POL: February Console sales numbers

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

You've made my point. Why is MS putting out what could be termed a marginal improvement as a system over what is currently available when they're still selling units? Not only that, but they're putting out a system that makes the 20 GB PS3 look like a viable option. Basically, for only $20 more you can have a gaming system with a HD movie player. For the few people that needed more HDD space on their PS3, they can update to a different HDD. Sony is giving them the option to get a console/HD player at a very affordable price because most people don't need all that HDD space.

Why put Sony back into a competitive position when you're currently leading the sales race? It just doesn't make sense unless they feel they need to improve their system because of increased competition. You can also be sure that MS knows that gap is going to be closed quite a bit when the big franchises are released at the end of this year into early next year. Perhaps this is their attempt to head that off and get more consoles into homes while they still have an edge.

If this were Sony doing what MS is doing,k it would be them ahead of the curve. Instead, MS is quaking in fear because of. . . why again?

Most of the exclusives are gone. If the rumored FF exclusive is gone, I'm not sure what you have left.

And ya know, MS has a few exclusives coming out themselves. Lets see, we have Forza, Mass Effect, Shadowrun and that one game. . . what is is caled, oh, yeah, HALO 3.

If anything, MS looks to have a majority of the A list exclusives for this gen. (again, this is especially true if FF goes by the wayside for Sony)

[Travis]

Just to be devils advocate here, but once you start to referring to platform gains as "we", that does tend to wreck one's appearance as impartial And no, I don't want to get into that point, it just struck me as funny is all.

To throw another question out there, how seriously does Sony quake at all while the PS2 continues to outsell both the 360 and PS3? I originally thought that people would make the decision to go MS or Sony for the new one, with a large group adding the Wii as a secondary system. Of course there'd also be a large group with only the Wii because of the price difference, but it still looks that while a large group don't care about the PS3 having the blu ray player on it, an even larger group don't appear to care enough about the next gen features period to make the financial sacrifice to upgrade. Yes, the Wii has new control methods, but certainly not a next gen graphics console in comparison to the PS2.

Depending on how long this continues for, how will it impact the next wave of consoles trying to crack the market?

I know I'm in the minority as a PS3 owner who values the Blu Ray add on and I feel like it's worth every penny, but the continued sales of the PS2 continues to amaze me with the other options available.

[spleen1015]

If Sony loses the FF exclusivity, I don't think Ratchet & Clank is enough to get me to buy a PS3.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by TroyF

If this were Sony doing what MS is doing,k it would be them ahead of the curve. Instead, MS is quaking in fear because of. . . why again?

Not at all. Let's take a look at the numbers.

The premium version of the console is $399. The new Elite unite has the new 65nm chip in it, which drops the chip price by roughly $100. So that's $299. Tack on HDMI and a 120GB hard drive and you're looking at a $180 price increase for a total of $479. Also, note that the 120 GB HDD alone will be offered for $180 (note that you can get a much larger storage HDD for the PS3 for the same price if you wanted to upgrade). So the difference between that Elite unit and the 20 GB PS3 is $20 which adds in the HD movie player that will likely be the format that wins that format war.

Also, consider Wifi. You can get Wifi for an additional $100 on the 360. So, the same comparison applies in that case. You can get the Elite unit with Wifi for $579. Compare that to the 60 GB PS3 which has the same thing with the HD movie player for $20 more.

FWIW......I've heard multiple podcasts (1UP and CAGcast to name a couple) that have cited a similar point. It's a bad business move by MS to bring the Sony pricing back into a position where it actually is a discount when compared to the 360 alternative.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

That's Microsoft's problem right now. They want to imply that they're different than Sony, yet they make moves that are contrary to that policy. The fact that MS introduced the HD-DVD format mainly to cause a war with Sony rather than any actual belief that it would succeed is one of the worst kept secrets in the console world.

