College Football Week 13: THE BORDER WAR!!!!!!!!

[sterlingice]

Congrats to Mizzou. Good luck against OU next week and if you make it to the title game. It would feel a lot better if our only regular season loss was to the national champs by 8

SI

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

Looks like a West Virginia vs. Ohio State national championship game.

Or,

Missouri-West Virginia
Missouri-Ohio State
Georgia-Ohio State
LSU-Ohio State
Oklahoma-Ohio State

I think those are all the possibilities still in play.

[st.cronin]

dola, forgot

USC-Ohio State

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Or,

Missouri-West Virginia
Missouri-Ohio State
Georgia-Ohio State
LSU-Ohio State
Oklahoma-Ohio State

I think those are all the possibilities still in play.

Can Georgia play? I thought you had to win your conference after the debacles with Nebraska and Oklahoma. Or did they never approve that provision?

SI

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Can Georgia play? I thought you had to win your conference after the debacles with Nebraska and Oklahoma. Or did they never approve that provision?

SI

I don't actually know. I haven't heard that you have to win your conference - and last year, there were some people wanting the championship game to be Michigan-Ohio State. I never heard that that wasn't possible.

[GoldenEagle]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Or,

Missouri-West Virginia
Missouri-Ohio State
Georgia-Ohio State
LSU-Ohio State
Oklahoma-Ohio State

I think those are all the possibilities still in play.

WVU should have no problem with Pittsburgh. They win, they are in. I don't see Missouri beating Oklahoma. It would take a massive melt-down for Georgia or Oklahoma to get in.

Not having to play in a conference championship game really benefits Ohio State. They are just sitting pretty right now at home.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I don't actually know. I haven't heard that you have to win your conference - and last year, there were some people wanting the championship game to be Michigan-Ohio State. I never heard that that wasn't possible.

I remember there was some clamoring for that after the year where K-State blitzed OU in the Big XII title game (yet OU still went to the BCS title game). But maybe that didn't ever come to pass.

SI

[CU Tiger]

Well in a little out of character move Clemson Dominates SC, but of courrse keeps it closer than it should be, but finds a way to not blow it at the end.

Just bought my tickets to the Peach Bowl.....

[Crim]

I feel strongly that if you're not the champion of your own conference, you should not be allowed to play for the NC. You want wildcard teams, fine, set up a playoff system. But in its current format, the BCS should not allow non-conference champs to play in the title game.

Nebraska v USC
OU v LSU
(almost) Mich v tOSU

In the case of the year Nebraska played (and got thumped by) USC, IIRC, they got rolled up by an unspectacular Colorado team, and didn't even make it into the B12 title game, and somehow they were deemed the #2 team in the country by the BCS? Pshaw.

[SirFozzie]

Here's the BCS teams, as things stand

ACC- Boston College-Virginia Tech winner
SEC - LSU/Tennessee Winner
PAC-10 USC-UCLA Winner
Big 10 - Ohio State
Big East - West Virginia
Big 12 - Mizzou/Oklahoma Winner

Possible BCS At-Large teams: Mizzou, LSU (if they lose the conference championship game), Kansas, Georgia (Both their regular seasons are done), Florida, Hawaii, possibly VTech if they lose.

Hawaii needs a couple of higher ranked teams (Mizzou and LSU come to mind) to win their conference championship games to avoid those teams stealing an at-large bid.

[k0ruptr]

Finally there is 1 Undefeated team in the country left. Hawaii

[Crim]

Oh, and Tim Tebow is ridiculous. That 23-yard TD he matadored a DLineman, then blasted through/carried four Seminoles over the goal line. Sick.

[ISiddiqui]

Here is one question about the Heisman. Everyone is talking about Tebow, McFadden, Daniels, etc. But NO ONE is talking about Pat White. It's been White, not Slaton, who's been carrying the Mountaineers. And the one game WVU lost, White was knocked out early in the game.

I think McFadden should win, but I'd put White #2.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Here is one question about the Heisman. Everyone is talking about Tebow, McFadden, Daniels, etc. But NO ONE is talking about Pat White. It's been White, not Slaton, who's been carrying the Mountaineers. And the one game WVU lost, White was knocked out early in the game.

I think McFadden should win, but I'd put White #2.

