College Football Week 15 discussion (Conference Championship Week)

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

There is plenty of resentment against the B12 for skipping this.

But there shouldn't be from voters that are supposed to be, I thought, independent.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I think Louisville is a no-brainer, and all of Memphis (if FedEx is actually willing to pour money in), USF, UCF and even BYU have some appeal. Not sold on Cincinnati, but allegedly the Big 12 likes them too. SMU has history and is right in the footprint, but I'm not sure that's actually a selling point. If you need to expand to 12 at some point (and you do), might as well grab the 2 you like the most now instead of waiting for the SEC/PAC/B1G to steal another of your teams or for the ACC to pick up its 2 favorite applicants for its attempt to be the 4th conference.

I think obvious team not being mentioned that is a semi brand more so than any school in the CUSA and is the university in the 4th biggest US city is Houston. I would say add them and Louisville . They are both great college ball schools .

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I think Louisville is a no-brainer, and all of Memphis (if FedEx is actually willing to pour money in), USF, UCF and even BYU have some appeal. Not sold on Cincinnati, but allegedly the Big 12 likes them too. SMU has history and is right in the footprint, but I'm not sure that's actually a selling point. If you need to expand to 12 at some point (and you do), might as well grab the 2 you like the most now instead of waiting for the SEC/PAC/B1G to steal another of your teams or for the ACC to pick up its 2 favorite applicants for its attempt to be the 4th conference.

Uhh Louisville is in the ACC and has signed the grant of rights. It would cost them $50MM to leave.

Originally Posted by Galaril

I think obvious team not being mentioned that is a semi brand more so than any school in the CUSA and is the university in the 4th biggest US city is Houston. I would say add them and Louisville . They are both great college ball schools .

Another reason why the SMU story may make sense is adding Dallas...

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

But there shouldn't be from voters that are supposed to be, I thought, independent.

Well, yeah, sure. They should be.

But personal bias is hard to overcome I'd suggest.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by bronconick

Pick Baylor, and the precedent is "garbage scheduling is ok." That’s very bad.
Pick TCU and the precedent is "head to head isn’t that important." Not great either.
Pick an Ohio State team that just crushed Wisconsin and the precedent is "championship games and being good at the end of the session matters." That’s not perfect, but it’s much better than the other options.

If that's the case why move TCU up to 3 in the 2nd to last poll?

Championship games were created to give an extra appealing game to sell to the networks. How we've gone to them being almost universally despised among fans a few years ago to conferences being forced to add teams to have one is mind boggling.

It's been odd to see the discussion in college sports go from "conference realignment is the death of college sports" to "the Big 12 should gotten their act together and expanded like everyone else" in such a short time.

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by Atocep

If that's the case why move TCU up to 3 in the 2nd to last poll?

They expected Florida State to lose.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Y'know, if we had a few more teams we could just have gigantic double elimination tournament, do away with regular season & conference play & all of it.

I mean, it's all about tournaments after all.

edit to add: Of course, then there's the argument about how to seed the teams.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Y'know, if we had a few more teams we could just have gigantic double elimination tournament, do away with regular season & conference play & all of it.

I mean, it's all about tournaments after all.

edit to add: Of course, then there's the argument about how to seed the teams.

Just put everyone's name in a hat.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by MacroGuru

BYU can move immediately, it would take a lot of contract buyouts and game moves happening, but I agree, I don't see the change taking place until 2016.

Do you see BYU rethinking it's position?


I would think the Big 12, if they do add team, would like to give West Virginia a relatively close, Eastern partner?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Do you see BYU rethinking it's position?


I would think the Big 12, if they do add team, would like to give West Virginia a relatively close, Eastern partner?

I think BYU makes sense if the Sunday thing can be worked out. The 2nd team would likely be a travel partner for WVU, IMO.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I think BYU makes sense if the Sunday thing can be worked out. The 2nd team would likely be a travel partner for WVU, IMO.

I think UCONN fits the profile best of the remaining schools, but I'd rather get a UCF or USF as our travel partner.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I think UCONN fits the profile best of the remaining schools, but I'd rather get a UCF or USF as our travel partner.

UCF and USF wouldn't be much of a travel partner for WVU.

[Matthean]

Looking at the actual bowl games, there's a number of interesting ones, but I think Baylor vs. MSU is near the top for the sheer difference in play styles.

[Lathum]

I was at the Cincinnati game on Saturday and there were rumors Big 12 reps were there.Would be a nice fit all around I would think

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by cartman

Dr. Sak sighting!