That's a major distortion of reality. HD-DVD is not just Microsoft's initiative - as a format, it was a product of many companies coming together to define a new, hi-def DVD standard, spearheaded by Toshiba and including support from NEC, Sanyo, RCA and Intel along with Microsoft. As a format, it was designed well before the 360 (it was endorsed by the DVD Forum in November, 2003 as the hi-def successor to DVD) and we all know that Microsoft opted not to use HD-DVD as the media for the 360.

Now, that's not to say that a significant factor in Microsoft continuing to endorse the HD-DVD format doesn't come from the desire to oppose Sony, but let's not go overboard by characterizing HD-DVD as solely Microsoft's product - it's far more Toshiba's than anyone else.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

The problem is that coders still have to program with the core 360 (no HDD) in mind.

Dola - I don't think this is going to be a huge limiting factor. Given the low percentage of 360 owners with the core unit, many publishers will feel OK with a decision to make their games carry the requirement of having a hard drive.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

If Sony loses the FF exclusivity, I don't think Ratchet & Clank is enough to get me to buy a PS3.

As was mentioned before, this just isn't going to happen. All that comment by the SCEF head did was give Square a bit more leverage in negotiations (which was dumb). The FF series in Japan was responsible for literally millions of PS2's going off the shelf. My understanding is that Square has put forth a figure that they expect the franchise to sell 3 million PS3 in Japan alone and that Sony isn't disputing that figure (i.e Sony isn't trying to say that it would only move 2M units to try to reduce the exclusivity cost). Sony has no choice but to keep the FF franchise in that case. They simply can't throw away those kind of sales.

Same thing with the MGS series. It'll still be a Sony exclusive.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Now, that's not to say that a significant factor in Microsoft continuing to endorse the HD-DVD format doesn't come from the desire to oppose Sony, but let's not go overboard by characterizing HD-DVD as solely Microsoft's product - it's far more Toshiba's than anyone else.

I agree that they do have partners in that fight.

[spleen1015]

Well, I hope my son takes the decision away from me. If he makes the honor roll the final term of this school year, he gets a PS3.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

Well, I hope my son takes the decision away from me. If he makes the honor roll the final term of this school year, he gets a PS3.

Ah, awfully generous parent (though I think you may have some selfish gaming reasons intertwined in that ). Chances of a honor roll spot for him?

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

As was mentioned before, this just isn't going to happen. All that comment by the SCEF head did was give Square a bit more leverage in negotiations (which was dumb). The FF series in Japan was responsible for literally millions of PS2's going off the shelf. My understanding is that Square has put forth a figure that they expect the franchise to sell 3 million PS3 in Japan alone and that Sony isn't disputing that figure (i.e Sony isn't trying to say that it would only move 2M units to try to reduce the exclusivity cost). Sony has no choice but to keep the FF franchise in that case. They simply can't throw away those kind of sales.

Same thing with the MGS series. It'll still be a Sony exclusive.

So, if they lose FF exclusivity, you'll admit that Sony is in some trouble with the PS3?

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

As was mentioned before, this just isn't going to happen. All that comment by the SCEF head did was give Square a bit more leverage in negotiations (which was dumb). The FF series in Japan was responsible for literally millions of PS2's going off the shelf. My understanding is that Square has put forth a figure that they expect the franchise to sell 3 million PS3 in Japan alone and that Sony isn't disputing that figure (i.e Sony isn't trying to say that it would only move 2M units to try to reduce the exclusivity cost). Sony has no choice but to keep the FF franchise in that case. They simply can't throw away those kind of sales.

Same thing with the MGS series. It'll still be a Sony exclusive.

Ummm. . . isn't it kind of important for Sony to have 3 million PS3's in the hands of console owners for that to happen? They have under a million consoles sold in Japan at this point, it isn't like they are breaking all time records. Hell, they don't even have 3 million units worldwide as I type this.

And of course Sony isn't going to dispute the figures. Doing so would hurt their cause far worse than saving some pennies on the FF exclusive.

At this point in the game, more Sony exclusives are leaving than joining. That's just the reality. And the bigger reality is that MS seems to be getting some amazing exclusives themselves.