Simple: Pat White doesn't have the stats. Tebow has about 300 yards less rushing but has 8 more rushing TD's. Tebow also has well over twice the number of passing yards and he had 29TD's vs 6 INT's coming into this week while White had 12 passing TD's vs 4 INT's. Tebow's numbers blow Pat White out of the water. Even with the missed game due to his injury Dixon's numbers also compare favorable to Pat White.

[ISiddiqui]

And yet, we are basically talking about an MVP award (forget that "Most Outstanding" stuff... it's usually not seen that way, especially when a player falls because his team lost even if he kicked some ass). WVU without White probably has 4 or 5 losses right now.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Yep. Too many things would have to happen for them to get to the NC, but thanks to UCLA beating Oregon today, USC goes to the Rose Bowl if they win next week, which I'm feeling very good about. The team is as healthy as it has been all year. They should destroy UCLA.

I love it when people say stupid stuff like this before a rivalry game (even if I think he's right).

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Here is one question about the Heisman. Everyone is talking about Tebow, McFadden, Daniels, etc. But NO ONE is talking about Pat White. It's been White, not Slaton, who's been carrying the Mountaineers. And the one game WVU lost, White was knocked out early in the game.

I think McFadden should win, but I'd put White #2.

Tebow is a much stronger candidate than White, for the reasons EF27 already mentioned.

McFadden has had a great season, but in an extremely run heavy system. He doesn't even have close to the best numbers on his team in terms of yards or touchdowns per carry. Very unimpressive receiving numbers and not a factor in the return game. I don't think 1,700 yards on a ton of carries (5.7 YPC to be exact) is deserving of the Heisman, no matter how impressive the games against USC and LSU were.

I think it will be a travesty if Tebow doesn't win it, but I can totally see it happening.

[Mike1409]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

More bizarre shit in Atlanta. GT punts deep, fair catch attempt is missed when the ball hits another UGA player, rolls back into the end zone, big scrum ... and after long replay conference turns into a simple touchback.

Jon,

I have been meaning to say this all year, Thanks for all the constant updates during the day.

I work midnight to 8am and then I sleep until around 4pm. I tape a couple of games during the day and appreciate all the real time updates of the action in other games when i get to work in the evening!!!

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

1. Mizzou was the better team and I'm glad they pulled it out last night. It was a blast to watch it in person at Arrowhead.

2. Tebow is not the Heisman winner. Florida could have gone without Tebow and still been a 3 loss team. Mizzou without Chase Daniel would be a middle of the pack Big 12 team. If Mizzou can get past Oklahoma, it would be a farce if Daniel wasn't the Heisman winner.

3. Mizzou was ahead 24-23 with 9 minutes left in the game in Norman before falling late. Most would agree that Mizzou is a much better team now than they were in that game. Mizzou should beat OU on a neutral field.

4. To the poster who said no one wants to watch a Mizzou/WV matchup, you just don't like football. Mizzou has no less than 3 players on offense that will be playing on Sundays after their college career (and that doesn't even include Chase Daniel at this point). WV has a great defense and a couple of special players on the offensive end. It would be a great matchup.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

So where does KU fall to?

1. Mizzou 11-1
1A. West Virginia 10-1
3. Ohio St 11-1

but then after that:
LSU 10-2
Georgia 9-2
ASU 9-2
Oklahoma 10-2
USC 9-2

SI

In an effort to go fishing for my own answer ahead of time, here''s what I've found:

Sagarin:
1. W Virginia
2. Ohio St
3. Missouri
4. Kansas
5. Florida
6. LSU
7. Oklahoma
8. USC
9. Va Tech
10. Georgia
(18) Hawaii

Colley Matrix with the following games included (you can only use 5 at a time so these are somewhat estimated):
Missouri over Kansas
USC over Arizona St
Arkansas over LSU
Virginia Tech over Virginia
West Virginia over Connecticut

Hawaii over Boise St
UCLA over Oregon

1. W Virginia
2. Missouri
3. Ohio St
4. LSU
5. Georgia
6. Va Tech
7. BC
8. Arizona St
9. Kansas
10. Florida
(17) Hawaii

Anderson & Hester, Richard Billingsley, Peter Wolfe, Kenneth Massey
Not up yet


SI

[GoldenEagle]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

1. Mizzou was the better team and I'm glad they pulled it out last night. It was a blast to watch it in person at Arrowhead.

2. Tebow is not the Heisman winner. Florida could have gone without Tebow and still been a 3 loss team. Mizzou without Chase Daniel would be a middle of the pack Big 12 team. If Mizzou can get past Oklahoma, it would be a farce if Daniel wasn't the Heisman winner.

