Sam Keller sues EA Sports and the NCAA

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

Once again, the end goal of the suit is to bar the NCAA from banning players from reaching their own deals. Not to keep the video game companies from being able to use the likenesses. The point is that the NCAA gets the money from EA so that EA can use the NCAA information. But the players get jack even though their likenesses are why the game makes money.

And the chances of that happening are zero. EA will end up doing what they appear to be doing with this year's version and just making things different enough to get by without making a deal with the players.

I've bought exactly 1 copy of NCAA football in the last 10 years so I really don't give a shit either way, but Keller knows exactly what the most likely result of this is. It's 100% an attempt to get attention.

[Logan]

The NCAA gets money from ESPN...and CBS...and Fox...and Disney...and every corporate sponsor. As someone said above, it's not even their likeness that they are making money from; it's them directly.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

Y But the players get jack even though their likenesses are why the game makes money.

Seen the cost of a 4 year ride lately? That's more than "jack".

And I say that as someone who thinks they ought to blow up the whole scholarship model & simply pay the players (for football & probably basketball) out of the marketing budget and forego the whole going to class thing for a redesigned Division I.

But that doesn't discount that every player currently on a ride is getting paid to play.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

enough to get by without making a deal with the players.

I hope so, otherwise we'll be paying $500 per copy just to cover the legal fees of negotiating individual deals with every player in D1 football.

[Huckleberry]

Jack is a relative term. Some of the players are overpaid based on their school's tuition rates and their value as players. The point is that many players are seriously underpaid. What do you think Matt Leinart's value was heading into his senior season compared to his tuition and fees? How about Tim Tebow and this season?

And your concern with negotiating with every player doesn't seem worthwhile. If the NCAA removes the ban then it would seem likely an NCAA Players' Association type organization would be formed fairly quickly and would be the sole negotiating point. The star players would make their money off outside deals, or for their likeness to be on the cover or to appear in commercials for the game.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

What do you think Matt Leinart's value was heading into his senior season compared to his tuition and fees?

What do you think Matt Leinart's value is now heading into his fourth NFL season compared to his contract and the amount of money he has already made?

Things tend to balance out.

[Huckleberry]

Originally Posted by Logan

What do you think Matt Leinart's value is now heading into his fourth NFL season compared to his contract and the amount of money he has already made?

Things tend to balance out.

Your grand argument for the NCAA and its institutions being able to pocket all the money they make off the players while they're in college is that "things tend to balance out"?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

They are being compensated, by a) Receiving a free college education, and b) Having the opportunity to play in the NFL, because the NFL required college sports experience, the fact that the NCAA/college is providing you that, free of charge, is compensation enough.

That might be enough in your mind, but it doesn't make it right legally. Many people believe that downloading music for free is fine because the singers make their money doing concerts and selling merchandise. Just because they are being given good opportunities doesn't mean that they don't have the same legal rights as others.

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

The Croc Hunter analogy doesn't fit at all. Sam Keller didn't have to play sports at ASU or Nebraska, he did so willingly under the idea that he could parley his time into a career in the NFL.

I don't see how it doesn't fit. It's the same thing. The old college hoops games had a player on Florida with the same number as Joakim Noah that was the same height, same hair, same complexion, and same facial features. That to me is no different than creating a character who matches every feature of the Crocodile Hunter but under a different name.

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

His "likeness" in a video game is no different than his likeness on an ESPN highlight -- ESPN, like EA, is benefiting financially, and Keller is benefiting by hightened exposure and a free education.

I believe highlights are not treated the same because a highlight is essentially a news event.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I doubt this is a coincidence. Apparently, NCAA 10 is going to ship with outdated rosters that will be much worse than previous years. There are reports that no freshman are on teams and seniors from last year are still with their teams:

NCAA Football Heading Down Generic Path | pastapadre.com

Is that due to the lawsuit? I just wonder if the outdated rosters has more to do with budget cuts at the company and less to do with this lawsuit (which makes a convenient excuse for them).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

What do you think Matt Leinart's value was heading into his senior season compared to his tuition and fees? How about Tim Tebow and this season?

Without that, his value would be virtually zero (or whatever the CFL is paying) unless & until the NFL wants to pay for a full minor league system.

And your concern with negotiating with every player doesn't seem worthwhile. If the NCAA removes the ban then it would seem likely an NCAA Players' Association type organization would be formed fairly quickly and would be the sole negotiating point. The star players would make their money off outside deals, or for their likeness to be on the cover or to appear in commercials for the game.