Well, off to buy the damned PS3 and Resistence (and another game if the trade ins are what I think they will be)

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

It's a bad business move by MS to bring the Sony pricing back into a position where it actually is a discount when compared to the 360 alternative.

I agree that it's a bad move by Microsoft to voluntarily cede some of their pricing advantage to Sony. I think it would've been better for Microsoft to introduce the Elite at $399 and drop the prices of the Premium and Core systems. I think Microsoft had better not get too cocky with their headstart in sales and milk as much price out of their hardware as they can - I think it's more important for them to be aggressive in trying to continue to outsell the PS3 and widen their market share advantage by keeping that significant price differential.

But it's important not to fall into the trap of thinking of the PS3 as a "discount" when compared to the 360 - that thinking assumes that every consumer wants a hi-def DVD player included in their gaming console. Many don't care, and many more aren't ready to choose a format - for them, it's still significantly less expensive to get a 360 than a PS3, and at very little loss of gaming quality.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

So, if they lose FF exclusivity, you'll admit that Sony is in some trouble with the PS3?

It would be disasterous in Japan, which is a region they can't afford to lose. Not that MS is mounting any significant challenge, but they need to plow MS under in Japan.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by TroyF

Ummm. . . isn't it kind of important for Sony to have 3 million PS3's in the hands of console owners for that to happen? They have under a million consoles sold in Japan at this point, it isn't like they are breaking all time records. Hell, they don't even have 3 million units worldwide as I type this.

I think you're missing the point. Literally, 3 million Japanese consumers will walk out of the store with a new PS3 under one arm and a copy of FF under the other arm. Japan is just borderline odd in regards to their infatuation with certain gaming franchises. You simply don't see those kinds of things in the American market.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

But it's important not to fall into the trap of thinking of the PS3 as a "discount" when compared to the 360 - that thinking assumes that every consumer wants a hi-def DVD player included in their gaming console. Many don't care, and many more aren't ready to choose a format - for them, it's still significantly less expensive to get a 360 than a PS3, and at very little loss of gaming quality.

In the current situation, I generally agree. You have to pay at least $100 to upgrade to a HD movie player. That's not going to do it for the people who aren't all that interested and they are certainly making the better decision at this point. But with the Elite unit, they're creating a situation where their console is actually less competitve than before they released the unit.

As you said, it would be in their best interest to just keep on with what they're doing. If they try to compete on level ground, they will likely cause themselves some problems. Their advantage is that they have a good price point for people who just want a gaming system. Don't give away that advantage by putting the system at a price that allows for comparison that may create unfavorable results.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

As you said, it would be in their best interest to just keep on with what they're doing. If they try to compete on level ground, they will likely cause themselves some problems. Their advantage is that they have a good price point for people who just want a gaming system. Don't give away that advantage by putting the system at a price that allows for comparison that may create unfavorable results.

Yep. If, 2-3 years down the line, Blu-Ray emerges as the de facto hi-def DVD standard, then Sony is looking good. The PS3 will no longer look like a great gaming machine with an expensive, unproven media format tacked-on, but a cool combo machine that's relatively inexpensive given the included hardware and a great show-off toy for your new HDTV, both for games and movies.

I would think it's in Microsoft's best interests to press the advantage they have while they still have it, because I can see a very plausible scenario where Blu-Ray wins out over HD-DVD and PS3 sales start gaining on the 360. Sony has handed Microsoft a lot of opportunities to build a big lead in console sales for this round, and they haven't taken full advantage of them.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Ah, awfully generous parent (though I think you may have some selfish gaming reasons intertwined in that ). Chances of a honor roll spot for him?

The chances are rather small. His last report card was A, A-, B, C, C-, C-, C-. That is with him putting in a small amount of effort. He doesn't like school and doesn't apply himself. If he makes the honor roll, the $1200 I will end up spending because of it will be worth it because getting him to put forth the effort will be the reward for me.

That's why his reward is so big. It will take a lot for him to do it.

I failed to mention I promised a small HDTV to go along with it. I just might follow your lead and go with the flat screen LCD monitor.

