably useless, but not the worst gamble. It isn't as though the bullpen is a need area, so as long as Frank doesn't put him in high leverage situations, it isn't a big deal.

The problem I have with Wilson is just the opportunity cost. Day is nothing special, but may have had slightly more value. Davis was never given a chance, but he could do well in Colorado (and follow the Guillen Rule 5 pick career path if he is REALLY lucky). My problem is the way Bowden used a little extra money under his new budget. Instead of using it to improve the team, he allocates it to a player that is a downgrade from Church. The team gets worse at the cost of more money. That just doesn't make sense to me.

Well...I don't want to get put into a position of defending Bowden because I don't think he's a good GM...but I'm not sure what other moves would have been available without giving up legitimate prospects. I think they needed to make some move to try to bring in some more power hitting just to avoid the backlash from fans. This year not a lot of teams are looking to unload people so the price is a little higher than normal and most teams I'd expect are looking for decent prospects. The Nats just don't have the prospects to give up IMO, so that leaves them trading crap for crap which is what happened.

John Galt · 07-14-2005, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bee

Well...I don't want to get put into a position of defending Bowden because I don't think he's a good GM...but I'm not sure what other moves would have been available without giving up legitimate prospects. I think they needed to make some move to try to bring in some more power hitting just to avoid the backlash from fans. This year not a lot of teams are looking to unload people so the price is a little higher than normal and most teams I'd expect are looking for decent prospects. The Nats just don't have the prospects to give up IMO, so that leaves them trading crap for crap which is what happened.

The problem I have is that LF is not a position that was in need of an upgrade and Wilson is a downgrade. 3B, SS, and CF (assuming we can find a player who can do well offensively and defensively) are the primary needs. Unfortunately, since we have two Bowden sinkholes at 3B and SS, he decided to add another OF (who really can't play CF anymore). I'm not sure they could get more than they got, but this move strikes me as a step in the wrong direction. It makes the team net worse at a cost of more money. That is just like the Guzman and Castilla signings, IMO.

bbor · 07-14-2005, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeVic

What the fuck. I don't understand the logic in this trade then... Chacin is a rookie, and is doing fairly well. Why trade him for another pitcher? It doesn't add another capable body to the rotation...

Agreed.

WSUCougar · 07-14-2005, 12:21 PM

Hmmm. The Cards are curiously quiet thusfar, and we really need some outfield help. You know Jocketty is going to pull something out of his magical hat. But what/who?

HomerJSimpson · 07-14-2005, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WSUCougar

Hmmm. The Cards are curiously quiet thusfar, and we really need some outfield help. You know Jocketty is going to pull something out of his magical hat. But what/who?

The Cards need help? What does that say about the rest of the league?

WSUCougar · 07-14-2005, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerJSimpson

The Cards need help?

Hey, nobody's perfect.

Seriously, though, Larry Walker is a walking disabled list, Edmonds has proven to be susceptible to injuries time and again, and Sanders is no spring chicken. On the bench we've got guys that can play short-term, but that disrupts the mix and is no long-term answer. AAA is a wasteland.

Paging Mike Cameron...Mike Cameron, please pick up the white courtesy phone.

SelzShoes · 07-14-2005, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerJSimpson

The Cards need help? What does that say about the rest of the league?

The NL is really really weak this year. If the Cards win the pennant, they'll need help to win the series. The record they have posted is against the 29th strongest schedule in baseball, so there is reason to believe they aren't as strong as they appear.

Fonzie · 07-14-2005, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WSUCougar

Hey, nobody's perfect.

Seriously, though, Larry Walker is a walking disabled list, Edmonds has proven to be susceptible to injuries time and again, and Sanders is no spring chicken. On the bench we've got guys that can play short-term, but that disrupts the mix and is no long-term answer. AAA is a wasteland.

Paging Mike Cameron...Mike Cameron, please pick up the white courtesy phone.

Agreed on all counts. OF help is essential.

Maple Leafs · 07-14-2005, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeVic

What the fuck. I don't understand the logic in this trade then... Chacin is a rookie, and is doing fairly well. Why trade him for another pitcher? It doesn't add another capable body to the rotation...

Buy low, sell high? A chance to get an established (cough) starter for a rookie who may be a one-year wonder? After all, Chacin wasn't projected to be a star in this league and his season has been up-and-down.

