Bowl Bound College Football Demo is out!

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by dervack

Uh, yeah you were, but what fucking ever. Apparently means nothing to you.

no i wasnt. show me where i was talking about grammar?

Originally Posted by st.cronin

The play by play really needs to be cleaned up. Spelling mistakes, no spaces between certain words, wrong description for the play, etc.

i was talking about how play by play are all not getting recorded when viewing the play by play log. look at the time of possession from one play to the next. and the downs and yards from one play to the next.

example 1:

Louisiana-Monroe ball, Q1, 1-10-ULM9 (14:40) 0-0
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Shotgun, Play: SG-SE-slants (short pass)
Defense: Normal, Set: Nickel, Play: Nickel-norm-TMan (normal)
QB W. Bender completes a 6 yard cross to WR P. Peelle (SS R. Polamalu, ILB C. Townsell).

Louisiana-Monroe ball, Q1, 2-9-ULM38 (13:16) 0-0
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-HB-curls (short pass)
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: Nickel, Play: Nickel-pass-Man-B10 (target pass)
QB W. Bender completes a 9 yard hook to RB M. Stachelski (SS R. Polamalu).

example 2

San Diego State ball, Q1, 3-3-SDSU40 (09:09) 0-7
Offense: Short Pass, Set: I Form, Play: I-SE-curls (short pass)
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: Dime, Play: Dime-pass-MZ (target pass)
QB C. Boiman completes a 9 yard hook to WR S. Archibald (OOB).

San Diego State ball, Q1, 2-8-ULM49 (08:25) 0-7
Offense: Medium Pass, Set: I Form, Play: I-FL-post-TE-out (med pass)
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 3-4, Play: 34-pass-Man-B7 (target pass)
QB C. Boiman completes a 2 yard post to WR S. Archibald (ILB C. Caldwell).

[sovereignstar]

Jesus H. Christ. Let's not lose our boots over this one.

[Leonidas]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

Rather than post in a whole new topic, I thought I'd toss this in here -- this was posted in the Grey Dog forum, but I know not everyone looks over there. My apologies for those who may have already read this:

I've always loved the online leagues -- from my first league using FPS Pro to FOF. I've wanted the chance to participate in an actual college league, and since this game is soon to be upon us, I've decided to go ahead and begin the process of creating a league for players of Bowl Bound.

The website is yet to be set up, but if you're interested in participating, go to the newly setup forums HERE and register, talk about what you would like to see in the league and grab up your favorite team! It's my hope to, along with good dedicated players, to make this a fun, enjoyable league for many years to come.

Anyway, please stop by, and again, thanks for this fantastic game. :-)

Eric
www.ncaacfl.org

I'm just getting a blankpage on your link

[Icy]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

I'm just drooling at the reports and utilities I'll be able to write given that this is an Access database and VS.NET 2005 comes with some sweet tools that make it trivial to read from an Access data source...

And i'm drooling about the reports and utillities that you will create

[WVUFAN]

Yeah, I accidentally screwed up my nameserver. :-) Should be fixed in an hour or so ...

right now it's just a forum, as there isn't content for a page yet. I'm going to be using Mambo CMS, as I've discovered CMS's are a much more efficient way of running a sports league.

Sorry about that. Please check in an hour or so. :-)

[Icy]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

Yeah, I accidentally screwed up my nameserver. :-) Should be fixed in an hour or so ...

right now it's just a forum, as there isn't content for a page yet. I'm going to be using Mambo CMS, as I've discovered CMS's are a much more efficient way of running a sports league.

Sorry about that. Please check in an hour or so. :-)

Good choice, Mambo is what i use for the DKBL website:
http://www.prodeportes.com/dkbl/

[cthomer5000]

1. Not enough stress on class year in the roster view, IMHO. It's kind of straining to look for that piece of info buried in the like the 5th or 6th column of a player.