Originally Posted by cuervo72

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Originally Posted by cartman

He was one of the refs for the Dr Pepper thing

Originally Posted by Lathum

That's cool.

How did that happen?

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Job perk. Work that and serve as gofer for director of officials in exchange for exposure, and tickets to the game and I assume a smaller payday, but a payday none the less in an otherwise "off" weekend

Glad you picked me out! It was a blast...Dr Pepper treated myself and my wife great. They put us up in the Westin...took care of all our meals...and we were allowed in their tailgate party with all the free food and booze we wanted. And of course tickets to the game.

Here's two pics...as you can see the Hokie didn't cooperate.

[RainMaker]

I still like 10 team conferences where everyone gets to play each other once. Conference championship games rarely feature the two best teams in the conference. They're kind of dumb.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

Just put everyone's name in a hat.

Somebody would rig the hat.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by cartman

The SEC ducked matching up A&M with Texas in the Texas Bowl. Big 12 announced first they were sending the Longhorns to Houston, then the SEC revealed they were sending Arkansas to the Texas Bowl. There isn't going to be much scoring in that game. Two great defenses and two middling offenses.

Texas/Texas A&M and WVU/Tennessee made too much sense.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Texas/Texas A&M and WVU/Tennessee made too much sense.

If you're the (former) Gator Bowl, you have to love getting Tennessee-Iowa as your traveling teams.

[MizzouRah]

Bring on Minnesota!

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

Bring on Minnesota!

Be careful. They are a step up from Indiana.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

The SEC would rig the hat.

FTFY

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Be careful. They are a step up from Indiana.

I think it will be a good game.. they had a pretty good season.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Uhh Louisville is in the ACC and has signed the grant of rights. It would cost them $50MM to leave.



Another reason why the SMU story may make sense is adding Dallas...

Oh wow, I forgot the Louisville move.

Between Oklahoma/Texas/TCU/Baylor doesn't the Big 12 already have the metroplex in hand from a TV rights perspective?

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Oh wow, I forgot the Louisville move.

Between Oklahoma/Texas/TCU/Baylor doesn't the Big 12 already have the metroplex in hand from a TV rights perspective?

I (personally) think the TV rights argument is overstated.
Dont forget the cost implications also of a farther school. Sure Football can handle it and probably basketball. Bit when you start looking at Olympic sports and high game count sports (ie baseball/softball) any financial gain by an out of market addition can be sucked back out of the AD budget...

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I (personally) think the TV rights argument is overstated.
Dont forget the cost implications also of a farther school. Sure Football can handle it and probably basketball. Bit when you start looking at Olympic sports and high game count sports (ie baseball/softball) any financial gain by an out of market addition can be sucked back out of the AD budget...

I agree the conferences overvalue TV rights and "footprints", and I'd love it if the Big 12 stayed in its lane and just added SMU and Houston, but they already added one team way outside its area last time - http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...2011-10-29.png - adding one more school (Cincinnati) near WVU does make sense from a travel partner perspective. Northern Illinois would seem to partner with Iowa State in that sense too, but their basketball program has been atrocious lately and I think the Big 12 is putting some weight on that. I think Memphis would be within bus range for at least some of the schools.

[albionmoonlight]

People are saying that the committee's decision shows that the B12 needs a championship game. Having thought about this, I am not sure what a Big 12 Championship would have solved.

Say Baylor/TCU played one extra game this weekend against each other. One of those teams would have won. Then, either that winning team would have still been left out in the cold, or a one-loss Ohio State team that just obliterated the Big 10 Championship game would have been left out in the cold.

[miked]

As a GT fan, it may be ugly football, but we win. I can't imagine another coach taking us to a pair of ACC title games in 3 seasons, a pair of Orange Bowls, and a few other milestones (1st win at FSU in school history).

I mean, I guess some are content to go back to the pro-style, Reggie Ball days, but not most. He's also led us to some mediocre years, but GT was still bowl eligible. In the ACC, it seems like most teams cycle through some mediocre years (Clemson, FSU, VT, etc) so I don't know what JimGA expects.

[Breeze]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

People are saying that the committee's decision shows that the B12 needs a championship game. Having thought about this, I am not sure what a Big 12 Championship would have solved.

Say Baylor/TCU played one extra game this weekend against each other. One of those teams would have won. Then, either that winning team would have still been left out in the cold, or a one-loss Ohio State team that just obliterated the Big 10 Championship game would have been left out in the cold.