Young Drachma · 07-14-2005, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeVic

What the fuck. I don't understand the logic in this trade then... Chacin is a rookie, and is doing fairly well. Why trade him for another pitcher? It doesn't add another capable body to the rotation...

I also heard from somewhere that the Jays would like to add a #4 bat in the best scenario... Dunn's name was brought up.

I think we have too many young arms in the Jays organization. No way all of them are going to pan out, so I say that it makes sense to start dealing arms now if we can get someone whose proven, because if we have to wait 3-5 more years for this franchise to get its act together...I dunno.

I hope the deal goes through, especially in the AL East where having Burnett (especially if we get him signed past this season) would be a huge shot in the arm for our rotation long term.

Swaggs · 07-14-2005, 01:21 PM

Interestingly, Pirates SP Mark Redman is supposedly now on the block and the two teams most attached to him are the Blue Jays and Marlins. Pirates are in need of corner INF, so maybe the Jays match up well.

He has a 3.76 ERA in 18 starts and is relatively affordable ($4.5M), but he will be a FA after this season. I'm wondering when the Pirates will quit trading guys like this and start trying for comp picks (which have really been taken advantage of by large market teams lately, it seems to me).

Fouts · 07-14-2005, 01:44 PM

Nice first at-bat for Preston Wilson (HR). I don't think the Nats payed much for him, but he wasn't exactly tearing it up in Colorado.

henry296 · 07-14-2005, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swaggs

Interestingly, Pirates SP Mark Redman is supposedly now on the block and the two teams most attached to him are the Blue Jays and Marlins. Pirates are in need of corner INF, so maybe the Jays match up well.

He has a 3.76 ERA in 18 starts and is relatively affordable ($4.5M), but he will be a FA after this season. I'm wondering when the Pirates will quit trading guys like this and start trying for comp picks (which have really been taken advantage of by large market teams lately, it seems to me).

Redman probably will be a free agent, but there is a mutual option (both team and player) for next season. I don't know if the Pirates would get compensation if they decline the option and he became a free agent.

Blade · 07-14-2005, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

I think we have too many young arms in the Jays organization. No way all of them are going to pan out, so I say that it makes sense to start dealing arms now if we can get someone whose proven, because if we have to wait 3-5 more years for this franchise to get its act together...I dunno.

I hope the deal goes through, especially in the AL East where having Burnett (especially if we get him signed past this season) would be a huge shot in the arm for our rotation long term.

True enough...we have been drafting young left handers like they are going out of style. Even if two or three pan out, we are going to have a wealth of arms to choose from...

That said, I really like Chacin, and I don't want to see him go.

MikeVic · 07-14-2005, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade

That said, I really like Chacin, and I don't want to see him go.

He's a character. Has the funny delivery, the glasses... Great first name.

I'm just afraid that we'll run into a problem of not having enough pitchers in a couple of years... The fall-out of Guzman, Ward, and Hentgen are recent enough for me to remember... and I don't want to go through that again.

QuikSand · 07-14-2005, 03:09 PM

If you can get full value for a guy like Chacin, who is basically exceeding both expectations and the expected results given his base skill set evidenced thus far -- then it makes sense to do so. Sure, he may have some good years ahead of him, but there's also a very solid chance that what we're seeing is basically a half season fueled substantially by a good deal of luck, which will level out and bring his stats up to a more expected level. The tapering off in his last five starts may well be a sign that he's coming to earth a bit.

Sell high. I have no problem with that.

MikeVic · 07-14-2005, 03:11 PM

Damn this board, convincing me to think differently.

Maybe this is why I don't fare too well in online leagues... too much attachment to the players on my team. :P

Ksyrup · 07-14-2005, 03:45 PM

I know this isn't a trade (although it may prompt one), but since this is where most of the baseball discussion is happening...Wang on the DL for the Yanks. Must...resist...urge...to...Woo Hoo!

Blade · 07-14-2005, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Damn this board, convincing me to think differently.

Maybe this is why I don't fare too well in online leagues... too much attachment to the players on my team. :P

Heh, I was thinking the same thing...I am way too attached to players, though all the arguments for the trade makes a ton of sense...

korme · 07-14-2005, 04:41 PM

Al Leiter designated for assignment by the Fish.

