2007 MLB Playoffs Thread

[Young Drachma]

I HATE those damn towels.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

I HATE those damn towels.

I don't mind em. I have to hand it to the Zona fans tonight. They actually have a bit of life. Not as wild as Coor's will be a couple of night from now, but better than the pathetic showing they had last night.

Of course we still haven't had a questionable call there either

[Young Drachma]

Hahaha...yeah, they can't come close to Coors even when it's quiet. Like I said, it's a hockey crowd. And I don't mean that in a bad way.

[dime]

the arizona crowd must have the attention span of a fly, in between every inning there is some sort of interactive contest or game with the PA announcer/carnival barker yammering about airline tickets or gasoline...just doesn't seem like a baseball atmosphere at all. surprising, considering the area has a baseball history. I guess the franchise doesn't, though.

[TroyF]

Good lord the announcing has been horrible in this years playoffs. Did I seriously just hear the announcer say "will the runners be going on contact?"

Ummm, it's 3-2 count with 2 outs and runners at 1 and 2. Yes, the F'n runners will be going you idiot.

[Young Drachma]

Maybe they assume the people don't know what's going on, so they have to explain basic stuff to us.

[Arles]

Both teams get out of a jam with a leadoff double. As to the festivities in Zona, there's always been more of an "event feel" to Arizona games. Heck, the ballpark has a pool in it

I think what people need to understand is that you have to be a bit "gimmicy" when your team is a decade old in a city full of transients. 80% of the fans over the age of 10 in the park tonight had a different team they rooted for back in 1995. You just can't play the "St. Louis/Boston" old time baseball game card and pack the house in that environment.

Still, the Suns had the same problem in the 70s and early 80s, yet they have sold out something like 7 of the past 10 seasons. So, it can be done, it just takes some time (and getting some true, first-time DBacks fans going).

[Young Drachma]

If the Rockies can win sustainably for the next couple years, they'll have a huge base of kids who've gone to games regularly who are fans.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Maybe they assume the people don't know what's going on, so they have to explain basic stuff to us.

It's a Friday night, it's Arizona vs Colorado. Is there anybody watching this game over the age of, say, 5 years old who doesn't have some sort of decent baseball background?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

It's a Friday night, it's Arizona vs Colorado. Is there anybody watching this game over the age of, say, 5 years old who doesn't have some sort of decent baseball background?

I didn't say I understood the logic. I was just saying that's probably what they're thinking...

[Arles]

Great D by the Rockies. I have to give that ump some credit for seeing that Young hit the foot of the SS. He easily beat the throw, but it wasn't until the replay that I saw him slide into Troy's foot.

I also got a kick out of Brenly acting like Troy had some scouting report that told him Young would slide exactly to the 3-4 inches of the base his foot was covering. Come on, that was just a heady instinctive play. I doubt he got there, sized up Young, checked to make sure his foot was perfectly placed, then caught the ball.

[miami_fan]

Just a heads up to the folks at TBS

The chances of me watching Frank TV decreases a little bit more with every commercial.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Arles

I also got a kick out of Brenly acting like Troy had some scouting report that told him Young would slide exactly to the 3-4 inches of the base his foot was covering. Come on, that was just a heady instinctive play. I doubt he got there, sized up Young, checked to make sure his foot was perfectly placed, then caught the ball.

I think Brenly was saying the scouting report probably indicated that Young slides head first. Because putting that foot there if Young likes to slide feet first would have been a REAL bad idea !

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by TroyF

They don't have a pitching staff that "isn't much beyond Francis" as Sterlingice suggests. You may not know the names, but that pitching staff was the single best staff in the NL after the all star break.

C'mon, you know that half a season does not a franchise make. There really *isn't* much beyond Francis. Where were they in the first half (hint: 3rd from the bottom)? Francis and Cook would make a pretty good 1-2 punch but the pair wouldn't exactly strike fear into the hearts of playoff teams everywhere. Neither are exactly Peavy or the aforementioned Webb. And it's a shame Cook is hurt because it would be a good chance to showcase him. Fogg is the only other guy who even pitched enough innings to qualify for an ERA title this year and he is what I said- erratic- brilliant in some games, crap in others. Not exactly what you draw up when you're going into the season as your best playoff rotation.

SI

[Wolfpack]

That's three straight innings Jimenez has been playing with fire and somehow got away with it. If Arizona loses tonight, they've got no one to blame but themselves, really.

