Formula 1 US Grand Prix to be cancelled for unsafe tires?

SirFozzie · 06-19-2005, 12:28 PM

Michelin tells teams not to use tires in Grand Prix.

Associated Press

INDIANAPOLIS -- The United States Grand Prix was in jeopardy hours before its scheduled start Sunday because tiremaker Michelin advised the seven Formula One teams it supplies not to compete because of safety concerns.

Michelin, the world's largest tiremaker, has been unable to determine why some of its tires failed during Friday's practice sessions at Indianapolis Motor Speedway. One failure led to an accident that knocked Ralf Schumacher out of Sunday's race.

In an effort to salvage it, Michelin bosses met with Formula One chief Bernie Ecclestone in a lengthy, closed-door meeting Sunday morning that ended roughly 90 minutes before the scheduled start of the event.

Several team bosses said nine of the 10 teams agreed to run if a chicane was placed in the final turn to slow speeds. Ferrari was the lone holdout.

The FIA, which earlier in the day adamantly refused to use a course obstacle, didn't immediately rule on the agreement.

Team bosses also said it wasn't clear if the U.S. Grand Prix would count in the championship standings.

"This is disappointing because Formula One, at times, can't realize it is a sport first and a political battle second," Minardi team boss Paul Stoddart said. "Nine teams have agreed to drive for points or no points as long as a chicane is installed. It is now in the FIA's hands, but for nine of us our position is this is sport and there are hundreds of millions of people wanting to see a race."

During the meeting, all 20 drivers were summoned to join the discussions that could be seen through glass office doors. The drivers left about 10 minutes later and declined comment.

The talks were clearly heated at times, and Ecclestone and Renault boss Flavio Briatore engaged in an animated conversation. Indianapolis Motor Speedway president Tony George was seen pacing and talking on his cell phone. He looked displeased when he left the meeting shortly before the drivers arrived.

In a letter to the FIA sent late Saturday night, Michelin officials said they informed teams that it could not guarantee that its tires are safe -- particularly in the high-banked final turn where Schumacher and Toyota teammate Ricardo Zonta both wrecked.

Schumacher sustained a serious concussion and two broken vertebrae in a similar accident here last season.

The tiremaker asked for permission to change the tires -- F-1 teams are forced to race on the same set of tires they qualify with -- or the use of a chicane in turn 13.

The FIA sent back a sharply worded response, questioning how the tiremaker landed in this position and warning the teams that they would be heavily penalized if they changed tires.

Michelin responded Sunday, saying its teams could not use the original tires. The company supplies tires to seven teams -- 14 of 20 cars in Sunday's race -- including championship leaders Renault and leading rival McLaren-Mercedes.

"We confirmed that with the tires on which we have qualified we are not able to sufficiently guarantee the total safety of the drivers," Michelin officials wrote Sunday. "As a result, we reached the conclusion that we will not compete with these tires in the current configuration of the circuit."

The FIA replied with a terse letter, refusing to budge on the issue.

"Your teams have a choice of running more slowly in turns 12/13, running a tire not used in qualifying [which would attract a penalty] or repeatedly changing a tire [subject to valid safety reasons]," FIA race director Charlie Whiting wrote.

"It is for them to decide. We have nothing to add."

Michelin had been trying to ship a fresh batch of tires in from its warehouse in France, but was unable to get permission from the FIA to allow teams to use them.

The FIA replied in its first letter Saturday night that if teams broke the one-tire rule, they would be heavily penalized.

"We believe the penalty would not be expulsion but would have to be heavy enough to ensure that no team was tempted to use qualifying tires in the future," Whiting ruled.

He also ruled out the use of a chicane.

"To change the course in order to help some of the teams with a performance problem caused by their failure to bring suitable equipment to the race would be a breach of the rules and grossly unfair to those teams which have come to Indianapolis with the correct tires," he said.

Only Ferrari, Minardi and Jordan use Bridgestone tires.

