Xbox 360 pricing announced - Page 8

Raiders Army · 11-21-2005, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bee

Do you rule North Korea in your spare time?

Regardless, he still needs to buy us beer like in My Name is Earl.

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Kindof like a Herm Edwards patch?

SI

Something like that. The team that sucked at management WAS a NY team, so maybe it's just in the water out there.

Eaglesfan27 · 11-21-2005, 01:08 PM

About to head off to my afternoon job, but I just got word that my Xbox360 is in the store and will be ready for pickup anytime after 8AM tomorrow morning

(I get off work around 12:00 Noon and will be heading over to pick it up then.)

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

About to head off to my afternoon job, but I just got word that my Xbox360 is in the store and will be ready for pickup anytime after 8AM tomorrow morning

(I get off work around 12:00 Noon and will be heading over to pick it up then.)

Make sure you pick up the charge 'n play kit with it. The batteries that come with the controller and remote are, so far as I can tell, regular AA's. So unless you have a large supply laid in, you'll want a way to recharge 'em and keep playing while they're being recharged.

Eaglesfan27 · 11-21-2005, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Make sure you pick up the charge 'n play kit with it. The batteries that come with the controller and remote are, so far as I can tell, regular AA's. So unless you have a large supply laid in, you'll want a way to recharge 'em and keep playing while they're being recharged.

Thanks for the tip.

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Thanks for the tip.

Aye. I need to pick one up myself when I go to work tomorrow. I hope we have some left.

Raiders Army · 11-21-2005, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Thanks for the tip.

Ditto

sterlingice · 11-21-2005, 01:22 PM

That's one thing I quickly learned. I have 12 or 16 rechargables that I rotate out of my camera, Wavebird, wireless mouse, and occasionally my GBA and Walkman when I use those. I still buy batteries, albeit rarely, for things like tv remotes that use very little power and rarely need to be replaced. However, I haven't had to buy batteries for any of those others in years. I have a recharger that is plugged in pretty much at all time below the nightlight in my bathroom (hey- don't laugh; when I need to go in the middle of the night, last thing I want to do is turn on the overhead light and blind myself before trying to head back to sleep). Camera gets up around 250 pictures, replace the batteries and recharge. Mouse dies about once a month, replace them. Wavebird goes out- well that's rare. I swear, you can get over 50, maybe 100 hours on it before replacing. But you get the idea. Anyone using a lot of wireless stuff should just put down the $20-$25 on a handful of batteries and a charger. It'll save you a ton of money in the long run and it's much better environmentally.

SI

Kodos · 11-21-2005, 01:31 PM

I need to get a wireless controller for my PS2. Damn cat always plays with the cord during key sequences in games...

Recommendations? I hear the Logitech one is good.

Anthony · 11-21-2005, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kodos

Damn cat always plays with the cord during key sequences in games...

Recommendations?

kill the cat.

rkmsuf · 11-21-2005, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

kill the cat.

that's sound advice. listen to him.

Kodos · 11-21-2005, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

kill the cat.

I sure would miss little Coolroy then.

MizzouRah · 11-21-2005, 02:08 PM

Logitech is the #1 wireless controller makers, period.

I have two for my ps2 and one for my pc.

Kodos · 11-21-2005, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

Logitech is the #1 wireless controller makers, period.

I have two for my ps2 and one for my pc.

Is there a particular model that is best?

sterlingice · 11-21-2005, 02:11 PM

I'll take the Nintendo one against anything Logitech makes but your point is well taken.

SI

MizzouRah · 11-21-2005, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kodos

Is there a particular model that is best?

http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/pr...CONTENTID=8157

Ksyrup · 11-21-2005, 02:16 PM

I don't follow consoles at ALL. Does this game come out at midnight or something? Because there's a 14-year old kid, his sister and their mom (all my guesses) sitting in the cold rain (yes, 60 degrees is cold here) outside of the Tallahassee Best Buy. They've got a big lines roped off, and these looney tunes are the only ones there...so far.

I'm assuming those kids are skipping school to sit in line. With mom.

sterlingice · 11-21-2005, 02:21 PM

Yeah, tonight at midnight, they can sell the X360 so you might see some odd behavior out there.

SI

Kodos · 11-21-2005, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/pr...CONTENTID=8157

Sounds great. Thanks!