[dime]

Originally Posted by Arles

Both teams get out of a jam with a leadoff double. As to the festivities in Zona, there's always been more of an "event feel" to Arizona games. Heck, the ballpark has a pool in it

I think what people need to understand is that you have to be a bit "gimmicy" when your team is a decade old in a city full of transients. 80% of the fans over the age of 10 in the park tonight had a different team they rooted for back in 1995. You just can't play the "St. Louis/Boston" old time baseball game card and pack the house in that environment.

My problem with this is that I don't see how you cultivate an appreciation for the product by emphasizing everything BUT the product...in ten years will these fans like the diamondbacks more, or like baseball more because of the klondike bar contest and the kiss cam and the scoreboard flashing "MAKE NOISE!" because they don't know when you should get loud at a game?

The Bartman stuff was really out of line, bush league stuff. Apparently the Cubs let the Diamondbacks know that they didn't appreciate it at all - they've been trying to shelter the guy and ignore his legacy. You shouldn't have to flash "beat the cubs!" on the scoreboard and play a bunch of bartman clips in order to fire up your crowd for a playoff game.

This franchise has made the playoffs for the 3rd time now, it's their second trip to the LCS. If that isn't enough to cultivate an actual fan base then I don't know if it's ever going to happen.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by dime

This franchise has made the playoffs for the 3rd time now, it's their second trip to the LCS. If that isn't enough to cultivate an actual fan base then I don't know if it's ever going to happen.

No kidding.

[Young Drachma]

78-1 with a lead after 8 innings. Wow, that's nuts.

[Young Drachma]

The D-Backs are built for these kinds of games. But Corpas does the cardiac thing from time to time...c'mon, get a double play ball.

[Young Drachma]

Drew blew that play.

[Young Drachma]

Bonus baseball.

[Wolfpack]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

78-1 with a lead after 8 innings. Wow, that's nuts.

That's one of those jinx-type stats. Saw that and thought, "Well, it's going to be 78-2 now that you bring it up...."

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

That's one of those jinx-type stats. Saw that and thought, "Well, it's going to be 78-2 now that you bring it up...."

Exactly. I knew when I saw it on the screen that it was going to happen that way. But I imagine the streak remains if they manage to pull this one out.

[Wolfpack]

Amazing how one little HBP can change the whole game. If Colorado loses, it'll be interesting to see how well they respond on Sunday to a mild bit of adversity.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by dime

My problem with this is that I don't see how you cultivate an appreciation for the product by emphasizing everything BUT the product...in ten years will these fans like the diamondbacks more, or like baseball more because of the klondike bar contest and the kiss cam and the scoreboard flashing "MAKE NOISE!" because they don't know when you should get loud at a game?

I'm pretty sure most stadiums have some kind of "clapping" or noise signal on the main board. I'm from St. Louis and went to Cards game and they had a similar prompt. Again, by being a little gimmicy, I mean having a hot dog race and occassionally fire T-shirts in the crowd. It's not like they are running dancing bears out in the middle innings. Most ball parks are trying to have more of an entertainment angle now-days, and the DBacks are part of that. In the end, though, I doubt many people go to the ballgame to see a kiss-cam or get a T-Shirt in the crowd.

The Bartman stuff was really out of line, bush league stuff. Apparently the Cubs let the Diamondbacks know that they didn't appreciate it at all - they've been trying to shelter the guy and ignore his legacy. You shouldn't have to flash "beat the cubs!" on the scoreboard and play a bunch of bartman clips in order to fire up your crowd for a playoff game.

Give me a break. I've seen tons worse in Philly, NY or Boston. How about all the Babe Ruth/Buckner crap with the Yankees? St. Louis has also picked on the Cubs like an open wound in the past 15-20 years. Bartman is a part of Cubs history as much as the goat and other things picked on.

This franchise has made the playoffs for the 3rd time now, it's their second trip to the LCS. If that isn't enough to cultivate an actual fan base then I don't know if it's ever going to happen.

The 100-loss season put them back 3 years ago, but they've been pretty solid in attendence over their lifetime. In the past 7 seasons they've been 14th, 4th, 8th, 14th, 20th, 24th and 20th. I'm guessing they will be in the mid-teens next season. For a team only 10 years old located in a very transient city, I would say they have a pretty solid fan base all things considered.

[Young Drachma]

Nice work, Valverde.

[Arles]

Looks like the TBS graphic jinx comes back and bites Arizona.

[Young Drachma]

hahaha..

[Wolfpack]

Wow. Talk about scoring with small ball. Three walks issued and a little nubber by Spilborghs to lead it off?