Points leader Fernando Alonso of Renault and Kimi Raikkonen of McLaren-Mercedes, who is second in the world championship standings, are among the Michelin drivers

Airhog · 06-19-2005, 12:37 PM

This is really sad when you put the lives of your drivers at risk. And for what good reason? I dunno, but I just dont like the smell of this at all.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 12:46 PM

Put a chicane in turns 12/13 and race.

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-19-2005, 12:48 PM

So, I take it there are a lot of not so happy fans and race teams out there.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 12:50 PM

Bernie just said they're going to race, however Speed Channel doesn't seem to sure about it.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 12:59 PM

Oh my....

They plan on starting the race and then the Michelin teams (along with Jordan and Minardi) are going to park it, after a lap. This would kill F-1 in Indy.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 01:10 PM

Jordan and Minardi decided to race, but the Michelin teams did retire. Six cars on the track now. This has to be the strangest thing I've witnessed in racing.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 01:18 PM

Another dagger in the death of open-wheel racing in the USA.

This is the worst joke you could have ever dreamed of happening.

JOKE. JOKE. JOKE.

145,000 fans. 6 Cars left on the track after protest. Nice job.

Formula 1 - Go Away.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 01:31 PM

From the broadcast (which is quite intriguing for some reason)....

All teams with the exception of Ferrari agreed to the chicane. Also, Michelin said they had the same problem with the backup tire compound, so it couldn't be used.

SirFozzie · 06-19-2005, 01:57 PM

Here's some information from another board.

They just interviewed Paul Stoddart (Minardi) and he couldn't care less about the points they're going to get - he flat-out called the race a "farce" and said they're only racing because Jordan is.

I think F1 might be dead at Indy, if not the States after this. Apparently the BBC's saying points will count, which I find absolutely disgusting. Ferrari's going to jump to a tie for 2nd in the constructor's standings if they complete the race

and

ITV just interviewed fans leaving Indy and they were, for lack of a better word, pissed off.

I think F1 will have to give refunds if they want to keep the race alive, otherwise you might as well pull it off the schedule and replace it with something else. There's no way you're going to pull in 100,000 next year with no refunds.

The French commentators just had a fun idea - imagine a bunch of cars come out with two or three laps to go trying to get 7th/8th place. Make it even more of a farce.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 02:01 PM

It's a mess. The drivers/owners/FIA are all right and wrong. The race fans are all right and....have left.

Of course, they get their money back, but undoubtedly there are fans coming in from Canada, the West Coast, East Coast and everywhere who have spent money on plane tickets and hotels and kennels for their pets and taken days off from work....

Very irresponsible for F1 to not be prepared to race at this track.

JonInMiddleGA · 06-19-2005, 02:08 PM

If it ain't safe, you don't race, so I don't blame those who dropped.
I understand why teams on other tires didn't feel a need to be penalized for that too.
And I _really_ understand why NASCAR went to a single tire supplier.

What a mess, what a farce.

Galaxy · 06-19-2005, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

If it ain't safe, you don't race, so I don't blame those who dropped.
I understand why teams on other tires didn't feel a need to be penalized for that too.
And I _really_ understand why NASCAR went to a single tire supplier.

What a mess, what a farce.

F1 is a joke to me. Way too technical. Whoever has the most money, can build the best cars. NASCAR and ChampCar actually place an emphasis on the driver. Personally, I hate the "team uniform" thing in F1. And this the end of F1 trying to return to the US.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 02:17 PM

If anything good comes out of this....

Hopefully they'll move the USGP to Vegas (as rumored) and then I can finally attend a F1 race in America.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 02:19 PM

The only good thing about this crap is it's hilarious that the two Ferrari drivers are probably going to wreck each other fighting for the "win".

Blackadar · 06-19-2005, 02:31 PM

What would be very funny is if a bunch of those teams went out with about 10 laps left and just parked their cars across the track so no one could get by. With 14 cars, I think you could do that pretty easily.

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-19-2005, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch

Another dagger in the death of open-wheel racing in the USA.