[WVUFAN]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Not at all. Let's take a look at the numbers.

The premium version of the console is $399. The new Elite unite has the new 65nm chip in it, which drops the chip price by roughly $100.

No it doesn't.

Same chipset as the last version.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

The chances are rather small. His last report card was A, A-, B, C, C-, C-, C-. That is with him putting in a small amount of effort. He doesn't like school and doesn't apply himself. If he makes the honor roll, the $1200 I will end up spending because of it will be worth it because getting him to put forth the effort will be the reward for me.

That's why his reward is so big. It will take a lot for him to do it.

I failed to mention I promised a small HDTV to go along with it. I just might follow your lead and go with the flat screen LCD monitor.

He is gonna make the honor roll. That's how it works.

[Icy]

Sony has reported that the 100,000 PS3 sales have been reached in Spain so far (you can believe it or not).

I'm still on the fence about what to do, i liked a lot the 360 as i said before, and sold it because i couldn't play USA sports games. I was going to pickup a PS3 as it's region free, but RIGHT NOW i think the Xbox360 has a better value because the biggest number of games available and the LIVE system. I also hate to pay Sony for the BR when i don't care about it at all (i never used the PS2 DVD player).

Today i learned about another option, to buy an USA 360 from an online shop in Canada that ships to Europe. I know other guys who have done it
already and received it in 48 hours by DHL without any problem. Also the price is in $ so it's prety cheap for me in Euros, 300€ vs the 600€ of the PS3 so for 600€ i can buy the american 360 plus College Hoops 07, NCAA07, MLB2k7, NHL2k7 and more games. The only problem is that if it ever breaks, if i send it to Microsoft Europe, i'll get an european console back instead of my USA one, but i guess i can always sell it and buy again an USA one.

I'll consider it tonight and will decide probably tomorrow if i order that American 360 online or if i go to a local shop and buy a Ps3.

[Icy]

Dola, i think i'm going to order it now, this is what i can get for the 600€ that the PS3 costs me in Spain:

XBOX 360 Premium 5 Game Bundle 304.88EUR

GAMES INCLUDED:
Call of Duty 3
Ghost Recon
Arcade Unplugged
PGR3
Kameo

GAMES:
College Hoops 2K7 - 360 38.92EUR
Major League Baseball 2K7 - 360 45.40EUR
NBA 2K7 - 360 45.40EUR
Ghost Recon Advanced WarFighter 2 - 360 45.40EUR
NHL 2K7 - 360 38.92EUR
The Elder Scrolls IV(4): Oblivion - 360 29.19EUR
Gears of War - 360 45.40EUR

Sub-Total: 593.51EUR

[Coder]

Downside of that, Icy, is of course that you won't be getting MLB The Show

[Travis]

Better off getting the 360 now or waiting for the new version? Do the updated specs mean much to you?

[sabotai]

Originally Posted by Travis

Better off getting the 360 now or waiting for the new version? Do the updated specs mean much to you?

I would say that unless you are planning on buying/downloading a lot of HD video, the "Premium" (kinda got to put that in quotes now, eh?) 360 will be fine. IMHO, MS saw the huge demand for HD video over Live and are coming out with the Elite to accomodate that crowd. So unless you are planning on using all that HD space, and you just want a gaming rig (like me, I just use it to play games and sometimes download a demo), the Premium is fine. I haven't even gotten close to using up the space on the Premium HD.

[Icy]

Originally Posted by Coder

Downside of that, Icy, is of course that you won't be getting MLB The Show

Yup, that is the only minus, but i have it in the PSP and the Ps3 version keeps being delayed again and again, now it's said it will be out in the middle of May but the continuous delays don't sound good to me.

I'll be able to play MLB2k7 in the other way with this USA 360.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

That's a major distortion of reality. HD-DVD is not just Microsoft's initiative - as a format, it was a product of many companies coming together to define a new, hi-def DVD standard, spearheaded by Toshiba and including support from NEC, Sanyo, RCA and Intel along with Microsoft. As a format, it was designed well before the 360 (it was endorsed by the DVD Forum in November, 2003 as the hi-def successor to DVD) and we all know that Microsoft opted not to use HD-DVD as the media for the 360.