[Young Drachma]

What a turn of events in this one.

[Young Drachma]

Good night.

[Wolfpack]

Yeah. I can finally get to sleep. Sucks royal that this sort of game ends up beginning at 10:30 PM in the east. Certainly a lot more tense and interesting to watch than Boston whaling on Cleveland.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

C'mon, you know that half a season does not a franchise make. There really *isn't* much beyond Francis. Where were they in the first half (hint: 3rd from the bottom)? Francis and Cook would make a pretty good 1-2 punch but the pair wouldn't exactly strike fear into the hearts of playoff teams everywhere. Neither are exactly Peavy or the aforementioned Webb. And it's a shame Cook is hurt because it would be a good chance to showcase him. Fogg is the only other guy who even pitched enough innings to qualify for an ERA title this year and he is what I said- erratic- brilliant in some games, crap in others. Not exactly what you draw up when you're going into the season as your best playoff rotation.

SI

1) When a pitching staff that throw at Coor's Field is leading the NL in ERA over a half season, it's a major accomplishment. I don't care how much the humidor is coming into play. (because it certainly isn't impacting the hitters home numbers)

2) While they may not strike fear into anyone, they sure as hell seem to be getting people out. They've now thrown 47 innings in the playoffs and given up 34 hits and 11 total runs. That'd be a 2.15 ERA. The first three games of that came against the best offensive team in the National League.

3) Assuming Cook were healthy, I'd take my chances with a Francis/Cook/Jimenez/Morales rotation against about anyone. Even without Cook, they are doing pretty good as far as I can tell.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by TroyF

1) When a pitching staff that throw at Coor's Field is leading the NL in ERA over a half season, it's a major accomplishment. I don't care how much the humidor is coming into play. (because it certainly isn't impacting the hitters home numbers)

2) While they may not strike fear into anyone, they sure as hell seem to be getting people out. They've now thrown 47 innings in the playoffs and given up 34 hits and 11 total runs. That'd be a 2.15 ERA. The first three games of that came against the best offensive team in the National League.

3) Assuming Cook were healthy, I'd take my chances with a Francis/Cook/Jimenez/Morales rotation against about anyone. Even without Cook, they are doing pretty good as far as I can tell.

Your first two points speak to small sample size. But at least you're consistent, even if blindly faithful with that last statement

Considering you really only need 3 pitchers there are quite a few teams I'd take over Francis, Cook, and Jimenez for the playoffs and just so that I'm throwing something out there instead of a random statement that just sounds like I'm disagreeing. Here's who I'll submit for rebuttal: I'll take the Padres (Peavy, Young, Maddux), Red Sox (Beckett, Matsuzaka, Schilling), Angels (Lackey, Escobar, Colon), and Indians (Sabathia, Carmona, Westbrook).

I'd also consider the Tigers (Verlander with some combo of Bonderman, Rogers, and Robertson), Dodgers (Penny, Lowe, Billingsly), Twins next year (Santana, Liriano, and either Silva, Bonser, or Baker), Braves (Smoltz, Hudson, someone off the street), White Sox (Buehrle, Vazquez, Garland), Cubs (Zambrano, Hill, Lilly), and the A's (Haren, Blanton, and Gaudin).

SI

[Young Drachma]

I don't think you can deny that the Rockies are truly a "team" in a way that we haven't seen in a long time in the post-season. All of the recent teams have had someone who could hurt you or a big name that you knew who was clutch for one reason or another.

It's truly a testament to great scouting, patience and luck...because what they're doing now is absolutely unprecedented. It'll get washed away if they don't win it all and that's a shame and I'm not even convinced it they win it all, that history will give them their due until someone goes back and looks at the storyline and says "they did what?!"

But man, this whole thing is absolutely crazy.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Your first two points speak to small sample size. But at least you're consistent, even if blindly faithful with that last statement

Considering you really only need 3 pitchers there are quite a few teams I'd take over Francis, Cook, and Jimenez for the playoffs and just so that I'm throwing something out there instead of a random statement that just sounds like I'm disagreeing. Here's who I'll submit for rebuttal: I'll take the Padres (Peavy, Young, Maddux), Red Sox (Beckett, Matsuzaka, Schilling), Angels (Lackey, Escobar, Colon), and Indians (Sabathia, Carmona, Westbrook).