This is the worst joke you could have ever dreamed of happening.

JOKE. JOKE. JOKE.

145,000 fans. 6 Cars left on the track after protest. Nice job.

Formula 1 - Go Away.

Now what happens to the 11 other cars? Would they pick up points or not?

CAsterling · 06-19-2005, 03:00 PM

That was hilarious......Max Mosely and Bernie Ecclestone really screwed themselves this time....The people that run F1 are assholes, and have been for years and maybe when the realise how much potential money they have lost in America they will stop running the sport as if it is their own personal toy.

I loved how happy the Jordan driver was to get hsi first ever podium finish.
Oh yeah, also what jerks the fans were to throw bottles on the race track, there is no excuse for that type of moronic behaviour.

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-19-2005, 03:04 PM

Is the US GP being televised here in US cuz I cant find it anywhere on tv.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAsterling

I loved how happy the Jordan driver was to get hsi first ever podium finish.
Oh yeah, also what jerks the fans were to throw bottles on the race track, there is no excuse for that type of moronic behaviour.

I think someone forgot to tell Monterio that all the other teams dropped out. Although, he probably didn't see any scenario this year where he'd see the podium. It was kind of funny, but also a slap in the face to the remaining fans.

ShaqFu · 06-19-2005, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHEMICAL SOLDIER

Is the US GP being televised here in US cuz I cant find it anywhere on tv.

It was on Speed.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 03:47 PM

from the same thread SirFozzie was referring to earlier:

Quote:

Fox Sports: F1 boss winning more friends

Formula 1 chief Bernie Ecclestone commenting about Danica Patrick:
"She did a good job, didn't she? Super. Didn't think she'd be able to make it like that. You know, I've got one of these wonderful ideas that women should be all dressed in white like all the other domestic appliances."

Brilliant

damnMikeBrown · 06-19-2005, 04:06 PM

I give a HUGE amount of credit to the folks at Michelin for coming out with this. It will likely generate huge amounts of publicity featuring the failure and potential failures of their tires. That they honored the drivers safety more than the negative knocks is the ultimate in corporate responsibility. Kudos to them.

Ryan S · 06-19-2005, 04:39 PM

I think Michelin in done in F1. That was inexcusable.

I think that there was more to the mass pullout today than just tires, but I really can't be bothered typing page after page about the politics of F1. I just am not surprised that all the teams that pulled out are behind the GPWC.

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-19-2005, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan S

I think Michelin in done in F1. That was inexcusable.

I think that there was more to the mass pullout today than just tires, but I really can't be bothered typing page after page about the politics of F1. I just am not surprised that all the teams that pulled out are behind the GPWC.

Are there any web sites out there detailing the politics of F-1 racing? If so I would like a linky so I could read them thanx.

SirFozzie · 06-19-2005, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHEMICAL SOLDIER

Now what happens to the 11 other cars? Would they pick up points or not?

Only the top 8 cars in F1 get points.

BTW.. here's something interesting. You read earlier that Ferrari said "no" to the chicane, being the only team to do so, right, and F1A had to bow to their wishes..

well..

But nine of the F1's 10 teams are in dispute with Eccletone and others over the running of the sport and have threatened to start their own series in 2008. Only Ferrari has signed to stay with Ecclestone after the 2007 season.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Only the top 8 cars in F1 get points.

BTW.. here's something interesting. You read earlier that Ferrari said "no" to the chicane, being the only team to do so, right, and F1A had to bow to their wishes..

well..

But nine of the F1's 10 teams are in dispute with Eccletone and others over the running of the sport and have threatened to start their own series in 2008. Only Ferrari has signed to stay with Ecclestone after the 2007 season.

Well, to be fair to Ferrari, it was not their fault that Michelin had sent the wrong tires. Ferrari runs on Bridgetone afterall.

The alternative that the Michelin crowd was offering Ferrari was to run a "friendly" match for no points thus putting Ferrari as the only team to do everything properly and get no credit for it.