If you think there's a snowball's chance in hell of, what, more than 8000 college players being able to agree on anything remotely approaching a collective marketing agreement then you have far more faith in the organizational ability of teenagers & early 20 somethings than I do.

And I give far less of a damn whether the Leinart's or any handful of star players are in the game than about having the bulk of team rosters being correct. Unlike the NFL, it's the teams that matter in college football, not just the individual star players. Point being, getting a handful of stars together under what amount to an agent's banner isn't going to cut it by a long shot.

And none of this matters one whit, since I can't imagine the NCAA essentially letting players turn pro in football anytime in the foreseeable future.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

Once again, the end goal of the suit is to bar the NCAA from banning players from reaching their own deals. Not to keep the video game companies from being able to use the likenesses. The point is that the NCAA gets the money from EA so that EA can use the NCAA information. But the players get jack even though their likenesses are why the game makes money.

Going to have to disagree pretty strongly with the bolded part. The game makes money because:

- It has all the college teams (by far the biggest reason it sells)
- It has the real stadiums
- It has other college touches like the fight songs and mascots
- It has rosters with players whose ratings are pretty close approximations of the real thing

I could personally give a rip if the players look much like their real counterparts. I realize I'm a bit unusual in that I don't care so much about having real players - I'm fine creating a fictional player universe, but I doubt too many people care all that much whether the "QB #10" for Washington looks much like Jake Locker or not, so long as the guy is white and solidly built. And that's all stuff that could be easily edited after the fact.

[sabotai]

I, for one, don't care at all about real rosters or if the likeness of the players match the real teams. In fact, I'd like an option to completely generate new rosters from scratch every time I begin a new dynasty.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

Your grand argument for the NCAA and its institutions being able to pocket all the money they make off the players while they're in college is that "things tend to balance out"?

To be fair, your Leinart example wasn't the best either. He had every right to forego his senior season and receive every penny of his market value as a professional football player. Instead, he decided to enroll in a ballroom dancing class, play college football and bang a bunch of co-eds.

[Balldog]

I don't buy into this crap that athletes don't get paid, a free education and all the other benefits that go along with getting a full ride is more than most of these could do right out of high school without playing football.

Very few college athletes end up playing professional sports, but they have an opportunity to leave with a college degree and no student loans.

And its not like I watch these sports to watch these specific players, if Pryor wasn't the QB at Ohio State I'd still watch the games.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Looks like the lack of freshman or accuracy of the rosters was a bug in the gold build of the game and not related to the lawsuit in any way. Color me surprised.

Update on NCAA Football 10 Rosters | pastapadre.com

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

Your grand argument for the NCAA and its institutions being able to pocket all the money they make off the players while they're in college is that "things tend to balance out"?

Actually, it was more of a shot at Matt Leinart.

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Without that, his value would be virtually zero (or whatever the CFL is paying) unless & until the NFL wants to pay for a full minor league system.

Originally Posted by digamma

To be fair, your Leinart example wasn't the best either. He had every right to forego his senior season and receive every penny of his market value as a professional football player. Instead, he decided to enroll in a ballroom dancing class, play college football and bang a bunch of co-eds.

But yeah, what these guys said. It's a tired argument, but no one is forcing these guys to return to school once they've *used the system* in place to begin building up their own value.

Don't like that the NCAA will make money off you? Don't play college football. Worked out pretty well for Antonio Gates.

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Looks like the lack of freshman or accuracy of the rosters was a bug in the gold build of the game and not related to the lawsuit in any way. Color me surprised.

Update on NCAA Football 10 Rosters | pastapadre.com

Like I said originally, knew something was wrong since I've seen the entire Rutgers roster and impact freshman and no "super super seniors" are in there.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

You're nuts if you think the free education is market value for every college football player.

I guess I am nuts, because I will be paying student loans back for many years, and I didn't even attend a high profile school such as USC. According to this article, tuition went up again, and is now over $37k, not including room/board/books/etc.

Daily Trojan - Tuition expected to rise again in 2009

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

The PDF is definitely an interesting read, pointing out all the prohibitions against using player likenesses by the NCAA, and then that the NCAA has to approve the EA titles before shipping. I think the bigger beef here will be with the NCAA vs EA, in that the argument is the NCAA should have stopped them from matching so much biographical and physical data and not approved the titles, given the NCAA's own stance and paperwork for the players. Should be interesting to follow...

