Question: Creatine and Ripped Fuel

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

Guys I have a question: My younger brother called me and wanted to know if it was safe to take Ripped Fuel with Creatine. I, adviced against it because I didnt know too much about taking both together. Now I have experience with both supplements but never took them together. Is it safe to take them together?

[Desnudo]

I've taken both at the same time before and never noticed a problem. Don't take that as gospel though. I thought Ripped Fuel got taken off the market due to concerns about ephedrine?

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I've taken both at the same time before and never noticed a problem. Don't take that as gospel though. I thought Ripped Fuel got taken off the market due to concerns about ephedrine?

It comes in Ephedra free now. It just keeps you awake now.

[Joe]

When I was in HS, a guy on my football team had a heart attack because he took too much Ripped Fuel before a game, so be careful with that stuff.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

Originally Posted by George W Bush

When I was in HS, a guy on my football team had a heart attack because he took too much Ripped Fuel before a game, so be careful with that stuff.

He's been taking creatine for 3 mos. now and has added 12 lbs. to his frame.
He's 17 y/o and weighs 170. He wants to get leaner w/o running 4-6 miles daily

[jamesUMD]

I think that HMB was the best supplement that I used for building muscle. That stuff rocked. It's been a while but from what I remember, your body is fairly inefficient when utilizing protein that is part of your dietary intake, something like your body uses 3 grams out of every 10 grams that you eat, with the rest going out the old pooper.

HMB kept the protein from flushing out of my system and I definitely put a good amount of lean muscle on quickly with it. Another pro was that my recovery period seemed much shorter.

Creatine just made me sick if I took it on an empty or near empty stomach (like when I was in the Army and PT was at 6:30am). I did like ripped fuel though. Once I stopped taking Creatine I lost a good bit of weight. My understanding was that creatine made your body retain more water in your muscles, which definitely makes your muscles have that full kind of pumped up effect. When you stop taking it your body tends to flush out that excess water. I used to be a trainer and that's what I remember from back then.

[mrsimperless]

HMB?

[jamesUMD]

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/eas/hmb.html

Not an advertisement.

[Shucker]

OK, you guys seem to know something about this stuff. What, if anything, would you suggest for my son. He is 13, very lean and solid as a rock. He has been growing and is about 5'9" and 118 lbs. He works very hard at the sports he plays. He wrestled for the first time last year and that is a tremendous workout. He is getting ready for 8th grade football but I am afraid he is a bit underweight for a runningback (his team had 160 and 165 RBs last year). He has done no weight training because I am not sure when boys are supposed to get started and when they are not. I am not disappointed with where he is or how he has developed, the only thing is, if there was a protein or something he could take to capitalize on his efforts even more, so the better. Above all, I don't want to risk his health with anything questionable, he means more to me as a son than he does an athlete.

I look forward to hearing from you guys. Thanks

[Neon_Chaos]

Chemical Soldier: Hmmm. Hydroxicut would be much safer, if he wants to get lean.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

Originally Posted by Shucker

OK, you guys seem to know something about this stuff. What, if anything, would you suggest for my son. He is 13, very lean and solid as a rock. He has been growing and is about 5'9" and 118 lbs. He works very hard at the sports he plays. He wrestled for the first time last year and that is a tremendous workout. He is getting ready for 8th grade football but I am afraid he is a bit underweight for a runningback (his team had 160 and 165 RBs last year). He has done no weight training because I am not sure when boys are supposed to get started and when they are not. I am not disappointed with where he is or how he has developed, the only thing is, if there was a protein or something he could take to capitalize on his efforts even more, so the better. Above all, I don't want to risk his health with anything questionable, he means more to me as a son than he does an athlete.

I look forward to hearing from you guys. Thanks

Start him off with whey pro and weight training 3-5 X week, I think he maybe too young to take creatine.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Why doesn't your brother ask his doctor??? I would advise against relying on anectodal comments from a few people here you don't even know very well. I know they mean best (hopefully), but posters giving advice on this to someone they know nothing about (especially their physiology) is dangerous, frankly.

And Shucker, I hope you're joking. You are not seriously interested in getting advice from people here on what chemicals to put in your 13 year old son?