3. Mizzou was ahead 24-23 with 9 minutes left in the game in Norman before falling late. Most would agree that Mizzou is a much better team now than they were in that game. Mizzou should beat OU on a neutral field.

4. To the poster who said no one wants to watch a Mizzou/WV matchup, you just don't like football. Mizzou has no less than 3 players on offense that will be playing on Sundays after their college career (and that doesn't even include Chase Daniel at this point). WV has a great defense and a couple of special players on the offensive end. It would be a great matchup.

I would say you are a little biased. I do not think it is a neutral field. Oklahoma will send fans to San Antonio in droves. Plus, I think it is basketball season in Missouri already.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

4. To the poster who said no one wants to watch a Mizzou/WV matchup, you just don't like football.

I tend to agree with the first part but I'm not sure about the second being exactly the reason I agree.

I guess what I'm trying to get at somehow is that while those two teams aren't USC-Ohio State (or Nebraska or Notre Dame or etc) they aren't a Fresno State-UConn matchup either.

While WVU is a relatively newcomer to the party & there's still no shortage of questions about their conference, they at least have been around the party a bit. And while Missouri isn't Oklahoma, they've at least been involved with a historically significant conference for a good long time.

I think those things will make the game reasonably okay as title matchups go, not the one most viewers would hope for but not nearly as uninteresting as it could be either.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

I would say you are a little biased. I do not think it is a neutral field. Oklahoma will send fans to San Antonio in droves. Plus, I think it is basketball season in Missouri already.

I'm guessing you haven't seen Mizzou Arena lately. We have a good basketball team this year, but there's still a lot of 'Quin-itis' in the program. There's tons of empty seats right now.

There's a lot of Mizzou fans that remember the glory years of the 60s and 70s when Mizzou was regularly one of the top teams in the country. They have been waiting for this day for a long time. Also, Mizzou's largest alumni base outside of the state of Missouri is in Texas. Also, the state with the most representation as far as player's home state on the team other than Missouri is Texas. There will be plenty of Tiger fans in attendance. It certainly won't be a OU home game like you make it out to be.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I tend to agree with the first part but I'm not sure about the second being exactly the reason I agree.

I guess what I'm trying to get at somehow is that while those two teams aren't USC-Ohio State (or Nebraska or Notre Dame or etc) they aren't a Fresno State-UConn matchup either.

There's also a ton of people that are glad that USC, OSU, NU, and ND are not in the top two right now. It's much like baseball. Most people get really tired of seeing the Red Sox and Yankees in the playoffs every year. Change is good, unless you're a fan of a traditional powerhouse. Parity has already taken hold in college basketball, with a lot of smaller teams starting to step into the spotlight. I'd argue that this season shows that the traditional dynasties in college football may be more of a rarity than in previous seasons as we move forward.

[larrymcg421]

So, Pittsburgh beats West Virginia and Oklahoma beats Missouri.

Kansas-Ohio State in the title game?

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

2. Tebow is not the Heisman winner. Florida could have gone without Tebow and still been a 3 loss team. Mizzou without Chase Daniel would be a middle of the pack Big 12 team. If Mizzou can get past Oklahoma, it would be a farce if Daniel wasn't the Heisman winner.

A team's record doesn't, and shouldn't, have anything to do with the Heisman. It's not an MVP. All the people who drop guys out of the race because a guy's team gets their 1st, 2nd, 3rd loss have their head up their asses.

Tebow will win because he's having the best season out of anyone in the country, and it's not even close.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

4. To the poster who said no one wants to watch a Mizzou/WV matchup, you just don't like football. Mizzou has no less than 3 players on offense that will be playing on Sundays after their college career (and that doesn't even include Chase Daniel at this point). WV has a great defense and a couple of special players on the offensive end. It would be a great matchup.

If it ends up being WVU/Mizzou, it'll be the lowest rated television BCS title game ever.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

So, Pittsburgh beats West Virginia and Oklahoma beats Missouri.

Kansas-Ohio State in the title game?

My guess would be no....it'll all depend on how far Kansas goes down and after reading/listening this morning how far up USC will come.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by rowech

If it ends up being WVU/Mizzou, it'll be the lowest rated television BCS title game ever.