Mustang · 11-21-2005, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I don't follow consoles at ALL. Does this game come out at midnight or something? Because there's a 14-year old kid, his sister and their mom (all my guesses) sitting in the cold rain (yes, 60 degrees is cold here) outside of the Tallahassee Best Buy. They've got a big lines roped off, and these looney tunes are the only ones there...so far.

I'm assuming those kids are skipping school to sit in line. With mom.

One of our local Best Buys has people with coolers outside..

Umm.. screw that. I'm crazy, not stupid. I'll go at the time I was planning (7 PM). If the line is absurd, oh well.. I'll go home. I'll waste 5 hours of my life... not 12-16 hours.

sterlingice · 11-21-2005, 02:47 PM

If anyone wants to send me an extra $100 for little Billy or, well, big Billy, I'll go sit outside our EBGames

SI

rkmsuf · 11-21-2005, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mustang

One of our local Best Buys has people with coolers outside..

Umm.. screw that. I'm crazy, not stupid. I'll go at the time I was planning (7 PM). If the line is absurd, oh well.. I'll go home. I'll waste 5 hours of my life... not 12-16 hours.

Go punch them in the face.

Pumpy Tudors · 11-21-2005, 02:50 PM

My wife is going to try Best Buy at about 11am tomorrow morning. Uh, yeah, I told her not to expect anything.

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mustang

One of our local Best Buys has people with coolers outside..

Umm.. screw that. I'm crazy, not stupid. I'll go at the time I was planning (7 PM). If the line is absurd, oh well.. I'll go home. I'll waste 5 hours of my life... not 12-16 hours.

Only about a dozen Best Buy locations are doing midnight openings. If yours ain't one of them, you'd waste 12 hours in that line by showing up at 7.

Raiders Army · 11-21-2005, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pumpy Tudors

My wife is going to try Best Buy at about 11am tomorrow morning. Uh, yeah, I told her not to expect anything.

Pumpy, I'd stay away from the big electronics stores like Best Buy. I'd try Sears, Target, or K-Mart.

I got my PS2 on launch day at K-Mart. Stood in line at 5 am, got a ticket at 5:30, went to work, and picked it up at noon.

I got my Xbox the day after launch day at Target.

Mustang · 11-21-2005, 04:57 PM

Oh well, looks like I'm not hanging around in line for one tonight. People at the local Wal-mart have been there since 6:00 AM and all the units are spoken for. (At least the premium systems) Judging by most of the people that I was chatting with, sounds as though Ebay is going to be a popular option.. (as in buying and reselling...)

WrongWay · 11-21-2005, 05:56 PM

I will be swinging by my little Wal~Mart tonight at 11:30Pm to see if I can get my hand on one before they close the store at midnight. If there is a line I will just do my regular shopping, if there is no line then I will go poke my nose around the electronics department and see if I can get someone to help me.

Mustang · 11-21-2005, 06:09 PM

Looks like the core system will be out there to be had... I could go to any of 3 Wal-marts and stand in line for one of those from what they are saying. Guess I could always add one later.. hmm...

Joe · 11-21-2005, 06:14 PM

will the old xbox's be able to play games from the 360? I'm guessing not, but they will probably stop producing games for the old school xbox. No?

sterlingice · 11-21-2005, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George W Bush

will the old xbox's be able to play games from the 360? I'm guessing not, but they will probably stop producing games for the old school xbox. No?

No, you can't play X360 games on the XBox. They won't stop producing games immediately for the XBox but there's already been some slowdown in production and it's only going to get less and less.

SI

WrongWay · 11-21-2005, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sterlingice

No, you can't play X360 games on the XBox. They won't stop producing games immediately for the XBox but there's already been some slowdown in production and it's only going to get less and less.

SI

And going the other way?

stevew · 11-21-2005, 06:24 PM

If I was gonna go out tonight, and stand in line to get one, how much of a markup on the 400 dollar unit could i reasonably stand to achieve? I figure it would already cost 424 after taxes....you think someone would pay 500 plus shipping?

Mustang · 11-21-2005, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

If I was gonna go out tonight, and stand in line to get one, how much of a markup on the 400 dollar unit could i reasonably stand to achieve? I figure it would already cost 424 after taxes....you think someone would pay 500 plus shipping?

Easily...

I'd say $600-700 will be the going rate. Seems like some are going for $800+ on pre-orders.