Now, that's not to say that a significant factor in Microsoft continuing to endorse the HD-DVD format doesn't come from the desire to oppose Sony, but let's not go overboard by characterizing HD-DVD as solely Microsoft's product - it's far more Toshiba's than anyone else.

Please, please, please tell me you don't believe that Microsoft has any real interest in HD-DVD other than to try and block Sony and Blu-Ray? That first paragraph sounds like a business brochure. Microsoft's main interest in HD-DVD is to take away one of Sony's strongest selling points to the PS3 and that's pretty much it.

Don't get me wrong- it's Toshiba's baby as well as the rest of the "consortium". Mizzou's a bit overzealous in saying that MS introduced it, but their interest in it is wholly to take down Sony. Heck, the best of both worlds for Microsoft would be a split format war where everyone ended up making dual format players and they could support both sides while completely neutering any advantage Sony wanted.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by TroyF

Ummm. . . isn't it kind of important for Sony to have 3 million PS3's in the hands of console owners for that to happen? They have under a million consoles sold in Japan at this point, it isn't like they are breaking all time records. Hell, they don't even have 3 million units worldwide as I type this.

I was going to say something but I guess this was already responded to. You know how system sellers work- they're dubbed that for a reason.

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

I think you're missing the point. Literally, 3 million Japanese consumers will walk out of the store with a new PS3 under one arm and a copy of FF under the other arm. Japan is just borderline odd in regards to their infatuation with certain gaming franchises. You simply don't see those kinds of things in the American market.

SI

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Please, please, please tell me you don't believe that Microsoft has any real interest in HD-DVD other than to try and block Sony and Blu-Ray? That first paragraph sounds like a business brochure. Microsoft's main interest in HD-DVD is to take away one of Sony's strongest selling points to the PS3 and that's pretty much it.

Don't get me wrong- it's Toshiba's baby as well as the rest of the "consortium". Mizzou's a bit overzealous in saying that MS introduced it, but their interest in it is wholly to take down Sony. Heck, the best of both worlds for Microsoft would be a split format war where everyone ended up making dual format players and they could support both sides while completely neutering any advantage Sony wanted.

SI

I don't think you're saying anything significantly different than I am. My primary point was that HD-DVD isn't Microsoft's in the way that Blu-Ray is Sony's, contrary to the impression Mizzou was giving.

I'm not going to pretend I know all the back-door business dealings and reasonings for Microsoft backing HD-DVD. Obviously there's a big incentive for them to block Sony's initiative given their battle over the game console/media center market. But that may not be the only reason for them lining up behind HD-DVD.

[ISiddiqui]

I also doubt that the only reason MS backed HD DVD was to block Sony and the PS3. They probably figured that if HD DVD wins out, MS is in a comfy position in that market as well.

If Blu-Ray wins, oh well, not like MS can't reverse fields... it isn't like they are making these HD DVD players.

[cartman]

I seriously think that the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD fight is going to be a wash. Companies have already demonstrated that they can make a single player that can read both formats. That was not possible with the previous generation of media formats.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Icy

Today i learned about another option, to buy an USA 360 from an online shop in Canada that ships to Europe. I know other guys who have done it
already and received it in 48 hours by DHL without any problem. Also the price is in $ so it's prety cheap for me in Euros, 300€ vs the 600€ of the PS3 so for 600€ i can buy the american 360 plus College Hoops 07, NCAA07, MLB2k7, NHL2k7 and more games. The only problem is that if it ever breaks, if i send it to Microsoft Europe, i'll get an european console back instead of my USA one, but i guess i can always sell it and buy again an USA one.

I'll consider it tonight and will decide probably tomorrow if i order that American 360 online or if i go to a local shop and buy a Ps3.