2. Player pages. Looking at a page of numbers makes me realize just how genius the ratings bars of FOF are. In FOF I've become quite accustomed to having a sort of "footprint" im looking for on a player by position. I can breeze through the QBs in a free agency list waiting for certain visual elements to jump out at me. Here I have to look at a lot of numbers, and mentally analyze them before I can decide what type of player im looking at.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

44-9 Florida over LSU with 7:53 left in the 4th. The suspense is pretty much out of this one, I just hope I get the bump to #1/#2 after this. I want to end a season @ #1 and see how well I can do recruiting then, cuz the season I actually ended at #2 or #3 I did really horrible in recruiting. And that might be a problem somewhat Arles...I'm talking of all the guys i went hard after (and this is as the #2/#3 team in the country, lost in the championship game by 6 points or something)...I got ONE of them. And this was guys with 10 interest in coming to Michigan that I spent max money on through the entire recruiting process...methinks a little tweaking might need to be done.

That's kind of ironic because a LOT of five star guys I went after with USC went to one of two schools, Michigan and Oregon State. They had absolutely monster classes. My problem was I didn't recruit the 4 star guys hard enough, and after the 5 stars were off the board (I did manage to land 5, so not too bad) I didn't get another player. Even three star guys I was interested at the end turned me down flat. I can live with that as I was up against schools they were talking to the whole time.

However, I do think maybe Arlie needs to look at the number of players committing early. I think nearly 15 5 star guys in each of my two games have committed in the first week, with most following in the second and almost none left after the third week. This may need tweaking because it's taking some of the fun out of it. I don't know if others are seeing the same thing, of course 2 games is a very small sample size.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

1. Not enough stress on class year in the roster view, IMHO. It's kind of straining to look for that piece of info buried in the like the 5th or 6th column of a player.

I had that problem at first, but after a while, it became not that big of deal, because now I know exactly where to look. However, it sure would be nice if there was a screen with position, class and Ovr/Pot right next to one another. Such a screen would be great for giving a quick look at where we stand at each position in terms of recruiting needs.

2. Player pages. Looking at a page of numbers makes me realize just how genius the ratings bars of FOF are. In FOF I've become quite accustomed to having a sort of "footprint" im looking for on a player by position. I can breeze through the QBs in a free agency list waiting for certain visual elements to jump out at me. Here I have to look at a lot of numbers, and mentally analyze them before I can decide what type of player im looking at.

Can't argue with you there. The bars are a very nice time-saver in FOF.

[cthomer5000]

Right now the biggest negative for me is sim speed. I absolutely have to have a second activity going while playing, because it takes a pretty decent chunk of time to sim a single week. And Im running on a P4 with 2 gigs of RAM.

[cthomer5000]

Week 8 and my 3-2 Air Force squad is favored by 13 over #8 BYU (6-0).

edit: I guess the oddsmakers knew something I didn't. We win 20-6. Yet somehow BYU only drops 3 places in the rankings.

[cthomer5000]

Ok, some serious issues with the polling. BYU was #8 at 6-0. After losing to three straight unranked teams them are now at 13th in the meida poll and 17th in the coaches poll. No chance they would still be ranked in real life.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

Ok, some serious issues with the polling. BYU was #8 at 6-0. After losing to three straight unranked teams them are now at 13th in the meida poll and 17th in the coaches poll. No chance they would still be ranked in real life.

Yeah. I noticed the same thing in my dynasty thread. Arlie has acknowledged that there is a polling issue, and is looking at it.

[cthomer5000]

Yeah, i'm probably pointing out of a lot of the obvious at this point, but this has been my first chance to really spend some time with the game. Overall I have to say I'm intersted. Haven't come across any show-stoppers yet.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

Yeah, i'm probably pointing out of a lot of the obvious at this point, but this has been my first chance to really spend some time with the game.

Well, you never know what could have been missed. When I first got the beta, I found some stuff that I thought would have been "obvious," too, but I got the impression I was the first one to mention it. Ya never know.

[cthomer5000]

aww shit. Run time error at the end of the regular season.

After restart I've got to back up 3 games. Cant wait to see if the error occurs again.

[cthomer5000]

Ok, I'm guessing my file was somehow corrupted during that crash. Now when I go to sim games it just says "storing stats" and moves onto the next week. It's simply ignored my Week 13 and 14 games, while now saying we're in Week 15.

In fact no one has played a game the last two weeks now... and they're listed on theteam schedules as if they were upcoming. Just for curiosity's sake im simming through Week 15.

So, has anyone else had a similar problem?

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Well, you never know what could have been missed. When I first got the beta, I found some stuff that I thought would have been "obvious," too, but I got the impression I was the first one to mention it. Ya never know.