Time to remind folks that the lawsuit is not about compensation but about the NCAA's own rules and paperwork they made these kids sign that they then went against in relation to the game...

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Pretty much. There's been players speak out against Keller essentially saying everyone they know loves seeing themselves in the games and would rather have it that way than have fictional players in their place.

Not wanting a cut of someone making money off of you means you're young or stupid or both.

He may or may not have a good legal claim, but what he's doing is just capitalism.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Samdari

Not wanting a cut of someone making money off of you means you're young or stupid or both.

He may or may not have a good legal claim, but what he's doing is just capitalism.

Capitalism would be if he goes around offering his likeness (or real-ness) to the highest bidder.

Comedy would be when no one pays him a god damn cent because no one out there gives a shit about his likeness.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Looks like the lack of freshman or accuracy of the rosters was a bug in the gold build of the game and not related to the lawsuit in any way. Color me surprised.

Update on NCAA Football 10 Rosters | pastapadre.com

Actually, the top producer of the game on OS has said that it isn't even a bug, but an issue of putting the wrong version of the roster on the team builder site and since it has to match up with the disc version, they don't want to change it. They are trying to come up with a solution that wouldn't invalidate all of the work that has gone on with team builder (reportedly well over 50k teams created so far.)

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Actually, the top producer of the game on OS has said that it isn't even a bug, but an issue of putting the wrong version of the roster on the team builder site and since it has to match up with the disc version, they don't want to change it. They are trying to come up with a solution that wouldn't invalidate all of the work that has gone on with team builder (reportedly well over 50k teams created so far.)

Alright, a FUBAR moment rather than a bug that could piss off some users. Either way, a horrible start and it hasn't even been released yet.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Alright, a FUBAR moment rather than a bug that could piss off some users. Either way, a horrible start and it hasn't even been released yet.

I think you bash EA way too much, but I absolutely agree. Personally, I think putting the wrong version of the rosters out there is much worse than some sort of bug that snuck through. Seems like a lack of basic organizational skills in their development team to put the wrong version of rosters out there.

[Tigercat]

Does anyone remember Mutant League Football? That had players with names similar to their NFL counterparts, like Bones Jackson for Bo Jackson. And, oh my goodness, Bones Jackson is just as good in certain running areas as Bo Jackson was! (Except Bones Jackson had even more fragile "bones," and he was allowed to kill the referee.)

I really think too many are overestimating the merits of this suit. There is no individual stored likeness in NCAA football games. Just like the characters in Mutant League Football were caricatures of real life players, but not illegal because they weren't being passed as real likenesses, so are the players in NCAA football. There are no specific likenesses stored on the game disc, nor are any specific likenesses displayed on the game. Similar or correct height and weight numbers and player equipment with generic game faces and no real names is not enough to say that EA is using real likenesses.

I think EA knows this and that is why they aren't afraid to keep doing what they've been doing with the rosters.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Logan

Capitalism would be if he goes around offering his likeness (or real-ness) to the highest bidder.

Comedy would be when no one pays him a god damn cent because no one out there gives a shit about his likeness.

+ 1

I am not sure why he would even WANT people to know there is a likeness to him in the game. Has anyone seen him play???? Ugghhhh....

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Tigercat

Does anyone remember Mutant League Football? That had players with names similar to their NFL counterparts, like Bones Jackson for Bo Jackson. And, oh my goodness, Bones Jackson is just as good in certain running areas as Bo Jackson was! (Except Bones Jackson had even more fragile "bones," and he was allowed to kill the referee.)

I really think too many are overestimating the merits of this suit. There is no individual stored likeness in NCAA football games. Just like the characters in Mutant League Football were caricatures of real life players, but not illegal because they weren't being passed as real likenesses, so are the players in NCAA football. There are no specific likenesses stored on the game disc, nor are any specific likenesses displayed on the game. Similar or correct height and weight numbers and player equipment with generic game faces and no real names is not enough to say that EA is using real likenesses.

I think EA knows this and that is why they aren't afraid to keep doing what they've been doing with the rosters.

The Mutant League players were parodies if anything of the players. Gross overexaggerations. I remember some of the players from the old College Hoops game, and they looked exactly like their real life counterparts.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I think you bash EA way too much, but I absolutely agree. Personally, I think putting the wrong version of the rosters out there is much worse than some sort of bug that snuck through. Seems like a lack of basic organizational skills in their development team to put the wrong version of rosters out there.