Although.. guess it depends on how much Ebay is flooded...

dawgfan · 11-21-2005, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

And going the other way?

There is backwards compatibility on the Xbox360, but on a case-by-case basis and only if you have the hard drive. There's a list published somewhere of the games currently supported for backwards compatibility (200+ titles) - it includes pretty much all the better games with the exception of the EA and 2K sports titles (they want to force you to buy the latest revs).

WrongWay · 11-21-2005, 06:30 PM

Is The Warriors on that list?

I really want this game and do not have an xbox currently.

TazFTW · 11-21-2005, 06:33 PM

WrongWay · 11-21-2005, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TazFTW

No.

What. That is a brand new game

Rich1033 · 11-21-2005, 06:46 PM

I have checked over the last few days and EBay seems to be flooded with them. It will be interesting to see how many sell.

Mustang · 11-21-2005, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich1033

I have checked over the last few days and EBay seems to be flooded with them. It will be interesting to see how many sell.

There are a ton of obvious scams going on. People selling 'Wholesale' lists for $399.. websites for $399.. One guy (w/zero feedback) has 100 premium units up for sale @ $360 each.. already sold 19.. *cough* bullshit *cough*

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George W Bush

will the old xbox's be able to play games from the 360?

I'm amazed at the number of people who apparently expect games developed for more powerful hardware to run on their existing console. Not sniping at you specifically, GWB. It's just something I hear about all the time at work.

Folks come up to me, and that's one of the things they want to know. It's like, c'mon: hardware is a money-losing proposition. If the newer games played on the older, less-unprofitable machines, why even develop a new one?

For that matter, do you expect DVDs to play on your VCR? Probably not. Different hardware, different format. Games are no different. Why do people have the expectation that they are somehow magically different? Is it the $50-60 price tag for games, compared to $10-20 for movies?

Quote:

I'm guessing not, but they will probably stop producing games for the old school xbox. No?

Major publishers will probably not invest the resources into Xbox development that they have in the past.

Niche publishers will take advantage of the fact that Xbox development costs are significantly lower than the $15-25 million frequently quoted for Xbox 360 development, and I think you'll see a strong "budget" library flourish there. I'm not talking about $10 dreck like "Ford Mustang," but rather games in the $20-$30 range that might otherwise not make it past the drawing board.

Why not? With 360 not sporting full backwards-compatibility yet, and some major Xbox titles not currently supported on 360 (such as Splinter Cell, Burnout Revenge, etc), it isn't as though original Xboxes are going to wind up in dumpsters en masse.

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

What. That is a brand new game

It's gotta go through a certification process. It's not in the same class as, say, the sports games, Burnout, or Splinter Cell, where there are obvious sequels due (which they're likely protecting with these omissions), so you'll probably see it sooner rather than later, but because it's still pretty recent, it may not have seen that process yet.

TazFTW · 11-21-2005, 07:02 PM

Heh, armed robbery for an Xbox 360.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gamespot

Two 360s taken in Virginia armed robbery

Consoles taken at gunpoint just hours ago; thief apprehended, consoles recovered.

A Stafford, Virginia, Electronics Boutique store was the scene of an armed robbery this morning. According to sources, the perpetrator made off with two Xbox 360 systems, forcing the store manager to hand them over at gunpoint.

Sources tell GameSpot the local police responded quickly, cordoned off the store, and immediately pursued the thief. The thief was apprehended shortly afterward.

Because the police consider the heist an ongoing criminal investigation, store employees were reluctant to discuss details of the robbery. But as of press time, the store is open, and all systems are back to normal.

"We're all fine, and everything is cool," a store staffer told GameSpot.

By Curt Feldman -- GameSpot Posted Nov 21, 2005 11:55 am PT

WrongWay · 11-21-2005, 07:21 PM

Hey SackAttack, would you of really expected Windows XP machines NOT to of supported Windows 98 programs?

I do not know why a company would try not to support backwards compatability. Seems, This would make people NOT want to buy a new machine if they could NOT play there favorite games.

ISiddiqui · 11-21-2005, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

I do not know why a company would try not to support backwards compatability. Seems, This would make people NOT want to buy a new machine if they could NOT play there favorite games.

When it'd cost too much. I believe the way they are doing it with the XBox is through rendering. They are using ATI for this one, IIRC, and Nvidia for the previous one, so if they include an Nvidia card to run the old XBox games, they'd have to pay them a royalty.

