Eternally A Close Friend: The Male Curse

[Izulde]

So I went out to the park with Dreams today, surprised her with a picnic lunch.

We had a wonderful time.. she loved the food.. conversation flowed easily between us... but the following red flags popped up in the midst of it:

1. There's an ex-boyfriend of hers who she's still not sure she's over
2. She's looking for a source of inspiration and someone whose mature, smart, responsible, fun to hang around, etc.
3. But she's going to concentrate on work and her friends now.
4. She asked me how to get over the ex and mentioned a couple guys she thought she might have interest in.
5. Her mother told her "Be careful with him" (meaning me) and her answer was "What? It's not like I'm going to hurt him or beat him or anything. We're friends."
6. On the drive home she said, "This is really awesome, having a friend to talk to about things I can't talk to about anyone else, not even Tricia."
7. When she dropped me off, she said, "Call me sometime so we can hang out again sometime."
8. She'd originally planned to see if Tricia wanted to come along too.

So no, I didn't mention anything and while the time was great, the handwriting is on the wall.

Once more, I'm the close guy friend and confidant.

I'm beginning to know what forever bridesmaids feel like.

*goes to put on Poxy Boggards "Rolling Down to Old Maui"*

[duckman]

You can never have too many friends.


*snickers*

[Maple Leafs]

That's rough.

Perhaps some words of encouragement from a wise man:

"You know what a platonic friend is to a woman? It's like a dick in a clase case. In case of emergency, break open glass. And guys, if you're woman has platonic friends, that who'll she be fucking when you mess up. One of those guys you're not even thinking about. It's gonna happen to you. You know the next man to fuck your woman. You've met him, he's been in your house, he ate yur food, he drank your wine. And he shall betray you."

[Joe]

she probably saw the wood in your pants and got frightened

[Airhog]

I think she wasnt to set you up with her friend...Go for it man!

[sabotai]

4. She asked me how to get over the ex and mentioned a couple guys she thought she might have interest in.

Ouch....time to move on. Is this Tricia chick hot and single?

[ThunderingHERD]

Originally Posted by Izulde

Eternally a Close Friend: The Male Spineless Pansy Curse

Fixed it for you.

"Do you think they're your friends? They're not your friends. Do you really think she'll be there when things go bad? Huh? When things go wrong? You think again. Fucking Denise. Denise the piece. Oh, you're gonna give me that cherry pie sweet mama baby. "

[Pacersfan46]

Guess I'm a spineless pansy too. Don't feel bad.

It's strange, when I'm interested, they want to be "friends". Most of the time I'm of the mind that I'm going to do what I want, and if a girl wants to tag along, fine. If not, she can get the hell out of my way. That's when the ones I don't want, flock to me.

It sure is a damn curse.

[Izulde]

The Tricia chick is hot and not single.

[Raiders Army]

If friends fuck, then you're in luck.

[Buccaneer]

Red Flags??? Handwriting on the wall????

Shit, you got big red curtains with large bold letters written on them. Nothing subtle about those "flags".

[Desnudo]

You mean like the flag where she says they are just friends?

At least you're the break glass in case of emergency guy. So if she ever needs rebound sex, make sure you are there.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Red Flags??? Handwriting on the wall????

Shit, you got big red curtains with large bold letters written on them. Nothing subtle about those "flags".

Yeah, sadly, that's how it looks. If the girl is not giving you any positive vibes, just be honest with yourself and the situation. Move on, the right girl may be at the next place you go without this chick...but if you are lingering around with her, you may miss your true calling.

Tough situation nevertheless.

[dawgfan]

Have you brought up the concept of "friends with benefits" with her yet?

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Have you brought up the concept of "friends with benefits" with her yet?

After the suprise picnic lunch, she probably thinks he's gay. All kidding aside, keep on truckin', man. But find someone else to focus on.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

After the suprise picnic lunch, she probably thinks he's gay.

Awesome.

[DaddyTorgo]

aaaah, i know that situation all too well. Bucc is right, those are giant curtains with huge red writing on them and flashing sirens. Have nothing more to do with this girl. Shit....where are my words of wisdom I live by, I gotta find them. Basically though, it's something like this:

look at every relationship with a woman strictly from a "what am i getting out of this?" perspective. And if you're not getting what you want out of it (namely in this case I think we can all agree, to get in her pants) and there are giant curtains and flashing sirens, then you cut and run. Cuz spending anymore time trying to get what she's not going to give up is pointless. POINTLESS. It's heartless, it's self-involved, but you have to look at all your relationships with women through this prism to avoid wasting your time.