Yeah, I've only be in one beta, but I do think there is a tendency to say "that's so obvious the programmer must know" or "someones probably reported this." That's another reason why this type of demo beta is such a good idea.

[cthomer5000]

I reported that bug at GreyDog. On another reload things appear to be back to normal (so far).

edit: spoke waaaaay too soon on that. my save game appears to be totally f***ed. Now i'll never know if RB Sultan Simms could get it done in our bowl game!

[21C]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

Ok, some serious issues with the polling. BYU was #8 at 6-0. After losing to three straight unranked teams them are now at 13th in the meida poll and 17th in the coaches poll. No chance they would still be ranked in real life.

I think that this would be one of the most difficult things to get right in a computer program. That's why there is such a big deal made out of the computer rankings in the past for the BCS and how it got it wrong. These days, the BCS uses the human rankings ( Harris and Coaches ) as part of the equation.

Humans can look at a poll and know if it seems right. It would be damn hard to come up with an algorithm that models this correctly. Three teams with 9-1 records have varying reasons why one is better than another - strength of schedule, records against ranked opponents and when each team got that loss - like early or late in the season. That's a lot of If-Then-Else statements.

[cody8200]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

That's kind of ironic because a LOT of five star guys I went after with USC went to one of two schools, Michigan and Oregon State. They had absolutely monster classes. My problem was I didn't recruit the 4 star guys hard enough, and after the 5 stars were off the board (I did manage to land 5, so not too bad) I didn't get another player. Even three star guys I was interested at the end turned me down flat. I can live with that as I was up against schools they were talking to the whole time.

However, I do think maybe Arlie needs to look at the number of players committing early. I think nearly 15 5 star guys in each of my two games have committed in the first week, with most following in the second and almost none left after the third week. This may need tweaking because it's taking some of the fun out of it. I don't know if others are seeing the same thing, of course 2 games is a very small sample size.

Try playing with a bad team. I play as Indiana. No matter what you dont get a recruit until at least week 12 or 13 in the recruing stage.

[GrantDawg]

Alright. Going crazy now. I'm sitting here, after having looked through every job board I can find, trying to find a game to distract me. I'm just not in the mood for anything but this game, but replaying one season over and over again is annoying.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by cody8200

Try playing with a bad team. I play as Indiana. No matter what you dont get a recruit until at least week 12 or 13 in the recruing stage.

This is kind of my point. It shouldn't be "good teams get good players in weeks 8-10, then the bad teams pick up the poorer players in weeks 12-17" That's not how it is in real life, and it's not a fun implementation IMO.

But, nobody else seems to have this problem so maybe it's just bugging me

[GrantDawg]

Let me ask this...does weight really matter in this game. My guess (and hope) is it does, but I'm noticing something odd about how my team's weight is distributed. It seems like most of my DE outweigh my DT when it should be the opposite. The same is true of ILB and OLB. Am I wrong that ILB's will generally be bigger than the outside guys? I've seen this consistently, but just as an example of my current ILB's (for UGA) not a single one weighs 230 pounds or higher (and one weighs 218), whereas there is only two olb that doesn't weigh more than 230 with one starter weighing 245.

Now, it doesn't look totally off because I often see seniors at DT or ILB playing at heavier weights than I see the outside players, but it seems like most of my outside guys are fat and inside guys are thin.

[GrantDawg]

Let me take that back just an inch. I do have one ILB at 233, but I also have another at 216 (that is two ILB at below 220).

[chinaski]

at least the injuries are realistic

Originally Posted by BBCF

RB R.J. Justice is really hampered by an injury to his Other (Gunshot Wound). He could play as an absolute last resort, but we would strongly advise against it.

[CraigSca]

Arles,

Any confirmation on the fact there "seem" to be too many upsets and too few 0 or 1-loss teams? Are you seeing this?

[nfg22]

Well...most of you know all this but I am going to mention a few things.

I have played two seasons now. Just testing it out. The first thing I notice, is that this game has the potential to be tedious. With the people getting suspended and distributing class hours every few weeks. Second the rankings are messed. I beat the number 2 team and I was ranked 4...They stayed at 2 and I went up to 3. Thats ridiculous. Second thing, since I was messing around I was trying to get over 700 yards a game and the one way to do this is onside kick, I tryed to onside prbably 100 times, seeing as I did it everytime I kicked off and I never once got it back. Bad luck? I think not. Also penalties on punts are not enforced correctly, they are being enforced to the oppisite team. On two point conversions againts me, I notice the other team has gotten 3 points because they opt for a field goal. Also recruting is way too tedious, I like the write ups on players and they way recruting is done but there needs to be some assisting function like TCY where you can let scouts sign your 3 star players because I dont like looking through 400 recruits...