Another thing to consider is that it's widely rumored that a redesigned 360 premium with the smaller chip and quieter console is going to come out for the holiday season. So you're going to end up buying a console right now that they'll replace in the near future with a redesign.

Honestly, I'm just glad I'm not you. I'm the kind of consumer that will get the itch and have to run down a buy a game. I don't have the patience to wait for a game to come across an ocean before I get it.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by cartman

I seriously think that the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD fight is going to be a wash. Companies have already demonstrated that they can make a single player that can read both formats. That was not possible with the previous generation of media formats.

The problem is that by the time those players get to any form of a reasonable price, there's not going to be any HD-DVD's left. It's no secret that HD-DVD is getting run over by the Blu-ray format right now.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

The problem is that by the time those players get to any form of a reasonable price, there's not going to be any HD-DVD's left. It's no secret that HD-DVD is getting run over by the Blu-ray format right now.

It's very hard to tell, because neither side is releasing "hard" sales figures for discs. From what I can gather, since the introduction of both formats, there have been more HD-DVD discs sold than blu-ray discs. In addition, even with the sales of the PS3, there are more HD-DVD players out there than Blu-Ray players, but that lead will quickly diminish once the PS3 is on the market for a few more months.

It does appear that Blu-Ray disc sales are outpacing HD-DVD sales over the past few months by a 2 or 3 to 1 margin, but how much of that is people buying a couple of Blu-Ray movies with their new PS3? A similar spike was seen with UMD movies when the PSP was first released. What remains to be seen is if people who don't have 1080p sets with their PS3 will continue to pay a premium for blu-ray titles, or if they will stick with regular DVDs.

In any event, the lead either category has on the other is minuscule compared to the overall movie market, where 250 DVDs are sold for every next gen high-def (blu-ray/HD-DVD) title. So any lead built by the new formats over the next few months is hardly an insurmountable knockout blow.

[Daimyo]

I don't see how you can call the format war when the players are still in early adopter phase. If the price of each player halves by the holiday season, the HD-DVD player will be pretty near the $200 sweet spot for mass consumption while the Blu-Ray players will still be well above it.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Another thing to consider is that it's widely rumored that a redesigned 360 premium with the smaller chip and quieter console is going to come out for the holiday season. So you're going to end up buying a console right now that they'll replace in the near future with a redesign.

And the PS3 has already released their redesign. They ripped the Emotion engine out for Europe, remember?

The key is that the existing 360s will work just fine for a LONG time.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Travis

Just to be devils advocate here, but once you start to referring to platform gains as "we", that does tend to wreck one's appearance as impartial And no, I don't want to get into that point, it just struck me as funny is all.

There's two ways to read that, though, Travis.

One is the implication you're making, that it's the old home-town "we."

The other is in the professorial sense. "Here we have..."

The usage doesn't wreck his impartiality (or lack thereof). What it does is alter your perception of it...but your perception isn't all that impartial to begin with, if your immediate interpretation of the usage of 'we' is 'woo, go Microsoft,' is it?

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

And the PS3 has already released their redesign. They ripped the Emotion engine out for Europe, remember?

The key is that the existing 360s will work just fine for a LONG time.

That was a different situation. I would argue that the original PS3 is the better unit of the two, simply from a compatibility standpoint for old games. It's all the same for PS3 gaming, but I have a PS2 built in where others do not.

My point was that an improved 360 with a lower price point will likely be out in 5 months. If I wanted a 360 at this point, I definitely wouldn't buy right now. I'd wait for the fall.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Daimyo

I don't see how you can call the format war when the players are still in early adopter phase. If the price of each player halves by the holiday season, the HD-DVD player will be pretty near the $200 sweet spot for mass consumption while the Blu-Ray players will still be well above it.

Blu-ray just had a price drop and will be less than $300 by the holiday season. Price won't be a problem for either unit. That article detailing the pricing drop is linked a few pages back. There's going to be little price difference on the stand-alone player. The problem is that HD-DVD is going to be way behind in installed units at that point and most of the movie studios support Blu-ray at this point (23 of the top 25 movies last year were on Blu-ray with Universal being the only studio not using Blu-ray).