Otherwise you end up eternally wrapped around this girl's finger, and even when you think you're over her, you will still think about her in the dark of the night when you're alone under your covers spooning with your pillow, knowing that she is off fucking some other dude.

Oh wait, does it sound like I've been there? Cuz I have been...but no more. NO MORE. Sure I have two female friends, but neither of them have me whipped. Well okay that's a bit of a lie. One of them has me eternally wrapped around her finger, as much as I'd like to deny it, but fortunately she is living a couple hundred miles away right now so I don't see her all that often. The other I'm cool with just being friends. I cut all the girls who had me whipped out of my life, and it makes life a hell of a lot better.

[pennywisesb]

Originally Posted by Izulde

So I went out to the park with Dreams today, surprised her with a picnic lunch.

What girl in their right mind would assume someone who's only interested in pursuing a friendship would do this?

Originally Posted by Izulde

4. She asked me how to get over the ex and mentioned a couple guys she thought she might have interest in.

Thats such BS when girls pull this with their guy friends. When girls ask me this stuff I don't even give them an answer. When you start answering questions like this you IMMEDIATELY move into the "close friend" zone (which is exactly where WE DO NOT WANT TO GO)

[pennywisesb]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

After the suprise picnic lunch, she probably thinks he's gay.

I guess this quote here nixes my argument on how any girl in their right mind would think that only a "friend" would do this for her. She probably does think you're gay. At least now you can watch her change and grab her butt without her thinking too much of it.

[CraigSca]

Right. Do girls actually think a guy sits around and plans a freakin surprise picnic to foster a friendship?!

Damn you, Dreams!

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by pennywisesb

Thats such BS when girls pull this with their guy friends. When girls ask me this stuff I don't even give them an answer. When you start answering questions like this you IMMEDIATELY move into the "close friend" zone (which is exactly where WE DO NOT WANT TO GO)

Once the question is out I think you are already done, since girls never mention that stuff to guys they are interested in. We've all been through it, except probably Noop. It's not hard to figure out.

[Raven]

Dude, cut your losses before you end up like this guy!

[sabotai]

Well....let's not just stop at "she thinks you're gay". Let's expand this more. She might already know what he feels and why he's doing this stuff, but takes advantage of it anyway....

Damn, that BITCH!

[Suicane75]

You guys are missing the in he has damnit, bunch of blind fuckers. TRICIA clearly wants you and Dreams to get together. Use that to your advantage. Call Tricia and ask her whats up with Dreams, tell Tricia you like Dreams (I mean LIKE, like, wanna get the worm in the warm damp soil kind of like). Tricia will tell dreams, and if im right, encourage her to hook up with you. And if im wrong, fuck it, it was lost anyway.

[DaddyTorgo]

devious...devious Sui. Well played

[Neon_Chaos]

Suicane is right on the money.

Anyone seen the Ladie's Man?

[Raven]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

TRICIA clearly wants you and Dreams to get together.

WTF are you talking about??? He mentioned the girls name, and you automatically assumes that Tricia wants them two to hook up?


Besides, who cares what Tricia wants. He should just take her to the movies, punch a hole in the bottom of the popcorn trick, and take things from there.


The picnic thing is definitely gay as hell. Dude definitely has watched too many Julia Roberts movies.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by Raven

WTF are you talking about??? He mentioned the girls name, and you automatically assumes that Tricia wants them two to hook up?


Besides, who cares what Tricia wants. He should just take her to the movies, punch a hole in the bottom of the popcorn trick, and take things from there.


The picnic thing is definitely gay as hell. Dude definitely has watched too many Julia Roberts movies.

List Cindy, you obviously dont know the backstory. T is D's BF, she wants I & D to get together. Hell, if T didnt have a BF, I might get a little TID action going on.

[Raven]

Sorry Jan, I guess I missed last weeks episode.

[CraigSca]

If T is D's BF, who is D's R^3? Please don't tell me there's a Y[@] involved.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by duckman

You can never have too many friends.


*snickers*

In all seriousness, you can use this situation to your advantage.

Take her out with you when you go to the bar or club. Make sure every girl in the joint sees you with her. Chicks love to hook up with guys they think are unattainable.

Sit with her and look around to make eye contact with other chicks. If they smile at you, go for it. Your batting average goes way up when you use this little tactic.

[JeeberD]

I was afraid this was going to happen.

I used to ALWAYS be The Friend. You know how I got out of that vicious cycle? I started to take action. Don't just sit there and listen to her talk about other guys...make the move, bro! Don't wait forever to let her know you're interested. Go in for the kiss. If she's not interested then at least you'll know and can move on. Be bold, man...