All in all this has the potential to be way better than TCY, but it still needs some work.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Let me ask this...does weight really matter in this game. My guess (and hope) is it does, but I'm noticing something odd about how my team's weight is distributed. It seems like most of my DE outweigh my DT when it should be the opposite. The same is true of ILB and OLB. Am I wrong that ILB's will generally be bigger than the outside guys? I've seen this consistently, but just as an example of my current ILB's (for UGA) not a single one weighs 230 pounds or higher (and one weighs 218), whereas there is only two olb that doesn't weigh more than 230 with one starter weighing 245.

Now, it doesn't look totally off because I often see seniors at DT or ILB playing at heavier weights than I see the outside players, but it seems like most of my outside guys are fat and inside guys are thin.

To add to that... on my two games I've actually got into I have not had a running back over 200lb's, and I've had a couple under 200lbs who look (to me anyway) like they are decent power backs.

This makes me worry that weight is purely cosmetic, which I sincerely hope it isn't.

[jbmagic]

from Tim Plum at greydog forum.

Weight is not cosmetic its just one of the many factors taken into account, as someone that looked at height/weight very early on in the testing I can say that Arlie has done a good job

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

from Tim Plum at greydog forum.

I would agree in general that Arles did a good job with it. It does seem to flip those positions a bit, though. I would say a huge amount, but just slightly.

[rexallllsc]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

agreed. but one thing that seems kind of weird to me...the descriptions of "short/medium/long" passing play seem kind of arbitrary. More often than not I've seen short passes on say 3rd and 4 go for 11-12 yards, and medium passes for 30-40 yards. More often then they would if it was simply broken coverage...or maybe there just needs to be more of "and coverage broke down on that play" kinda PBP, because right now as it stands I could make a living just throwing short passes and never having to go to medium/long. Anyone else notice this?

Does the PbP tell you how many yards the WR goes for after the catch?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by rexallllsc

Does the PbP tell you how many yards the WR goes for after the catch?

no. which is another possiblity/problem. I'm running a West Coast offense, so that could definately be part of it. But without the PBP telling me some more info i'm left just going "well it's 3rd and 8 i'm going to throw a short pass"

[Icy]

I have just noted your request and agree, just suggested to Arlie to add yards after catch to the pbp if possible.

[dubb93]

Some crazy things with the PBP such as running backs turning the corner and having a footrace to the endzone that ends in a 11 yard gain. I was expecting more, also these gems here...

Michigan State ball, Q2, 3-3-ND15 (00:39) 10-14
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-HB-screen (short pass)
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 4-2-5, Play: 425-pass-MZ (target pass)

The OL lets the defense through - it's a screen. QB Lynn Luzar throws it up for grabs to avoid the sack. RB Weldon Chavous pulls it in for a minimal gain as he gets dumped by OLB Arnaz Knief.MIST: Gain of 7 on the play.

I actually thought we had them stopped when it said minimal gain, then it unloads gain of 7 on me.

And then there is this confusing one...

Michigan State ball, Q1, 1-10-MIST35 (13:45) 7-0

Cie Calloway gets ready to kick, It's in the air, and comes down to Hoby Calloway.He'll be brought down at around the 2.

Reading that you really have no clue what the heck happened but it was an 88 yard kickoff return down to the 2.

[streetballer22]

I played four weeks and everything was fun untill I started paying closer attention to the polls. That really runined it for me but I'm that by the final version this will be tweaked and fixed. Seems like it has quite a bit of potential.

[dubb93]

I'm putting the game up b/c it is unplayable for me right now. Hopefully he'll update the beta.

I played a total of 3 games, won 1(the only 1 that didn't envolve some stupid error) and lost the other 2. The latest disaster was an overtime loss @ Nebraska. It took everything they had to put it into overtime including scoring a TD in the 3rd quarter, attempting to go for 2, getting a penalty and being set up at 1st and goal again. Several plays later and they were in the end zone again for another TD. This time, instead of going for 2 they decide to kick a field goal and just make it a 15 point swing.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Some crazy things with the PBP such as running backs turning the corner and having a footrace to the endzone that ends in a 11 yard gain. I was expecting more, also these gems here...