The general consensus is that the committee sent a message the Big 12 needs a conference championship game...but what if FSU had lost to GaTech and what if OSU (who was an underdog to Wisc) actually lost (or Alabama and OU losing works in the scenario as well). Would we be talking about how brilliant the Big12 was not to have a conference championship game that screwed up their representative, and how it allowed them to get 2 teams into the playoffs?

[cuervo72]

5 conferences for 4 spots is not a recipe for good feelings in the long run.

[flounder]

Originally Posted by miked

As a GT fan, it may be ugly football, but we win. I can't imagine another coach taking us to a pair of ACC title games in 3 seasons, a pair of Orange Bowls, and a few other milestones (1st win at FSU in school history).

I mean, I guess some are content to go back to the pro-style, Reggie Ball days, but not most. He's also led us to some mediocre years, but GT was still bowl eligible. In the ACC, it seems like most teams cycle through some mediocre years (Clemson, FSU, VT, etc) so I don't know what JimGA expects.

I think what this season has made me realize is that while the offense gets more out of less talent than a lot of other systems, it really needs a dynamic playmaker at QB. Paul Johnson is 34-14 with Josh Nesbitt or Justin Thomas at QB and 23-21 with someone else. Fortunately, it looks like QB recruiting is picking up.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

People are saying that the committee's decision shows that the B12 needs a championship game. Having thought about this, I am not sure what a Big 12 Championship would have solved.

Say Baylor/TCU played one extra game this weekend against each other. One of those teams would have won. Then, either that winning team would have still been left out in the cold, or a one-loss Ohio State team that just obliterated the Big 10 Championship game would have been left out in the cold.

Someone is always going to be left out. However the lack of a conference championship game made it easier for the Big 12 to be that conference that gets left out, IMO. It's a harder decision if there is a Big 12 conference championship.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by flounder

Fortunately, it looks like QB recruiting is picking up.

That one I'll give you, the kid inbound from Washington Co might just be pretty good.

[Easy Mac]

I'd like to think that the committee learned something this year and will release no more than 2-3 rankings next year, around week 7, 11 and 15. Although, I'm sure ESPN loves the controversy these weekly polls have created.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

5 conferences for 4 spots is not a recipe for good feelings in the long run.

No worries. The B12 has it all figured out.

“I think it's fair to say that some [conferences] that have gotten larger are now wondering if it's going to be worth it,” Bowlsby said Thursday while visiting Kansas on a conference-wide tour. “There are complexities, especially regarding some scheduling issues, that have really caused some problems.”

“We're feeling pretty good about 10 [teams]. We're also feeling good we brought in two ranked football teams in exchange for the two that moved out.”

Bob Bowlsby, August 23, 2012

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

I'd like to think that the committee learned something this year and will release no more than 2-3 rankings next year, around week 7, 11 and 15. Although, I'm sure ESPN loves the controversy these weekly polls have created.

I don't know why people are so against rankings being released on a weekly basis. I think it makes the process more interesting. I do agree they should hold off until 7-8 games into the season (which is pretty much what they did).

[Suicane75]

I've thought for a long time that NO RANKINGS at all should be taken or released until 6 or 7 weeks into the year. Too many teams are adversely affected by being too low or rewarded by being too high based on very little data.

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I don't know why people are so against rankings being released on a weekly basis. I think it makes the process more interesting. I do agree they should hold off until 7-8 games into the season (which is pretty much what they did).

It's not that I'm against it, its more that it makes them look like idiots, like dropping TCU after they win handily.

[VPI97]

Originally Posted by flounder

I think what this season has made me realize is that while the offense gets more out of less talent than a lot of other systems, it really needs a dynamic playmaker at QB. Paul Johnson is 34-14 with Josh Nesbitt or Justin Thomas at QB and 23-21 with someone else. Fortunately, it looks like QB recruiting is picking up.

While QB is a key position for all collegiate offenses, it's even more critical for GT's offense. I would also assume that the profile for QB success at GT is completely different than other college offensive systems and thus, harder to identify during the recruiting process than your standard drop back passer vs. dual-threat passer that you see on recruiting sites. During the ACC Championship game I heard Herbstreit say that Thomas was the best fit at the QB spot that Johnson has had while at GT, and I disagreed in favor of Nesbitt. If Thomas can identify more Nesbitts from Georgia high school football (or wherever), the more successful seasons GT will have on offense. You guys need to shore up the D, though.