I'd also consider the Tigers (Verlander with some combo of Bonderman, Rogers, and Robertson), Dodgers (Penny, Lowe, Billingsly), Twins next year (Santana, Liriano, and either Silva, Bonser, or Baker), Braves (Smoltz, Hudson, someone off the street), White Sox (Buehrle, Vazquez, Garland), Cubs (Zambrano, Hill, Lilly), and the A's (Haren, Blanton, and Gaudin).

SI

I'll argue the second half thing til I die. That's impressive as hell and it tells me those guys have some talent. But I'm not sure why you wasted so much time on the post.

I didn't say the Rockies pitchers were the best or that I'd take them over all others. I said I'd take the group against about anyone. I fully believe those Rockies pitchers would keep me in the ball game and give me a chance. Francis and Cook combined for 59 starts this year and completed less than 5 innings two times. Jimenez and Morales are pretty good. I'd take my chances with that group. Doesn't mean I wouldn't take Boston's pitchers over them. (or the Indians, who I'd seriously consider taking over anyone, even after last night)

The one variable is the bullpen. The big 3 are pretty good I think. (Fuentes, Corpas, Hawkins) After that, I think some guys are throwing a bit over their heads. Herges, Affeldt, Speir.

Still, I think those starters give me a chance in most series. I don't think they'll have a lot of series like the Cub pitchers you have on your list. (2 of those three couldn't get out of the fourth against this same DBacks team)

[Galaril]

I was at the Boston-Cleveland game last night and the Soxes looked very polished and confident. I still think this series is going to go 6 games with the Sox prevailing. Also, I saw the Rockies game on TIVO after getting back home and am really really impressed with them.
I am honest scared as hell to play these guys especially if they sweep the D-backs and go into the WS with a 21 out of 22 streak. I rememeber when they came to Boston this year and pummeled us taking 2 out of 3. They beat Beckett and gave him his first victory. I believe they are one of the better hitting teams on the road so any talk aboutht em taht it is becuz of Coors Filed is bullcrap. I am sure the local Boston media will try to spin that. I am going to be torn who I "REALLY" want to win. The Sox got there WS in 04 and with all the financial advantages the Sox have over a team like the Rockies I kind of want to see Colorado take it.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Arles

Great D by the Rockies. I have to give that ump some credit for seeing that Young hit the foot of the SS. He easily beat the throw, but it wasn't until the replay that I saw him slide into Troy's foot.

Where I guess I'm confused is you've got that play, then you have the play where Arizona tied the game. There was contact between the runner and the fielder holding the ball before he touched the base, and yet the umpire called the runner "safe, fielder's off the bag," which appeared to confuse the fielder enough that he didn't try for the double play (which would have negated the run that scored).

Why would a basestealer be out for touching Tulo's foot, while a runner moving in the course of the play could hit the fielder's ankle and be safe?

[DaddyTorgo]

manny ramirez is now the MLB record holder for career postseason HR's with 23

[Logan]

They really need to start separating those types of records by era.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Logan

They really need to start separating those types of records by era.

only if they include the HR records!

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

manny ramirez is now the MLB record holder for career postseason HR's with 23

I heard the other night someone already say that the "real" records are the "post-season home-run record" and all-time World Series home-run record. So...I don't think anyone who follows such records is confused, given the distinction between the two and the fact that expanded playoffs inflate numbers like that.

[Young Drachma]

I really want the Red Sox in the World Series, if only so that the Rockies get national attention. Folks will watch a Rox-Red Sox World Series because of all of the story lines involved -- include the one that Todd Helton almost ended up in Boston before opening day -- and the fact that folks will watch the Red Sox play.

It would be even better if the Rockies streak would run through them because it'd prove them to be one of the hottest champs ever, but..even if they don't, it'd be a lot better than the crickets we'll hear if it's Cleveland-Colorado. Not that the Indians don't have a fan base, it's just...not anything on par with "Red Sox Nation".

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Logan

My eyes suck...they keep telling me that this game is only in the bottom of the third.

These fuckin eyes again! Over 3 hours in, finally through with 6 innings. I love it! Was there a monsoon I missed?

[sterlingice]

136-115 pitches through 6. Greg Maddux is rolling over in his grave ("I'm not dead yet!")

SI

[wade moore]

I never get tired of hearing the name "Coco Crisp".

[Logan]

Originally Posted by wade moore

I never get tired of eating "Coco Crisp".

Same.

[Young Drachma]

What possesses old dudes with too much money to go having more kids at like 60?

::looks at James Taylor::

[Logan]

Someone get McCarver a cup of tea please.

[JetsIn06]

This is intense.