Michigan State ball, Q2, 3-3-ND15 (00:39) 10-14
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-HB-screen (short pass)
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 4-2-5, Play: 425-pass-MZ (target pass)

The OL lets the defense through - it's a screen. QB Lynn Luzar throws it up for grabs to avoid the sack. RB Weldon Chavous pulls it in for a minimal gain as he gets dumped by OLB Arnaz Knief.MIST: Gain of 7 on the play.

I actually thought we had them stopped when it said minimal gain, then it unloads gain of 7 on me.

And then there is this confusing one...

Michigan State ball, Q1, 1-10-MIST35 (13:45) 7-0

Cie Calloway gets ready to kick, It's in the air, and comes down to Hoby Calloway.He'll be brought down at around the 2.

Reading that you really have no clue what the heck happened but it was an 88 yard kickoff return down to the 2.

I feel a bit pedantic complaining about the PBP because as long as it gives good stats (which it does) I don't really care.

But my personal favourite is calling streaks out of whatever formation, hearing the tight end or reciever (usually the TE) has a step on his defender and then the pass being complete for less than 5 yards. Not quite what I had in mind when I called the play

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by wheels

Obviously, for a quick summary, there is the team summary area at the bottom of the screen that is always visible. There also is an expectations screen available under the roster menu item during the camp stage, and a Team Info screen available also under the roster menu item once the season starts.

I think this is the info you're looking for: it contains the expectations for the year, full schedule and results to date, team strengths and weaknesses, roster breakdown, team overview and a team almanac.

Here's what you can't get from BBCF right now that needs to be added....

http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum...0050#post60050

I've left off some stuff that needs to be in there, such as current record, overall ranking, all defensive stats, and overall scoring defense (which doesn't appear to be in the game for some reason, and needs to be added).

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Icy

I have just noted your request and agree, just suggested to Arlie to add yards after catch to the pbp if possible.

It is already recorded in the post game summary emails film reports. So, it shouldn't be hard to add it to the stats.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Arles...anyway we could get an e-mail inviting us to our bowl game? That'd be nice, especially so we could see what week we are playing in in terms of bowl games. Or is there a list already in-game that I just can't find for the current year?

yeah, the beta team's been after me to add this in as well. It will be in the final version.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

Player pages. Looking at a page of numbers makes me realize just how genius the ratings bars of FOF are. In FOF I've become quite accustomed to having a sort of "footprint" im looking for on a player by position. I can breeze through the QBs in a free agency list waiting for certain visual elements to jump out at me. Here I have to look at a lot of numbers, and mentally analyze them before I can decide what type of player im looking at.

You can look at the image of the player to the left on the player card and see his overall. The bright image shows his current ability and the background image shows his potential. It should be able to give you a general idea of how good a player is.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

However, I do think maybe Arlie needs to look at the number of players committing early. I think nearly 15 5 star guys in each of my two games have committed in the first week, with most following in the second and almost none left after the third week. This may need tweaking because it's taking some of the fun out of it. I don't know if others are seeing the same thing, of course 2 games is a very small sample size.

I'll check this out. But, the logic is that (just in real life) many of the 3 and 4 star guys wait to see where the studs go. IE, if I am a 4-star RB and really want to go to michigan, but see they have a 5-star on their list ahead of me. I would probably wait and see where the 5-star guy goes before committing. If he goes to another school, perhaps I choose Michigan. If he goes to Michigan, I probably look elsewhere. So, I think having that order overall makes sense. however, I do agree that too many guys seem to commit after just a week or two. I will look into this.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Arles

You can look at the image of the player to the left on the player card and see his overall. The bright image shows his current ability and the background image shows his potential. It should be able to give you a general idea of how good a player is.

I think what Ct is getting at isn't having a general idea, but specifics. If I'm looking for, say, a run-stopping DE in FOF, I can very rapidly scroll through (using keyboard shortcuts, not just the mouse--faster) the list of DE's until I see that long run-stopping bar. It is even more helpful when looking for, say, a WR who is good at route running AND catching. Rather than reading both numbers, I can go through the list rapidly until I see the bars I'm looking for. It isn't something that could be added at this point, I don't think, but is definitely worth other text sim developers looking at for future games.