Installing a chicane would have violated the FIA rulebook and would not have been a sanctioned race.

The bottom line is that 14 drivers got screwed by a mixup at Michelin. No reason to suggest that's Ferrari's doing. At least not from what I've gathered.

rexallllsc · 06-19-2005, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheLionKing

I think someone forgot to tell Monterio that all the other teams dropped out. Although, he probably didn't see any scenario this year where he'd see the podium. It was kind of funny, but also a slap in the face to the remaining fans.

Not really his fault that their equipment was faulty.

Ryan S · 06-19-2005, 07:52 PM

Tony George's press release - http://www.brickyard.com/news/story.php?story_id=4898

Quote:

Sunday, June 19, 2005
The Indianapolis Motor Speedway shares in the disappointment with the loyal fans of IMS and Formula One that we did not see the exciting race we all anticipated due to circumstances beyond our control. The FIA, Formula One, the constructors and manufacturers that represent the cars on the starting grid made decisions on an individual basis to limit participation in today’s USGP.

We suggest the fans who wish to make their feelings known, contact the following:

Michelin
46, rue du Ressort
63100 Clermont-Ferrand
France
www.michelinsport.com

FIA
8 Place de la Concorde
F-75008 Paris
www.fia.com

Formula One Management
6 Princes Gate
Knightsbridge
London SW7 1QJ
United Kingdom

I actually thought it was a joke when I first saw it on another forum....

TLK · 06-19-2005, 08:08 PM

I bet this promotion went over well....

Renew Tickets For 2006 USGP, Drive Lap On IMS Road Course June 20

By Eric Powell
usgpindy.com
Formula One fans can drive on the same Indianapolis Motor Speedway road course on Monday, June 20, just one day after the superstars of Formula One raced the sixth United States Grand Prix, if they renew their USGP tickets for the 2006 race.

The USGP Ticket Renewal Drivearound is scheduled for 4-8 p.m. (local time).

Anyone who renews their ticket for the 2006 United States Grand Prix and holds a valid driver’s license can drive their passenger vehicle around the 13-turn, 2.605-mile circuit on which their F1 heroes raced June 19.

“For six years, United States Grand Prix fans have proven they are among the most dedicated and loyal race fans in the world, so we’re pleased to say ‘thank you’ to our customers with this once-a-year opportunity,” said Joie Chitwood, Indianapolis Motor Speedway president and chief operating officer. “Fans should remember to bring a camera or video recorder to capture the memories, while they experience the thrill of driving the course and look ahead to the 2006 USGP.”

To participate in the Drivearound, USGP tickets can be purchased online at the IMS Ticket Office or atwww.indianapolismotorspeedway.com. Tickets will be on sale at 8 a.m. (local time) at both the Ticket Office and online.

Ticket renewals also can be made at the Speedway’s Gate 10 off of 30^th Street, where fans will enter for the Drivearound.

Online ticket renewals also will be accepted if the participant brings a printed copy of their confirmation. Mail-in renewals will not have been processed by the Drivearound day and will not be eligible for the track lap.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 09:42 PM

One more chuckle for the night...

Quote:

The Champ Car Grand Prix of Cleveland Presented by U.S. Bank to Honor Tickets From the Formula 1 United States Grand Prix

Indianapolis (June 19, 2005) -- The Bridgestone Presents the Champ Car World Series Powered by Ford has always been a series about its fans, and in support of the international open-wheel racing community, the organizers of the Champ Car Grand Prix of Cleveland Presented by U.S. Bank and Champ Car officials have announced that tickets for Sunday's Formula 1 United States Grand Prix will be honored on June 26.

Open-wheel racing fans will be able to see the 750-horsepower Champ Car's battle on the temporary circuit constructed in Downtown Cleveland at Burke Lakefront Airport as the headliners of a full day of racing. Joining the Champ Cars will be the Toyota Atlantic Championship Presented by Yokohama, the Speed World Challenge GT cars and the Formula Ford 2000 series.