As far as the earlier argument concerning the question of whether people are just buying Blu-ray movies because they want to use them on their PS3, it doesn't matter a whole lot. Installed base is usually the one calling the shots and the Blu-ray installed base is growing further and further ahead of the HD-DVD base. MS is having troubles even selling them at this point.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

There's two ways to read that, though, Travis.

One is the implication you're making, that it's the old home-town "we."

The other is in the professorial sense. "Here we have..."

The usage doesn't wreck his impartiality (or lack thereof). What it does is alter your perception of it...but your perception isn't all that impartial to begin with, if your immediate interpretation of the usage of 'we' is 'woo, go Microsoft,' is it?

I honestly missed that this was probably about something I said. The exact quote was, let's see, we have. . . Not "we" in the MS sense, "we" as in all of us. I don't think there has been another time throughout the thread I've even posted the word. I think you guys are REALLY grasping at straws to prove my hatred of Sony and my love for MS.

As it stands, a big, gigantic PS3 is sitting on my shelf now. I'm still stunned I bought something for 600 bucks that didn't even include component cables, but here we are. Oh God, I said we again. Damnit.

Early thoughts:

1) I like the MS controller better. I can live with the six axis, but the MS controller fits my hands perfectly. Lets say the PS3 does win the graphical battle and looks a lot prettier. (it doesn't now, more on that later). It would be a difficult choice for me - take the better looking game or the better feeling controller.

2) Sony is lucky it isn't charging for online, because I'm not real impressed. The same setup as the PSP, which I'm also not really a fan of. I can see areas of improvement, but as of now, you get what you pay for. The 360 interface is better in just about every area. (though I didn't mind the actual gameplay in Resistence MP)

3) Resistence is fun. A LOT of fun.

4) Maybe it happens down the line as PS3 fans insist will happen, but I don't see anything in Resistence that Gears of War or Crackdown don't match in terms of graphics.

5) Did i mention the thing is big? I remember when the Xbox came out, one of the major downsides was how big the thing was. (not to mention that ridiculous bulky controller they first tried to pass on the public)

6) After all the trade ins it was a little over 400 bucks without the component cables. I'm hoping Sony gets off their asses and releases a lot of games in the next few months, because I really want to justify this purchase. The more I review, the more I trade, the less I spend in games the rest of the year. That's the goal anyway.

7) Don't ask me about BluRay. I've bought about 5 DVD's in the last year, and most of those are cartoons. I don't expect to get a BluRay movie anytime soon.


My nick is TroyF on the PS3 network for those of you who want to play sometime. I only have Resistence now and it'll probably stay that way for awhile as I see no other solid games out at the moment. (I've already beat Oblivion on the 360, nothing else looks all that appealing)

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by TroyF

As it stands, a big, gigantic PS3 is sitting on my shelf now. I'm still stunned I bought something for 600 bucks that didn't even include component cables, but here we are.

Your restraint in regards to impulse control is quite admirable.

The main situation you face now owning both the 360 and PS3 is that there are many titles that are released simultaneously on both consoles. Both are the same price. There's a pretty good chance that as time goes along, with the PS3 probably being the better system 'under the hood', that programmers will be able to squeeze more out of the PS3 and the PS3 version will definitely be no worse and in some cases be better than its 360 counterpart. At that point, you're basically using the 360 for exclusives on that system.

As far as games, these are the good exclusive titles available and coming in the next couple of months........

Out already:

Resistance: FOM
Motorstorm
F1 Championship Racing
Tekken 5 ($20)

Coming in next two months:

MLB 07: The Show
Heavenly Sword
Lair
Singstar


Here's the 360 list of exclusives already out in 2007 and upcoming in the next two months (I listed all the games rather than decide which were 'good' since I hadn't played any of them).....