I think it is a no brainer. You put the correct roster version on the disc. You wipe the website and put the correct version on team builder and everyone can re-make their teams.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Balldog

I don't buy into this crap that athletes don't get paid, a free education and all the other benefits that go along with getting a full ride is more than most of these could do right out of high school without playing football.

Very few college athletes end up playing professional sports, but they have an opportunity to leave with a college degree and no student loans.

And its not like I watch these sports to watch these specific players, if Pryor wasn't the QB at Ohio State I'd still watch the games.

Totally agree, I emailed a coach I talk to at BYU from time to time and right now, with ancillaries, stipends, travel , meal costs and actual tuition the average Football schollie costs $125,000 to $150,000 over 4 years. With each class averaging around 22 athletes thats well over $3,000,000 per class if they stay and earn a degree. Obviously not all kids stay, but those are lofty figures. Add to the fact that most players are treated very well by any number of people (Girls, Alumni, etc) that but them things, lends them Cars and everything else, not tom mention the extra money his degree will help him earn when he enters the work force. Should anyone really cry for Sam Keller, whose career never fullfilled the hype and who now whats to file a bullshit suit instead of earning an honest living like the rest of us.

In the end if they divied up the profits from Merchandise and Video game sales amoung the players and said "Here, pay your own tuition." I highly doubt the players would come out ahead. Also lets not forget the fact that Football and Basketball are the only two College sports that really make money, so they therefore subsidize things like Lacrosse, swimming, Baseball, etc, helping many more men and women in other sports get a free College education as well.

[kcchief19]

Here's something worth noting from the NCAA's Web site (their underlining, not mine):

Athletic scholarships for undergraduate student-athletes at Division I and Division II schools are partially funded through the NCAA membership revenue distribution. About $1 billion in athletic scholarships are awarded each year. Over 126,000 student-athletes receive either a partial or full athletic scholarship. However, these scholarships are awarded and administered directly by each academic institution, not the NCAA.

If you look closely at the game, you'll see that the licenses inside the game are struck by EA with the individual bowl games, conferences and teams. The NCAA does not have any contract for scholarship with the players; it is the universities themselves that have the contract. Why is Sam Keller not suing Nebraska and Arizona State, since they also profited from the use of his likeness in the game? The answer is that Keller's scholarship agreement with those universities provides them with the ability to use his likeness.

The NCAA Constitution does cover how member institutions may use a student athlete's likeness. Check out page 71. http://www.ncaapublications.com/Uplo...d6827c16bc.pdf
Since Keller's lawsuit doesn't specify what the constitution says, let's check it out for ourselves:

Any commercial items with names, likenesses or pictures of multiple student-athletes (other than highlight films or media guides per Bylaw 12.5.1.7) may be sold only at the member institution at which the student-athletes are enrolled, institutionally controlled (owned and operated) outlets or outlets controlled by the charitable or educational organization (e.g., location of the charitable or educational organization, site of charitable event during the event). Items that include an individual student-athlete’s name, picture or likeness (e.g., name on jersey, name or likeness on a bobble-head doll), other than informational items (e.g., media guide, schedule cards, institutional publications), may not be sold; and (Adopted: 1/16/93, Revised: 1/9/96, 4/27/06 effective 8/1/06)

So, let's say for a moment that Keller's right -- the video games use his likeness. If that is the case, that is not allowed. However, it is not the NCAA that is doing it; rather, it is the university. So in effect the schools are the ones in violation of the NCAA Constitution. Violations of using a player's likeness are considered an institutional violation and the school's could face penalties.

So, in essence Sam Keller is claiming he and every other NCAA athlete is entitled to damages because the NCAA is not putting teams on probation for allowing their student athletes' likenesses to be used in the video games. How is he harmed? Rereading the suit, Keller never actually says the universities used his likeness without authorization. Instead, Keller says the NCAA isn't following its own rules.

How would that be different from me suing the state of Missouri because the guy passing me on the highway was speeding and the highway patrol didn't give him a ticket? Aren't they just encouraging speeding by not enforcing their own rules?

But we are left with a question of whether or not the video games are "informational items." I think it's a very grey line. Strictly speaking, the school may be breaking NCAA rules. However, the school's are violating the player's right to the use of his or her likeness; the school's are violating NCAA rules. The penalty for that is not compensation to the players; it's NCAA sanctions.

I guess the winner in the lawsuit if Keller prevails will be the FCS schools. They aren't in the game so I guess it will be Northern Iowa vs Appalachian State in the Rose Bowl!