I think everyone's dream scenario for the ACC includes constant success from GT so that there will always be a dogfight in the Coastal between GT, VT and Miami while the Atlantic showcases FSU, Clemson and Louisville. Sure other programs will reach heights at times, but I think the strength of those six are critical to elevating the conference to where we want it to be.

[digamma]

Except that little girl Swofford, who wants UNC to be a football power.

The one thing Thomas doesn't have that Nesbitt did is the inside midline power option ability. Other than that he's better in pretty much every way--and Nesbitt is one of my 5 favorite Jackets all time.

[VPI97]

Originally Posted by digamma

Except that little girl Swofford, who wants UNC to be a football power.

Screw UNC...and screw UVA (just because it needs to be mentioned every so often).

Originally Posted by digamma

The one thing Thomas doesn't have that Nesbitt did is the inside midline power option ability. Other than that he's better in pretty much every way--and Nesbitt is one of my 5 favorite Jackets all time.

Nesbitt was a freaking beast and the only GT QB since Joe Ham that I remember being scared of. Thomas is only a sophomore, though, he has a lot more time to bring the pain like Nesbitt did.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by VPI97

During the ACC Championship game I heard Herbstreit say that Thomas was the best fit at the QB spot that Johnson has had while at GT, and I disagreed in favor of Nesbitt.

Nesbitt was such an interesting/perplexing career arc. In HS (playing down at Greene County) he had a cannon for an arm, some truly remarkable throws. His adjustment period, for whatever reason, took a while.

I think what really set him apart (and I know anti-intangibles people will hate this) over his college career was his heart. He had good games, he had some not so good games but by God you knew he wanted it on every snap.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by VPI97

Nesbitt was a freaking beast and the only GT QB since Joe Ham that I remember being scared of. Thomas is only a sophomore, though, he has a lot more time to bring the pain like Nesbitt did.

This is true. I think if you compared Nesbitt's sophomore season, Thomas compares favorably, but that's probably not a fair comparison. Thomas has been in the system 3 seasons (redshirt and two playing seasons). Nesbitt had one spring practice.

I do think the inside running is something to be addressed. Whether it is bringing in a second QB to handle that or what. Thomas offers too much, his ability to read the defense is very good, he has good connections with his backs and he can throw multiple types of passes.

[VPI97]

Originally Posted by digamma

I do think the inside running is something to be addressed. Whether it is bringing in a second QB to handle that or what.

I had always hoped that one of the Powder Springs guys would pan out at QB for GT. Synjyn Days was moved to A back then B back, Ty Griffin transferred and Ty Clemons (who I thought would be a good fit) was never really recruited by GT and ended up at MTSU.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

It's not that I'm against it, its more that it makes them look like idiots, like dropping TCU after they win handily.

But I don't really see that mattering too much. If they want to look like idiots, they can heh.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by digamma

Except that little girl Swofford, who wants UNC to be a football power.
.

Screw Swofford.
The ACC should add a year to UNC sanctions because of "league integrity"


but he didnt suggest that, and when confronted with the tape of HIS VOICE putting forth the measure, he walked away.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

It's not that I'm against it, its more that it makes them look like idiots, like dropping TCU after they win handily.

It doesn't make them look like idiots. Positioning changes. TCU ended the year playing a 2-10 crappy team. They blew them out like everyone else does. Big deal. They also got second place in their conference.

If one of the better teams had lost they were in position for a spot. The other schools just had more schedule gas in their tank at the end of the season. And they won, so TCU rightfully moves down.

You don't just get to keep your position because you won or even won big. If it doesn't match up to the competition.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Big 12 coaches vote TCU over Baylor, plus more final 2014 Coaches Poll shenanigans - SBNation.com

[Breeze]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Big 12 coaches vote TCU over Baylor, plus more final 2014 Coaches Poll shenanigans - SBNation.com

This goes back to my point regarding groupthink in the polls. I would guess seeing TCU ranked ahead of Baylor for several weeks caused coaches to put TCU ahead and leave them there. The polls aren't as dynamic as the playoff committee...

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

It doesn't make them look like idiots. Positioning changes. TCU ended the year playing a 2-10 crappy team. They blew them out like everyone else does. Big deal. They also got second place in their conference.

If one of the better teams had lost they were in position for a spot. The other schools just had more schedule gas in their tank at the end of the season. And they won, so TCU rightfully moves down.

You don't just get to keep your position because you won or even won big. If it doesn't match up to the competition.

But surely the committee knew they were playing a poor team the next game, so what was the point of moving them up in the first place?