[Travis]

13 years old? Just make sure he's eating right and don't worry about him hitting a gym or any of that kind of stuff right now. If he's active and eating properly, waiting until he's 16+ to start weight training isn't a bad thing.

Cardio, flexibility training and that sort of stuff go crazy, but his natural growth at this point should take care of the rest.

[jamesUMD]

Originally Posted by Vinatieri for Prez

Why doesn't your brother ask his doctor??? I would advise against relying on anectodal comments from a few people here you don't even know very well. I know they mean best (hopefully), but posters giving advice on this to someone they know nothing about (especially their physiology) is dangerous, frankly.

I know the prefice behind what creatine and HMB do are correct from what I said. When I say, "from what I remember", it means that I can't remember verbatim what the research I read said and feel the need to put a disclaimer on myself, not invalidate what I am saying. HMB is a form of Amino Acid and is essentially making your body more efficient at storing protein, which in returns builds more muscle.

The information is out there for others to do their own due diligence on. Many doctor's won't stray from the general eat healthy/excercise edict since:

1. Most Nutritional supplements have not been approved by the FDA
2. There are millions of different types out there in use (far too many for them to understand the effects of all the types of supplements, let alone each specific brand)
3. There is not much in the way of research on the long term effects of these supplements since they are much newer, and there is less oversight to force the companies to do long term studies.

Doctor's might not want to put them in a position for a nice fat malpractice suit.

[maximus]

Originally Posted by George W Bush

When I was in HS, a guy on my football team had a heart attack because he took too much Ripped Fuel before a game, so be careful with that stuff.

I would bet the bank that the stuff he was taking had Ephedra in it but at the same time I took Ephedra for four years w/o issues with creatine and some "other help"...which I won't get into right now but I doubt Ephedra was the cause. He may have had other unknown issues prior to that. I think it is common knowledge that Ephedra is a base of cocaine which is actually used for medical uses these days. Ephedra gets a bad rap about how it can cause heart attacks but yet they still legalize cigs - which causes cancer and has been proven to help in the cause of heart attacks. There is so little info on Ephedra that people do not know about.

Back to Shucker.

If he is only 13 yrs old I would completely stay away from any performing enhancing drug (OTC or not). All creatine does is that is helps keeps the muscles "pumped" and hydrates the muscles so that they last longer (more enegery) and allows for quicker recovery. This in return allows for a quicker build of lean body mass. Creatine is a compound that can be made in our bodies or taken as a dietary supplement. The chemical name for Creatine is methyl guanidine-acetic acid. It is believed that 95 - 98% of the creatine in our body is stored in our muscles. The remaining about 2- 5% is stored in various other parts of the body including the brain, heart and testes. When adding more creatine to the body (more than say 3.5 to 5.0 grams) it then becomes waste - you crap it out.

Creatine does these three major things:
*Volumization of your muscles
*Buffer Lactic Acid build-up
*Enhances Protein Synthesis

At the age of 13 he should not be taking this stuff as like anything else it may stun or prohibit groweth. Thats just my advice.

[JimmyWint]

Whatever happened to gool ole eating a lot of Lean Meats High in Protien...ie chicken and turkey breast as well as other good forms including egg whites and cottage cheese. Combine that with 4 servings of Veggies every day, and a multivitamin, and hit the weights and you will see gains. I am not sold on all of these supplements when it can be achieved naturally.

I would never let a child use any kind of supplement.
Just my opinion

[maximus]

Over the weekend I will right up a pretty big thread containing what I've doen to get to where I am. I will come clean on isses that people here at home do not even know. But I will tell you all one thing. I am 30 yrs old right now - at the age of 24 I was a stick at 170lbs (even shorty could break me in half ) But that all changed when I started to get serious in body building. I just got bigger...and bigger...and bigger. Before you knew it in 6-8 weeks later I was a lean massive 200lb beast. But again, I will write up something and then post it for all to read.

[maximus]

Originally Posted by JimmyWint

Whatever happened to gool ole eating a lot of Lean Meats High in Protien...ie chicken and turkey breast as well as other good forms including egg whites and cottage cheese. Combine that with 4 servings of Veggies every day, and a multivitamin, and hit the weights and you will see gains. I am not sold on all of these supplements when it can be achieved naturally.