Details will follow on www.grandprixofcleveland.com and www.champcar.ws explaining how fans can redeem their F1 USGP tickets for race-day seats at the Champ Car Grand Prix of Cleveland Presented by U.S. Bank.

Fans who are unable to benefit from this unique opportunity, the Champ Car Grand Prix of Cleveland Presented by U.S. Bank will be broadcast live on CBS Sports on June 26 at 1:30 pm ET.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheLionKing

One more chuckle for the night...

I'm sure that makes people who travelled from all over the country and paid big bucks to go to Indy feel better knowing they can do it all over again! Right!

TLK · 06-19-2005, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch

I'm sure that makes people who travelled from all over the country and paid big bucks to go to Indy feel better knowing they can do it all over again! Right!

Even if nobody takes them up on their offer (which I can promise you, some Midwest race fans will), it's an incredibly smart move and hopefully they will get some good press for the offering.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 10:13 PM

I wish IRL and CART would offer us a real racing series for the price of full admission. Now that would be a neat marketing gimmick.

TLK · 06-19-2005, 10:27 PM

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder... I guess.

I paid $120.00 for my ticket for Cleveland and I have no doubt I get my monies worth.

Dutch · 06-19-2005, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheLionKing

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder... I guess.

I paid $120.00 for my ticket for Cleveland and I have no doubt I get my monies worth.

Well, going to a race is one thing. I love going and I think your money is well spent. But getting CART and IRL out of their really, really, really small niche market they have created for themselves is a whole 'nother mess and until they either merge or one of the series is killed off, it will remain an ugly blemish that will remain hopeless in the wake of the NASCAR marketing juggernaut.

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-19-2005, 11:28 PM

Did the fans actually stay or was there a mass exodus after the announcement was made?

nilodor · 06-19-2005, 11:53 PM

I'd say roughly 50% stayed. There were alot who were throwing stuff on the track.

I'm not sure how much this will hurt F1 overall. Eccelstone has said on many occasions that he could care less if people show up to the events. The money is made through TV viewership and will this "race" kill off TV viewership? Who knows? The worst part is that this race is on in prime time in the UK but will it really make them stop watching? Did that many americans really watch the race to begin with considering most of the races are only available on a specialty channel in the middle of the night in the US? I figure that this will help move the grand prix to somewhere like Long Beach right about the time that all the smoking adverts go away so they can start with a clean slate in a venue that is more attractive to sponsors.

HomerJSimpson · 06-20-2005, 07:00 AM

Quote:

"You know, I've got one of these wonderful ideas that women should be all dressed in white like all the other domestic appliances."

That is just wrong....

but funny.

Blackadar · 06-20-2005, 07:44 AM

The whole thing is absurd. If I had purchased tickets via Credit Card the past 90 days, I'd immediately protest the charges. What a big middle finger to the fans.

Alf · 06-20-2005, 08:04 AM

FWIW : the USA Grand prix was not televised in France

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-20-2005, 09:41 AM

How much dsoes an average ticket cost for an F1 race? F1 looks like one of those $ 1,000 per ticket.

Icy · 06-20-2005, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHEMICAL SOLDIER

How much dsoes an average ticket cost for an F1 race? F1 looks like one of those $ 1,000 per ticket.

Nah not that much, the standard ones are around $150.

Samdari · 06-20-2005, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch

Well, to be fair to Ferrari, it was not their fault that Michelin had sent the wrong tires. Ferrari runs on Bridgetone afterall.

Sure, but put yourself in their situation.

Do you risk the lives of your opposition in order to keep a competitive advantage over them due to it being "fair"?

Warhammer · 06-20-2005, 10:28 AM

In a sport like racing, it is up to the teams to make sure they use the right equipment. If one engine runs better than another, do the teams that have better engines get penalized because other teams are running inferior engines? No.

The fact that the Michelin tires that most of the teams decided to use were not fit for the track is not the fault of Bridgestone teams. The teams that raced on the Michelins should have determined before the race whether or not their tires would perform.