[Tigercat]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

The Mutant League players were parodies if anything of the players. Gross overexaggerations. I remember some of the players from the old College Hoops game, and they looked exactly like their real life counterparts.

Well I can't speak for the college hoops game, but when there are 3 skin tone types and 10-20 generic face types available, how is it possible for the college football game to show a player's true likeness?

You can't accurately portray anyone's actual likeness using college football's programing. Thus why Keller and his lawyers have to start talking about listed height/weights and equipment used to being a fundamental part of a player's likeness, which won't hold up.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

So, let's say for a moment that Keller's right -- the video games use his likeness. If that is the case, that is not allowed. However, it is not the NCAA that is doing it; rather, it is the university. So in effect the schools are the ones in violation of the NCAA Constitution. Violations of using a player's likeness are considered an institutional violation and the school's could face penalties.

The claim is that EA Sports is using his likeness (and that the NCAA and the CLC are conspiring with EA to allow such use when they should be taking steps to stop it).

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Totally agree, I emailed a coach I talk to at BYU from time to time and right now, with ancillaries, stipends, travel , meal costs and actual tuition the average Football schollie costs $125,000 to $150,000 over 4 years. With each class averaging around 22 athletes thats well over $3,000,000 per class if they stay and earn a degree. Obviously not all kids stay, but those are lofty figures. Add to the fact that most players are treated very well by any number of people (Girls, Alumni, etc) that but them things, lends them Cars and everything else, not tom mention the extra money his degree will help him earn when he enters the work force. Should anyone really cry for Sam Keller, whose career never fullfilled the hype and who now whats to file a bullshit suit instead of earning an honest living like the rest of us.

In the end if they divied up the profits from Merchandise and Video game sales amoung the players and said "Here, pay your own tuition." I highly doubt the players would come out ahead. Also lets not forget the fact that Football and Basketball are the only two College sports that really make money, so they therefore subsidize things like Lacrosse, swimming, Baseball, etc, helping many more men and women in other sports get a free College education as well.

Scholarships are great for the players, but lets not act like this is done by schools out of the greatness of their heart. Those scholarships help schools like BYU reach bowl games and make millions of dollars in profit for the university.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by digamma

The claim is that EA Sports is using his likeness (and that the NCAA and the CLC are conspiring with EA to allow such use when they should be taking steps to stop it).

But if his likeness belongs to the school (or the school is allowed to use it) and the school endorses the product (which I'm assuming they do explicitly to allow the game to use the mascots, stadiums and school names) what's the problem? Is Keller going to sue the publishers of the school's media guide because they didn't ask him whether they can use his photo or not?

[fantom1979]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

The NCAA Constitution does cover how member institutions may use a student athlete's likeness. Check out page 71. http://www.ncaapublications.com/Uplo...d6827c16bc.pdf
Since Keller's lawsuit doesn't specify what the constitution says, let's check it out for ourselves:


Any commercial items with names, likenesses or pictures of multiple student-athletes (other than highlight films or media guides per Bylaw 12.5.1.7) may be sold only at the member institution at which the student-athletes are enrolled, institutionally controlled (owned and operated) outlets or outlets controlled by the charitable or educational organization (e.g., location of the charitable or educational organization, site of charitable event during the event). Items that include an individual student-athlete’s name, picture or likeness (e.g., name on jersey, name or likeness on a bobble-head doll), other than informational items (e.g., media guide, schedule cards, institutional publications), may not be sold; and (Adopted: 1/16/93, Revised: 1/9/96, 4/27/06 effective 8/1/06)

Originally Posted by bhlloy

But if his likeness belongs to the school (or the school is allowed to use it) and the school endorses the product (which I'm assuming they do explicitly to allow the game to use the mascots, stadiums and school names) what's the problem? Is Keller going to sue the publishers of the school's media guide because they didn't ask him whether they can use his photo or not?

Looks like media guides are covered by the NCAA constitution

[digamma]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

But if his likeness belongs to the school (or the school is allowed to use it) and the school endorses the product (which I'm assuming they do explicitly to allow the game to use the mascots, stadiums and school names) what's the problem? Is Keller going to sue the publishers of the school's media guide because they didn't ask him whether they can use his photo or not?

Can't seem to find a grant in aid example on the web, but I'd be surprised if it signed over full use of a student athlete's likeness to the school.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Scholarships are great for the players, but lets not act like this is done by schools out of the greatness of their heart. Those scholarships help schools like BYU reach bowl games and make millions of dollars in profit for the university.