Dammit, no more cheap vodka for me. I'm sounding way too much like HM tonight...

[DaddyTorgo]

and speaking of the one who has me eternally wrapped her finger, guess who is coming down from NY tomorrow to come home for the weekend and who I've already said I'll hang out with tomorrow afternoon?

[BigJohn&TheLions]

Women love to fuck with men they know want them. She has you right where she wants you. You will just about piss yourself if she calls, then she gets to talk about different guys that interest her.

One thing I have found is that women hate it when the tables are turned. Have dinner with her and talk about some woman you met. Hype her up like she is the finest woman you ever saw. Be very excited about her, but admit that you're concerned that you might be falling too fast. You know, BS the whole thing! It will be exactly what she needs. If she has any part of her that has you on standby she might even make a move. If you really want to teach her a lesson, tell her that you enjoy being friends with a woman like her very much, but she's just not the type of woman you could have more than a friendship with.

This site is a great explanation of where you are currently at:
http://www.intellectualwhores.com/ladderintro.html

[timmynausea]

I agree with the assessment of the others who say these are more than just red flags. The only way it could be worse would be if she was literally shouting "You have no chance!" from the roof tops.

[ThunderingHERD]

There are two things that could be going on here:

1) She never really found you suitable for a relationship, but now values your "friendship" because it makes her feel good about herself

2) She initially thought you may be suitable for a relationship, but your behavior made it clear to her that there was no need to pursue anything, because she's got you wrapped around her finger and can have you at any point in the future if she's ever desperate enough

If it is #1, then there is no hope. If it is #2, the chances are still extremely slim.

Assuming it is #2, you have to stop talking to her. Don't make a big deal out of it, like letting her know you can't talk to her anymore because of the way you feel--that will just make you look more pathetic. Just don't call her anymore, if she does call you (which is unlikely, but may occur if she has been jilted by someone she is pursuing) be polite, but do not talk for more than a few minutes. Make sure she knows you have better things to do. Attempt to date as many attractive girls as you can (as if you're not already). After a while, if she was interested enough in you in the first place, she may become available to you again. Chances are she wasn't/won't.

[Izulde]

Hmm well I know back in the winter she was still with the now ex-bf, so I think part of it is that she's still not over this guy, though she's trying to be.

I found it highly amusing when she was talking about what she wanted in a guy and it's like 'um, yo... I'm all those things', but naturally I wasn't going to say a damn thing about that. If she really wants to get to know me, then she get to know me and realize that. If she doesn't, then that's cool... It's been a fun experience and all that jazz.

Though when she was talking about how with her ex-bf, he was her best friend as well as her lover blah blah blah... and how she used to paint all the time, these really great murals etc when they were together, and now she can't even paint a decent tree.

So she was like "I'd like a relationship where I can just jump into it and not go through all this tedious getting to know each other bullshit."

I looked at her and just started laughing, "Nope you're not looking for a quick relationship. You're looking for someone who can inspire you... take your breath away and expand your creative horizons again... You want to breathe and know there's still beauty in the world that can dazzle you... and for someone to show you that."

"Yes! Yes that's exactly what I mean!"

So then I grinned, leapt on my feet, walked over on the blanket to her and took her hands.. pulled her up... "What you're looking for is someone to lift you off your feet and show you how to fly again... to live again..."

Looking back on it now, there was a sparkle in her eyes and I probably should have at least kissed her hands... I think I saw that moment in her face... then, just as I was about to, I paused and waited too long... so she laughed, said I was a dork and we ran off to pick blackberries again together.

[ThunderingHERD]

First, that didn't happen. Second, deluding yourself won't make anything better unless you want to be all masochistic and wallow in fantasies of "what could have been."

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by ThunderingHERD

First, that didn't happen. Second, deluding yourself won't make anything better unless you want to be all masochistic and wallow in fantasies of "what could have been."

I'll grant you that maybe I misinterpreted the look she had, in which case it's a good thing I *didn't* follow my hunch... but yeah.

[Neon_Chaos]

Uh. Izlude, that post was scary. Lol.

BUT, do what you have to do, man. I say go for it.

[Suicane75]

At what point did a musical break out?

[Desnudo]

Lost cause, but I suppose you only learn by doing.

[korme]

Girls suck man. They do, it's part of life.

I have nothing to say.