Ksyrup · 07-14-2005, 04:43 PM

That was suggested earlier today on Rotoworld. At least that was a 1-year deal. Shoulda stuck with the broadcast booth, huh?

MikeVic · 07-14-2005, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

That was suggested earlier today on Rotoworld. At least that was a 1-year deal. Shoulda stuck with the broadcast booth, huh?

I liked him there too. Hopefully he returns.

07-13-2005, 10:18 PM	#3
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	Boston and the A's completed the Payton/Bradford deal, but now Payton may be going to the Yankees. Nationals signed Mike Stanton. Blue Jays and Marlins might have a deal for AJ Burnett, but only if he agrees to a contract extension. Red Sox may trade Millar to Houston. Devil Rays pick up of Borowski means Baez is even more likely to be shipped to the Marlins, Braves, Cubs, or Rangers. __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

07-13-2005, 11:11 PM	#12
bbor Pro Starter Join Date: May 2001 Location: toronto	Any idea who the Jays are giving up for Burnett?.....I imagine it's Orlando Hudson plus??? __________________ Pumpy Tudors Now that I've cracked and made that admission, I wonder if I'm only a couple of steps away from wanting to tongue-kiss Jaromir Jagr and give Bobby Clarke a blowjob.

07-14-2005, 08:34 AM	#24
jeff061 Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: MA	I can't wait to get rid of Millar, I hate that whiny dick. __________________

07-14-2005, 09:12 AM	#26
John Galt Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Internets	Bowden sucks. I knew he was going to start making crappy trades sooner or later. If there ever was a case of a team succeeding despite their GM, it would be this year's Nats. Guzman - the worst regular in MLB signed for 4 years; Castilla - sucks donkey balls; and Wilson - broken player with Coors numbers (obviously no lesson learned from Castilla). If all 3 of those players are in the starting lineup, the Nats will continue to be among the worst offenses in the league. You just can't win with that. Here are Wilson's road stats this year: .224/.280/.411 for a booming .691 OPS. And he has a gimpy knee to boot. Church is not a long term answer and is playing above his head, but here is what he has done (while playing in a pitcher's park): .325/.381/.544. The New Bowden offense: CF Wilkerson .271/.376/.433 2B Vidro .288/.368/.480 1B Johnson .320/.444/.508 RF Guillen .310/.360/.539 (Bowden's only good move, but no one ever doubted Guillen's ability) LF Wilson .224/.280/.411 (we can only hope he improves on those road stats) 3B Castilla .253/.330/.397 C Schneider .263/.323/.412 SS Guzman .201/.239/.291 P The dropoff between the top 4 in the lineup and the bottom 5 is ridiculous. And an interesting tidbit. The 2005 salaries of the top 4 in the lineup: 15 million (7 mill to Vidro). The 2005 salaries for the 4 through 8 hitters: 21.7 million (12.5 mill to Wilson). If though the Nats aren't paying all of Wilson's salary, it is embarrasing that any of those players (except Schneider) is getting paid for what they do. __________________ I do mind, the Dude minds. This will not stand, ya know, this aggression will not stand, man. - The Dude

07-14-2005, 12:21 PM	#32
WSUCougar Rider Of Rohan Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Port Angeles, WA or Helm's Deep	Hmmm. The Cards are curiously quiet thusfar, and we really need some outfield help. You know Jocketty is going to pull something out of his magical hat. But what/who? __________________ It's not the years...it's the mileage.

07-13-2005, 10:18 PM	#2
Crapshoot Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Dec 2003	Jim Bowden is an idiot- but that's hardly news. Preston Wilson is hardly better than your average schlub OF at this point - and he's going to sit Ryan Church, a better hitter, for this.

07-13-2005, 10:19 PM	#4
korme Go Reds Join Date: May 2001 Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio	WOW to every trade so far

07-13-2005, 10:26 PM	#5
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	I like what the Rockies did. Getting Byrnes, Day and a couple prospects for Wilson, Kennedy and Whitasick seems like good value for them. I don't think the A's did all that badly and it seems that Nationals are hoping Wilson follows what Burnitz is doing out of Coors field.

07-13-2005, 10:38 PM	#6
Balldog Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Macomb, MI	Typical Bowden, I don't think he realizes you can only play 3 OFers at a time in the NL. He now has Wilkerson, Church, Guillen, Byrd, and Wilson.