Samdari · 06-20-2005, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

In a sport like racing, it is up to the teams to make sure they use the right equipment. If one engine runs better than another, do the teams that have better engines get penalized because other teams are running inferior engines? No.

Actually, NASCAR does do this. They want the cars as close as possible to each other, to guarantee right races (following the NFL's parity model). Thus, if one manufacturer gets ahead of another (be it frame, engine or whatever) they impose restrictions on those cars to bring them back to the field.

RPI-Fan · 06-20-2005, 11:05 AM

I think the appropriate solution here would have been to allow the Michelin teams to use safer tires (ones that weren't initially brought along), but to penalize them for the next 5 races, or something, by in qualifying guaranteeing the Bridgestone drivers the first 6 spots. That way, this race would have been competitive, as would each of the next several races.

And Bridgestone would feel like they still got something out of being appropriately prepared.

RPI-Fan · 06-20-2005, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alf

FWIW : the USA Grand prix was not televised in France

Are you sure? On SpeedTV they frequently refered to the French broadcast (and how it was dropped shortly after the 6-car race started...).

Dutch · 06-20-2005, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

I think the appropriate solution here would have been to allow the Michelin teams to use safer tires (ones that weren't initially brought along), but to penalize them for the next 5 races, or something, by in qualifying guaranteeing the Bridgestone drivers the first 6 spots. That way, this race would have been competitive, as would each of the next several races.

And Bridgestone would feel like they still got something out of being appropriately prepared.

Something along those lines were probably in order. A better idea than what they eventually came up with, that's for sure!

fantastic flying froggies · 06-20-2005, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

Are you sure? On SpeedTV they frequently refered to the French broadcast (and how it was dropped shortly after the 6-car race started...).

I think that's what Alf meant.
They did start the broadcast and then dropped it to show a rerun of the Experts.

06-19-2005, 12:37 PM	#2
Airhog Captain Obvious Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Norman, Oklahoma	This is really sad when you put the lives of your drivers at risk. And for what good reason? I dunno, but I just dont like the smell of this at all. __________________ Thread Killer extraordinaire Yay! its football season once again!

06-19-2005, 12:48 PM	#4
CHEMICAL SOLDIER College Starter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Henderson, Nevada	So, I take it there are a lot of not so happy fans and race teams out there. __________________ Toujour Pret

06-19-2005, 01:18 PM	#8
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	Another dagger in the death of open-wheel racing in the USA. This is the worst joke you could have ever dreamed of happening. JOKE. JOKE. JOKE. 145,000 fans. 6 Cars left on the track after protest. Nice job. Formula 1 - Go Away. Last edited by Dutch : 06-19-2005 at 01:20 PM.

06-19-2005, 01:57 PM	#10
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	Here's some information from another board. They just interviewed Paul Stoddart (Minardi) and he couldn't care less about the points they're going to get - he flat-out called the race a "farce" and said they're only racing because Jordan is. I think F1 might be dead at Indy, if not the States after this. Apparently the BBC's saying points will count, which I find absolutely disgusting. Ferrari's going to jump to a tie for 2nd in the constructor's standings if they complete the race and ITV just interviewed fans leaving Indy and they were, for lack of a better word, pissed off. I think F1 will have to give refunds if they want to keep the race alive, otherwise you might as well pull it off the schedule and replace it with something else. There's no way you're going to pull in 100,000 next year with no refunds. The French commentators just had a fun idea - imagine a bunch of cars come out with two or three laps to go trying to get 7th/8th place. Make it even more of a farce. __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

06-19-2005, 02:01 PM	#11
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	It's a mess. The drivers/owners/FIA are all right and wrong. The race fans are all right and....have left. Of course, they get their money back, but undoubtedly there are fans coming in from Canada, the West Coast, East Coast and everywhere who have spent money on plane tickets and hotels and kennels for their pets and taken days off from work.... Very irresponsible for F1 to not be prepared to race at this track. Last edited by Dutch : 06-19-2005 at 02:07 PM.