I would never let a child use any kind of supplement.
Just my opinion

Meats are overy processed now but I completely agree with you. Lean meats are the only (legal) way to pack on that true lean mass. I will say that beef (red meat) has a lot of creatine in it all by itself. Chicken and turkey does not have it. Personally I use creatine in what you would call a "cut cycle". Since creatine is a mass builder - well actually its a mass keeper and may add a few pouunds of mass over time, it is good to take when you want to get shredded. However, creatine holds water so stay away from sodium related foods because you'll just look all "puffy" and rounded out instead of lean.

[maximus]

Originally Posted by Shucker

OK, you guys seem to know something about this stuff. What, if anything, would you suggest for my son. He is 13, very lean and solid as a rock. He has been growing and is about 5'9" and 118 lbs. He works very hard at the sports he plays. He wrestled for the first time last year and that is a tremendous workout. He is getting ready for 8th grade football but I am afraid he is a bit underweight for a runningback (his team had 160 and 165 RBs last year). He has done no weight training because I am not sure when boys are supposed to get started and when they are not. I am not disappointed with where he is or how he has developed, the only thing is, if there was a protein or something he could take to capitalize on his efforts even more, so the better. Above all, I don't want to risk his health with anything questionable, he means more to me as a son than he does an athlete.

I look forward to hearing from you guys. Thanks

IMO at 5'9" at 118lbs he is underweight. He needs to eat more lean foods - a lot more.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by maximus

Meats are overy processed now but I completely agree with you.

I'd like to point out that a growing number of stores now sell Meats that do not have artificial substances in them (hormones, antibiotics, preservatives, etc...). It costs a bit more, but it can be worth it, IMO.

In Chicago, I've found these products even at "normal" grocery stores, but if you have a Whole Foods or something similar nearby, they will certainly have these meats.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by Vinatieri for Prez

Why doesn't your brother ask his doctor??? I would advise against relying on anectodal comments from a few people here you don't even know very well. I know they mean best (hopefully), but posters giving advice on this to someone they know nothing about (especially their physiology) is dangerous, frankly.

And Shucker, I hope you're joking. You are not seriously interested in getting advice from people here on what chemicals to put in your 13 year old son?

It's pretty standard knowledge that you don't start lifting weights until you are 15 or 16. It doesn't require a doctor. You don't need to know someone's specific physiology, just use their age as a rule of thumb.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by maximus

IMO at 5'9" at 118lbs he is underweight. He needs to eat more lean foods - a lot more.

That's because he's got a high metabolism at his age. When I was 13, I was 5'6" and weighed 108lbs. He will start putting the weight on as he ages and won't put on tons of weight until he is at least 18.

[MO542]

Originally Posted by CHEMICAL SOLDIER

He's been taking creatine for 3 mos. now and has added 12 lbs. to his frame.
He's 17 y/o and weighs 170. He wants to get leaner w/o running 4-6 miles daily

My guess is that at least half of those 13 lbs he put on is water weight from the creatine. It is safe to take them together, although creatine is usually used for putting on mass and ripped fuel is used for cutting. It’s hard to both at the same time. If he wants to lean out, diet and cardio is the key. He is going to have to learn how to eat correctly. He needs to find out many calories he needs to maintain his weight, then cut them about 500 calories a day from there. An example diet would be something like the following:

Breakfast
3 egg whites / 3 eggs
Oatmeal
Banana
Flax seed oil
Snack
Whey protein shake
Some fruit
Lunch
Tuna on wheat
Some veggies
Snack
Whey protein shake
Some fruit
Dinner
Lean meat (i.e. chicken, turkey, lean red meat)
Brown rice
Veggie or salad
Before Bed
Whey protein mixed in milk or cottage cheese

You looking for about 1.5 -2 grams of protein per lb of body weight and cut the maintenance calories by about 500.

[damnMikeBrown]

\
Creatine as a way to get shredded? It causes water retention in muscle mass. How does bloating aide in a cut look?

Creatine aids in muscle recovery. It is found in red meat naturally, and not harmfull in any way (there have been volumes of studies done). There is about 20% of the population that does not respond to creatine. I am, unfortunately, a non-responder. For people like us, there are other routes to go such as CEE. CEE is another form of creatine that often is usefull to non-responders. It's fairly new however, and doesn't have the wealth of studies behind it that creatine does.