I never insinuated the universities did it as a charity or didn't benefit. Its called a return in your investment and its a win/win.

Players get free education and many other great benefits.

Universities get funding and exposure and the ability to finance other scholarship funds with the profits from the big two sports. You don't think that's fair?

And don't act like the players are taken advantage of either, I can tell you story after story of self entitled players who use their status to milk everything they can out of anyone who will give it to them, just like there are many players who are humble and grateful for the opportunities their abilites afford them and exhibit integrity and class every step of the way.

There is good and bad in every layer of the College athletic experience, but again, it is hardly unfair to the players.

[Logan]

Ex-Rutgers quarterback Hart files suit, alleges unauthorized use of likeness in game | mycentraljersey.com | MyCentralJersey.com

The article says that the claims are the same as Keller but I think it's a bit of a different situation. Hart appears as the main background menu image for Rutgers in NCAA 09 despite having graduated in 2007. I thought it was a little weird that they were using graduated players.

[RainMaker]

Saw this on CNBC. Thought it was interesting that he stated he thought they would win.

EA & NCAA Ignoring Lawsuit? - Sports Biz with Darren Rovell - CNBC.com

[Logan]

Should Keller eventually prevail in this lawsuit, as I believe he will, all the athletes who were infringed on this year will be entitled to get cut in on a piece of the damages.

Can someone PLEASE inform me on how a college athlete could receive monetary compensation for being a college athlete without completely destroying his eligibility status? No one discusses it, and even if it's a simple answer (which I doubt), I would like to know why.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by Logan

Can someone PLEASE inform me on how a college athlete could receive monetary compensation for being a college athlete without completely destroying his eligibility status? No one discusses it, and even if it's a simple answer (which I doubt), I would like to know why.

That's why this is such a minefield for the NCAA. They have been adamant about their amateurism rules, but have marketed their sports like professional products. Them losing this lawsuit would seriously impinge on their ability to do so.

[Logan]

I guess my other question is why isn't Keller, et al suing ESPN, CBS, ABC, the BCS, etc as well? As I'm pretty sure someone said earlier, his issue is with the NCAA, not really EA. They are the ones granting the ability for EA and the networks to advertise the players. And I would think that's a much easier case, since we're not talking about a "likeness", but their actual image.

[Huckleberry]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

I guess I am nuts, because I will be paying student loans back for many years, and I didn't even attend a high profile school such as USC. According to this article, tuition went up again, and is now over $37k, not including room/board/books/etc.

Daily Trojan - Tuition expected to rise again in 2009

Yes, you are definitely nuts if you think USC is not more than $150K richer based on Matt Leinart's efforts during his time there. Or Texas based on Vince Young's work, for example.

Also, I'm not saying the players aren't compensated. I already said some are over-compensated based on value. In fact, most are over-compensated. However, some are vastly under-compensated based on value.

[sterlingice]

Great- we're rehashing the old "should athletes be paid" argument. I have yet to see the answer even in the slightest to the following scenario that *will* play out, guaranteed, within 5 years of paying student athlets.

What do you do when you're a university and a women's lacrosse player sues and wins- and they will win under Title IX- and you have to pay every single athlete? Goodbye college athletics.

SI

[mh2365]

If you noticed this lawsuit caused the rosters to be just slightly off on all the players (hometown, height & weight) and the announcers no longer say the names

[Grammaticus]

Lots of the height and weight data is correct and the announcers say most of the names. I'm pretty sure my game disc is not different from anyone elses.

[mh2365]

I've played about 15 games on the 360 with named players and not once have they said any names. A lot of home towns were off in the EA roster, if the home town wasn't then the height or weight was ....

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by mh2365

I've played about 15 games on the 360 with named players and not once have they said any names. A lot of home towns were off in the EA roster, if the home town wasn't then the height or weight was ....

Same here. Almost every USC player has either their hometown, height, or weight slightly different than what they are in real life. Lots of wrong hometowns which I never remember being an issue in previous years.

[RainMaker]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...caa/index.html

Looks like former players and lawyers smell blood.

[Logan]

I hope the Nets turn around and sue Ed O'Bannon.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Same here. Almost every USC player has either their hometown, height, or weight slightly different than what they are in real life. Lots of wrong hometowns which I never remember being an issue in previous years.

Hometowns were not correct in 09. States were correct but hometowns were definitely random...