WrongWay · 11-21-2005, 07:43 PM

Cost I understand.

dawgfan · 11-21-2005, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

Cost I understand.

Well, then you know the reason.

And for the vast majority of worthwhile games from the Xbox library, it's a moot point if you get an Xbox360 with a hard drive - you'll have backwards compatibility. Considering that this is more of a PR issue than anything else (in past generations of consoles, actual use of previous generation games on a current gen console was very low) I think Microsoft handled this one pretty well all things considered.

Microsoft could've decided to stay with the Intel/nVidia CPU/GPU config for the Xbox360, but they obviously felt like they were getting more bang for the buck with the bids from AMD & ATI. Given that the hardware on consoles is usually sold at a loss, Microsoft was understandably looking to shave costs. Plus, they may well have felt that they were getting better performance from the AMD/ATI combo, and whatever headaches on trying to create backwards compatibility through software emulation specific to each game was worth the tradeoff.

Joe · 11-21-2005, 08:27 PM

will they even work without a hard drive?

Eaglesfan27 · 11-21-2005, 08:30 PM

You won't be able to play older games without the harddrive GWB.

I'm really glad my pre-order came through and I'm not being tempted to try to hunt for one tonight/tomorrow.

I can't wait to be done work at 12 noon tomorrow

Joe · 11-21-2005, 08:32 PM

oh gotcha

SackAttack · 11-21-2005, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

Hey SackAttack, would you of really expected Windows XP machines NOT to of supported Windows 98 programs?

Expected it? No. Been surprised by it? Also no.

If you build on an aging architecture for the sole purpose of supporting what's gone before, instead of getting something truly new and versatile, you get a creaky facsimile that doesn't really know what it wants to be.

Supporting a previous platform helps, of course, but look - Nintendo has never been backwards compatible on home consoles, and they're the most profitable game company in the business. Seems to have hurt them, eh?

Quote:

I do not know why a company would try not to support backwards compatability. Seems, This would make people NOT want to buy a new machine if they could NOT play there favorite games.

These days there's an expectation, but sometimes you have to make compromises. Microsoft can't do it the same way Sony does, because Sony controls the production of the PS2's chips. Microsoft didn't, and they switched vendors as a result. That means they're trying to emulate games designed for different hardware. It can be done, but it has to be done on a case-by-case basis. I'm shocked that there are 200+ games compatible right now. I honestly expected about 1/4 that many at launch.

11-21-2005, 01:08 PM	#353
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	About to head off to my afternoon job, but I just got word that my Xbox360 is in the store and will be ready for pickup anytime after 8AM tomorrow morning (I get off work around 12:00 Noon and will be heading over to pick it up then.) __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

11-21-2005, 01:22 PM	#358
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	That's one thing I quickly learned. I have 12 or 16 rechargables that I rotate out of my camera, Wavebird, wireless mouse, and occasionally my GBA and Walkman when I use those. I still buy batteries, albeit rarely, for things like tv remotes that use very little power and rarely need to be replaced. However, I haven't had to buy batteries for any of those others in years. I have a recharger that is plugged in pretty much at all time below the nightlight in my bathroom (hey- don't laugh; when I need to go in the middle of the night, last thing I want to do is turn on the overhead light and blind myself before trying to head back to sleep). Camera gets up around 250 pictures, replace the batteries and recharge. Mouse dies about once a month, replace them. Wavebird goes out- well that's rare. I swear, you can get over 50, maybe 100 hours on it before replacing. But you get the idea. Anyone using a lot of wireless stuff should just put down the $20-$25 on a handful of batteries and a charger. It'll save you a ton of money in the long run and it's much better environmentally. SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!" Last edited by sterlingice : 11-21-2005 at 01:23 PM.

11-21-2005, 02:11 PM	#365
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	I'll take the Nintendo one against anything Logitech makes but your point is well taken. SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!"

11-21-2005, 02:16 PM	#367
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	I don't follow consoles at ALL. Does this game come out at midnight or something? Because there's a 14-year old kid, his sister and their mom (all my guesses) sitting in the cold rain (yes, 60 degrees is cold here) outside of the Tallahassee Best Buy. They've got a big lines roped off, and these looney tunes are the only ones there...so far. I'm assuming those kids are skipping school to sit in line. With mom. __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

11-21-2005, 02:21 PM	#368
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	Yeah, tonight at midnight, they can sell the X360 so you might see some odd behavior out there. SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!"