Some non-responders are actually responders that have already loaded themselves with creatine naturally through their diet. This is difficult to do, but a diet heavy in red meats would highly raise creatine levels in the body. Creatine supplementation is easier, cheaper, and probably treat most people much better than eating that much red meat however.

The best way for a youth to put on weight? Eat more food. Just a rule of thumb, but a gram of protein for every pound of lbm. Body builders go as high as 2+, as I have done in the past. I found it to be very effective. This is in conjunction with a hyper-caloric diet that includes 20+g/day of good fats. Can't forget those omega 3's...

Creatine and ripped fuel would be working at counter purposes. Ripped fuel is in part a diuretic, countering the water retention of creatine. Ripped fuel would probably add something to the order of an additional 10% to the calories burned per day. Perhaps 5% is more realistic, but that's what you're looking at. It isn't a huge benefit, and diet is still the king of how to alter the body's appearance.

Taking creatine while trying to get very lean wouldn't prohibit getting the "lean" look, but it would hamper it. Creatine would, however, help reduce strength loss that is almost unavoidable during cutting.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

"Why doesn't your brother ask his doctor??? I would advise against relying on anectodal comments from a few people here you don't even know very well. I know they mean best (hopefully), but posters giving advice on this to someone they know nothing about (especially their physiology) is dangerous, frankly."

And Shucker, I hope you're joking. You are not seriously interested in getting advice from people here on what chemicals to put in your 13 year old son

Originally Posted by Desnudo

It's pretty standard knowledge that you don't start lifting weights until you are 15 or 16. It doesn't require a doctor. You don't need to know someone's specific physiology, just use their age as a rule of thumb.

The first part of my thread was in relation to the CS's brother who was older, when I talk about physiology. The second part was related to Shucker's 13 year old son. Anyways, when I say physiology, I mean nobody knows here whether the brother has high blood pressure, a certain disease, a history of reactions to stuff, on certain medication, etc. that could make taking this stuff very dangerous. That's why asking these kinds of things and taking advice can be a little dangerous. For most people, the advice is fine, but for a few it will end up being very, very bad advice.

[BishopMVP]

Shucker - I'd say avoid any sort of supplements like Creatine, and even heavy weight-lifting at this age. Whey protein would probably be safe, but unnecessary as long as he's eating a lot of meat. For getting stronger, I've always heard avoid lifting heavily until you've started to reach the end of puberty and your natural growing. So just stick to push-ups, sit-ups, chin-ups/pull-ups for now. If he does them every day, he'll get stronger without risking damage to his future health. For RB, maybe get some leg weights and go run some hills. Get a jump-rope and do that every day in addition to the running. But in my completely unprofessional opinion, I'd say avoid lifting with heavy weights and all supplements for a couple years.

[JeeberD]

I'll need to give this thread a more thorough look after work today. About three days ago I started working out again after a six or seven year layoff (and boy am I sore). I would like to add muscle and cut my fat way down...gotta look sexy for my wedding in a year, you know?

[mrsimperless]

Originally Posted by maximus

Over the weekend I will right up a pretty big thread containing what I've doen to get to where I am. I will come clean on isses that people here at home do not even know. But I will tell you all one thing. I am 30 yrs old right now - at the age of 24 I was a stick at 170lbs (even shorty could break me in half ) But that all changed when I started to get serious in body building. I just got bigger...and bigger...and bigger. Before you knew it in 6-8 weeks later I was a lean massive 200lb beast. But again, I will write up something and then post it for all to read.

What ever happened to this? How are we supposed to mold ourselves in your physical image if you don't show us the way?

Seriously, are you still planning on doing this, or did I miss it somewhere in the jumble?

[maximus]

Originally Posted by mrsimperless

What ever happened to this? How are we supposed to mold ourselves in your physical image if you don't show us the way?

Seriously, are you still planning on doing this, or did I miss it somewhere in the jumble?

No, I never wrote it up because I am not sure if people on this board will accept it. I thought about it but then I decided I really don't want to get into how I did it due to all the recent sports scandals.