[thesloppy]

I make the krinkly face everytime I see these threads and the inevitable generalizations that follow, painting women as devious puppetmasters who get joy out of torturing menfolk and depleting them of their vital essence. Surely, there are some women like that (as there are men), but I think the great majority are just going through the same shit that we men deal with. When you're pining away in a situation like this (as I'm sure we've all been in) it's certainly not very healthy for you to think of her as having full control and full knowledge of the situation...A) that's probably not entirely true, and B) whatever control advantage she has in this situation was not brought about necessarily by her choice as much as it was your choice to give it to her. If she truly only wants a close friend, and you present yourself as only that, she can hardly be accused of abusing the situation, since there is no situation in her view.

Likewise, I get really freaked out by advice that involves multiple convoluted steps and gamesmanship. That stuff can be effective, and I'm certainly not going to claim I've never palyed any headgames, but starting a relationship with games and deception just means you're going to have to work AWFUL hard to get out of that loop. If you manage to hook a girl through deceit, jealousy and/or manipulation then that's likely how you're going to default to dealing with her in other time sof stress.

I'm hardly the kind of guy to be giving romantic advice, as I've never been super confident and my list of 'conquests' could fit on a hand, but regardless of what kind of relationship we're talking about, romantic, professional, wheatever, it's never effective to think of yourself as a pawn in someone else's game. You end up being passive and only responding to the other person's actions, assuming that they know how to play the game, which isn't necessarily true. Remember that there are no hard and fast rules and overanalyzing everything will just give you a big headache.

The best advice, in my opinion, has already been suggested, and unfortunately it's also the hardest to take: just eb honest and up-front. you obviously want to know if she's interested in you as more than a friend, but for all intents and purposes you are only presenting yourself as a friend, so it's possible you are confusing her just as much as she is you. Sure the typical 'I love how we can talk' comments, and talk about other boys could mean she has no attraction to you....could also mean she's trying to feel you out with her own bit of passive-aggressive manipulations. Unfortunately without confronting the situation directly and honestly, you could dance around in the same fog for months until one of you finds something or someone better to do.

Rather than acting passive and trying to decipher her every word and action with the super secret gurl decoder ring, put your focus back on your own actions and words....the things that you can actually control. Don't try to affect the 'sensitive friend' or the 'cocky and funny playboy'. If you just be yourself, be upfront, and be honest, whatever reaction you get won't have to be analyzed and decoded.

[korme]

Not devious puppetmasters, it is just that like men, they want what they can't get. Drooling over them doesn't really work. I mean, you can say "you look really good tonight", but there is a line you dont cross, i.e. "i like you". or atleast that is how it seems to be working lately.

As a wise sheriff once said, "desperation is a stinky cologne."

[timmynausea]

Originally Posted by Izulde

So she was like "I'd like a relationship where I can just jump into it and not go through all this tedious getting to know each other bullshit."

I looked at her and just started laughing, "Nope you're not looking for a quick relationship. You're looking for someone who can inspire you... take your breath away and expand your creative horizons again... You want to breathe and know there's still beauty in the world that can dazzle you... and for someone to show you that."

"Yes! Yes that's exactly what I mean!"

So then I grinned, leapt on my feet, walked over on the blanket to her and took her hands.. pulled her up... "What you're looking for is someone to lift you off your feet and show you how to fly again... to live again..."

Looking back on it now, there was a sparkle in her eyes and I probably should have at least kissed her hands... I think I saw that moment in her face... then, just as I was about to, I paused and waited too long... so she laughed, said I was a dork and we ran off to pick blackberries again together.

The solution here is plain as day. You should just get a job writing for Dawson's Creek or etc. Then once you're sort of halfway famous, you can probably get a girlfriend.

[Loren]

I agree with the guy on top of me(DAMMMNIT it was the sloppy guy when i started typing )..just be straight with her, you're a GUY, go with your gut and say what you want without thinking about it, trust me, we expect it from you, if you're not blatant about something, we aint gonna guess..you guys are the ones with the magical powers to read our minds when we keep everything inside cuz you all should know what we want..if you dont tell her, you'll just wonder about it for forever, and live in regret..

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by Loren

I agree with the guy on top of me(DAMMMNIT it was the sloppy guy when i started typing )..just be straight with her, you're a GUY, go with your gut and say what you want without thinking about it, trust me, we expect it from you, if you're not blatant about something, we aint gonna guess..you guys are the ones with the magical powers to read our minds when we keep everything inside cuz you all should know what we want..if you dont tell her, you'll just wonder about it for forever, and live in regret..

I wanna lick your sweaty feet.

[Loren]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

I wanna lick your sweaty feet.

you know just how to turn me on..dont forget my sweaty hands...

[korme]

what about sweaty hands? did someone call my name?