06-19-2005, 12:46 PM	#3
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	Put a chicane in turns 12/13 and race.

06-19-2005, 12:50 PM	#5
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	Bernie just said they're going to race, however Speed Channel doesn't seem to sure about it.

06-19-2005, 12:59 PM	#6
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	Oh my.... They plan on starting the race and then the Michelin teams (along with Jordan and Minardi) are going to park it, after a lap. This would kill F-1 in Indy.

06-19-2005, 01:10 PM	#7
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	Jordan and Minardi decided to race, but the Michelin teams did retire. Six cars on the track now. This has to be the strangest thing I've witnessed in racing.

06-19-2005, 01:31 PM	#9
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	From the broadcast (which is quite intriguing for some reason).... All teams with the exception of Ferrari agreed to the chicane. Also, Michelin said they had the same problem with the backup tire compound, so it couldn't be used.

06-19-2005, 02:08 PM	#12
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	If it ain't safe, you don't race, so I don't blame those who dropped. I understand why teams on other tires didn't feel a need to be penalized for that too. And I _really_ understand why NASCAR went to a single tire supplier. What a mess, what a farce. __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

06-19-2005, 02:17 PM	#14
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	If anything good comes out of this.... Hopefully they'll move the USGP to Vegas (as rumored) and then I can finally attend a F1 race in America.

06-19-2005, 02:19 PM	#15
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	The only good thing about this crap is it's hilarious that the two Ferrari drivers are probably going to wreck each other fighting for the "win". Last edited by Dutch : 06-19-2005 at 02:20 PM.

06-19-2005, 02:31 PM	#16
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	What would be very funny is if a bunch of those teams went out with about 10 laps left and just parked their cars across the track so no one could get by. With 14 cars, I think you could do that pretty easily.

06-19-2005, 03:00 PM	#18
CAsterling High School JV Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Herndon, Va	That was hilarious......Max Mosely and Bernie Ecclestone really screwed themselves this time....The people that run F1 are assholes, and have been for years and maybe when the realise how much potential money they have lost in America they will stop running the sport as if it is their own personal toy. I loved how happy the Jordan driver was to get hsi first ever podium finish. Oh yeah, also what jerks the fans were to throw bottles on the race track, there is no excuse for that type of moronic behaviour. __________________ The funniest comedy duo I have ever seen - www.magaga.com/

06-19-2005, 03:04 PM	#19
CHEMICAL SOLDIER College Starter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Henderson, Nevada	Is the US GP being televised here in US cuz I cant find it anywhere on tv. __________________ Toujour Pret

06-19-2005, 04:06 PM	#23
damnMikeBrown College Benchwarmer Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Cincinnati, OH	I give a HUGE amount of credit to the folks at Michelin for coming out with this. It will likely generate huge amounts of publicity featuring the failure and potential failures of their tires. That they honored the drivers safety more than the negative knocks is the ultimate in corporate responsibility. Kudos to them.

06-19-2005, 04:39 PM	#24
Ryan S Quarterback Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London, England	I think Michelin in done in F1. That was inexcusable. I think that there was more to the mass pullout today than just tires, but I really can't be bothered typing page after page about the politics of F1. I just am not surprised that all the teams that pulled out are behind the GPWC. Last edited by Ryan S : 06-19-2005 at 04:39 PM.