Out already:

Bullet Witch
Crackdown
DDR: Universe
Fusion Frenzy 2
Lost Planet: Extreme Condition

Coming in next two months:

Forza 2
Halo 3


Obviously, the system seller in that list is Halo 3. However, I'm not sure that all of the Halo series fans haven't already purchased a 360 console. The boost for MS will obviously be from the software sales.

[TroyF]

Mizzou,

I'm fine on impulse control. If you read between the lines, you can see why I picked it up. If you read earlier in the thread, you'll see that I mentioned if I could get one with the cost cut down, I probably would. This wasn't a snap decision, it was something that I put a lot of thought into and should work out for me long term.

You keep saying the PS3 will be better under the hood. At this point, I see nothing to make me believe it. But it doesn't matter now. If it really is better, I have both consoles. I'm not a moron, I'm going to buy the game that plays the best. For all of you trying to convince me that my MS bias shows through and through, you have not understood a word I've said.

I've played both FI and Motorstorm, neither are the game for me. Lair looks interesting. We'll see about Heavinly Sword. Singstar has no appeal to me at all except as trade fodder if I get to review the game.

Your MS assertions, as usual, are way the hell off. First off, Halo 3 won't be out until November 1. There are also a few more A list titles due out shortly for MS than just Forza. Mass Effect and Shadowrun will be out soon as well, not to mention Guitar Hero II tomororow.

I think you are off base with the Halo thing as well. If you don't think it's going to cause a spike in systems, especially right around Christmas when we'll probably see a price drop to go with it, you are nuts.

[spleen1015]

Halo 3 is out in November.

Guitar Hero 2 is coming out this week.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

Halo 3 is out in November.

Guitar Hero 2 is coming out this week.

I relied on the Wiki list for my list on 360. I don't have much idea about the games and their release dates because I don't own the system.

Also, GH2 is not an exclusive. I only was listing exclusives.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by TroyF

I think you are off base with the Halo thing as well. If you don't think it's going to cause a spike in systems, especially right around Christmas when we'll probably see a price drop to go with it, you are nuts.

The price drop would be the reason for consoles moving. Halo may cause a minimal spike, but it would be dwarfed by the consoles moved by dropping the consoles $100 across the line.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

The price drop would be the reason for consoles moving. Halo may cause a minimal spike, but it would be dwarfed by the consoles moved by dropping the consoles $100 across the line.

I think you're severely underestimating the impact Halo's release could have on console sales.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

PS3 has now passed over 3 million units worldwide.

http://www.vgcharts.org/

Even more interesting is that Europe in 2 weeks time has sold more units than Japan did in 4 months. It's a pretty good sign that the Japanese consumers are waiting for a 'big' game (FF, MGS and Kingdom Hears are the big ones to the Japanese public) before purchasing a next-gen system. If Sony can get out at least one of those games before the holidays, Japan sales will spike as well. That should be a key goal for Sony right now. Obviously, the price isn't a problem in Japan as the PS3 is cheap in Japan relatively speaking and the 360 sales are non-existant.

As far as America goes, the release of MLB 07: The Show (May) will likely be the next place to watch for a console sales spike of any sort.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

I think you're severely underestimating the impact Halo's release could have on console sales.

Oh, I think they'll sell a ton of Halo 3 games. I just think that a lot of Halo fans already have the console. Obviously, price cuts by Sony or MS in addition to any big titles on the PS3 will have a relative effect that is simply too hard to forecast at this point.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Oh, I think they'll sell a ton of Halo 3 games. I just think that a lot of Halo fans already have the console. Obviously, price cuts by Sony or MS in addition to any big titles on the PS3 will have a relative effect that is simply too hard to forecast at this point.

Between a possible price cut, normal holiday sales spikes and the release of Halo 3, it'll be difficult to tease out the relative impacts of each of those 3 factors. But I suspect there are a lot of gamers that have held off on buying a console so far that will find the release of Halo 3 to be the tipping point in terms of compelling exclusive content.

I don't have a 360 yet, but I'm probably going to get one in the next 6 months, and the coming availability of Halo 3 will be a definite factor.

[Daimyo]

MLB 07 is a system seller, but Halo is not?!?