11-21-2005, 01:31 PM	#359
Kodos Resident Alien Join Date: Jun 2001	I need to get a wireless controller for my PS2. Damn cat always plays with the cord during key sequences in games... Recommendations? I hear the Logitech one is good.

11-21-2005, 02:08 PM	#363
MizzouRah Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Troy, Mo	Logitech is the #1 wireless controller makers, period. I have two for my ps2 and one for my pc.

11-21-2005, 02:47 PM	#371
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	If anyone wants to send me an extra $100 for little Billy or, well, big Billy, I'll go sit outside our EBGames SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!"

11-21-2005, 02:50 PM	#373
Pumpy Tudors Bounty Hunter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Pittsburgh, PA	My wife is going to try Best Buy at about 11am tomorrow morning. Uh, yeah, I told her not to expect anything. __________________ No, I am not Batman, and I will not repair your food processor.

11-21-2005, 04:57 PM	#376
Mustang Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Wisconsin	Oh well, looks like I'm not hanging around in line for one tonight. People at the local Wal-mart have been there since 6:00 AM and all the units are spoken for. (At least the premium systems) Judging by most of the people that I was chatting with, sounds as though Ebay is going to be a popular option.. (as in buying and reselling...) __________________ You, you will regret what you have done this day. I will make you regret ever being born. Your going to wish you never left your mothers womb, where it was warm and safe... and wet. i am going to show you pain you never knew existed, you are going to see a whole new spectrum of pain, like a Rainboooow. But! This rainbow is not just like any other rainbow, its...

11-21-2005, 05:56 PM	#377
WrongWay Banned Join Date: Jan 2005	I will be swinging by my little Wal~Mart tonight at 11:30Pm to see if I can get my hand on one before they close the store at midnight. If there is a line I will just do my regular shopping, if there is no line then I will go poke my nose around the electronics department and see if I can get someone to help me.

11-21-2005, 06:09 PM	#378
Mustang Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Wisconsin	Looks like the core system will be out there to be had... I could go to any of 3 Wal-marts and stand in line for one of those from what they are saying. Guess I could always add one later.. hmm... __________________ You, you will regret what you have done this day. I will make you regret ever being born. Your going to wish you never left your mothers womb, where it was warm and safe... and wet. i am going to show you pain you never knew existed, you are going to see a whole new spectrum of pain, like a Rainboooow. But! This rainbow is not just like any other rainbow, its...

11-21-2005, 06:14 PM	#379
Joe Pro Starter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Minneapolis	will the old xbox's be able to play games from the 360? I'm guessing not, but they will probably stop producing games for the old school xbox. No?

11-21-2005, 06:24 PM	#382
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	If I was gonna go out tonight, and stand in line to get one, how much of a markup on the 400 dollar unit could i reasonably stand to achieve? I figure it would already cost 424 after taxes....you think someone would pay 500 plus shipping?

11-21-2005, 06:30 PM	#385
WrongWay Banned Join Date: Jan 2005	Is The Warriors on that list? I really want this game and do not have an xbox currently.

11-21-2005, 06:33 PM	#386
TazFTW Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Honolulu, HI	No.

11-21-2005, 06:46 PM	#388
Rich1033 High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Sylvania, Ohio	I have checked over the last few days and EBay seems to be flooded with them. It will be interesting to see how many sell.

11-21-2005, 07:21 PM	#393
WrongWay Banned Join Date: Jan 2005	Hey SackAttack, would you of really expected Windows XP machines NOT to of supported Windows 98 programs? I do not know why a company would try not to support backwards compatability. Seems, This would make people NOT want to buy a new machine if they could NOT play there favorite games.

11-21-2005, 07:43 PM	#395
WrongWay Banned Join Date: Jan 2005	Cost I understand.

11-21-2005, 08:27 PM	#397
Joe Pro Starter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Minneapolis	will they even work without a hard drive?

11-21-2005, 08:30 PM	#398
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	You won't be able to play older games without the harddrive GWB. I'm really glad my pre-order came through and I'm not being tempted to try to hunt for one tonight/tomorrow. I can't wait to be done work at 12 noon tomorrow __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

11-21-2005, 08:32 PM	#399
Joe Pro Starter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Minneapolis	oh gotcha

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