06-19-2005, 08:08 PM	#30
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	I bet this promotion went over well.... Renew Tickets For 2006 USGP, Drive Lap On IMS Road Course June 20 By Eric Powell usgpindy.com Formula One fans can drive on the same Indianapolis Motor Speedway road course on Monday, June 20, just one day after the superstars of Formula One raced the sixth United States Grand Prix, if they renew their USGP tickets for the 2006 race. The USGP Ticket Renewal Drivearound is scheduled for 4-8 p.m. (local time). Anyone who renews their ticket for the 2006 United States Grand Prix and holds a valid driver’s license can drive their passenger vehicle around the 13-turn, 2.605-mile circuit on which their F1 heroes raced June 19. “For six years, United States Grand Prix fans have proven they are among the most dedicated and loyal race fans in the world, so we’re pleased to say ‘thank you’ to our customers with this once-a-year opportunity,” said Joie Chitwood, Indianapolis Motor Speedway president and chief operating officer. “Fans should remember to bring a camera or video recorder to capture the memories, while they experience the thrill of driving the course and look ahead to the 2006 USGP.” To participate in the Drivearound, USGP tickets can be purchased online at the IMS Ticket Office or atwww.indianapolismotorspeedway.com. Tickets will be on sale at 8 a.m. (local time) at both the Ticket Office and online. Ticket renewals also can be made at the Speedway’s Gate 10 off of 30^th Street, where fans will enter for the Drivearound. Online ticket renewals also will be accepted if the participant brings a printed copy of their confirmation. Mail-in renewals will not have been processed by the Drivearound day and will not be eligible for the track lap.

06-19-2005, 10:13 PM	#34
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	I wish IRL and CART would offer us a real racing series for the price of full admission. Now that would be a neat marketing gimmick.

06-19-2005, 10:27 PM	#35
TLK Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Allen Park, MI	Beauty is in the eye of the beholder... I guess. I paid $120.00 for my ticket for Cleveland and I have no doubt I get my monies worth. Last edited by TLK : 06-19-2005 at 10:29 PM.

06-19-2005, 11:28 PM	#37
CHEMICAL SOLDIER College Starter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Henderson, Nevada	Did the fans actually stay or was there a mass exodus after the announcement was made? __________________ Toujour Pret

06-19-2005, 11:53 PM	#38
nilodor College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: calgary, AB	I'd say roughly 50% stayed. There were alot who were throwing stuff on the track. I'm not sure how much this will hurt F1 overall. Eccelstone has said on many occasions that he could care less if people show up to the events. The money is made through TV viewership and will this "race" kill off TV viewership? Who knows? The worst part is that this race is on in prime time in the UK but will it really make them stop watching? Did that many americans really watch the race to begin with considering most of the races are only available on a specialty channel in the middle of the night in the US? I figure that this will help move the grand prix to somewhere like Long Beach right about the time that all the smoking adverts go away so they can start with a clean slate in a venue that is more attractive to sponsors.

06-20-2005, 07:44 AM	#40
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	The whole thing is absurd. If I had purchased tickets via Credit Card the past 90 days, I'd immediately protest the charges. What a big middle finger to the fans.

06-20-2005, 08:04 AM	#41
Alf Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Rennes, France	FWIW : the USA Grand prix was not televised in France __________________ FOFL - GML - IHOF - FranceStats

06-20-2005, 09:41 AM	#42
CHEMICAL SOLDIER College Starter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Henderson, Nevada	How much dsoes an average ticket cost for an F1 race? F1 looks like one of those $ 1,000 per ticket. __________________ Toujour Pret

06-20-2005, 10:28 AM	#45
Warhammer Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Dayton, OH	In a sport like racing, it is up to the teams to make sure they use the right equipment. If one engine runs better than another, do the teams that have better engines get penalized because other teams are running inferior engines? No. The fact that the Michelin tires that most of the teams decided to use were not fit for the track is not the fault of Bridgestone teams. The teams that raced on the Michelins should have determined before the race whether or not their tires would perform.

06-20-2005, 11:05 AM	#47
RPI-Fan Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Troy, NY	I think the appropriate solution here would have been to allow the Michelin teams to use safer tires (ones that weren't initially brought along), but to penalize them for the next 5 races, or something, by in qualifying guaranteeing the Bridgestone drivers the first 6 spots. That way, this race would have been competitive, as would each of the next several races. And Bridgestone would feel like they still got something out of being appropriately prepared. __________________ Quis custodiets ipsos custodes? Last edited by RPI-Fan : 06-20-2005 at 11:06 AM.

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