[Arles]

dola, as to the polls. One of the problem was that the movement between weeks was limited because of issues early on regarding "poll instability" (ie, a team ranked No. 2 in week 2 loses to low SOS opponenet and falls to #35). However, this move limited the movement later in the season when the sample size is enough to allow for it (like the BYU example above). I am working on some fixes for it as we speak and it should make things a little more realistic.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

I think what Ct is getting at isn't having a general idea, but specifics. If I'm looking for, say, a run-stopping DE in FOF, I can very rapidly scroll through (using keyboard shortcuts, not just the mouse--faster) the list of DE's until I see that long run-stopping bar. It is even more helpful when looking for, say, a WR who is good at route running AND catching. Rather than reading both numbers, I can go through the list rapidly until I see the bars I'm looking for. It isn't something that could be added at this point, I don't think, but is definitely worth other text sim developers looking at for future games.

Ah, OK. There is a "player type" right next to the image. Perhaps I should make the font on that bigger/bold it. IE, you see a 3.5/5.0 DT that's a "Run Stopper" and it gets you similar information.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Arles

Ah, OK. There is a "player type" right next to the image. Perhaps I should make the font on that bigger/bold it. IE, you see a 3.5/5.0 DT that's a "Run Stopper" and it gets you similar information.

Making that info larger would help.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

I think what Ct is getting at isn't having a general idea, but specifics. If I'm looking for, say, a run-stopping DE in FOF, I can very rapidly scroll through (using keyboard shortcuts, not just the mouse--faster) the list of DE's until I see that long run-stopping bar. It is even more helpful when looking for, say, a WR who is good at route running AND catching. Rather than reading both numbers, I can go through the list rapidly until I see the bars I'm looking for.

but is that realistic? you do realize that actual scouts don't have a cheat sheet when looking at FA's that lets them automatically know which FA DT is rated "88" at stopping the run (that is, "88"=fantastic) and which are rated "42" ("42" being just under average). they don't have those hard thumbprints on every player that makes them know exactly who to target. they don't have the benefits of looking at bars and saying "you 8 guys over there, it says here in my clipboard your bars in run stopping are less than 40, and i'm looking for guys with bars over 80, so i won't even bother looking at you guys. rather, i'm just going to concentrate on these 3 guys over here who are rated VG in run stopping."

if only if was that easy. i like FOF's way of doing it, and i welcome a different approach. i don't know how you could expect Arles to make his game just like Jim's. i welcome change every now and then. sure, i have to analyze players a little more deeper now, but with no trading in college football and no free agency your duties as a college coach are diminished as it is.

[Ajaxab]

This would likely be something that could potentially work in mp, but would anyone else like to be able to vote in the coaches' poll? Obviously, there would be accountability issues to deal with and it's unlikely that it could ever appear in this year's iteration of the game, but it might do more towards immersion in the game.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

but is that realistic? you do realize that actual scouts don't have a cheat sheet when looking at FA's that lets them automatically know which FA DT is rated "88" at stopping the run (that is, "88"=fantastic) and which are rated "42" ("42" being just under average). they don't have those hard thumbprints on every player that makes them know exactly who to target. they don't have the benefits of looking at bars and saying "you 8 guys over there, it says here in my clipboard your bars in run stopping are less than 40, and i'm looking for guys with bars over 80, so i won't even bother looking at you guys. rather, i'm just going to concentrate on these 3 guys over here who are rated VG in run stopping."

if only if was that easy. i like FOF's way of doing it, and i welcome a different approach. i don't know how you could expect Arles to make his game just like Jim's. i welcome change every now and then. sure, i have to analyze players a little more deeper now, but with no trading in college football and no free agency your duties as a college coach are diminished as it is.

We've been over this before. In real life, scouts have TONNNNNSSS more information than we do in any text sim; they get to watch film, watch guys practice, etc. There has to be some form of abstraction of that information, or the game is going to have to produce hours and hours of film for every player. I'm not looking for a game "just like Jim's," and nowhere did I say that, either. I've mentioned ideas from FBCB, FOF, and even OOTP that could be helpful. No point in re-inventing the wheel.