07-13-2005, 10:59 PM	#9
Toddzilla Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Burke, VA	The Preston Wilson move was idiotic, but then again Day and Davis were never going to play in DC anyway. However, like Balldog said, The Nats now have too many outfielders. For the time being Wilkerson moves to virst, but what happens when Nick Johnson comes back? Who's the odd man out? Johnson? Byrd?

07-13-2005, 11:11 PM	#11
Buccaneer Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Colorado	I'm anxiously awaiting the news of Adam Dunn being traded to the Pads.

07-13-2005, 11:26 PM	#15
Travis Pro Rookie Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Canada eh	As far as the Jays are concerned, rumors were surrounding Hudson, Batista and Chacin as the main possible proponents in the deal. The Jays were hoping to make Lilly or Bush the main player on their side of the deal, but I would hope that they make it Hudson and swing one of the two young guys over to 2B as we have 3 guys to man the corners and play DH (plus an extra OF body or two). No way can we afford to lose Batista if they want to try and make a run this year, and to lose Lilly or Chacin at this point hurts the rotation as much as you're helping it. Now if you can throw a rotation of Halladay, Lilly, Burnett, Chacin and Towers (if they are still in it once Roy returns), they've got a helluva chance so long as the mid relievers don't lose them a glut of ball games.

07-14-2005, 06:57 AM	#19
MIJB#19 Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Maassluis, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands	Why the [bleep] haven't these MLB teams given me a phone call? There a potential dream job for me there! (Yeah, I may not like baseball that much, but I know the basics a bit and can learn to at least appreciate the game...) __________________ * 2005 Golden Scribe winner for best FOF Dynasty about IHOF's Maassluis Merchantmen * Former GM of GEFL's Houston Oilers and WOOF's Curacao Cocktail

07-14-2005, 09:40 AM	#27
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	I thought picking up Mike Stanton was a decent gamble with little downside. He may be washed up, but for a minsal experiment it's worth taking a long shot gamble. As far as the Wilson for Day and Davis trade...it doesn't upset me like it seems it does some here. Day looked like a below average pitcher to me and I don't know if Davis will ever be more than a minor leaguer. Wilson is average at best and way overpaid, but the Rockies are picking up some of his salary. This trade looks to me more like a couple teams moving around crappy players than anything else...

07-14-2005, 01:21 PM	#39
Swaggs Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Interestingly, Pirates SP Mark Redman is supposedly now on the block and the two teams most attached to him are the Blue Jays and Marlins. Pirates are in need of corner INF, so maybe the Jays match up well. He has a 3.76 ERA in 18 starts and is relatively affordable ($4.5M), but he will be a FA after this season. I'm wondering when the Pirates will quit trading guys like this and start trying for comp picks (which have really been taken advantage of by large market teams lately, it seems to me). __________________ DOWN WITH HATTRICK!!! The RWBL Are you reading In The Bleachers?

07-14-2005, 01:44 PM	#40
Fouts College Starter Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: California	Nice first at-bat for Preston Wilson (HR). I don't think the Nats payed much for him, but he wasn't exactly tearing it up in Colorado.

07-14-2005, 03:09 PM	#44
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	If you can get full value for a guy like Chacin, who is basically exceeding both expectations and the expected results given his base skill set evidenced thus far -- then it makes sense to do so. Sure, he may have some good years ahead of him, but there's also a very solid chance that what we're seeing is basically a half season fueled substantially by a good deal of luck, which will level out and bring his stats up to a more expected level. The tapering off in his last five starts may well be a sign that he's coming to earth a bit. Sell high. I have no problem with that.

07-14-2005, 03:11 PM	#45
MikeVic Head Coach Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Hometown of Canada	Damn this board, convincing me to think differently. Maybe this is why I don't fare too well in online leagues... too much attachment to the players on my team. :P

07-14-2005, 03:45 PM	#46
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	I know this isn't a trade (although it may prompt one), but since this is where most of the baseball discussion is happening...Wang on the DL for the Yanks. Must...resist...urge...to...Woo Hoo! __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

07-14-2005, 04:41 PM	#48
korme Go Reds Join Date: May 2001 Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio	Al Leiter designated for assignment by the Fish.

07-14-2005, 04:43 PM	#49
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	That was suggested earlier today on Rotoworld. At least that was a 1-year deal. Shoulda stuck with the broadcast booth, huh? __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

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