I don't think you could be wrong predicting this game will be the lowest rated title game ever no matter which two teams are in the title game. TV ratings for all sports continue to drop nationwide each year. It doesn't matter what the teams are that are involved. With that said, when TV ratings start deciding championships rather than who wins and loses, we have a much bigger issue.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Logan

A team's record doesn't, and shouldn't, have anything to do with the Heisman. It's not an MVP. All the people who drop guys out of the race because a guy's team gets their 1st, 2nd, 3rd loss have their head up their asses.

Tebow will win because he's having the best season out of anyone in the country, and it's not even close.

Agreed with the first part but disagree with the second part. I would not disagree with anybody saying Tebow but McFadden is right there as well. If I was voting....

1. Tebow
2. McFadden
3. Daniel
4. Dixon
5. White

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by k0ruptr

Finally there is 1 Undefeated team in the country left. Hawaii

You do realize that people are ignoring you because you make it sound like it's worth something more than beating 10 bad teams and 1 mediocre team. An SEC team with 2-3 losses is worth much, much than no losses from Hawaii. So there.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

I don't think you could be wrong predicting this game will be the lowest rated title game ever no matter which two teams are in the title game. TV ratings for all sports continue to drop nationwide each year. It doesn't matter what the teams are that are involved. With that said, when TV ratings start deciding championships rather than who wins and loses, we have a much bigger issue.

At this point I have no problem with those two teams playing. I was impressed by Missouri last night having seen them play for the first time. It seems those two teams have survived better than the other teams and in this season, that's as good a reason as any to get a shot at the title.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by rowech

Agreed with the first part but disagree with the second part. I would not disagree with anybody saying Tebow but McFadden is right there as well. If I was voting....

1. Tebow
2. McFadden
3. Daniel
4. Dixon
5. White

+1 sort of. If Daniel can beat OU, then I would put put him #2. I would also consider dropping Dixon and putting in that QB from UK.

[Buccaneer]

One more thing. Those clamoring for a playoffs already got one. What do you call the games this weekend and next??? If there an 8-teams playoff, then we would repeat some of the games. That's stupid.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by rowech

Agreed with the first part but disagree with the second part. I would not disagree with anybody saying Tebow but McFadden is right there as well. If I was voting....

1. Tebow
2. McFadden
3. Daniel
4. Dixon
5. White

The numbers Tebow is putting up rushing and passing are unreal. McFadden is obviously great, and what he's doing is special too, but you can't ignore what Felix Jones has done with fewer chances. Just like you can't ignore that on a crucial 3rd and 4 against LSU, McFadden was out and Jones got the carry on a toss where he converted the 1st down. And on the last 2 pt attempt, again McFadden was off the field and Jones got the carry off tackle, where he again converted.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Logan

A team's record doesn't, and shouldn't, have anything to do with the Heisman. It's not an MVP. All the people who drop guys out of the race because a guy's team gets their 1st, 2nd, 3rd loss have their head up their asses.

Tebow will win because he's having the best season out of anyone in the country, and it's not even close.

Even for those voters who think it is an MVP type of award, it is hard to argue that Tebow hasn't been the most valuable player to his team. I think MBBF is gravely mistaken if he thinks Florida won't lose more than 3 teams without Tebow. His 50 TD's this year would be very hard for any other QB to replace and Florida's running attack has been weak if you discount Tebow's contribution.

[sooner333]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

So, Pittsburgh beats West Virginia and Oklahoma beats Missouri.

Kansas-Ohio State in the title game?

I think you'd see either Ohio State vs. either Georgia, LSU, or Oklahoma.

Georgia would be the obvious choice, but it would depend on whether the voters think they are really the best team if they can't make their own championship game.

For LSU to get there they will need to beat Tennessee convincingly.

Oklahoma doesn't deserve to be there, but with a convincing win over a top-2 team (perhaps #1) for a second time in the season could gain some support in this wacky season.

I think Kansas goes down this weekend in the human polls simply because they haven't beaten a top-25 team and they avoided OU, Texas, and Texas Tech in the South. They had a great season, but lets be honest about the scheduling helping them get there. They might have very well beaten OU, Texas, and Tech, but it's like Hawaii...they simply did not do it and we don't know the answer. Also, OU would have beaten Mizzou twice as their only two losses and Mizzou just beat Kansas in a neutral site.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

+1 sort of. If Daniel can beat OU, then I would put put him #2. I would also consider dropping Dixon and putting in that QB from UK.

I haven't seen every UK snap, but from what I've seen, Woodson has regressed a bit as the season has gone along. He wouldn't be on my ballot.

BTW, I think Daniel should definitely be on the ballot, but on his play alone, not just because he's the key guy on a team which would be middle of the road otherwise, as MBBF wants us to believe.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by Logan

I haven't seen every UK snap, but from what I've seen, Woodson has regressed a bit as the season has gone along. He wouldn't be on my ballot.

BTW, I think Daniel should definitely be on the ballot, but on his play alone, not just because he's the key guy on a team which would be middle of the road otherwise, as MBBF wants us to believe.

That makes sense. I saw numerous poor decisions by Woodson in the game against Tennessee, as if he couldn't think or react fast enough. He also doesn't have a leadership presence but does have the tools to play.

[GoldenEagle]

If Pitt beats WVU and Missouri losses, it will be a toss up between Oklahoma and LSU. I think Tennessee will play LSU very close. If WVU lose, then it will Oklahoma-OSU.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

That makes sense. I saw numerous poor decisions by Woodson in the game against Tennessee, as if he couldn't think or react fast enough.

Ditto the week before versus UGA.

He also doesn't have a leadership presence but does have the tools to play.

I think this sums him up pretty well.

[timmynausea]

WVU is number 1 in the new coaches' poll. Interestingly, 7 Big Ten coaches have votes and Ohio State got 6 first place votes.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colle...l/usatpoll.htm

[k0ruptr]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

You do realize that people are ignoring you because you make it sound like it's worth something more than beating 10 bad teams and 1 mediocre team. An SEC team with 2-3 losses is worth much, much than no losses from Hawaii. So there.

No problem, I'm still beaming from Our first outright WAC title ever, most wins ever, and the fact we are undefeated this late in the season when no one else is.

[Atocep]

In the Elo_Chess rankings, Sagarin has Missouri #1, WVU #2, and Ohio State #5.

His actual rankings are WVU #1, Ohio State #2, and Missouri #3.

[MizzouRah]

Wow, what a great game. I'm both hungover and hoarse today.

I hope we can ride this momentum into the Big 12 Championship game and put OU to rest.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by timmynausea

WVU is number 1 in the new coaches' poll. Interestingly, 7 Big Ten coaches have votes and Ohio State got 6 first place votes.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colle...l/usatpoll.htm

Another WVU fan will correct me if wronmg, but I beleive this is the first time WVU has ever been ranked number 1 in either poll ever. Despite undefeated regular seasons in 1988 and 1993, this is teh first time WVU has had the top spot.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Another WVU fan will correct me if wronmg, but I beleive this is the first time WVU has ever been ranked number 1 in either poll ever. Despite undefeated regular seasons in 1988 and 1993, this is teh first time WVU has had the top spot.

As far as I know this is correct.

[timmynausea]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Another WVU fan will correct me if wronmg, but I beleive this is the first time WVU has ever been ranked number 1 in either poll ever. Despite undefeated regular seasons in 1988 and 1993, this is teh first time WVU has had the top spot.

That's correct.

[CU Tiger]

Well at this point I think we should have a series of coin flips to determine the BCS bowl contenders.

No, no, I know, how about lottery balls like te NBA... its about as sporting as fat bald over 40 gusy who never played the game typing formulas into a laptop between watching clips of Jenna Jameson's later masterpice.

As far as th Heisman debate, Tim Tebow has 22 rushing and 29 passing TDs this season. Is there seriously a debate?
Seriously?
I cant do that on NCAA08 on JV setting....
51TDs.....thats maddenesque... and its in the SEC, so of course he played against College Football Gods every week

[Cuckoo]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

3. Mizzou was ahead 24-23 with 9 minutes left in the game in Norman before falling late. Most would agree that Mizzou is a much better team now than they were in that game. Mizzou should beat OU on a neutral field.

To correct some misinformation here. Missouri led 24-23 with 11 minutes to play because of a missed extra point by OU. They led for all of about 10 minutes in the entire game, and Oklahoma had a comfortable 17 point lead until Missouri scored a garbage TD with like 10 seconds left on the clock.

No doubt it was a big advantage for OU in Norman, and I'm by no stretch of the imagination confident about the rematch, particularly with Temple back. But Herbstreit and company were going crazy with the "OU didn't beat Missouri; Missouri beat themselves" comments last night. Missouri got 2 of their touchdowns with short fields due to Oklahoma turnovers, so I would say both teams hurt themselves pretty badly with turnovers.